Re: Computer Monitors Can Make You Sick

[Guest guest]

I thought that everybody knew this..

The plastics that most plastic objects are made from in the US (these

chemicals have already been banned in many other countries) emit chemicals

called phthalates when they are hot which cause a multitude of health

problems, including acting as sex hormones - a situation that causes

infertility in men and early puberty in women.. (see

http://ourstolenfuture.org )

Also, any soft plastic will contain them.. Thats why they say don't use soft

plastic water bottles anymore.. for example.. they leech the phthalates and

plasticizers into them when they get hot, like in a hot car.. You should not

drink out of plastic cups, either, esp. coffee, tea, etc.

As far as emitting the fumes, monitors and TVs are among the worst...

Old style CRT monitors also use high voltage electricity which causes them

to suck dust into them.. Like ionizers, they break down the mold structure

and liberate lots of mycotoxins, so an old TV or monitor that has been in a

moldy place accumulates a lot of mycotoxins inside and on it just from being

on - from being ionized.. I have tried to laboriously clean monitors with

ammonia and Q-tips.. (very hard and gave up)... they never got clean enough

to use..

Now I just use a laptop with an LCD...

[Guest guest]

> I have Multiple Chemical Sensitivities (MCS). The good news is that, as I have

eliminated most of the > mold from my environment, my MCS has also become very

minor. This leads me to believe that there > is a connection between mold

reaction and MCS, or that they are both aspects of the same genetic or > immune

system malfunction.

I think this is absolutely true according to Mold Warriors - I don't have my

copy with me right now, but I am recalling that Dr. Shoemaker says that when

someone has MCS, they always have a mold problem. The MCSers in my family are

also the dreaded genotypes, which makes sense in that everything bothers us.

In the recent summary I got of the CRBAI research for 2006, it mentions that the

low VIP correlates with MCS.

B.

[Guest guest]

I hate to bust the " shoemaker is always right bubble " but the FACT is

MOLD IS NOT ALWAYS ASSOCIATED WITH MCS! One can lead to the other...it is

NOT NECESSARY for BOTH to be attributed to mold/MCS.

On Fri, 10 Nov 2006 mary.barnes@... wrote:

> Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 16:04:09 +0000

> From: mary.barnes@...

> Reply-

> ,

> < >

> Cc: Joe Salowitz <josephsalowitz@...>

> Subject: Re: [] Computer Monitors Can Make You Sick

>

>> I have Multiple Chemical Sensitivities (MCS). The good news is that, as I

have eliminated most of the > mold from my environment, my MCS has also become

very minor. This leads me to believe that there > is a connection between mold

reaction and MCS, or that they are both aspects of the same genetic or > immune

system malfunction.

>

> I think this is absolutely true according to Mold Warriors - I don't have my

copy with me right now, but I am recalling that Dr. Shoemaker says that when

someone has MCS, they always have a mold problem. The MCSers in my family are

also the dreaded genotypes, which makes sense in that everything bothers us.

>

> In the recent summary I got of the CRBAI research for 2006, it mentions that

the low VIP correlates with MCS.

>

> B.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

What he says is that toxins (either manmade or natural) cause MCS.

>

> > Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 16:04:09 +0000

> > From: mary.barnes@...

> > Reply-

> > ,

> > < >

> > Cc: Joe Salowitz <josephsalowitz@...>

> > Subject: Re: [] Computer Monitors Can Make You Sick

> >

> >> I have Multiple Chemical Sensitivities (MCS). The good news is

that, as I have eliminated most of the > mold from my environment,

my MCS has also become very minor. This leads me to believe that

there > is a connection between mold reaction and MCS, or that they

are both aspects of the same genetic or > immune system malfunction.

> >

> > I think this is absolutely true according to Mold Warriors - I

don't have my copy with me right now, but I am recalling that Dr.

Shoemaker says that when someone has MCS, they always have a mold

problem. The MCSers in my family are also the dreaded genotypes,

which makes sense in that everything bothers us.

> >

> > In the recent summary I got of the CRBAI research for 2006, it

mentions that the low VIP correlates with MCS.

> >

> > B.

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Helo All:

I am new to this group today..........but I wanted to ask a few

things:

I have been quite ill and dropping weight like mad. I have tested

positive for tricocothenes in my urine - the toxins producted by

the molds, as well as are very chemically and electrically sensitive

after inhaling consruction dust and mold at high concentrations in a

construction zone- (yes, we should have been in a hotel- but we

werent.)! What can I do to get this out of my body and my childrens?

I am NOT getting well living outside the moldy building. I am just

as sensitive. My neuro transmitters are not working. When they

stick light into my pupils, they dilate at first, but if you keep

the light on them, they open back up. I cannot pass a sobriety

test with my eyes closed - sober - of course. My balance is very

affected. The doctor called it a " hit to the brain " . I got on

oxygen last week and it helps so so much, but if I dont get my two

hours in the morning, I am sleeping in a bathtub the rest of the

day. Can anyone help me with any feedback on this..............I am

living in a hotel with two small children. My cats are dying that

are 20 pounds and my daughter is only 40 pounds. I am a nervous

wreck -and it seems that no two doctors agree on these

things...........If anyone can shed light on this- I would so

appreciate it. I am new to this and not sure what doctors to go

see. I hear that Shoemaker can run tests, but no matter what will

treat with Cholestyramine...........Marinkovich-

antifungals............can anyone make recommendations as to what

one doctor to see if I have kids with sensitivity to sound and smell

and also need treated. Too bad we need to be millionaires to get

injured by this stuff. I hear that I need to get my family to Dr.

Rae in Texas. (ehcd.com) What to do? I just want to get well

again. Smells of any kind hurt me..........and start an asthma like

symptom.

> >

> > > Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 16:04:09 +0000

> > > From: mary.barnes@

> > > Reply-

> > > ,

> > > < >

> > > Cc: Joe Salowitz <josephsalowitz@>

> > > Subject: Re: [] Computer Monitors Can Make You

Sick

> > >

> > >> I have Multiple Chemical Sensitivities (MCS). The good news

is

> that, as I have eliminated most of the > mold from my environment,

> my MCS has also become very minor. This leads me to believe that

> there > is a connection between mold reaction and MCS, or that

they

> are both aspects of the same genetic or > immune system

malfunction.

> > >

> > > I think this is absolutely true according to Mold Warriors - I

> don't have my copy with me right now, but I am recalling that Dr.

> Shoemaker says that when someone has MCS, they always have a mold

> problem. The MCSers in my family are also the dreaded genotypes,

> which makes sense in that everything bothers us.

> > >

> > > In the recent summary I got of the CRBAI research for 2006, it

> mentions that the low VIP correlates with MCS.

> > >

> > > B.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I am in a similar situation as yourself in terms of getting hit by being in the

house while they fixed our roof leak. My kids were also impacted and I had a

cat that got ill (cancer) shortly thereafter.

You won't get well living outside the moldy building if you're a genotype whose

body does not recognize and get rid of the toxins - they just keep circulating

until you use something like CSM to bind them out. All the symptoms you have

can be attributed to the neurotoxins. I have all those problems especially with

the smells - it makes life very difficult.

I live in the Dallas area where EHCD is located and I chose to go to Pocomoke to

see Dr. Shoemaker. My kids were 10 and 13 when they went to see him this past

summer. My oldest is doing significantly better (he's grown like crazy). The

results for my younger son (whose a dreaded genotype) have not been as

significant, but he has improved somewhat (less tummy and headaches). I've

been to several presentations for Dr. Rea and I don't believe that he uses the

same treatment protocol as Dr. Shoemaker and I know the costs are significantly

greater (even including my travel costs to Pocomoke). If you think you have

many issues beyond the mold, then perhaps Dr. Rea would be a good alternative -

I do know he has some very unique injections that can really boost one's immune

system.

Feel free to contact me offline if you want more information.

Peace and Healing,

B.

Helo All:

I am new to this group today..........but I wanted to ask a few

things:

I have been quite ill and dropping weight like mad. I have tested

positive for tricocothenes in my urine - the toxins producted by

the molds, as well as are very chemically and electrically sensitive

after inhaling consruction dust and mold at high concentrations in a

construction zone- (yes, we should have been in a hotel- but we

werent.)! What can I do to get this out of my body and my childrens?

I am NOT getting well living outside the moldy building. I am just

as sensitive. My neuro transmitters are not working. When they

stick light into my pupils, they dilate at first, but if you keep

the light on them, they open back up. I cannot pass a sobriety

test with my eyes closed - sober - of course. My balance is very

affected. The doctor called it a " hit to the brain " . I got on

oxygen last week and it helps so so much, but if I dont get my two

hours in the morning, I am sleeping in a bathtub the rest of the

day. Can anyone help me with any feedback on this..............I am

living in a hotel with two small children. My cats are dying that

are 20 pounds and my daughter is only 40 pounds. I am a nervous

wreck -and it seems that no two doctors agree on these

things...........If anyone can shed light on this- I would so

appreciate it. I am new to this and not sure what doctors to go

see. I hear that Shoemaker can run tests, but no matter what will

treat with Cholestyramine...........Marinkovich-

antifungals............can anyone make recommendations as to what

one doctor to see if I have kids with sensitivity to sound and smell

and also need treated. Too bad we need to be millionaires to get

injured by this stuff. I hear that I need to get my family to Dr.

Rae in Texas. (ehcd.com) What to do? I just want to get well

again. Smells of any kind hurt me..........and start an asthma like

symptom.

[Guest guest]

> > >

> > > > Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 16:04:09 +0000

> > > > From: mary.barnes@

> > > > Reply-

> > > > ,

> > > > < >

> > > > Cc: Joe Salowitz <josephsalowitz@>

> > > > Subject: Re: [] Computer Monitors Can Make You

> Sick

> > > >

> > > >> I have Multiple Chemical Sensitivities (MCS). The good news

> is

> > that, as I have eliminated most of the > mold from my

environment,

> > my MCS has also become very minor. This leads me to believe that

> > there > is a connection between mold reaction and MCS, or that

> they

> > are both aspects of the same genetic or > immune system

> malfunction.

> > > >

> > > > I think this is absolutely true according to Mold Warriors -

I

> > don't have my copy with me right now, but I am recalling that Dr.

> > Shoemaker says that when someone has MCS, they always have a mold

> > problem. The MCSers in my family are also the dreaded genotypes,

> > which makes sense in that everything bothers us.

> > > >

> > > > In the recent summary I got of the CRBAI research for 2006,

it

> > mentions that the low VIP correlates with MCS.

> > > >

> > > > B.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Hi, sorry to hear that. we have several sensery recepters and i'm not

sure but its looking like they all become disfunctional with toxin

exposures of any kind. sounds like you got exposed to many

possabilitys. as far as i know, nothing to help that part but try to

fique out with you've been exposed to and avoid like the plague. your

belonging soak it all up too. you'll get alot of advice on cleaning

or leaveing it behind, it's hard to say who's treatment will work for

you. so may depend on allergies, stomachm bowel problems,dr.rea's

detox might be a option. some have a hard time with csm, some

dont.same with reactions to some antifungals. you can even have

sensativitys to some medicines, inhalents, etc.

i think anyway you choose will make you sicker before you get better

for a little bit. i tried a herb detox, i think i detoxed some, it

made me sicker than a dog,but at the same time had allergic reactions

to the herbs,this cost me about 3 thousand, so its trail and error in

some cases.

do you have the links to all 3's web sites?

it sounds like you've gotten some medical attention.

i think sr. shoemaker will work with other doctors if they will.

another option.

> > >

> > > > Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 16:04:09 +0000

> > > > From: mary.barnes@

> > > > Reply-

> > > > ,

> > > > < >

> > > > Cc: Joe Salowitz <josephsalowitz@>

> > > > Subject: Re: [] Computer Monitors Can Make You

> Sick

> > > >

> > > >> I have Multiple Chemical Sensitivities (MCS). The good news

> is

> > that, as I have eliminated most of the > mold from my

environment,

> > my MCS has also become very minor. This leads me to believe that

> > there > is a connection between mold reaction and MCS, or that

> they

> > are both aspects of the same genetic or > immune system

> malfunction.

> > > >

> > > > I think this is absolutely true according to Mold Warriors -

I

> > don't have my copy with me right now, but I am recalling that Dr.

> > Shoemaker says that when someone has MCS, they always have a mold

> > problem. The MCSers in my family are also the dreaded genotypes,

> > which makes sense in that everything bothers us.

> > > >

> > > > In the recent summary I got of the CRBAI research for 2006,

it

> > mentions that the low VIP correlates with MCS.

> > > >

> > > > B.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Helo All:

" I am new to this group today..........but I wanted to ask a few

things:

I have been quite ill and dropping weight like mad. I have tested

positive for tricocothenes in my urine - the toxins producted by

the molds, as well as are very chemically and electrically sensitive

after inhaling consruction dust and mold at high concentrations in a

construction zone- (yes, we should have been in a hotel- but we

werent.)! What can I do to get this out of my body and my childrens? "

I am new to this group as well, but not to trying to recover from

mold exposure. My family has received treatment from a multitude of

doctors--mostly during the time we unknowingly lived in the moldy

house. After we left we almost felt sicker than when we lived in the

mold so we sought treatment from an environmental doctor. Then,

improved but still sick, we went to Dr. Shoemaker. He is one of the

few doctors who addresses mold toxins. He has helped us get more

well, but the reality is that indoor mold is rampant in this country

in businesses, government offices and factories. So, it seems that we

are subjected to constant exposure. Cholestyramine has helped us to

function in a moldy world. Personally, I would choose Dr. Shoemaker

again. Although he runs many blood tests, they seem to covered by

insurance. And, he understands that mold has made us ill. I notice

that Dr. Schaller has contributed to this group--maybe he is closer

to where you live.

[Guest guest]

I thought that this might be of interest - Its one reason why TVs and

computer monitors, in particular, collect mold toxins out of the air and

concentrate them.. CRT-type TVs have very high voltage inside them, they are

basically like ionizers in that they collect dust.. a LOT of dust.. They

collect particles from the air, and the smallest particles of toxinogenic

mold material have the most toxins attached to them.. As far as floating

spores, I am pretty sure that high voltages also break down any mold spores

and free the toxins from them..

(Watch out for that high voltage inside of monitors and TV sets. They can

hold a strong charge for a very long time after the TV is turned off.. days,

even.. and it is so strong that it can kill you..BE VERY CAREFUL when

cleaning them out.. and they get VERY dirty..toxically dirty..)

This was at:

http://www.madsci.org/posts/archives/feb2001/982001147.Ph.r.html

Re: why does dust stick to the television

screen?<http://www.madsci.org/posts/archives/feb2001/982001147.Ph.q.html>Date:

*Mon Feb 12 12:54:40 2001*

Posted By: *Shel Randall, System Consultant*

Area of science: *Physics*

ID: *980909511.Ph*

------------------------------

*Message:*

Most televisions still made today have a giant glass tube inside the box.

It's similar to a light bulb in that it is a sealed container of glass

containing specialized gases that assist in the display process. At the

front of the tube is the screen. When you look at the TV screen, you're

looking at the front of this tube.

At the back of the tube is a set of electron guns, a series of magnets and

conductive plates that accelerate electrons through a high voltage

difference. Televisions display an image by firing these electrons at the

back of the screen, which is coated with a phosphorous material. When the

electrons impact the phosphor, the phosphor is energized and it begins to

glow. If the glowing phosphor is behind a red filter, the screen displays a

red dot.

These electron beams are necessarily strong, to provide a bright clean

picture, but they also represent a modest amount of electromagnetic

radiation. While there isn't a lot of evidence that this radiation is

harmful, it is one of the reasons your parents always tell you not to sit so

close to the TV screen.

Since electrons are negatively charged, this bombardment of electrons

against the back of this glass screen charges the back of the screen

negatively. The glass acts like a bit of a capacitor, and so the outside of

the screen becomes positively charged to balance the negative charge on the

inside.

Some more sophisticated televisions have a grounding wire attached to the

outside of the tube to dissipate this positive charge, but often, that's not

the case.

The air is full of dust and particles, some are charged (or ionized), some

are not. The particles in the air that happen to be negatively charged are

attracted to the positively charged television screen. And so, the particles

stick to the screen. Airborne particles can be anything: dirt, tiny flecks

of dead skin, hair, fuzz, water, grease, pollen … just to name a few. Any of

them can be negatively charged, and will be attracted to the static charge

of the TV screen.

Once the TV is turned off, the charge dissipates, and in theory the

particles should fall off. But they often don't, because all that dirt and

water and grease and grime, etc. is now sticking to the screen because it's

just sticky stuff. The static got them all together, and the natural

stickiness of the things kept them together. This is why it's necessary to

clean the screen periodically. This is also why you should avoid touching

the screen with your fingers… oils from your skin will stick to the screen

and make cleaning it more difficult.

As a side note, don't use drippy liquids to clean the screen. If the liquid

drips down into the guts of the TV, something could short out and that would

be the end of that TV. There are many cleaning products designed especially

for TV screens, which clean and work to reduce the static build up of grime

on the screen.

Thanks for your question!

------------------------------

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------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Where did you get this information from: " the smallest particles of

toxinogenic mold material have the most toxins attached to them "

Could this get any weirder?

--- In , LiveSimply <quackadillian@...>

wrote:

>

> collect particles from the air, and the smallest particles of

toxinogenic

> mold material have the most toxins attached to them.. As far as

floating

[Guest guest]

I would think first and foremost if you still continue to be sick you

should highly suspect your new environment. The hotel your staying at

in particular. You might want to try switching hotels and see if you

notice an improvement. If you can afford it go to higher quality

hotel, that is relatively modern, do it. Maybe 25 years old or less.

Otherwise you might be jumping from one frying pay to another.

Also as far as monitors go I would think if you can blow the dust off

and there is nothing remaining on the circuit boards than chances are

it's ok to take with you. If after you have blown it off it still

appears to be dirty or have black specks on it throw it out.

As Live has warned about DON'T TOUCH ANY OF THE INTERNAL COMPONENTS

even if it's unplugged. The capacitor's hold charges even with the

device unplugged.

If it cleans up you will want to stay away from it a few days and than

go back to it. If you feel a profound change from being away or

re-exposing yourself to it. Theirs a good chance theirs mold on it and

you should consider discarding it. Unfortunately these changes are

very difficult to observe because the affects of mold don't just blink

on and off based on your exposures. And it's very easy to misinterpret

what in particular is the culprit, most the time it's the place you

are staying and if you rectify this you will get pronounced relief.

A monitor with active colonies of mold that your sensitized to will

make you sick even if your not in front of it. To properly do this

test put it out in the car or somewhere away from your living

environment.

If you move to a new apartment or buy a house you will want to

consider replacing it because they are impossible to decontaminate.

It's probably not worth the risk of introducing the same species, or

spores from that species of mold that your so sensitized to. Monitors

and just about all other electronics would probably be one of the

easiest ways to do this as far as personal possessions go.

Specifically because of the positive and negatively charged particles

that article Live posted talked about. Food particles get on these

devices and are like a cafeteria for any viable spore that lands on

them. The heat they generate make a perfect growing environment.

On Sat, 11 Nov 2006 16:24:24 -0000, you wrote:

>Helo All:

>

>I am new to this group today..........but I wanted to ask a few

>things:

>

>I have been quite ill and dropping weight like mad. I have tested

>positive for tricocothenes in my urine - the toxins producted by

>the molds, as well as are very chemically and electrically sensitive

>after inhaling consruction dust and mold at high concentrations in a

>construction zone- (yes, we should have been in a hotel- but we

>werent.)! What can I do to get this out of my body and my childrens?

>

> I am NOT getting well living outside the moldy building. I am just

>as sensitive. My neuro transmitters are not working. When they

>stick light into my pupils, they dilate at first, but if you keep

>the light on them, they open back up. I cannot pass a sobriety

>test with my eyes closed - sober - of course. My balance is very

>affected. The doctor called it a " hit to the brain " . I got on

>oxygen last week and it helps so so much, but if I dont get my two

>hours in the morning, I am sleeping in a bathtub the rest of the

>day. Can anyone help me with any feedback on this..............I am

>living in a hotel with two small children. My cats are dying that

>are 20 pounds and my daughter is only 40 pounds. I am a nervous

>wreck -and it seems that no two doctors agree on these

>things...........If anyone can shed light on this- I would so

>appreciate it. I am new to this and not sure what doctors to go

>see. I hear that Shoemaker can run tests, but no matter what will

>treat with Cholestyramine...........Marinkovich-

>antifungals............can anyone make recommendations as to what

>one doctor to see if I have kids with sensitivity to sound and smell

>and also need treated. Too bad we need to be millionaires to get

>injured by this stuff. I hear that I need to get my family to Dr.

>Rae in Texas. (ehcd.com) What to do? I just want to get well

>again. Smells of any kind hurt me..........and start an asthma like

>symptom.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>> >

>> > > Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 16:04:09 +0000

>> > > From: mary.barnes@

>> > > Reply-

>> > > ,

>> > > < >

>> > > Cc: Joe Salowitz <josephsalowitz@>

>> > > Subject: Re: [] Computer Monitors Can Make You

>Sick

>> > >

>> > >> I have Multiple Chemical Sensitivities (MCS). The good news

>is

>> that, as I have eliminated most of the > mold from my environment,

>> my MCS has also become very minor. This leads me to believe that

>> there > is a connection between mold reaction and MCS, or that

>they

>> are both aspects of the same genetic or > immune system

>malfunction.

>> > >

>> > > I think this is absolutely true according to Mold Warriors - I

>> don't have my copy with me right now, but I am recalling that Dr.

>> Shoemaker says that when someone has MCS, they always have a mold

>> problem. The MCSers in my family are also the dreaded genotypes,

>> which makes sense in that everything bothers us.

>> > >

>> > > In the recent summary I got of the CRBAI research for 2006, it

>> mentions that the low VIP correlates with MCS.

>> > >

>> > > B.

>> > >

>> > >

>> > >

>> > >

[Guest guest]

Hi Barb,

Here is where that *important piece of information* comes from.

Read the numbers carefully and you will see what I mean. Its an important

paper for that reason.

Download this paper, its free Here is the URL:

http://aem.asm.org/cgi/reprint/71/1/114.pdf

*Detection of airborne Stachybotrys chartarum macrocyclic trichothecene

mycotoxins on particulates smaller than

conidia.*<http://lib.bioinfo.pl/pmid:15640178>

* * T L Brasel, <http://lib.bioinfo.pl/auth:Brasel,TL> D R ,

<http://lib.bioinfo.pl/auth:,DR> S C ,

<http://lib.bioinfo.pl/auth:,SC> D C Straus

<http://lib.bioinfo.pl/auth:Straus,DC> Abstract:

" Highly respirable particles (diameter, <1 microm) constitute the majority

of particulate matter found in indoor air. It is hypothesized that these

particles serve as carriers for toxic compounds, specifically the compounds

produced by molds in water-damaged buildings. The presence of airborne

Stachybotrys chartarum trichothecene mycotoxins on particles smaller than

conidia (e.g., fungal fragments) was therefore investigated. Cellulose

ceiling tiles with confluent Stachybotrys growth were placed in gas-drying

containers through which filtered air was passed. Exiting particulates were

collected by using a series of polycarbonate membrane filters with

decreasing pore sizes. Scanning electron microscopy was employed to

determine the presence of conidia on the filters. A competitive

enzyme-linked immunosorbent assay (ELISA) specific for macrocyclic

trichothecenes was used to analyze filter extracts. Cross-reactivity to

various mycotoxins was examined to confirm the specificity. Statistically

significant (P < 0.05) ELISA binding was observed primarily for macrocyclic

trichothecenes at concentrations of 50 and 5 ng/ml and 500 pg/ml (58.4 to

83.5% inhibition). Of the remaining toxins tested, only verrucarol and

diacetylverrucarol (nonmacrocyclic trichothecenes) demonstrated significant

binding (18.2 and 51.7% inhibition, respectively) and then only at high

concentrations. The results showed that extracts from conidium-free filters

demonstrated statistically significant (P < 0.05) antibody binding that

increased with sampling time (38.4 to 71.9% inhibition, representing a range

of 0.5 to 4.0 ng/ml). High-performance liquid chromatography analysis

suggested the presence of satratoxin H in conidium-free filter extracts.

These data show that S. chartarum trichothecene mycotoxins can become

airborne in association with intact conidia or smaller particles. These

findings may have important implications for indoor air quality assessment. "

Here is the text that says that specific fact, in the first paper..

" The World Health Organization made the first attempt to

define sick building syndrome (SBS) in 1982. SBS has proven

to be difficult to define, and no single cause has ever been

identified (2, 34). The complaints associated with poor indoor

air quality (IAQ) range in severity and include difficulty in

breathing, headaches, watering of the eyes, and flu-like symptoms,

but they are not limited to these complaints (35). Numerous

research groups have tried to determine the underlying

cause(s) of SBS and poor IAQ. Fungi and their secondary

metabolites, such as mycotoxins, are hypothesized contributors

that have been closely examined (3, 5, 6, 9, 18, 21). The fungi

isolated from buildings with poor IAQ include a wide variety of

genera and species. Recent research has shown that, along with

airborne conidia, highly respirable fungal fragments can lead

to human exposure because the fragments can be aerosolized

simultaneously with conidia. The amounts of these fragments

could be as large as 320 times the amounts of conidia (16).

Kildeso et al. (29) claimed that for a typical spore size (diameter,

3 m; density, 1 g/cm3) the average exposure to spores

may be approximately 0.14 g/m3. Expanding on previous

studies which concluded that the average concentration of

respirable particles in a typical Danish office building was approximately

50 g/m3 of air (28), conidia could be only a small

fraction of the potential particulates (possibly less than 1%) in

contaminated buildings. This suggests that fungal fragments

and other small particulates, such as dust and nonorganic debris,

could be potential carriers of the majority of aerosolized

mycotoxins and therefore be a cause for concern and further

study. A number of different fungi, including Stachybotrys chartarum,

have been hypothesized to be important contributors to

problems such as the adverse human health effects associated

with indoor fungal growth (6, 15, 37). S. chartarum has been

proposed to be associated with human adverse health effects

on a limited scale (8, 12, 13, 22, 23). Numerous compounds

have been characterized from S. chartarum. This fungus can

produce anticomplement compounds and phenylspirodrimanes

(30). Recently, a novel hemolysin named stachylysin has

been described (42). A group of compounds known as atranones

has also been described recently (20). S. chartarum is

also known to produce cyclosporins, trichoverrols, trichoverrins,

spirolactams, spirolactones (24), and spirocyclic drimanes

(31). None of these compounds, however, have been a

main focus of study for ailments arising from exposure to S.

chartarum in indoor air. Instead, there has been much interest

in the trichothecene mycotoxins that S. chartarum produces (1,

27, 32, 33, 39, 40). These toxins include, but are not limited to,

the macrocyclic trichothecenes verrucarins B and J, roridin E,

satratoxins F, G, and H, and isosatratoxins F, G, and H (19,

25). Recently, satratoxin G was found to be localized primarily

in the conidia, followed by other fungal constituents, such as

the phialides and hyphae (17). Several of these mycotoxins are

known to react primarily with mucous membranes of the upper

respiratory tract and eyes, leading to irritating erythema, in-

flammation, and pain (10). Inhalational studies in animals have

shown that the respiratory route of exposure to trichothecene

mycotoxins is highly effective (7).

While the consequences of exposure to mycotoxins in buildings

with poor IAQ are essentially unexplored (36), there is a

substantial body of case studies and some laboratory evidence

which suggest that these toxins may contribute to reported

complaints such as headaches, eye and throat irritation, nausea,

dizziness, nose bleeds, and both physical and mental fatigue

in subjects occupying such interiors (11, 36, 41). The

members of the macrocyclic trichothecene family of mycotoxins

are known inhibitors of protein synthesis in eukaryotes (14,

34, 43). In some studies workers have hypothesized that these

compounds may also play a role in neurotoxicity and could

therefore be particularly detrimental to humans (26). In light

of the potential consequences of airborne mycotoxins for human

health, it is important to know the possible ways in which

mycotoxins can become airborne. The aim of this study was to

determine if airborne macrocyclic trichothecenes can exist separate

from S. chartarum conidia. "

Barb, this was in

APPLIED AND ENVIRONMENTAL MICROBIOLOGY, Jan. 2005, p. 114–122

0099-2240/05/$08.000 doi: 10.1128/AEM.71.1.114–122.2005

It's a peer-reviewed scientific paper. In a very respected journal.

Thats what it said.. The tiniest particles are the most toxic.

They are also the ones you can't identify with a microscope.

.........

You should also read THIS paper:

Detection of Airborne *Stachybotrys chartarum* Macrocyclic Trichothecene

Mycotoxins in the Indoor Environment

T. L. Brasel, J. M. , C. G. Carriker, S. C. , and D. C. Straus*

also downloadable at

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/picrender.fcgi?artid=1287651 & blobtype=pdf

On 11/11/06, barb1283 <barb1283@...> wrote:

>

> Where did you get this information from: " the smallest particles of

> toxinogenic mold material have the most toxins attached to them "

> Could this get any weirder?

>

>

> >

> > collect particles from the air, and the smallest particles of

> toxinogenic

> > mold material have the most toxins attached to them..

>

>

[Guest guest]

Don't waste your time right now with anything but Dr Shoemakers

Proticals. Get a perscription for Cholestrymine right away- buy Mold

Warriors by Dr Shoe- and get your Dr to run the tests explained there-

but you may be lucky and start improving right away on the meds. It

took a while for you to get sick- it may take a while to get better-

keep reading the posts here and use the archives- you will find tons

of info that will help- we have all been where you are- more or less

Good luck

--- In , " moldieme " <moldieme@...>

wrote:

>

> Helo All:

>

> I am new to this group today..........but I wanted to ask a few

> things:

>

> I have been quite ill and dropping weight like mad. I have tested

> positive for tricocothenes in my urine - the toxins producted by

> the molds, as well as are very chemically and electrically

sensitive

> after inhaling consruction dust and mold at high concentrations in

a

> construction zone- (yes, we should have been in a hotel- but we

> werent.)! What can I do to get this out of my body and my

childrens?

>

> I am NOT getting well living outside the moldy building. I am

just

> as sensitive. My neuro transmitters are not working. When they

> stick light into my pupils, they dilate at first, but if you keep

> the light on them, they open back up. I cannot pass a sobriety

> test with my eyes closed - sober - of course. My balance is very

> affected. The doctor called it a " hit to the brain " . I got on

> oxygen last week and it helps so so much, but if I dont get my two

> hours in the morning, I am sleeping in a bathtub the rest of the

> day. Can anyone help me with any feedback on this..............I

am

> living in a hotel with two small children. My cats are dying that

> are 20 pounds and my daughter is only 40 pounds. I am a nervous

> wreck -and it seems that no two doctors agree on these

> things...........If anyone can shed light on this- I would so

> appreciate it. I am new to this and not sure what doctors to go

> see. I hear that Shoemaker can run tests, but no matter what will

> treat with Cholestyramine...........Marinkovich-

> antifungals............can anyone make recommendations as to what

> one doctor to see if I have kids with sensitivity to sound and

smell

> and also need treated. Too bad we need to be millionaires to get

> injured by this stuff. I hear that I need to get my family to Dr.

> Rae in Texas. (ehcd.com) What to do? I just want to get well

> again. Smells of any kind hurt me..........and start an asthma

like

> symptom.

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I don't see where you have concluded that smaller

particles hold more toxins. I can see where

small particles might get by filters and be

greater source of toxins that way. I can also

see where smaller particles can be more dangerous

if they are inhaled and absorbed by our bodies

more easily than larger particle, etc. I read

below but didn't come away with conclusion that

smaller particles hold more mycotoxins though. I

think you may have drawn wrong conclusion from

article. I didn't go to second article to read.

--- LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

> Here is where it comes from. Read the numbers

> carefully and you will see

> what I mean. Its an important paper for that

> reason.

>

> Download this paper, its free Here is the URL:

>

> http://aem.asm.org/cgi/reprint/71/1/114.pdf

>

> Appl Environ Microbiol. 2005 Jan ;71:114-22

> > *Detection of airborne Stachybotrys chartarum

> macrocyclic trichothecene

> mycotoxins on particulates smaller than

> conidia.*<http://lib.bioinfo.pl/pmid:15640178>

> * * T L Brasel,

>

[Guest guest]

-if you are refering to stachybotrys spores they are heavier, thats

why they dont always pick up on airtests and if they do you can be

pretty sure its there in higher amounts. stiring them up or wind can

make them airborne. all mycotoxins can hitch a ride into your lungs

by attaching to smaller particles in the air. you dont have to inhale

a spore to inhale mycotoxins. mycotoxins can be airborne right along

with millions of other tiny particles. look at it this way, if a

particle has moisture content, water or oil or a sticky content to it

other particles will attach to it.mycotoxins are so tiny that yes,

millions of them could attach to any other particle in the air and be

inhaled. i'd even say when it comes to stachy your chances of

inhaleing the myco's would be higher than inhaleing the spores.-- In

, bbw <barb1283@...> wrote:

>

> I don't see where you have concluded that smaller

> particles hold more toxins. I can see where

> small particles might get by filters and be

> greater source of toxins that way. I can also

> see where smaller particles can be more dangerous

> if they are inhaled and absorbed by our bodies

> more easily than larger particle, etc. I read

> below but didn't come away with conclusion that

> smaller particles hold more mycotoxins though. I

> think you may have drawn wrong conclusion from

> article. I didn't go to second article to read.

>

> --- LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

>

> > Here is where it comes from. Read the numbers

> > carefully and you will see

> > what I mean. Its an important paper for that

> > reason.

> >

> > Download this paper, its free Here is the URL:

> >

> > http://aem.asm.org/cgi/reprint/71/1/114.pdf

> >

> > Appl Environ Microbiol. 2005 Jan ;71:114-22

> > > *Detection of airborne Stachybotrys chartarum

> > macrocyclic trichothecene

> > mycotoxins on particulates smaller than

> > conidia.*<http://lib.bioinfo.pl/pmid:15640178>

> > * * T L Brasel,

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I figured out a great way to condense a lot of these papers, its auto text

summarization, using tree-trimming algorithms.

It is amazingly accurate, and it is apolitical and unemotional (after all,

its a machine)

feeding the text I posted earlier into the summarization program and turning

up the summarization to shorten it by 2/3, I got this.

" The complaints associated with poor indoor air quality (IAQ) range in

severity and include difficulty in breathing, headaches, watering of the

eyes, and flu-like symptoms, but they are not limited to these complaints

(35). Numerous research groups have tried to determine the underlying

cause(s) of SBS and poor IAQ.... The fungi isolated from buildings with

poor IAQ include a wide variety of genera and species. Recent research has

shown that, along with airborne conidia, highly respirable fungal fragments

can lead to human exposure because the fragments can be aerosolized

simultaneously with conidia.... Expanding on previous studies which

concluded that the average concentration of respirable particles in a

typical Danish office building was approximately 50 g/m3 of air (28),

conidia could be only a small fraction of the potential particulates

(possibly less than 1%) in contaminated buildings. "

(LiveSimply's commentary here: That is the part that gets counted in air

testing..)

" This suggests that fungal fragments and other small particulates, such as

dust and nonorganic debris, could be potential carriers of the majority of

aerosolized mycotoxins and therefore be a cause for concern and further

study. "

" A number of different fungi, including Stachybotrys chartarum, have been

hypothesized to be important contributors to problems such as the adverse

human health effects associated with indoor fungal growth (6, 15, 37)....

Several of these mycotoxins are known to react primarily with mucous

membranes of the upper respiratory tract and eyes, leading to irritating

erythema, inflammation, and pain (10)....

While the consequences of exposure to mycotoxins in buildings with poor IAQ

are essentially unexplored (36), there is a substantial body of case studies

and some laboratory evidence which suggest that these toxins may contribute

to reported complaints such as headaches, eye and throat irritation, nausea,

dizziness, nose bleeds, and both physical and mental fatigue in subjects

occupying such interiors (11, 36, 41).... In light of the potential

consequences of airborne mycotoxins for human health, it is important to

know the possible ways in which mycotoxins can become airborne. "

So, there you have it..

Isn't technology great in that it can help us distill SO much information

into a simple short set of sentences that even mold-overwhelmed people like

ME can easily understand!?

[Guest guest]

This is very interesting Live Simply. It says

that exposure to mycotoxins can be much greater

than what you might expect if you only look at

spore count, because they are carried on other

particles as well. In this article they are

saying much more exposure is due to other

particles, rather than just the spores. That

good information. However it doesn't say that

the smaller particles hold more toxins, which is

what you said I believe. Perhaps it was the way

you phrased your sentence. Anyway, this makes

sense and is important to know, that spore count

is a very small part of the picture. Thanks