Guest guest Posted March 2, 2004 Report Share Posted March 2, 2004 > Is katie's book helpful? Yes! Then I would consider that she is > helping people. > > Do participants improve after attending her workshops? Yes! She must > be facilitating some HELP for them. > > Is it helpful to receive clarity about a problem? Yes! Therefore > everyone who provides clarity in this group by sharing their stories > and inquiries is helping other group members! > > Semantics is such a STUPID thing to argue about! Hello, KS. I would agree with what you say, and I've noticed that when I set out to be helpful, I'm usually not successful. When I focus on helping myself by doing The Work for me, I get lots of feedback about how helpful and fun and clear I am in what I say and do. It seems that I can be helpful, but only if I'm willing to not be helpful. From my point of view, it's not a semantic distinction, but one of intention. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2004 Report Share Posted March 2, 2004 If you need help , help others . To best help others , let them help you . Wisdom cries out in the street and no man regards it . One cannot shake hands with a clenched fist . Let other people have it your way ! > >> Is katie's book helpful? Yes! Then I would consider that she is >> helping people. >> >> Do participants improve after attending her workshops? Yes! She must >> be facilitating some HELP for them. >> >> Is it helpful to receive clarity about a problem? Yes! Therefore >> everyone who provides clarity in this group by sharing their stories >> and inquiries is helping other group members! >> >> Semantics is such a STUPID thing to argue about! > > Hello, KS. I would agree with what you say, and I've noticed that when > I set out to be helpful, I'm usually not successful. When I focus on > helping myself by doing The Work for me, I get lots of feedback about > how helpful and fun and clear I am in what I say and do. > > It seems that I can be helpful, but only if I'm willing to not be > helpful. From my point of view, it's not a semantic distinction, > but one of intention. > > Tom > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2004 Report Share Posted March 2, 2004 --- This sounds like very good advice. Cardinal In Loving-what-is , knight of the woeful countenance <windowpanetest@m...> wrote: > If you need help , help others . To best help others , let them help > you . > > > > Wisdom cries out in the street and no man regards it . > > > > One cannot shake hands with a clenched fist . > > Let other people have it your way ! > > > > > >> Is katie's book helpful? Yes! Then I would consider that she is > >> helping people. > >> > >> Do participants improve after attending her workshops? Yes! She must > >> be facilitating some HELP for them. > >> > >> Is it helpful to receive clarity about a problem? Yes! Therefore > >> everyone who provides clarity in this group by sharing their stories > >> and inquiries is helping other group members! > >> > >> Semantics is such a STUPID thing to argue about! > > > > Hello, KS. I would agree with what you say, and I've noticed that when > > I set out to be helpful, I'm usually not successful. When I focus on > > helping myself by doing The Work for me, I get lots of feedback about > > how helpful and fun and clear I am in what I say and do. > > > > It seems that I can be helpful, but only if I'm willing to not be > > helpful. From my point of view, it's not a semantic distinction, > > but one of intention. > > > > Tom > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2004 Report Share Posted March 2, 2004 > Is katie's book helpful? Yes! Then I would consider that she is > helping people. > > Do participants improve after attending her workshops? Yes! She > must be facilitating some HELP for them. > Hi KS, Ten people attend a workshop. Five may find it a life changing experience. Two may find amusing. Another three may just be bored. Everyone gets the same sensory input from . How do you explain the different reactions, if s presence and words are so " helpful " ? In my opinion the experience in a worshop has NOTHING to do with , it is determined SOLELY by the THOUGHTS each person in the room is thinking. It can be very difficult to see this because we always look outside ourselves for causes, but the only cause that can effect me is my THINKING. Awakening is purely internal. awoke without being " helped " by anyone. Maybe awakening simply happens, and then I get to tell the story about how helped me. Just some thoughts Loving what is, angel, and that would be you. Neo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2004 Report Share Posted March 2, 2004 > > Is katie's book helpful? Yes! Then I would consider that she is > > helping people. > > > > Do participants improve after attending her workshops? Yes! She > > must be facilitating some HELP for them. > > > > Hi KS, > > Ten people attend a workshop. Five may find it a life changing > experience. Two may find amusing. Another three may just be > bored. > > Everyone gets the same sensory input from . How do you explain > the different reactions, if s presence and words are > so " helpful " ? > > In my opinion the experience in a worshop has NOTHING to do > with , it is determined SOLELY by the THOUGHTS each person in > the room is thinking. It can be very difficult to see this because we > always look outside ourselves for causes, but the only cause that can > effect me is my THINKING. > > Awakening is purely internal. awoke without being " helped " by > anyone. Maybe awakening simply happens, and then I get to tell the > story about how helped me. > > Just some thoughts > > Loving what is, angel, and that would be you. > > > Neo Hey Neo! How do you know was not helped by a book she read or something someone said when she was in treatment for her addictions? Nothing she came up with is new...so she must have gotten the information from somewhere and I call that HELPFUL! KS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2004 Report Share Posted March 3, 2004 " Maybe I used to believe that the world out there was the source of my suffering. Now I am supposed to believe that it is my thinking that the world out there is the cause of my suffering which is actually the cause of my suffering. I have evidently been wrong in this whole suffering thing before, why should I accept this new doctrine, just because I now say this is right? " Steve You raised some good points. What is often overlooked is that Kt is in a different state of consciousness from the norm. She woke up that way one morning, then created the work. So when she asks the questions it's from a different place than the rest of us. Her lack of clarity on this point leads to a lot of confusion amongst those who would like to follow her. That's my story, and I like it ;-) Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2004 Report Share Posted March 3, 2004 " Tim, You have realized that the source of your suffering is not " out there " but neither is the source of your bliss and wisdom--it's not in following Kt's example or doctrine--it's by contacting that divine place within you that holds the wisdom and peace you desire. (reconnecting to your Source) " Love, Eddie For me the most valuable thing about Kt is that she exists, thereby proving that a different way of being is possible for anyone who wants it - and the " path " to that state is...... I love looking within and finding the source/s of all those 'different voices'. One inner voice, the loneliest, the most terrified, the crucified one is he who thinks he has to judge it all, to judge everything except his own consciousness. The other inner selves wait patiently, lovingly, for the Judge to give birth to a new life at last, love Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2004 Report Share Posted March 3, 2004 dear Tim: You said: " What is often overlooked is that Kt is >in a different state of consciousness from the norm. She woke up that >way one morning, then created the work. So when she asks the >questions it's from a different place than the rest of us. Her lack >of clarity on this point leads to a lot of confusion amongst those >who would like to follow her. That's my story, and I like it ;-) >Tim " I have a different story. Mine says that KT does not lack any clarity regarding how she perceives vs how " we " perceive. She is totally clear that you/we are The One, and she reealizes that you/we may forget that on occasion. :-) Steve D. > Tim, > You have realized that the source of your suffering is not " out there " but > neither is the source of your bliss and wisdom--it's not in following Kt's > example or doctrine--it's by contacting that divine place within you that > holds the wisdom and peace you desire. (reconnecting to your Source) > > Love, > Eddie > > > >From: " timitisi " <timitisi@y...> > >Reply-To: Loving-what-is > >To: Loving-what-is > >Subject: Re: What is help? > >Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 14:38:10 -0000 > > > > " Maybe I used to believe that the world out there was the source of my > >suffering. Now I am supposed to believe that it is my thinking that > >the world out there is the cause of my suffering which is actually > >the cause of my suffering. I have evidently been wrong in this whole > >suffering thing before, why should I accept this new doctrine, just > >because I now say this is right? " Steve > > > >You raised some good points. What is often overlooked is that Kt is > >in a different state of consciousness from the norm. She woke up that > >way one morning, then created the work. So when she asks the > >questions it's from a different place than the rest of us. Her lack > >of clarity on this point leads to a lot of confusion amongst those > >who would like to follow her. That's my story, and I like it ;-) > >Tim > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Store more e-mails with MSN Hotmail Extra Storage – 4 plans to choose from! > http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200362ave/direct/01/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 4, 2004 Report Share Posted March 4, 2004 " Her lack of clarity on this point leads to a lot of confusion amongst those who would like to follow her. That's my story, and I like it " ;-) >Tim " I have a different story. Mine says that KT does not lack any clarity regarding how she perceives vs how " we " perceive. She is totally clear that you/we are The One, and she reealizes that you/we may forget that on occasion " . :-) Steve D. Ah, the perils of the English language, turkeys not withstanding. I meant that Kt does not make it clear to her audience that the metanoia came before the work; and that she has always done the work in a different state of being than everyone else, which has got to alter the quality of it, surely? Altho her statement that the work leads to this state belies my theory <g> Nobody's given me any evidence of someone who became One thru the work, I'd love some, cheers, Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 4, 2004 Report Share Posted March 4, 2004 " That's my story, and I like it " ;-) Tim " Yes, it gives you a reason to stay where you are " . I'm perplexed you differ with my brief chronology of Kt's awakening and the work, I got it from the book! How could I possibly be anywhere other than where I am? Kt rejoices that we are where we are, is that what you had in mind? Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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