RE: Husband's appointment with Dr R

[Guest guest]

Kim - so happy for your DH to get answers and get started down the

road to feeling better! Hurrah!

His profile really sounds like my DH's first set of labs. When you

are rested and able to, glance back at my post #30087 where I listed

my DH's labs for the 3 visits he's had and see how similar they are

to your DH's.

Wow. We certainly get a lot of reinforcing data from following your

family. I'm sorry you all are going through this, but so glad you are

in such good hands.

Sara

>

> Well I am so glad that we decided to have my dear husband see Dr

R. He is not a complainer but I just felt like our family DO has

been treating just his symptoms.high blood pressure, elevated

cholesterol, fatty liver, abnormal liver function tests. I have also

felt that he is hypothyroid but has been for so long that he is just

not aware what it feels like to be well.

>

> Like I stated before, Dr R was EXTREMELY thorough! First his

temps, many days he registered less then 96.0. So Dr R threw all of

those out because the were not considered accurate. He came up with

the average of 97.0. He thoroughly explained how he uses basal temps

in his practice and how he has found it to be a very good indicator

of overall function/wellness. As we start warming up, we start

feeling better.

>

> I thought I got copies of the labs but I did not. I do have my

notes but I'm not sure whether I got all of the normal ranges written

down correctly, etc.

>

> First off, his potassium was low enough that it can be causing him

to feel unwell. His thoughts were that it is secondary to his blood

pressure medication. My husband said it has been low in the past.

Dr R said it is time to start supplementing. New prescription for

that.

>

> He an elevated carbon dioxide level but not concerned about that at

this point.

>

> His iron levels were low including his percent of saturation. I

wrote down 13 with normal being (20-50). A lot of discussion about

this since obviously he is not menstruating. I was concerned since

we have been eating a lot of red meat during the past year due to my

low ferritin. So we decided, that he should definitely supplement

with iron but it was also time for a colonoscopy. The recommended

age for screening is 50 and my husband is 48. Plus his grandfather

died of colon cancer. So I need to track down a GI doctor out our

way.

>

His folic acid and B12 were down. So he starts on Foltx.

>

His TSH was 2.1, Free T4 1.36 (0.73 - 1.95) and Free T3 380 (230-

420). His ratio was 21.8%. So he starts Armour tomorrow.

>

> His testosterone was REALLY low, sorry I did not get the numbers.

>

> His DHEA was TERRIBLE!! He is only 340 with normal (800-5600). Dr

R explained that 5600 would be a young adult male and then it slowly

decreasing with age. He said a level of 340 would probably represent

a 112 year old man.

>

> So he will have compounded DHEA and testosterone. Dr R is starting

the doses pretty low since there are so many things to work on. He

also explained how important that everything be in balance.

>

> We're supposed to call if any of the supplements/Rxs makes him feel

worse. Also call if he does not notice any improvement in the next

month.

>

> My husband was just so happy that what his idea of feeling " normal "

is not really normal and that there is so much room for improvement.

He said he would love to have some " get up and go " .

>

> has greatly improved since starting thyroid replacement,

especially her low immunity. She has still been dragging. I asked

her how come she has not been riding her horse. She said she feels

too tired. She is only 16. She was last seen in July. She's been

cold and having a hard time warming up. She is not well rested in

the morning.

>

> Her temps have come up some in comparison to when starting. But her

labs did definitely reflect the way she was feeling. Her TSH had

gone from 1.5 back up to 2.0. Again I don't have the labs. The

free's also had room for improvement. He felt that she warranted an

increase of 30 mgs but asked that she watch for signs of too much

thyroid.

>

> So we are definitely a hypothyroid family (myself, my husband, both

daughters and Buddy - the hypothyroid dog).

>

> I am wiped out from the drive there and back but I just love

sleeping in my own bed! I sleep so much better at home then in a

hotel room.

>

Kim in No Texas

[Guest guest]

What does the ratio mean? How do you figure it out and what should it be? Should I search the group posts to find out more about it?

Thanks!

-

To: Texas_Thyroid_Groups From: CAdata4u@...Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2008 21:51:44 -0600Subject: Husband's appointment with Dr R

His TSH was 2.1, Free T4 1.36 (0.73 – 1.95) and Free T3 380 (230-420). His ratio was 21.8%. So he starts Armour tomorrow.

Kim in No Texas

Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM, we give. Learn more.

[Guest guest]

Good question. I’ve not heard about

a ratio either. My problem is that I don’t know if I should or should not

suspect hypothyroidism or trust the drs that told me I don’t have it because

of my blood test a couple of weeks ago. I believed my symptoms prior to the

tests, even though I warned myself not to after doing it 10 years ago. I don’t

really understand what is normal, although I do know it varies from person to

person. I’m afraid to go to another doctor and not be able to be strong

enough to influence them that I should be treated if I don’t understand

all this. My brain fog prevents me from understanding and remembering how this

works. I guess I keep reading till it sticks. Can anyone point me in the right

direction of what to look at?

·

TSH – 3rd generation

– 1.49 (ref. range - > or = 20 years 0.40-4.50)

·

Free T4 – 1.0 (0.8-1.8)

·

Total T3 – 182 (60-181)

·

Free T3 – 319 (230-420)

·

Reverse T3 – 16 (11-32)

·

Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies (TPOAb)

- 17 (<35)

·

Thyroglobulin Antibodies - <20 (<20)

·

Thyroid-Stimulating Immunoglobulins

(TSI) – 106 (ref. range 125 or less)

Melody

Husband's appointment with Dr R

His TSH was 2.1, Free T4 1.36 (0.73

– 1.95) and Free T3 380 (230-420). His ratio was 21.8%.

So he starts Armour tomorrow.

Kim in No Texas

Helping your favorite cause is as

easy as instant messaging. You IM, we give. Learn more.

[Guest guest]

One of the other ladies is going to have

to answer that one. Dr R did a very good job of explaining it to us but there

was just so much information shared. Anyone that has gone to him understands.

Sharon made it

a point to call to make sure I was coming. She said that my poor husband would

have a very difficult time explaining to me all that was said.

Kim in No Texas

From: Texas_Thyroid_Groups [mailto:Texas_Thyroid_Groups ] On Behalf Of Caldwell

Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008

11:03 PM

To:

texas_thyroid_groups

Subject: RE:

Husband's appointment with Dr R

What does the ratio mean? How do you figure it out and what

should it be? Should I search the group posts to find out more about it?

Thanks!

-

_

[Guest guest]

I think it has something to do with determining that there is

enough Free T3 being converted from Free T4 and/or supplied from the

Armour - sort of an expected ratio range when you are in better

shape. T3 is the thyroid hormone that is the usable version in the

cells. But he also looks at where the Free's are in their ranges

along with it. He's looking at this and all other tests together and

I wouldn't presume anything from one person to another as far has

regimen adjustments.

When both DH and I had our first labs, we were in the 19% range of

Free T3 to total Free's. Target is 25-30%. Dr. R mentioned once that

most all of the new patients who come in not feeling well are in the

19% range. There are just amazing similarites in our bodies in how

they react when the thyroid system starts to falter. It's all

connected.

I came up to 31% I think at one point, and then back down into the

mid- 20's. But my Free T4 has remained low and my Free T3 has barely

come to mid range. DH was in the 20%'s last testing, but he was well

over mid range in both Frees.

Here's some detail if you need a sleep aid :-) -

Free T4 lab range – .73-1.95ng (nanograms) 1 nanogram = 1000 picograms

Free T3 lab range – 230-420pg (picograms)

Me - Free T3/(Free T3+Free T4) = 320/[320+(1000x1.10)] = 320/

(320+1100)=320/1420=22.5% - this says my ratio was better, but my

Free T4 (1.10)is well below mid-range. I still was not feeling good

at the time of this blood work. Other tests were not in range.

Husband - Free T3/(Free T3+Free T4) = 380/[380+(1000x1.50)] = 380/

(380+1500)=380/1880=20.2% - this says his ratio got a bit worse, but

his Free T4 (1.50)is well into upper part of range. He was feeling

good and had good results in other tests.

In both instances, we had room for improvement and a bit more Armour

was an option.

Someone please elaborate if you have more information on the ratio

thing.

>

> One of the other ladies is going to have to answer that one. Dr R

did a very good job of explaining it to us but there was just so much

information shared. Anyone that has gone to him understands. Sharon

made it a point to call to make sure I was coming. She said that my

poor husband would have a very difficult time explaining to me all

that was said.

>

> Kim in No Texas

>

>

>

> _____

>

> From: Texas_Thyroid_Groups

> [mailto:Texas_Thyroid_Groups ] On Behalf Of

Caldwell

> Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 11:03 PM

> To: texas_thyroid_groups

> Subject: RE: Husband's appointment with Dr R

>

>

>

> What does the ratio mean? How do you figure it out and what should

it be? Should I search the group posts to find out more about it?

>

> Thanks!

>

> -

> _

>

[Guest guest]

DH said that once he had his first meds, 1gr Armour and 7.5mg x 2

DHEA, his 1 tube of Testim per day, his Metanx, and Flintstones (had

the iron he needed), he was feeling much better within a couple of

weeks. Then he had a bit of a bumpy period where his improvement

crashed right into all the anti-depressant med he was on, and he got

to feeling too good! He and our pcp adjusted his a-d meds and he was

then able to cruise in a more comfortable spot. But he said, at least

for him, the improvements were felt within a couple of weeks.

Yes, DH spoke those very words to me about how he thought he was

going to have to accept feeling that bad and worse for the rest of

his life. He has been so grateful.

DH has been on cholesterol and bp meds for awhile. He didn't want to

go without help during the time before he went to Lubbock. I don't

think he had abnormal liver test results. He's got 50 pounds to lose.

Blood sugar is toward top of range. Not good but being watched. He's

just not been able to adjust his work and eating lifestyle to get to

a point where he can go off of the meds. But he keeps trying. I wish

I could help him more, but I'm not to the point where I can closely

manage both our diets.

Keep us posted on how your DH progresses. And I'd really like to see

the labs if he is willing to release the information.

Sara

>

> My husband was so excited to start is Armour and Foltx today. He

is getting dressed right now to go pick-up his prescription for his

potassium. It is so amazing what a little bit of hope can do. Hope

that you don't have to feel like crud (or worse) for the rest of your

life. I'm sure he had been thinking " this is as good as it is going

to get " and " I'm only getting older so it's going to go downhill from

here " , especially with his family history.

>

> I'm hoping his cholesterol comes down with the Armour. I am so

glad that I stuck to my guns and never let any of our doctors put him

on the statin drugs. Dr R stated that statin drugs would not be a

good idea with his abnormal liver function tests. This is what I've

been telling my husband when the doctors have been wanting to put him

on it.

>

> It is just such a good feeling to have a doctor that " gets it " .

Sharon is so wonderful too. We definitely feel well taken care of.

>

> His mother is insulin dependent. Dr R did the long term blood

sugar. There is no problem there.

>

> Kim In No Texas

>

[Guest guest]

I have never understood these ratios configurations, and even looking at

this, I still don't see what's working here. What basis are you multiplying

x's 1000 on? Where do you get the basis for this? I don't understand why

this is.

Re: Husband's appointment with Dr R

I think it has something to do with determining that there is

enough Free T3 being converted from Free T4 and/or supplied from the

Armour - sort of an expected ratio range when you are in better

shape. T3 is the thyroid hormone that is the usable version in the

cells. But he also looks at where the Free's are in their ranges

along with it. He's looking at this and all other tests together and

I wouldn't presume anything from one person to another as far has

regimen adjustments.

When both DH and I had our first labs, we were in the 19% range of

Free T3 to total Free's. Target is 25-30%. Dr. R mentioned once that

most all of the new patients who come in not feeling well are in the

19% range. There are just amazing similarites in our bodies in how

they react when the thyroid system starts to falter. It's all

connected.

I came up to 31% I think at one point, and then back down into the

mid- 20's. But my Free T4 has remained low and my Free T3 has barely

come to mid range. DH was in the 20%'s last testing, but he was well

over mid range in both Frees.

Here's some detail if you need a sleep aid :-) -

Free T4 lab range - .73-1.95ng (nanograms) 1 nanogram = 1000 picograms

Free T3 lab range - 230-420pg (picograms)

Me - Free T3/(Free T3+Free T4) = 320/[320+(1000x1.10)] = 320/

(320+1100)=320/1420=22.5% - this says my ratio was better, but my

Free T4 (1.10)is well below mid-range. I still was not feeling good

at the time of this blood work. Other tests were not in range.

Husband - Free T3/(Free T3+Free T4) = 380/[380+(1000x1.50)] = 380/

(380+1500)=380/1880=20.2% - this says his ratio got a bit worse, but

his Free T4 (1.50)is well into upper part of range. He was feeling

good and had good results in other tests.

In both instances, we had room for improvement and a bit more Armour

was an option.

Someone please elaborate if you have more information on the ratio

thing.

[Guest guest]

It's just always what Dr. R has noted on my lab results during my and

my DH's appts, as well as others on the board who see him. He makes

the measurement units equal and then uses the formula. Perhaps it is

his own analysis or something that has come through research, like

the BBT's. But it's noted on my labs each time, as to the ratio of

Free T3 to Total Frees, with the target of 25-30%. I think this is

another indication of why Dr. is so much more knowledgeable

than others about hormone balancing.

Maybe someone else will add some additional detail about what Dr.

has told them. I wasn't told more than what the target was.

I will try to ask him about the different measurement units and why

that is, and where the ratio and range came from, when I see him late

next week.

As I noted below, the conversion is due to one Free being stated in

nanograms and the other in picograms. One is 1000 times larger than

the other, hence the multiplying to make equal.

>

> I have never understood these ratios configurations, and even

looking at

> this, I still don't see what's working here. What basis are you

multiplying

> x's 1000 on? Where do you get the basis for this? I don't

understand why

> this is.

>

>

>

> Re: Husband's appointment with Dr R

>

>

> I think it has something to do with determining that there is

> enough Free T3 being converted from Free T4 and/or supplied from the

> Armour - sort of an expected ratio range when you are in better

> shape. T3 is the thyroid hormone that is the usable version in the

> cells. But he also looks at where the Free's are in their ranges

> along with it. He's looking at this and all other tests together and

> I wouldn't presume anything from one person to another as far has

> regimen adjustments.

>

> When both DH and I had our first labs, we were in the 19% range of

> Free T3 to total Free's. Target is 25-30%. Dr. R mentioned once that

> most all of the new patients who come in not feeling well are in the

> 19% range. There are just amazing similarites in our bodies in how

> they react when the thyroid system starts to falter. It's all

> connected.

>

> I came up to 31% I think at one point, and then back down into the

> mid- 20's. But my Free T4 has remained low and my Free T3 has barely

> come to mid range. DH was in the 20%'s last testing, but he was well

> over mid range in both Frees.

>

> Here's some detail if you need a sleep aid :-) -

>

> Free T4 lab range - .73-1.95ng (nanograms) 1 nanogram = 1000

picograms

> Free T3 lab range - 230-420pg (picograms)

>

> Me - Free T3/(Free T3+Free T4) = 320/[320+(1000x1.10)] = 320/

> (320+1100)=320/1420=22.5% - this says my ratio was better, but my

> Free T4 (1.10)is well below mid-range. I still was not feeling good

> at the time of this blood work. Other tests were not in range.

>

> Husband - Free T3/(Free T3+Free T4) = 380/[380+(1000x1.50)] = 380/

> (380+1500)=380/1880=20.2% - this says his ratio got a bit worse, but

> his Free T4 (1.50)is well into upper part of range. He was feeling

> good and had good results in other tests.

>

> In both instances, we had room for improvement and a bit more Armour

> was an option.

>

> Someone please elaborate if you have more information on the ratio

> thing.

>

[Guest guest]

Oh ok, you're telling me that one is being converted to the other, as far as

mathematical equivalents. Duh, I just wasn't " seeing " this, staring at it

for a few minutes. Thank you. (((Sigh))) (Is it brain fog on my part or

what, lol?)

Re: Husband's appointment with Dr R

> It's just always what Dr. R has noted on my lab results during my and

> my DH's appts, as well as others on the board who see him. He makes

> the measurement units equal and then uses the formula. Perhaps it is

> his own analysis or something that has come through research, like

> the BBT's. But it's noted on my labs each time, as to the ratio of

> Free T3 to Total Frees, with the target of 25-30%. I think this is

> another indication of why Dr. is so much more knowledgeable

> than others about hormone balancing.

>

> Maybe someone else will add some additional detail about what Dr.

> has told them. I wasn't told more than what the target was.

> I will try to ask him about the different measurement units and why

> that is, and where the ratio and range came from, when I see him late

> next week.

>

> As I noted below, the conversion is due to one Free being stated in

> nanograms and the other in picograms. One is 1000 times larger than

> the other, hence the multiplying to make equal.