Re: I tripped over a flea today

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

These types of things have happened to me, too. I think you just have

to have those feelings that you had (anger, etc) and then move on and

realize that you got what you went in for. Probably all folks would

have those same emotions, even if they weren't KO's.

If it would help, or change matters, you could go back and tell that

person how they made you feel and that you felt their negative

comments were uncalled for. It is always best to start with that

person one on one. Then if you get the same condescending remarks, you

could talk to their supervisor.

Hang in there!

Di.

[Guest guest]

I also have tons of trouble asking other people for anything. Now

when I have ventured to do so I sometimes got a " We'd be glad to help "

from someone I know fairly well to people practically ignornig my

request, even if it sounded semi-desperate but without me being

demanding or setting up a guilt trip. I think that when a single

parent, for instance, asks another family to be somewhat involved in

your child's life only as much as they can, or giving them a 1-way

ride to something, they somehow see it as whining and " don't bug me, I

have my own family to be busy with " So it's then that I wish I

never would ask anyone anything again, but when the husband of a

person I know somewhat actually takes up my request to put my riding

lawn mower back together after my dad left it all apart for a year,

then I do want to ask again, just not too often or I will feel guilty.

The guy even cleaned it up, put grease on the wheel axles, put a

part of the carburator that was falling off back on, replaced part of

a gas line, made it so that one darn screw would quit falling out,

sharpened the blades, etc. etc. that makes me feel kindof good.

Most of the time people ignore me, though, which is sad. I can't

figure how nada can just call them up and make them do anything but

when I do it I just hear crickets. I guess it's the ole nada having

that tactic of sending guilt or playing on people's emotions.

I think it is a flea. I remember when I was 2 and asked my grandnada

for a cookie. She gave it to me. Second time I asked for a cookie

later on she was cussing under her breath, and it really scared me and

made me feel bad, so I think that's when I started getting the idea I

hated asking anyone for anything.

I can't figure it out. I picture me 10 years down the road telling

people I needed help with this or that and picturing them saying,

" Well, ifonly you had asked us back then! " but when I ask them now,

it's like too much of a bother. Definitely with people I don't know

all that well, andmost people I don't know that well. But sometimes

you find a generous person here and there. Some people are just not

as giving as others; sometimes it's b/c they don't eventually want to

be taken advantage of. You know, like you babysit someone's kid and

then they start wanting to drop their kid off at your house every

opportunity that comes up just so they can go shopping or whatever.

So I guess some people fear other people will take advantage of them.

It's also possible you could have " read " that person not quite right

b/c of anticipation of responses you learned from nada. I know KOs

tend to read people quite well, but sometimes it's just a little " off "

b/c of our

anticipation of a particular response we always received.

I think the best situation I have found where I could ask someone for

something is when that other person tells me they appreciate something

I have done or they owe me a big favor or whatever. Of course that

does not happen very often, but that's the situation under which I got

my lawnmower put back together.

Theresa

> Hi KOs,

>

> Something happened today at work that I'm just getting around to

> admitting to myself. Tonight I realized that because of this event,

> since then I've been back to old habits, avoiding what I'm feeling

> and trying to ignore what's bothering me. Once I recognized this

> (the sudden anxiety for no solid reason was the red flag), I spent

> some time being present in my emotions, and I discovered

> embarrassment and sadness, and a whole lotta shame.

>

> In generic terms, this is what happened: I finally worked up the

> nerve to ask someone for something I really needed for health

> reasons (this is hard for me to do in the first place). The response

> I got back was basically a suggestion that my request was not only

> frivolous, but also that it was taking advantage, and for selfish

> reasons. Worse, the request was granted.

>

> This is exactly what my nada does, the whole, " you don't deserve

> this but here it is anyway, I hope you choke on it " routine. It

> always makes me feel like I have to account for my existence, and I

> think that's where the anger/shame/anxiety comes from. The fact that

> I " selfishly " inconvenienced someone else is where the guilt comes

> from.

>

> My initial reaction was intense anger (once I was alone, of course),

> followed by guilt and depression. When I finally paid attention, I

> saw the embarrassment and shame. I shut down and vowed to not ask

> anyone for anything ever again (a defense mechanism, of course).

>

> I feel very hurt by this, and the depth of that feeling tells me

> that this is a flea. I also can't be sure that my perceptions are

> accurate - I was questioned about the request I made, and that in

> itself made me feel all those things. Whether or not it was supposed

> to make me feel bad, I honestly couldn't say. I don't know this

> person very well.

>

> It doesn't really matter to me if this other person was in the right

> or wrong on this. I'm posting this here because I'd like to work on

> the flea I found. How do I ask for what I need, defend my reasons

> for needing things in a calm, healthy way, and not be horribly hurt

> by implications (actual or perceived) that I'm being selfish or

> unreasonable? How can I start to feel like a person with legitimate

> needs?

>

> As I think about it, this has happened before with other people and

> other situations. A big, ugly flea, and I just discovered it.

>

> Blech. Someone please pass the flea powder.

>

>

>

>

> Send questions and/or concerns to ModOasis-owner

> " Stop Walking on Eggshells, " a primer for non-BPs, can be ordered via

1-888-35-SHELL () and for the table of contents, go to:

> http://www.BPDCentral.com

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I also have tons of trouble asking other people for anything. Now

when I have ventured to do so I sometimes got a " We'd be glad to help "

from someone I know fairly well to people practically ignornig my

request, even if it sounded semi-desperate but without me being

demanding or setting up a guilt trip. I think that when a single

parent, for instance, asks another family to be somewhat involved in

your child's life only as much as they can, or giving them a 1-way

ride to something, they somehow see it as whining and " don't bug me, I

have my own family to be busy with " So it's then that I wish I

never would ask anyone anything again, but when the husband of a

person I know somewhat actually takes up my request to put my riding

lawn mower back together after my dad left it all apart for a year,

then I do want to ask again, just not too often or I will feel guilty.

The guy even cleaned it up, put grease on the wheel axles, put a

part of the carburator that was falling off back on, replaced part of

a gas line, made it so that one darn screw would quit falling out,

sharpened the blades, etc. etc. that makes me feel kindof good.

Most of the time people ignore me, though, which is sad. I can't

figure how nada can just call them up and make them do anything but

when I do it I just hear crickets. I guess it's the ole nada having

that tactic of sending guilt or playing on people's emotions.

I think it is a flea. I remember when I was 2 and asked my grandnada

for a cookie. She gave it to me. Second time I asked for a cookie

later on she was cussing under her breath, and it really scared me and

made me feel bad, so I think that's when I started getting the idea I

hated asking anyone for anything.

I can't figure it out. I picture me 10 years down the road telling

people I needed help with this or that and picturing them saying,

" Well, ifonly you had asked us back then! " but when I ask them now,

it's like too much of a bother. Definitely with people I don't know

all that well, andmost people I don't know that well. But sometimes

you find a generous person here and there. Some people are just not

as giving as others; sometimes it's b/c they don't eventually want to

be taken advantage of. You know, like you babysit someone's kid and

then they start wanting to drop their kid off at your house every

opportunity that comes up just so they can go shopping or whatever.

So I guess some people fear other people will take advantage of them.

It's also possible you could have " read " that person not quite right

b/c of anticipation of responses you learned from nada. I know KOs

tend to read people quite well, but sometimes it's just a little " off "

b/c of our

anticipation of a particular response we always received.

I think the best situation I have found where I could ask someone for

something is when that other person tells me they appreciate something

I have done or they owe me a big favor or whatever. Of course that

does not happen very often, but that's the situation under which I got

my lawnmower put back together.

Theresa

> Hi KOs,

>

> Something happened today at work that I'm just getting around to

> admitting to myself. Tonight I realized that because of this event,

> since then I've been back to old habits, avoiding what I'm feeling

> and trying to ignore what's bothering me. Once I recognized this

> (the sudden anxiety for no solid reason was the red flag), I spent

> some time being present in my emotions, and I discovered

> embarrassment and sadness, and a whole lotta shame.

>

> In generic terms, this is what happened: I finally worked up the

> nerve to ask someone for something I really needed for health

> reasons (this is hard for me to do in the first place). The response

> I got back was basically a suggestion that my request was not only

> frivolous, but also that it was taking advantage, and for selfish

> reasons. Worse, the request was granted.

>

> This is exactly what my nada does, the whole, " you don't deserve

> this but here it is anyway, I hope you choke on it " routine. It

> always makes me feel like I have to account for my existence, and I

> think that's where the anger/shame/anxiety comes from. The fact that

> I " selfishly " inconvenienced someone else is where the guilt comes

> from.

>

> My initial reaction was intense anger (once I was alone, of course),

> followed by guilt and depression. When I finally paid attention, I

> saw the embarrassment and shame. I shut down and vowed to not ask

> anyone for anything ever again (a defense mechanism, of course).

>

> I feel very hurt by this, and the depth of that feeling tells me

> that this is a flea. I also can't be sure that my perceptions are

> accurate - I was questioned about the request I made, and that in

> itself made me feel all those things. Whether or not it was supposed

> to make me feel bad, I honestly couldn't say. I don't know this

> person very well.

>

> It doesn't really matter to me if this other person was in the right

> or wrong on this. I'm posting this here because I'd like to work on

> the flea I found. How do I ask for what I need, defend my reasons

> for needing things in a calm, healthy way, and not be horribly hurt

> by implications (actual or perceived) that I'm being selfish or

> unreasonable? How can I start to feel like a person with legitimate

> needs?

>

> As I think about it, this has happened before with other people and

> other situations. A big, ugly flea, and I just discovered it.

>

> Blech. Someone please pass the flea powder.

>

>

>

>

> Send questions and/or concerns to ModOasis-owner

> " Stop Walking on Eggshells, " a primer for non-BPs, can be ordered via

1-888-35-SHELL () and for the table of contents, go to:

> http://www.BPDCentral.com

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks Di,

In reading your response and thinking about this some more, I

discovered a couple of perceptions I have that are probably not quite

accurate.

I'm always trying to help other people - that's a side-effect for me

of being a KO and I tend to pick the jobs that are more service-

oriented. As a result, when someone comes to me with a need it never

crosses my mind that they're being " selfish " or " unreasonable " ,

because I'm too busy thinking of ways to help them. To a reasonable

point, of course . So I'm shocked when I ask for something -

especially if it's the first request I've ever made of the person,

which in this case it was - and I get the kind of response that I did.

I expect this from nada, but I have to remember that there ARE other

people out there who, if not exactly like nada, act in less than

generous ways for reasons of their own.

This particular woman strikes me as being generally unhappy. And the

more I think about it, I'm convinced that her response was much more

about her unhappiness than it was about my request. I mean, when you

feel miserable and resentful about what life has handed you, why would

you freely help other people fulfill their own needs?

Perhaps the key to not taking it so personally is to remember that

often it's not really about me at all. Everyone operates out of their

own reality, including me.

Still processing.

Thanks,

> Hi ,

> These types of things have happened to me, too. I think you just

have

> to have those feelings that you had (anger, etc) and then move on

and

> realize that you got what you went in for. Probably all folks would

> have those same emotions, even if they weren't KO's.

>

> If it would help, or change matters, you could go back and tell that

> person how they made you feel and that you felt their negative

> comments were uncalled for. It is always best to start with that

> person one on one. Then if you get the same condescending remarks,

you

> could talk to their supervisor.

>

> Hang in there!

>

> Di.

[Guest guest]

Thanks Theresa,

Your story about the cookie really resonated with me. I remember

similar situations with my nada when I was young, asking for

something and getting grumbles in return. And then getting what I

asked for, but paying for it over and over again. I think that's

where my reaction of wanting to return this thing comes from - I

don't want to pay for it repeatedly - not worth the price. It could

also be a form of self-punishment (I noticed an inner voice being

disgusted with me for needing it in the first place). I'm trying to

remember that my needs are valid, too.

In this respect I find that people are hard to read. Maybe because

all of my experiences with asking for help from adults when I was

little were so inconsistent. And in some ways they still are! Like I

said in my last post, people operate from their own realities, and

those realities are all different.

> > Hi KOs,

> >

> > Something happened today at work that I'm just getting around to

> > admitting to myself. Tonight I realized that because of this

event,

> > since then I've been back to old habits, avoiding what I'm

feeling

> > and trying to ignore what's bothering me. Once I recognized this

> > (the sudden anxiety for no solid reason was the red flag), I

spent

> > some time being present in my emotions, and I discovered

> > embarrassment and sadness, and a whole lotta shame.

> >

> > In generic terms, this is what happened: I finally worked up the

> > nerve to ask someone for something I really needed for health

> > reasons (this is hard for me to do in the first place). The

response

> > I got back was basically a suggestion that my request was not

only

> > frivolous, but also that it was taking advantage, and for selfish

> > reasons. Worse, the request was granted.

> >

> > This is exactly what my nada does, the whole, " you don't deserve

> > this but here it is anyway, I hope you choke on it " routine. It

> > always makes me feel like I have to account for my existence,

and I

> > think that's where the anger/shame/anxiety comes from. The fact

that

> > I " selfishly " inconvenienced someone else is where the guilt

comes

> > from.

> >

> > My initial reaction was intense anger (once I was alone, of

course),

> > followed by guilt and depression. When I finally paid attention,

I

> > saw the embarrassment and shame. I shut down and vowed to not ask

> > anyone for anything ever again (a defense mechanism, of course).

> >

> > I feel very hurt by this, and the depth of that feeling tells me

> > that this is a flea. I also can't be sure that my perceptions are

> > accurate - I was questioned about the request I made, and that in

> > itself made me feel all those things. Whether or not it was

supposed

> > to make me feel bad, I honestly couldn't say. I don't know this

> > person very well.

> >

> > It doesn't really matter to me if this other person was in the

right

> > or wrong on this. I'm posting this here because I'd like to work

on

> > the flea I found. How do I ask for what I need, defend my reasons

> > for needing things in a calm, healthy way, and not be horribly

hurt

> > by implications (actual or perceived) that I'm being selfish or

> > unreasonable? How can I start to feel like a person with

legitimate

> > needs?

> >

> > As I think about it, this has happened before with other people

and

> > other situations. A big, ugly flea, and I just discovered it.

> >

> > Blech. Someone please pass the flea powder.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Send questions and/or concerns to ModOasis-owner

> > " Stop Walking on Eggshells, " a primer for non-BPs, can be

ordered via 1-888-35-SHELL () and for the table of

contents, go to:

> > http://www.BPDCentral.com

> >

> >

> >