Re: Strength and speed/power

[Guest guest]

Solid thoughts. One thing that seems to be true is that adding

muscle mass MAY be an issue in speed development. That is why isos

are so handy, as you can increase you strength and not add any

appreciable muscle mass. Moreover, there is some evidence that the

fast twitch muscle fibers are deeply accessed with the use of isos.

That is the theory anyway.

All I know is that I am much quicker with my hands when I use isos

for strength training as opposed to using weights.

Go figure.

>

>

> It's usually quite common to hear that strength training impedes

> speed, or something to that effect. Some even say that one should

not

> resistance train if they want to be fast.

>

> However, I think strength and speed are unrelated. One trains for

> strength one way (isometrics, resistance training), and one trains

for

> speed another way (coordination, movement repetition).

>

> So if you want to develop both strength and speed, you simply

workout

> for strength, and make sure you ALSO workout for speed. One does

not

> necessarily affect the other. (Well... training for speed can

increase

> strength somewhat.)

>

> I've been a martial arts practitioner interested in strength

training.

> And from my experience, my speed suffers if I don't train for

speed,

> whether or not I'm in training for strength. And even if I am

training

> for strength, my speed still improves if I also train for speed.

>

> A sprinter can train with squats, but his speed will only improve

if

> he also keeps sprinting. Squats will only impede his speed IF he

stops

> sprinting. But if he keeps his sprint training, his squats will

> improve his sprint by strengthening is muscles.

>

> So my recommendation would be to go ahead and train for strength,

but

> you still have to maintain your speed training. They're two

different

> things. And they do complement each other.

>

> Gerry

[Guest guest]

Solid thoughts. One thing that seems to be true is that adding

muscle mass MAY be an issue in speed development. That is why isos

are so handy, as you can increase you strength and not add any

appreciable muscle mass. Moreover, there is some evidence that the

fast twitch muscle fibers are deeply accessed with the use of isos.

That is the theory anyway.

All I know is that I am much quicker with my hands when I use isos

for strength training as opposed to using weights.

Go figure.

>

>

> It's usually quite common to hear that strength training impedes

> speed, or something to that effect. Some even say that one should

not

> resistance train if they want to be fast.

>

> However, I think strength and speed are unrelated. One trains for

> strength one way (isometrics, resistance training), and one trains

for

> speed another way (coordination, movement repetition).

>

> So if you want to develop both strength and speed, you simply

workout

> for strength, and make sure you ALSO workout for speed. One does

not

> necessarily affect the other. (Well... training for speed can

increase

> strength somewhat.)

>

> I've been a martial arts practitioner interested in strength

training.

> And from my experience, my speed suffers if I don't train for

speed,

> whether or not I'm in training for strength. And even if I am

training

> for strength, my speed still improves if I also train for speed.

>

> A sprinter can train with squats, but his speed will only improve

if

> he also keeps sprinting. Squats will only impede his speed IF he

stops

> sprinting. But if he keeps his sprint training, his squats will

> improve his sprint by strengthening is muscles.

>

> So my recommendation would be to go ahead and train for strength,

but

> you still have to maintain your speed training. They're two

different

> things. And they do complement each other.

>

> Gerry

[Guest guest]

Solid thoughts. One thing that seems to be true is that adding

muscle mass MAY be an issue in speed development. That is why isos

are so handy, as you can increase you strength and not add any

appreciable muscle mass. Moreover, there is some evidence that the

fast twitch muscle fibers are deeply accessed with the use of isos.

That is the theory anyway.

All I know is that I am much quicker with my hands when I use isos

for strength training as opposed to using weights.

Go figure.

>

>

> It's usually quite common to hear that strength training impedes

> speed, or something to that effect. Some even say that one should

not

> resistance train if they want to be fast.

>

> However, I think strength and speed are unrelated. One trains for

> strength one way (isometrics, resistance training), and one trains

for

> speed another way (coordination, movement repetition).

>

> So if you want to develop both strength and speed, you simply

workout

> for strength, and make sure you ALSO workout for speed. One does

not

> necessarily affect the other. (Well... training for speed can

increase

> strength somewhat.)

>

> I've been a martial arts practitioner interested in strength

training.

> And from my experience, my speed suffers if I don't train for

speed,

> whether or not I'm in training for strength. And even if I am

training

> for strength, my speed still improves if I also train for speed.

>

> A sprinter can train with squats, but his speed will only improve

if

> he also keeps sprinting. Squats will only impede his speed IF he

stops

> sprinting. But if he keeps his sprint training, his squats will

> improve his sprint by strengthening is muscles.

>

> So my recommendation would be to go ahead and train for strength,

but

> you still have to maintain your speed training. They're two

different

> things. And they do complement each other.

>

> Gerry

[Guest guest]

Aren't " fast twitch " the fibers that result in mass?

Personally, I don't think there are fast or slow fibers. I think what

muscle fibers we have can become fast or slow fibers depending on our

training. Maybe molecular techniques available now can see what is

really so.

Gerry

>

> ...Moreover, there is some evidence that the

> fast twitch muscle fibers are deeply accessed with the use of isos.

>

> That is the theory anyway.

[Guest guest]

Aren't " fast twitch " the fibers that result in mass?

Personally, I don't think there are fast or slow fibers. I think what

muscle fibers we have can become fast or slow fibers depending on our

training. Maybe molecular techniques available now can see what is

really so.

Gerry

>

> ...Moreover, there is some evidence that the

> fast twitch muscle fibers are deeply accessed with the use of isos.

>

> That is the theory anyway.

[Guest guest]

Aren't " fast twitch " the fibers that result in mass?

Personally, I don't think there are fast or slow fibers. I think what

muscle fibers we have can become fast or slow fibers depending on our

training. Maybe molecular techniques available now can see what is

really so.

Gerry

>

> ...Moreover, there is some evidence that the

> fast twitch muscle fibers are deeply accessed with the use of isos.

>

> That is the theory anyway.

[Guest guest]

-Based on muscle biopsies, there are different characteristics to

these different types of fibers. Apparently, the relative

percentage of these fibers determine your top end potential for

certain physical performance.

IE, Carl has a higher percentage of these fast twitch babies

and he certainly actualized them through traninig. Since he was not

large (muscle mass), I don't know what this says about fast twitch

fibers being the ones that generate mass.

-- In bullworkerclub , " knuj_gse "

<gerardo.esguerra@u...> wrote:

>

> Aren't " fast twitch " the fibers that result in mass?

>

> Personally, I don't think there are fast or slow fibers. I think

what

> muscle fibers we have can become fast or slow fibers depending on

our

> training. Maybe molecular techniques available now can see what is

> really so.

>

> Gerry

>

>

> >

> > ...Moreover, there is some evidence that the

> > fast twitch muscle fibers are deeply accessed with the use of

isos.

> >

> > That is the theory anyway.

[Guest guest]

-Based on muscle biopsies, there are different characteristics to

these different types of fibers. Apparently, the relative

percentage of these fibers determine your top end potential for

certain physical performance.

IE, Carl has a higher percentage of these fast twitch babies

and he certainly actualized them through traninig. Since he was not

large (muscle mass), I don't know what this says about fast twitch

fibers being the ones that generate mass.

-- In bullworkerclub , " knuj_gse "

<gerardo.esguerra@u...> wrote:

>

> Aren't " fast twitch " the fibers that result in mass?

>

> Personally, I don't think there are fast or slow fibers. I think

what

> muscle fibers we have can become fast or slow fibers depending on

our

> training. Maybe molecular techniques available now can see what is

> really so.

>

> Gerry

>

>

> >

> > ...Moreover, there is some evidence that the

> > fast twitch muscle fibers are deeply accessed with the use of

isos.

> >

> > That is the theory anyway.

[Guest guest]

>

> -Based on muscle biopsies, there are different characteristics to

> these different types of fibers. Apparently, the relative

> percentage of these fibers determine your top end potential for

> certain physical performance.

Yes, but from what I've seen so far, such biopsies were done on

" existing " states, such as long distance runners compared to

sprinters, or similar such comparisons.

What I'm thinking is: taking the same muscle fiber, apply (train it)

speed. Will it not develop into fast twitch? (adjusting enzyme

systems, anaerobic pathways, etc.) Now take the same muscle fiber and

apply endurance training. Will it not develop into slow twitch?

(developing aerobic pathways, etc.) So far, I have not seen such

studies, but knowing the adaptability of the body, I suspect that this

is what is actually going on.

That sprinters have more fast twitch and marathoners slow twitch may

probably be more of effect, rather than cause.

> I don't know what this says about fast twitch

> fibers being the ones that generate mass.

Just read about this, that is, fast twitch are more bulky than slow

twitch. Some compare runners as the illustration: sprinters are more

massive than marthoners.

Gerry

[Guest guest]

The current theory is that no, you cannot change the nature of the

fibers but as you train, you can have some develop and some

atrophy. I think this is intuitive. No matter how I trained, I did

not develop the speed nor the development of my childhood buddy, who

simply had the body for speed.

> >

> > -Based on muscle biopsies, there are different characteristics

to

> > these different types of fibers. Apparently, the relative

> > percentage of these fibers determine your top end potential for

> > certain physical performance.

>

> Yes, but from what I've seen so far, such biopsies were done on

> " existing " states, such as long distance runners compared to

> sprinters, or similar such comparisons.

>

> What I'm thinking is: taking the same muscle fiber, apply (train

it)

> speed. Will it not develop into fast twitch? (adjusting enzyme

> systems, anaerobic pathways, etc.) Now take the same muscle fiber

and

> apply endurance training. Will it not develop into slow twitch?

> (developing aerobic pathways, etc.) So far, I have not seen such

> studies, but knowing the adaptability of the body, I suspect that

this

> is what is actually going on.

>

> That sprinters have more fast twitch and marathoners slow twitch

may

> probably be more of effect, rather than cause.

>

> > I don't know what this says about fast twitch

> > fibers being the ones that generate mass.

>

> Just read about this, that is, fast twitch are more bulky than

slow

> twitch. Some compare runners as the illustration: sprinters are

more

> massive than marthoners.

>

> Gerry