Guest guest Posted September 2, 2003 Report Share Posted September 2, 2003 Dear Lynne, Oh YES!! We deal with that. My daughter has OCD, ADHD and TS. Her OCD was brought on suddenly by an illness, though not strep, so she is kind of a PANDAS kid, but not quite. Her biggest problem (or perhaps OUR biggest problem) is her impulsive behavior. She loses her cool and says things to friends that are not forgotten or forgiven, occasionally lashes out at one of us, and always speaks before she has thought anything through. She also acts impulsively, without ever thinking about the consequences. Some ADHD experts consider that the defining characteristic of ADHD (not learning consequences from past behavior in order to inhibit future actions). Our psychiatrist told us that this is also very much part of the OCD with tics picture - which is often OCD caused by PANDAS. At any rate, it's part of the package of our kids' kind of OCD. It's *very* frustrating, isn't it?? We just went through this last night when our 11 yr. old daughter was leaping onto her bed, without any shirt on, in front of her window with her bedroom light on. With her curtains open. We have gone over this about seven million times, but she NEVER thinks to close her shade or put on clothing before we remind her. Every time we point it out she looks at us like it's new information. I have been trying to stop her and get her to listen to what she sounds like when she blurts out something not very nice (usually to her brother). She now agrees that she wouldn't like to hear it from someone else, but I don't see any sign that she is learning to control it. Good luck with this! Let me know if you make any progress on it! in NV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 3, 2003 Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 You said a phrase that really caught my attention... " like it is new information " . That is exactly it...even our little son reminds the older one that I already said something one dozen times!!!! Thanks! >From: efowle@... >Reply-To: >To: >Subject: Re: outspoken behavior >Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2003 13:59:32 EDT > >Dear Lynne, > Oh YES!! We deal with that. My daughter has OCD, ADHD and TS. Her OCD >was >brought on suddenly by an illness, though not strep, so she is kind of a >PANDAS kid, but not quite. Her biggest problem (or perhaps OUR biggest >problem) is >her impulsive behavior. She loses her cool and says things to friends that >are not forgotten or forgiven, occasionally lashes out at one of us, and >always >speaks before she has thought anything through. She also acts impulsively, >without ever thinking about the consequences. Some ADHD experts consider >that the >defining characteristic of ADHD (not learning consequences from past >behavior >in order to inhibit future actions). Our psychiatrist told us that this is >also very much part of the OCD with tics picture - which is often OCD >caused by >PANDAS. At any rate, it's part of the package of our kids' kind of OCD. >It's >*very* frustrating, isn't it?? > We just went through this last night when our 11 yr. old daughter was >leaping onto her bed, without any shirt on, in front of her window with her >bedroom light on. With her curtains open. We have gone over this about >seven >million times, but she NEVER thinks to close her shade or put on clothing >before we >remind her. Every time we point it out she looks at us like it's new >information. > I have been trying to stop her and get her to listen to what she >sounds >like when she blurts out something not very nice (usually to her brother). >She >now agrees that she wouldn't like to hear it from someone else, but I don't >see any sign that she is learning to control it. >Good luck with this! Let me know if you make any progress on it! > in NV > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 4, 2003 Report Share Posted September 4, 2003 HI Lynne: Sometimes this can be a compulsion where OCD is insisting on the vocalization to reduce anxiety. Sometimes this can be impulsivity which is a symptom of other disorders, and sometimes this can be a social blindness to what is appropriate. It sounds like this symptom is being sufficiently disruptive of your daughter and her family's lives that it needs to be assessed by a skilled clinician. OCD and TS are sometimes part of a triad which includes ADHD which covers impulsivity. Although this triad is more common in males than females, you may want to discuss your concerns with your daughter's p-doc. Since E & RP for OCD well done is so effective typically, you may want to consider what else is operating that is making it difficult for your daughter to function effectively in her social settings. Good luck, take care, aloha,Kathy (h) P.S. Sometimes my son, Steve, does this. For him it is his scrupulosity coming to the forefront. K. kathy.hi@... outspoken behavior Hi Has anyone else experienced this difficulty... my child will say whatever she feels when she thinks it without giving any thought to what the consequences will be for herself or others. She has ocd and ts (pandas type) and has worked on this with minimal success. It is usually not bad as in bad language or inappropriate, but is often hurtful or rude. I feel like I am repeating myself over and over but it truly seems like she has little control. She has done well in all other areas of using her ERp when necessary and CBT. Has good control over tics, all the time, except when very tired or greatly stressed(which we have kept to a tiny spec!0. Thanks lynne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 5, 2003 Report Share Posted September 5, 2003 Hi Kathy In what way is it your son's scrupilosity; by thinking he is correct with everything? I have wondered this as well. See, she has enough insight to know it is affecting her negatively. Can you explain that further. Thankyou! Lynne > >Reply-To: >To: < > >Subject: RE: outspoken behavior >Date: Wed, 3 Sep 2003 21:42:36 -1000 > >HI Lynne: > >Sometimes this can be a compulsion where OCD is insisting on the >vocalization to reduce anxiety. Sometimes this can be impulsivity which >is a symptom of other disorders, and sometimes this can be a social >blindness to what is appropriate. It sounds like this symptom is being >sufficiently disruptive of your daughter and her family's lives that it >needs to be assessed by a skilled clinician. > >OCD and TS are sometimes part of a triad which includes ADHD which >covers impulsivity. Although this triad is more common in males than >females, you may want to discuss your concerns with your daughter's >p-doc. Since E & RP for OCD well done is so effective typically, you may >want to consider what else is operating that is making it difficult for >your daughter to function effectively in her social settings. Good >luck, take care, aloha,Kathy (h) > >P.S. Sometimes my son, Steve, does this. For him it is his scrupulosity >coming to the forefront. K. > >kathy.hi@... > > outspoken behavior > >Hi >Has anyone else experienced this difficulty... >my child will say whatever she feels when she thinks it without giving >any >thought to what the consequences will be for herself or others. She has >ocd >and ts (pandas type) and has worked on this with minimal success. It is > >usually not bad as in bad language or inappropriate, but is often >hurtful or >rude. I feel like I am repeating myself over and over but it truly >seems >like she has little control. >She has done well in all other areas of using her ERp when necessary and > >CBT. Has good control over tics, all the time, except when very tired >or >greatly stressed(which we have kept to a tiny spec!0. >Thanks >lynne > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 5, 2003 Report Share Posted September 5, 2003 Hi Lynne, a different Kathy replying :-) I'm coming in late on this thread but wanted to say that my daughter 9 also tends to blurt out things before considering them. She even does that thing where she'll say something and then quickly cover her mouth in surprise as though the remark just jumped out without her knowing it was coming. Her remarks are not very often hurtful carrying anger or spite, more in the category of " better left unsaid " or " waaaay off topic " which sometimes causes her friends to look at her funny as though thinking " where did that come from? " . It doesn't seem to be a compulsive scrupe thing where she *must* set others straight in their thinking or actions. Kel can't explain it except to say that " OCD just takes over her body sometimes " yet agrees this is not really OCD in that there is no anxiety, bad thought etc. Anyway she doesn't like this about herself and would like this to stop. I have noticed that Risperdal reduces these blurted remarks so perhaps it is more an urge, impulse thing rather than OCD in her at least. Good luck, Kathy R. in Indiana ----- Original Message ----- From: lynne DE Hi Kathy In what way is it your son's scrupilosity; by thinking he is correct with everything? I have wondered this as well. See, she has enough insight to know it is affecting her negatively. Can you explain that further. Thankyou! Lynne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 7, 2003 Report Share Posted September 7, 2003 HI Lynne: Steve has symptoms of what I call non-religious scrupulosity. He suffers from hypermorality and sometimes hyper-criticality and then feels terribly bad and guilty about it. Really he is a very sweet guy. Steve has a very strong sense of what is right and wrong; and he also has a tendency to express this. I encourage him to think what he thinks but to control his behavior, i.e. expressing what he is thinking. I remind him he can control his behavior but not necessarily his thoughts and feelings. And when he can control his behavior, over time his thoughts and feelings will change too. This is very well explained in Dr. Lee Baer's wonderful book, " Getting Control. " I hope this brief explanation helps, if not, please ask again and I will try to respond more effectively. Take care, aloha,Kathy (h) kathy.hi@... RE: outspoken behavior Hi Kathy In what way is it your son's scrupilosity; by thinking he is correct with everything? I have wondered this as well. See, she has enough insight to know it is affecting her negatively. Can you explain that further. Thankyou! Lynne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 7, 2003 Report Share Posted September 7, 2003 ----- Original Message ----- From: kathy.hi > but to control his behavior, i.e. expressing what he is thinking. I remind him he can control his behavior but not necessarily his thoughts and feelings. And when he can control his behavior, over time his thoughts and feelings will change too. This is very well explained in Dr. Lee Baer's wonderful book, " Getting Control. " *****I would like to second this, the technique of changing behavior to change feelings and/or thoughts has been the one most effecting technique or " tool " Kel has learned in CBT. It also is something that she can think of " in the moment " often she has trouble thinking what she can do when " under attack " by thoughts or bad feelings. Her therapist showed her a triangle, the sides were rubber bands with corner knobs labeled " behavior " , " thoughts " , and " feelings " . He showed how if one corner of the triangle moved (changed) it pulled the others (changed them) too. Sometimes something comes along to change how we are feeling or what we are thinking (ex. unexpected package in the mail) but usually the only one of the things we have control over is our behavior. Kel has learned that if she changes her behavior--which usually involves bossing back or not doing whatever OCD is urging her to do--fairly quickly her feelings and thoughts change and she has pulled herself out of an OCD downward spiral. Kathy R. in Indiana Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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