Re: Vets: Hypertrophy Specific Training (High Vol/High Freq)

[Guest guest]

The only caveat I'd add to this is that it is a classic example of

what everyone tends to do at first - put chest first because we like

to brag about our bench press and put pushing movements first.

Unfortunately, people do this so consistently that they create major

imbalances. The chest and quadriceps are much stronger than the

hamstring and back, so what happens is that you have an uneven pull

on your rotator cuff (affects posture and can lead to rotator cuff

injuries - in fact, bench press is the leading cause of shoulder

injury in the gym, when simply rowing enough so that your back

strength compares to your chest strength can help prevent that) and

then you have an uneven pull through your pelvis/hip area (tight,

weak hamstrings will cause unnatural pelvic rotation which results

in compression of the spine, back pain, etc).

So, everyone, whether you're doing a BFL routine or any other, try

to balance your muscles - if you do quads first in the workout for 4

weeks, the next 4 weeks try putting hamstrings first. If you like to

bench press, try putting rowing first. And remember, too, that while

the back seems like one muscle, functionally it works in two planes.

You should balance chest presses with rows and miitary presses with

pull-down/pull-up movements.

In health,

Likness

> I saw this on another list, and it is SO similar to BFL that I

thought I would post it here

>

> > -----Original Message-----

> > From: Mr. Uxo

> >

> > Here is a program I designed that utilizes high volume, high

frequency

> > training. Took me almost 14 yrs to finally realize my best

results come with

> > higher frequency training.

> >

> > 1) Program involves lifting every other day with cardio on off

days or rest

> > if you so choose.

> >

> > 2) Program involves training each muscle 3-4 times/week. Such as

Mon, Wed,

> > Fri, Sun, Tues., Thur, Sat, Mon, etc.

> >

> > 3) Choose only 1 exercise per muscle on any given training day.

> >

> > 4) Start with a weight you can do for 10 reps, and each set

increase 2.5-10

> > pounds until you can no longer get at least 8 reps. You should

hit this

> > failure no later then the 4th set if not sooner if your lifting

heavy. If

> > it's too light and your doing 10 reps too easily increase

weight. if too

> > heavy and not getting at least 8 reps, decrease weight unless

your on your

> > 3rd or 4th set and have hit failure then your done with the

exercise.

> >

> > 5) Make sure to eat like a pig!

>

> (I would suggest BFL - Brett)

> >

> > I'm going to post a sample program with exercises you could

follow. You can

> > always use your own exercises.

> >

> > Day 1

> > Bench Press superset with A Rowing Movement for the Back

> > Squats superset with Seated Leg Curls

> > Dumbbell lateral or front delt raise

> > Barbell Curls superset with Tricep Pressdowns

> > Optional Crunches and low back work

> >

> > Day 2

> > Cardio

> >

> > Day 3

> > Incline bench superset with Lat pulldowns

> > Leg press superset with lying leg curls

> > Barbell shrugs

> > barbell curls superset with lying french presses (tri extension)

> > Calf Raises

> >

> > Day 4

> > Cardio

> >

> > Day 5

> > *Dumbbell bench Presses superset with One arm rows superset with

dumbbell

> > pullovers. This is tough; I use 100 pounders for all 3

exercises. Believe

> > me, this is one tough superset.

> > *Leg Extensions superset with leg curls or deadlifts

> > *Shoulder exercise of your choice, you can even do dumbbell

shrugs when you

> > finish the tri set above using same weight.

> > And again, bi and tri superset

> > Optional Crunches and low back work

> >

> > Day 6

> > Cardio

> >

> (insert free day - Brett)

>

> > Day 7

> > Power clean and Presses (I keep these reps no higher then 5)

> > Front Squats

> > An Easy seated Chest Press machine

> > Easy back exercise like a lat pulldown or row machine

> > Any arms.

> > Optional Crunches and low back work

> >

> > Day 8

> > Cardio

> >

> > Day 9

> > Repeat Program, etc....

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Absolutely!

However many pushing sets you do you need to do an equal number of

pulling... and on the same plane. How many people over-develop the

anterior delt and forget about the rear? Do one set of rows (or

none) and then hit the pecs with the bench, dips, flyes, incline,

decline... a recipe for shoulder damage and tears.

Making sure to alternate the push/pull motions can help keep it in

balance, and your advice to start a routine with bench one workout

and rows the next is the best way avoid those shoulder injuries.

Balnace. And don't forget the shrugs!

> > I saw this on another list, and it is SO similar to BFL that I

> thought I would post it here

> >

> > > -----Original Message-----

> > > From: Mr. Uxo

> > >

> > > Here is a program I designed that utilizes high volume, high

> frequency

> > > training. Took me almost 14 yrs to finally realize my best

> results come with

> > > higher frequency training.

> > >

> > > 1) Program involves lifting every other day with cardio on off

> days or rest

> > > if you so choose.

> > >

> > > 2) Program involves training each muscle 3-4 times/week. Such

as

> Mon, Wed,

> > > Fri, Sun, Tues., Thur, Sat, Mon, etc.

> > >

> > > 3) Choose only 1 exercise per muscle on any given training day.

> > >

> > > 4) Start with a weight you can do for 10 reps, and each set

> increase 2.5-10

> > > pounds until you can no longer get at least 8 reps. You should

> hit this

> > > failure no later then the 4th set if not sooner if your

lifting

> heavy. If

> > > it's too light and your doing 10 reps too easily increase

> weight. if too

> > > heavy and not getting at least 8 reps, decrease weight unless

> your on your

> > > 3rd or 4th set and have hit failure then your done with the

> exercise.

> > >

> > > 5) Make sure to eat like a pig!

> >

> > (I would suggest BFL - Brett)

> > >

> > > I'm going to post a sample program with exercises you could

> follow. You can

> > > always use your own exercises.

> > >

> > > Day 1

> > > Bench Press superset with A Rowing Movement for the Back

> > > Squats superset with Seated Leg Curls

> > > Dumbbell lateral or front delt raise

> > > Barbell Curls superset with Tricep Pressdowns

> > > Optional Crunches and low back work

> > >

> > > Day 2

> > > Cardio

> > >

> > > Day 3

> > > Incline bench superset with Lat pulldowns

> > > Leg press superset with lying leg curls

> > > Barbell shrugs

> > > barbell curls superset with lying french presses (tri

extension)

> > > Calf Raises

> > >

> > > Day 4

> > > Cardio

> > >

> > > Day 5

> > > *Dumbbell bench Presses superset with One arm rows superset

with

> dumbbell

> > > pullovers. This is tough; I use 100 pounders for all 3

> exercises. Believe

> > > me, this is one tough superset.

> > > *Leg Extensions superset with leg curls or deadlifts

> > > *Shoulder exercise of your choice, you can even do dumbbell

> shrugs when you

> > > finish the tri set above using same weight.

> > > And again, bi and tri superset

> > > Optional Crunches and low back work

> > >

> > > Day 6

> > > Cardio

> > >

> > (insert free day - Brett)

> >

> > > Day 7

> > > Power clean and Presses (I keep these reps no higher then 5)

> > > Front Squats

> > > An Easy seated Chest Press machine

> > > Easy back exercise like a lat pulldown or row machine

> > > Any arms.

> > > Optional Crunches and low back work

> > >

> > > Day 8

> > > Cardio

> > >

> > > Day 9

> > > Repeat Program, etc....

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

You know, I just now looked at the title and didn't realize it was

Hypertrophy Specific Training. I've been employing that method for

about 2 months with incredible results. Haycock is one of the

best in his field, and very responsive - we've e-mailed back and

forth several times.

The brief post didn't give it 100% justice because there are a

million factors behind the philosophy - it is nowhere close to BFL-

style training. You have different rep schemes on different weeks

and purposefully stagger weights so that several workouts you might

be doing half of what your potential is - but all for good reason.

You also end up training one muscle three times each week.

The link to find out all of the information for those interested is:

http://www.hypertrophy-specific.com/

Likness

> > > I saw this on another list, and it is SO similar to BFL that I

> > thought I would post it here

> > >

> > > > -----Original Message-----

> > > > From: Mr. Uxo

> > > >

> > > > Here is a program I designed that utilizes high volume, high

> > frequency

> > > > training. Took me almost 14 yrs to finally realize my best

> > results come with

> > > > higher frequency training.

> > > >

> > > > 1) Program involves lifting every other day with cardio on

off

> > days or rest

> > > > if you so choose.

> > > >

> > > > 2) Program involves training each muscle 3-4 times/week.

Such

> as

> > Mon, Wed,

> > > > Fri, Sun, Tues., Thur, Sat, Mon, etc.

> > > >

> > > > 3) Choose only 1 exercise per muscle on any given training

day.

> > > >

> > > > 4) Start with a weight you can do for 10 reps, and each set

> > increase 2.5-10

> > > > pounds until you can no longer get at least 8 reps. You

should

> > hit this

> > > > failure no later then the 4th set if not sooner if your

> lifting

> > heavy. If

> > > > it's too light and your doing 10 reps too easily increase

> > weight. if too

> > > > heavy and not getting at least 8 reps, decrease weight

unless

> > your on your

> > > > 3rd or 4th set and have hit failure then your done with the

> > exercise.

> > > >

> > > > 5) Make sure to eat like a pig!

> > >

> > > (I would suggest BFL - Brett)

> > > >

> > > > I'm going to post a sample program with exercises you could

> > follow. You can

> > > > always use your own exercises.

> > > >

> > > > Day 1

> > > > Bench Press superset with A Rowing Movement for the Back

> > > > Squats superset with Seated Leg Curls

> > > > Dumbbell lateral or front delt raise

> > > > Barbell Curls superset with Tricep Pressdowns

> > > > Optional Crunches and low back work

> > > >

> > > > Day 2

> > > > Cardio

> > > >

> > > > Day 3

> > > > Incline bench superset with Lat pulldowns

> > > > Leg press superset with lying leg curls

> > > > Barbell shrugs

> > > > barbell curls superset with lying french presses (tri

> extension)

> > > > Calf Raises

> > > >

> > > > Day 4

> > > > Cardio

> > > >

> > > > Day 5

> > > > *Dumbbell bench Presses superset with One arm rows superset

> with

> > dumbbell

> > > > pullovers. This is tough; I use 100 pounders for all 3

> > exercises. Believe

> > > > me, this is one tough superset.

> > > > *Leg Extensions superset with leg curls or deadlifts

> > > > *Shoulder exercise of your choice, you can even do dumbbell

> > shrugs when you

> > > > finish the tri set above using same weight.

> > > > And again, bi and tri superset

> > > > Optional Crunches and low back work

> > > >

> > > > Day 6

> > > > Cardio

> > > >

> > > (insert free day - Brett)

> > >

> > > > Day 7

> > > > Power clean and Presses (I keep these reps no higher then 5)

> > > > Front Squats

> > > > An Easy seated Chest Press machine

> > > > Easy back exercise like a lat pulldown or row machine

> > > > Any arms.

> > > > Optional Crunches and low back work

> > > >

> > > > Day 8

> > > > Cardio

> > > >

> > > > Day 9

> > > > Repeat Program, etc....

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

> boost - typically the first set of your workout is the one that gets

> the most service, regardless of what comes afterwards.

The first set or the first working set? (above say 70%)

> perspective, I think more dead-lift variations to balance the squats

> would be more balanced. That is simply my opinion - the leg curl is

> a very effective movement for hamstrings, I agree, but with squat

> working 70+ percent of the body, I think the hip-dominant movement

> deserves something of like caliber.

Agreed, leg curl hardly does the same as squat. Doesn't deadlift use most of

the same muscles as

squat though? Also, depending on how you squat, it can be quad dominant or

glute dominant (me). In

the glute dominant powerlifting style, aren't the hams involved almost as much

as the quads? This

has been my theory, and so I usually hit quads on the leg press and do SL deads

and/or curls.

> I think we are in agremeent about the routine - again, the routine

> itself is fine. I just wanted to make others aware that in the

> context of their other workouts, it should be appropriately

> balanced. If someone was coming off of a cycle of heavy dead-lifts

> and doing a lock of back, or let's say they're a roofer, then this

> routine is perfect because it brings into focus the other groups

> that were neglected.

There are deads and low-back work (good mornings) in this though, are there not?

Brett (still learning)

[Guest guest]

Yes, there are deads and low back work. As for the way that

squats/quads hit different body parts - yes, not only do different

variations of the exercises hit different areas and prioritize

different regions, but there is no agreement on the true, correct

form for a squat, and there is no agreement even by physiologists

and kinesiologists upon what these exercises really work the most. I

personally like Ian King's teachings. He teaches the squat in a way

that emphasizes quadriceps involvement, but still employs the glutes

(especially when executing the postive phases) while his dead-lifts

are taught to really maximize hamstring involvement but also employ

a LOT of back involvemnet as well.

His typical guidelines for the squat are to ascend in the same

manner you descend, in other words, don't dip or rise in a different

motion as many people do, and that you never go low enough that your

torso moves more than 45% from perpendicular (some people squat low

power-lifting style and their back can be almost parallel to the

ground!). There is much more to it (he has an hour long video just

on the single exercise!) but that is a general summation apart from

what I've heard elsewhere. For deads, the three biggest points I see

him emphasize are keeping shoulders OVER the bar, maintaining

scapular retraction, and maintaing the same torso angle until the

bar clears the knees. Of course, stiff-legged and good-morning

variations can be used to emphasize more hamstring and less upper

back/quadricep.

He doesn't really consider them quadriceps/hamstrings movements. He

calls them " quad dominant " and " hip dominant " because he looks at

the quad as being predominant as the hip flexors have less

invovlement with what we do most of the day - i.e. jump/run/walk,

whereas when we use our hamstrings, we can hardley use them without

using our glutes and lower back as well, so the set of muscles is

more the antagonist rather than the hamstring itself. Not mainstream

thinking, but interesting.

In health,

Likness

> > boost - typically the first set of your workout is the one that

gets

> > the most service, regardless of what comes afterwards.

>

> The first set or the first working set? (above say 70%)

>

> > perspective, I think more dead-lift variations to balance the

squats

> > would be more balanced. That is simply my opinion - the leg curl

is

> > a very effective movement for hamstrings, I agree, but with squat

> > working 70+ percent of the body, I think the hip-dominant

movement

> > deserves something of like caliber.

>

> Agreed, leg curl hardly does the same as squat. Doesn't deadlift

use most of the same muscles as

> squat though? Also, depending on how you squat, it can be quad

dominant or glute dominant (me). In

> the glute dominant powerlifting style, aren't the hams involved

almost as much as the quads? This

> has been my theory, and so I usually hit quads on the leg press

and do SL deads and/or curls.

>

> > I think we are in agremeent about the routine - again, the

routine

> > itself is fine. I just wanted to make others aware that in the

> > context of their other workouts, it should be appropriately

> > balanced. If someone was coming off of a cycle of heavy dead-

lifts

> > and doing a lock of back, or let's say they're a roofer, then

this

> > routine is perfect because it brings into focus the other groups

> > that were neglected.

>

> There are deads and low-back work (good mornings) in this though,

are there not?

>

> Brett (still learning)

[Guest guest]

> The only caveat I'd add to this is that it is a classic example of

> what everyone tends to do at first - put chest first because we like

> to brag about our bench press and put pushing movements first.

Ya know.. I'm a little offended. You just lumped us all in with a bunch of

flex reading gym rat jocks who train chest and biceps every day and say

" what's a squat rack? " I can pretty much guarantee that 99.6% of the ppl

on this list have actually *read* the body for life book. If they have,

they understand the importance of working the whole body.

I admit, I love to work chest and arms like the next guy, but my hamstrings

hurt like hell today because I did them yesterday. Just cuz I dont' like

doing legs doesn't mean I don't do them. (as everyone else on the list

feels). And for the record, Bill says in the book TO work the chest first.

(UBW)

This list is not full of idiots, but most don't care about any more than

whats in the book. Us vets (and yeah, I'm one of them), try to let the

newbies know that what we are talking about is not for newbies as it

confuses them and they in turn leave because they think that simple to learn

" body for life " is difficult. At the end of the day, this is a BFL list, and

we need to make sure that those needing BFL advice get it.

Us vets are open to " alternative " ways of thinking if it's not presented as

the be all end all.

Lana

[Guest guest]

Lana you know you like being lumped together with the flex people

and that it is your secret desire to use the Squat Rack to do Curls

to failure. LOL

Bill

[Guest guest]

Ack! I have to apologize for POOR communication. I'm not lumping the

people on this list as a bunch of idiots. Not all all. Even the urge

to do chest/pushing is not because people are idiots - its because

that's what is promoted. My explanation was ONLY for the sake of

people who DON'T know about balance - for everyone there who

understands, GREAT! " Everyone " was a poor choice of words. I'm not

coming from the perspective of this list, I'm coming from the

perspective of people I've worked with through the years -

intelligent people, but ones who don't research a lot of training so

they make assumptions. That's all.

As for the BFL list, I agree. I apologize because I and others have

been " talking in front of " the others on this list, rather than

interacting with the rest of you. If we have to draw out this

further, I will definitely take it to e-mail.

Thanks again for all of the great points, and I apologize once more

for not communicating effectively.

In health,

Likness

>

>

> > The only caveat I'd add to this is that it is a classic example

of

> > what everyone tends to do at first - put chest first because we

like

> > to brag about our bench press and put pushing movements first.

>

>

> Ya know.. I'm a little offended. You just lumped us all in with a

bunch of

> flex reading gym rat jocks who train chest and biceps every day

and say

> " what's a squat rack? " I can pretty much guarantee that 99.6% of

the ppl

> on this list have actually *read* the body for life book. If they

have,

> they understand the importance of working the whole body.

>

> I admit, I love to work chest and arms like the next guy, but my

hamstrings

> hurt like hell today because I did them yesterday. Just cuz I

dont' like

> doing legs doesn't mean I don't do them. (as everyone else on the

list

> feels). And for the record, Bill says in the book TO work the

chest first.

> (UBW)

>

> This list is not full of idiots, but most don't care about any

more than

> whats in the book. Us vets (and yeah, I'm one of them), try to

let the

> newbies know that what we are talking about is not for newbies as

it

> confuses them and they in turn leave because they think that

simple to learn

> " body for life " is difficult. At the end of the day, this is a BFL

list, and

> we need to make sure that those needing BFL advice get it.

>

> Us vets are open to " alternative " ways of thinking if it's not

presented as

> the be all end all.

>

> Lana

[Guest guest]

,

As a newbie to BFL, but someone who's spent years in the gym without getting

bigger than average... just two words... THANK YOU !

I for one certainly appreciate the different angle to do things, and the

buckets-full of information you've dump on the list in the last few days...

please keep it going !

Yours in health

Niel