Re: Accountability for actions.....

[Guest guest]

My 14 yr old son is held accountable for his actions but i make his different because of his issues.

[Guest guest]

I really must agree with just about everything you said. Firstly, of course is the learning issue. But secondly and perhaps even more importantly, what does it say about the esteem in which we hold individuals with challenges if we say we want them to be a full member of the community but we hold them to a lower standard? To: autism-aspergers Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2012 11:28 AM Subject: Accountability for actions.....

I had an interesting discussion with my sister yesterday and wanted to pose this topic to you all. She was discussing with me how upset she was that her 12 year old boy with ASD got suspended at school. (not sure exactly what he did but it involved swearing a lot) She believes her child should not receive the same punishment as the other students since he can't help it, has impulse control issues as well as sensory issues. I disagree. When he goes out in the world society will give him the same punishment as his peers. It is my understanding that police don't necessarily receive any training in how people with ASD are and wouldn't know the difference so they will be treated the same. I have always held my son accountable for any rule he breaks even if he had a really good reason for why he broke the rule. I don't just think they should receive the same punishment.... maybe the child with ASD needs a specific type of

punishment to meet his needs so he can learn from the situation. Example: giving a NT child home suspension may not have the same effect on a child with ASD. Maybe the child with ASD needs to write down what he did wrong and what he could have done different or any series of questions that would help teach. Anyway, I think the punishment should be accompanied by a teaching moment. Maybe the IEP needs to include a specific method of what steps will be taken when disciplinary action occurs..... either way I believe no matter what level of understanding these guys have they need to be held accountable for their actions.

[Guest guest]

My daughter is 10, and has gotten 2 suspensions for her actions. She's got a

great ASD program at school, plus peer groups, and group sessions that all are

aimed at helping her learn to curb her impulses, and teaching her that even if

she has a hard time curbing those impulses, she is still accountable for her

actions.

Both suspensions were held in school, as opposed to at home, where she did more

one on one time with her counselors to help learn better ways to react to the

problems she was experiencing at the time.

IE: the last time she was suspended, 3 boys were picking on her at lunch. She

did really good at first asking them to stop, but after a few times, one of them

got really close to her (like right in her face) teasing her, and kept at it, so

she hauled off and slugged him in the face for it.

All of the boys received a punishment for what they did, and the teachers did

congratulate Gillian for trying very hard NOT to react, but hitting is a

suspendable offense.

Her DX does make it more difficult to curb her natural reactions, she tested

very high on impulse problems. But, that doesn't mean she's unaccountable.

Here at home, if she responds by yelling and screaming, or getting mad over

nothing (another big one for her), she will lose her computer time for the day,

or sometimes go to bed early if it's close to bed time.

Anytime something happens, I do talk to her about why it wasn't the right

choice, and ask her to think about it, and to tell me what she thinks a better

choice would have been. She always knows immediately what she SHOULD have done-

she just has trouble with the impulse of doing the first thing that comes to

mind.

>

> I had an interesting discussion with my sister yesterday and wanted to pose

this topic to you all. She was discussing with me how upset she was that her 12

year old boy with ASD got suspended at school. (not sure exactly what he did

but it involved swearing a lot) She believes her child should not receive the

same punishment as the other students since he can't help it, has impulse

control issues as well as sensory issues. I disagree. When he goes out in the

world society will give him the same punishment as his peers. It is my

understanding that police don't necessarily receive any training in how people

with ASD are and wouldn't know the difference so they will be treated the same.

I have always held my son accountable for any rule he breaks even if he had a

really good reason for why he broke the rule. I don't just think they should

receive the same punishment.... maybe the child with ASD needs a specific type

of punishment to meet his needs so he can learn from the situation. Example:

giving a NT child home suspension may not have the same effect on a child with

ASD. Maybe the child with ASD needs to write down what he did wrong and what he

could have done different or any series of questions that would help teach.

Anyway, I think the punishment should be accompanied by a teaching moment.

Maybe the IEP needs to include a specific method of what steps will be taken

when disciplinary action occurs..... either way I believe no matter what level

of understanding these guys have they need to be held accountable for their

actions.

>

[Guest guest]

I agree. We HAVE to hold our kids accountable. The have to learn to live in our society and it is our job to teach them. Babying them or coddling them will only hurt them. If anything we have to be more strict with our kids than NT kids. My friends kids (teens) talk back but know where to draw the line. I can't allow that to even begin because she wouldn't understand if I allow it and then don't allow it. That concept is very difficult for my daughter.

That being said, we do have to question everything when our children get into trouble at school or elsewhere. In another post I just read was a mom saying that her stepdad had told her son to shut up. Things like that we have to question the circumstances so we can understand what instruction needs to be given to our child. Do we teach the child that sometimes we have to ignore grumpy adults or do we have to teach them to be quiet in certain circumstances. If we don't question it we don't know what needs to be learned. I think that is why many people think we coddle more than we do. It sounds like we are defending them but really we are trying to identify a deficit.

In our house, if my children are rude I asked them if they would like to rephrase that. If they can't manage it, then I tell them the appropriate way of saying something. I also tell them that if they are not careful, they will loose their electronics for the remainder of the day. When my daughter does something wrong that is outside her control, she is still disciplined for it but the punishment is different (less severe and more educational in nature) than if she was being willful or defiant.

  Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you;

Jesus Christ and the American Soldier.

One died for your soul; the other for your freedom.

-- Re: Accountability for actions.....

My daughter is 10, and has gotten 2 suspensions for her actions. She's got a great ASD program at school, plus peer groups, and group sessions that all are aimed at helping her learn to curb her impulses, and teaching her that even if she has a hard time curbing those impulses, she is still accountable for her actions.Both suspensions were held in school, as opposed to at home, where she did more one on one time with her counselors to help learn better ways to react to the problems she was experiencing at the time.IE: the last time she was suspended, 3 boys were picking on her at lunch. She did really good at first asking them to stop, but after a few times, one of them got really close to her (like right in her face) teasing her, and kept at it, so she hauled off and slugged him in the face for it.All of the boys received a punishment for what they did, and the teachers did congratulate Gillian for trying very hard NOT to react, but hitting is a suspendable offense. Her DX does make it more difficult to curb her natural reactions, she tested very high on impulse problems. But, that doesn't mean she's unaccountable.Here at home, if she responds by yelling and screaming, or getting mad over nothing (another big one for her), she will lose her computer time for the day, or sometimes go to bed early if it's close to bed time.Anytime something happens, I do talk to her about why it wasn't the right choice, and ask her to think about it, and to tell me what she thinks a better choice would have been. She always knows immediately what she SHOULD have done- she just has trouble with the impulse of doing the first thing that comes to mind.>> I had an interesting discussion with my sister yesterday and wanted to pose this topic to you all. She was discussing with me how upset she was that her 12 year old boy with ASD got suspended at school. (not sure exactly what he did but it involved swearing a lot) She believes her child should not receive the same punishment as the other students since he can't help it, has impulse control issues as well as sensory issues. I disagree. When he goes out in the world society will give him the same punishment as his peers. It is my understanding that police don't necessarily receive any training in how people with ASD are and wouldn't know the difference so they will be treated the same. I have always held my son accountable for any rule he breaks even if he had a really good reason for why he broke the rule. I don't just think they should receive the same punishment.... maybe the child with ASD needs a specific type of punishment to meet his needs so he can learn from the situation. Example: giving a NT child home suspension may not have the same effect on a child with ASD. Maybe the child with ASD needs to write down what he did wrong and what he could have done different or any series of questions that would help teach. Anyway, I think the punishment should be accompanied by a teaching moment. Maybe the IEP needs to include a specific method of what steps will be taken when disciplinary action occurs..... either way I believe no matter what level of understanding these guys have they need to be held accountable for their actions.>

[Guest guest]

Well said!!!! That is fantastic. I hadn't thought about it in those terms. Now I agree even more!

-- Accountability for actions.....

I had an interesting discussion with my sister yesterday and wanted to pose this topic to you all. She was discussing with me how upset she was that her 12 year old boy with ASD got suspended at school. (not sure exactly what he did but it involved swearing a lot) She believes her child should not receive the same punishment as the other students since he can't help it, has impulse control issues as well as sensory issues. I disagree. When he goes out in the world society will give him the same punishment as his peers. It is my understanding that police don't necessarily receive any training in how people with ASD are and wouldn't know the difference so they will be treated the same. I have always held my son accountable for any rule he breaks even if he had a really good reason for why he broke the rule. I don't just think they should receive the same punishment.... maybe the child with ASD needs a specific type of punishment to meet his needs so he can learn from the situation. Example: giving a NT child home suspension may not have the same effect on a child with ASD. Maybe the child with ASD needs to write down what he did wrong and what he could have done different or any series of questions that would help teach. Anyway, I think the punishment should be accompanied by a teaching moment. Maybe the IEP needs to include a specific method of what steps will be taken when disciplinary action occurs..... either way I believe no matter what level of understanding these guys have they need to be held accountable for their actions.

[Guest guest]

Totally agree. Do I let my son get away with things I probably shouldn't at home? Yeah...there are those times where I have to pick my battles (you know what I mean?)But...at school...NO TOLERANCE! I have always been the one to tell the principal to suspend him...They don't like to do it to a kid in elementary (espec my son, mainsteamed)...but, I encourage it. Almost demand it.I don't want people to think my son has preferred treatment because of his dx.LoriSubject: Re: Re:

Accountability for actions.....To: autism-aspergers Date: Sunday, March 18, 2012, 9:55 PM

I agree. We HAVE to hold our kids accountable. The have to learn to live in our society and it is our job to teach them. Babying them or coddling them will only hurt them. If anything we have to be more strict with our kids than NT kids. My friends kids (teens) talk back but know where to draw the line. I can't allow that to even begin because she wouldn't understand if I allow it and then don't allow it. That concept is very difficult for my daughter.

That being said, we do have to question everything when our children get into trouble at school or elsewhere. In another post I just read was a mom saying that her stepdad had told her son to shut up. Things like that we have to question the circumstances so we can understand what instruction needs to be given to our child. Do we teach the child that sometimes we have to ignore grumpy adults or do we have to teach them to be quiet in certain circumstances. If we don't question it we don't know what needs to be learned. I think that is why many people think we coddle more than we do. It sounds like we are defending them but really we are trying to identify a deficit.

In our house, if my children are rude I asked them if they would like to rephrase that. If they can't manage it, then I tell them the appropriate way of saying something. I also tell them that if they are not careful, they will loose their electronics for the remainder of the day. When my daughter does something wrong that is outside her control, she is still disciplined for it but the punishment is different (less severe and more educational in nature) than if she was being willful or defiant.

  Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you;

Jesus Christ and the American Soldier.

One died for your soul; the other for your freedom.

-- Re: Accountability for actions.....

My daughter is 10, and has gotten 2 suspensions for her actions. She's got a great ASD program at school, plus peer groups, and group sessions that all are aimed at helping her learn to curb her impulses, and teaching her that even if she has a hard time curbing those impulses, she is still accountable for her actions.Both suspensions were held in school, as opposed to at home, where she did more one on one time with her counselors to help learn better ways to react to the problems she was experiencing at the time.IE: the last time she was suspended, 3 boys were picking on her at lunch. She did really good at first asking them to stop, but after a few times, one of them got really close to her (like right in her face) teasing her, and kept at it, so she hauled off and slugged him in the face for it.All of the boys received a punishment for what they did, and the teachers did congratulate Gillian for trying very hard NOT to

react, but hitting is a suspendable offense. Her DX does make it more difficult to curb her natural reactions, she tested very high on impulse problems. But, that doesn't mean she's unaccountable.Here at home, if she responds by yelling and screaming, or getting mad over nothing (another big one for her), she will lose her computer time for the day, or sometimes go to bed early if it's close to bed time.Anytime something happens, I do talk to her about why it wasn't the right choice, and ask her to think about it, and to tell me what she thinks a better choice would have been. She always knows immediately what she SHOULD have done- she just has trouble with the impulse of doing the first thing that comes to mind.>> I had an interesting discussion with my sister yesterday and wanted to pose this topic to you all. She was discussing with me how upset she was that her 12 year old boy with ASD got suspended at school. (not sure exactly what he did but it involved swearing a lot) She believes her child should not receive the same punishment as the other students since he can't help it, has impulse control issues as well as sensory issues. I disagree. When he goes out in the world society will give him the same punishment as his peers. It is my understanding that police don't necessarily receive any training in how people with ASD are and wouldn't know the difference so they will be treated the same. I have always held my son accountable for any rule he breaks even if he had a really good reason for why he broke the rule. I don't just think they should receive the same punishment.... maybe the child with ASD needs a

specific type of punishment to meet his needs so he can learn from the situation. Example: giving a NT child home suspension may not have the same effect on a child with ASD. Maybe the child with ASD needs to write down what he did wrong and what he could have done different or any series of questions that would help teach. Anyway, I think the punishment should be accompanied by a teaching moment. Maybe the IEP needs to include a specific method of what steps will be taken when disciplinary action occurs..... either way I believe no matter what level of understanding these guys have they need to be held accountable for their actions.>

[Guest guest]

I love what you said !! I do that as well with my son where I will say "I'll give you a moment to figure out another way to say that...." Or I use the term..... "You need to correct yourself". For us it has been successful to not always tell him what it was that he did wrong so he can identify it and figure it out ftrom within. From:

Muehleisen Family To: autism-aspergers Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2012 9:55 PM Subject: Re: Re: Accountability for actions.....

I agree. We HAVE to hold our kids accountable. The have to learn to live in our society and it is our job to teach them. Babying them or coddling them will only hurt them. If anything we have to be more strict with our kids than NT kids. My friends kids (teens) talk back but know where to draw the line. I can't allow that to even begin because she wouldn't understand if I allow it and then don't allow it. That concept is very difficult for my daughter.

That being said, we do have to question everything when our children get into trouble at school or elsewhere. In another post I just read was a mom saying that her stepdad had told her son to shut up. Things like that we have to question the circumstances so we can understand what instruction needs to be given to our child. Do we teach the child that sometimes we have to ignore grumpy adults or do we have to teach them to be quiet in certain circumstances. If we don't question it we don't know what needs to be learned. I think that is why many people think we coddle more than we do. It sounds like we are defending them but really we are trying to identify a deficit.

In our house, if my children are rude I asked them if they would like to rephrase that. If they can't manage it, then I tell them the appropriate way of saying something. I also tell them that if they are not careful, they will loose their electronics for the remainder of the day. When my daughter does something wrong that is outside her control, she is still disciplined for it but the punishment is different (less severe and more educational in nature) than if she was being willful or defiant.

  Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you;

Jesus Christ and the American Soldier.

One died for your soul; the other for your freedom.

-- Re: Accountability for actions.....

My daughter is 10, and has gotten 2 suspensions for her actions. She's got a great ASD program at school, plus peer groups, and group sessions that all are aimed at helping her learn to curb her impulses, and teaching her that even if she has a hard time curbing those impulses, she is still accountable for her actions.Both suspensions were held in school, as opposed to at home, where she did more one on one time with her counselors to help learn better ways to react to the problems she was experiencing at the time.IE: the last time she was suspended, 3 boys were picking on her at lunch. She did really good at first asking them to stop, but after a few times, one of them got really close to her (like right in her face) teasing her, and kept at it, so she hauled off and slugged him in the face for it.All of the boys received a punishment for what they did, and the teachers did congratulate Gillian for trying very hard NOT to

react, but hitting is a suspendable offense. Her DX does make it more difficult to curb her natural reactions, she tested very high on impulse problems. But, that doesn't mean she's unaccountable.Here at home, if she responds by yelling and screaming, or getting mad over nothing (another big one for her), she will lose her computer time for the day, or sometimes go to bed early if it's close to bed time.Anytime something happens, I do talk to her about why it wasn't the right choice, and ask her to think about it, and to tell me what she thinks a better choice would have been. She always knows immediately what she SHOULD have done- she just has trouble with the impulse of doing the first thing that comes to mind.>> I had an interesting discussion with my sister yesterday and wanted to pose this topic to you all. She was discussing with me how upset she was that her 12 year old boy with ASD got suspended at school. (not sure exactly what he did but it involved swearing a lot) She believes her child should not receive the same punishment as the other students since he can't help it, has impulse control issues as well as sensory issues. I disagree. When he goes out in the world society will give him the same punishment as his peers. It is my understanding that police don't necessarily receive any training in how people with ASD are and wouldn't know the difference so they will be treated the same. I have always held my son accountable for any rule he breaks even if he had a really good reason for why he broke the rule. I don't just think they should receive the same punishment.... maybe the child with ASD needs a specific type of punishment to

meet his needs so he can learn from the situation. Example: giving a NT child home suspension may not have the same effect on a child with ASD. Maybe the child with ASD needs to write down what he did wrong and what he could have done different or any series of questions that would help teach. Anyway, I think the punishment should be accompanied by a teaching moment. Maybe the IEP needs to include a specific method of what steps will be taken when disciplinary action occurs..... either way I believe no matter what level of understanding these guys have they need to be held accountable for their actions.>