Question about understanding inappropriate behavior

June 3, 2007

Hi everyone,

As you know, I am autistic and behavior problems have been a pretty

prominent feature of that for me. When I behave inappropriately, the

staff at independent living training home send me to my own apartment

or leave when they are in my apartment with me. I don't remember them

often correcting me in any other way than to threaten to leave me, or

to actually do so, but my staff says I am " unreachable " so it might be

I just don't pick it up. In any case, I often don't understand what I

did wrong. Sometimes I do, like when I scream, but many other " rules "

I don't understand, so I apply the general rule " you have to behave

and when you don't, the staff will leave you " . Yet this often leaves

me knowing I did something wrong but not what, and it makes it

impossible for me to improve, which is obviously something I want. A

few weeks ago, my staff even got to wonder w hether she should still

show when my behavior was upsetting her, and obviously I said yes

cause I won't learn when she just lets it happen (I'm not talking

about violence or anything). We discussed this with the psych nurse I

see for autism-related reasons and she suggested we discuss what went

wrong later when staff is not upset anymore and I am quiet. The

problem is I don't understand general statements like " you were

walking around in a way that draws attention " (since I wasn't meaning

to seek attention) and " you are constantly filling in for me " . Now my

staff recently voiced her suspection that I don't notice my own

behavior, so she proposed we record it. I saw someone else recently on

this lsist mentioned doing that. How did it work for their

son/daughter? What exaclty did they record and how did they show it to

their son/duaghter? (I don't remember who it was) For me, the primary

concern is, I'm afraid just playing a recording of my behavior to me

won't show me anything I didn't know yet, since I'm generally very

aware of what I did, like say this or that or walk around. I notice

I'm not aware of how that behavior is received by the other person,

and why it may offend them. Like, to give an example, a few weeks ago

I was having a discussion (quite heated already) with a staff and got

to sit on the floor in the middle of the discussion. This is

inappropriate but I didn't know it at the time, and the staff said

that she would leave me and said she didn't have the obligation to

watch me sitting on the floor. I now understand I'm not supposed to

sit on the floor when the other person stands, but I have no clue why

(of course, this is something you can't record cause I'm blind and it

had no sound, but just an example). I could understand it was the

sitting on the floor that offended the staff cause the only thing I'd

changed doing just before the staff threatened to leave was sitting on

the floor, but quite often it's something more complicated, like

things I say. I think the recording thing might be a good idea, but

I'm afraid it won't help me to just play back to me a scene in which I

upset someone. So does anyone have suggestions on how I/my staff can

help me to understand when I'm behaving inappropriately / saying

inappropriate things? We're going to ask psych nurse on Thursday but I

was just wondering if anyone of you had any suggestions.

Astrid

June 4, 2007

If you can interpret, remember and apply what you see in a video

recording of events, then this could be a very good thing for you and

everyone else involved. Sometimes, everyone becomes so angry or

emotionally involved in a situation, they really can't remember what

they were doing at the time.

Being an athlete, video was the best way to improve my performance,

because it was an objective, unbiased view of my performance. My

coach and I could freeze a moment in time and determine a better

course of action to take at that moment.

The videos should not be only of you or focus on you, but the entire

situation and environment. Maybe you are not catching all of the

social signals being presented, maybe your staff is injecting

negative signals they may not be aware of. Maybe the staff allows you

to have too many adverse behavioral reactions before they try to

resolve the issue. Just make sure that whenever there is a review of

any video, all participants are evaluated, not just you. When you

evaluate team sports videos, everyone's mistakes are evaluated to

make the team play better.

>

> Hi everyone,

> As you know, I am autistic and behavior problems have been a

pretty

> prominent feature of that for me. When I behave inappropriately,

the

> staff at independent living training home send me to my own

apartment

> or leave when they are in my apartment with me. I don't remember

them

> often correcting me in any other way than to threaten to leave me,

or

> to actually do so, but my staff says I am " unreachable " so it might

be

> I just don't pick it up. In any case, I often don't understand what

I

> did wrong. Sometimes I do, like when I scream, but many

other " rules "

> I don't understand, so I apply the general rule " you have to

behave

> and when you don't, the staff will leave you " . Yet this often

leaves

> me knowing I did something wrong but not what, and it makes it

> impossible for me to improve, which is obviously something I want.

A

> few weeks ago, my staff even got to wonder w hether she should

still

> show when my behavior was upsetting her, and obviously I said yes

> cause I won't learn when she just lets it happen (I'm not talking

> about violence or anything). We discussed this with the psych nurse

I

> see for autism-related reasons and she suggested we discuss what

went

> wrong later when staff is not upset anymore and I am quiet. The

> problem is I don't understand general statements like " you were

> walking around in a way that draws attention " (since I wasn't

meaning

> to seek attention) and " you are constantly filling in for me " . Now

my

> staff recently voiced her suspection that I don't notice my own

> behavior, so she proposed we record it. I saw someone else recently

on

> this lsist mentioned doing that. How did it work for their

> son/daughter? What exaclty did they record and how did they show it

to

> their son/duaghter? (I don't remember who it was) For me, the

primary

> concern is, I'm afraid just playing a recording of my behavior to

me

> won't show me anything I didn't know yet, since I'm generally very

> aware of what I did, like say this or that or walk around. I

notice

> I'm not aware of how that behavior is received by the other

person,

> and why it may offend them. Like, to give an example, a few weeks

ago

> I was having a discussion (quite heated already) with a staff and

got

> to sit on the floor in the middle of the discussion. This is

> inappropriate but I didn't know it at the time, and the staff said

> that she would leave me and said she didn't have the obligation to

> watch me sitting on the floor. I now understand I'm not supposed

to

> sit on the floor when the other person stands, but I have no clue

why

> (of course, this is something you can't record cause I'm blind and

it

> had no sound, but just an example). I could understand it was the

> sitting on the floor that offended the staff cause the only thing

I'd

> changed doing just before the staff threatened to leave was sitting

on

> the floor, but quite often it's something more complicated, like

> things I say. I think the recording thing might be a good idea,

but

> I'm afraid it won't help me to just play back to me a scene in

which I

> upset someone. So does anyone have suggestions on how I/my staff

can

> help me to understand when I'm behaving inappropriately / saying

> inappropriate things? We're going to ask psych nurse on Thursday

but I

> was just wondering if anyone of you had any suggestions.

> Astrid

>

June 4, 2007

I'm not so sure the video will work, as Astrid (please correct me if I'm wrong) is blind, so applying what she "sees" is out of the question. To me, videotaping "walking around in a manner that draws attention" is the same as videotaping Astrid sitting on the floor during a conversation - not a productive vehicle to changing this situation.

I think with a precise definition of what the behaviors are, you (Astrid) can begin to change them through omission and then shaping.

A. Petrucelli, MA

Board Certified Behavior Analyst - #1031400 Senior Behavior Analyst Allegro School & Programs

Re: Question about understanding inappropriate behavior

If you can interpret, remember and apply what you see in a video recording of events, then this could be a very good thing for you and everyone else involved. Sometimes, everyone becomes so angry or emotionally involved in a situation, they really can't remember what they were doing at the time.Being an athlete, video was the best way to improve my performance, because it was an objective, unbiased view of my performance. My coach and I could freeze a moment in time and determine a better course of action to take at that moment.The videos should not be only of you or focus on you, but the entire situation and environment. Maybe you are not catching all of the social signals being presented, maybe your staff is injecting negative signals they may not be aware of. Maybe the staff allows you to have too many adverse behavioral reactions before they try to resolve the issue. Just make sure that whenever there is

a review of any video, all participants are evaluated, not just you. When you evaluate team sports videos, everyone's mistakes are evaluated to make the team play better.>> Hi everyone,> As you know, I am autistic and behavior problems have been a pretty > prominent feature of that for me. When I behave inappropriately, the > staff at independent living training home send me to my own apartment > or leave when they are in my apartment with me. I don't remember them > often correcting me in any other way than to threaten to leave me, or > to actually do so, but my staff says I am "unreachable" so it might be > I just don't pick it up. In any case, I often don't understand what I > did wrong. Sometimes I

do, like when I scream, but many other "rules" > I don't understand, so I apply the general rule "you have to behave > and when you don't, the staff will leave you". Yet this often leaves > me knowing I did something wrong but not what, and it makes it > impossible for me to improve, which is obviously something I want. A > few weeks ago, my staff even got to wonder w hether she should still > show when my behavior was upsetting her, and obviously I said yes > cause I won't learn when she just lets it happen (I'm not talking > about violence or anything). We discussed this with the psych nurse I > see for autism-related reasons and she suggested we discuss what went > wrong later when staff is not upset anymore and I am quiet. The > problem is I don't understand general statements like "you were > walking around in a way that draws attention" (since I wasn't

meaning > to seek attention) and "you are constantly filling in for me". Now my > staff recently voiced her suspection that I don't notice my own > behavior, so she proposed we record it. I saw someone else recently on > this lsist mentioned doing that. How did it work for their > son/daughter? What exaclty did they record and how did they show it to > their son/duaghter? (I don't remember who it was) For me, the primary > concern is, I'm afraid just playing a recording of my behavior to me > won't show me anything I didn't know yet, since I'm generally very > aware of what I did, like say this or that or walk around. I notice > I'm not aware of how that behavior is received by the other person, > and why it may offend them. Like, to give an example, a few weeks ago > I was having a discussion (quite heated already) with a staff and got > to

sit on the floor in the middle of the discussion. This is > inappropriate but I didn't know it at the time, and the staff said > that she would leave me and said she didn't have the obligation to > watch me sitting on the floor. I now understand I'm not supposed to > sit on the floor when the other person stands, but I have no clue why > (of course, this is something you can't record cause I'm blind and it > had no sound, but just an example). I could understand it was the > sitting on the floor that offended the staff cause the only thing I'd > changed doing just before the staff threatened to leave was sitting on > the floor, but quite often it's something more complicated, like > things I say. I think the recording thing might be a good idea, but > I'm afraid it won't help me to just play back to me a scene in which I > upset someone. So does anyone have

suggestions on how I/my staff can > help me to understand when I'm behaving inappropriately / saying > inappropriate things? We're going to ask psych nurse on Thursday but I > was just wondering if anyone of you had any suggestions.> Astrid>

Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell.

June 4, 2007

Your doing what I told Astrid shouldn't be done. You are only

analyzing Astrid's behavior, which isn't happening in a vacuum.

Everyone in Astrid's environment should have their behavior assessed

in the video to see what all of the contributing factors are and how

to deal with all the adverse effects.

> >

> > Hi everyone,

> > As you know, I am autistic and behavior problems have been a

> pretty

> > prominent feature of that for me. When I behave inappropriately,

> the

> > staff at independent living training home send me to my own

> apartment

> > or leave when they are in my apartment with me. I don't remember

> them

> > often correcting me in any other way than to threaten to leave

me,

> or

> > to actually do so, but my staff says I am " unreachable " so it

might

> be

> > I just don't pick it up. In any case, I often don't understand

what

> I

> > did wrong. Sometimes I do, like when I scream, but many

> other " rules "

> > I don't understand, so I apply the general rule " you have to

> behave

> > and when you don't, the staff will leave you " . Yet this often

> leaves

> > me knowing I did something wrong but not what, and it makes it

> > impossible for me to improve, which is obviously something I

want.

> A

> > few weeks ago, my staff even got to wonder w hether she should

> still

> > show when my behavior was upsetting her, and obviously I said yes

> > cause I won't learn when she just lets it happen (I'm not talking

> > about violence or anything). We discussed this with the psych

nurse

> I

> > see for autism-related reasons and she suggested we discuss what

> went

> > wrong later when staff is not upset anymore and I am quiet. The

> > problem is I don't understand general statements like " you were

> > walking around in a way that draws attention " (since I wasn't

> meaning

> > to seek attention) and " you are constantly filling in for me " .

Now

> my

> > staff recently voiced her suspection that I don't notice my own

> > behavior, so she proposed we record it. I saw someone else

recently

> on

> > this lsist mentioned doing that. How did it work for their

> > son/daughter? What exaclty did they record and how did they show

it

> to

> > their son/duaghter? (I don't remember who it was) For me, the

> primary

> > concern is, I'm afraid just playing a recording of my behavior to

> me

> > won't show me anything I didn't know yet, since I'm generally

very

> > aware of what I did, like say this or that or walk around. I

> notice

> > I'm not aware of how that behavior is received by the other

> person,

> > and why it may offend them. Like, to give an example, a few weeks

> ago

> > I was having a discussion (quite heated already) with a staff and

> got

> > to sit on the floor in the middle of the discussion. This is

> > inappropriate but I didn't know it at the time, and the staff

said

> > that she would leave me and said she didn't have the obligation

to

> > watch me sitting on the floor. I now understand I'm not supposed

> to

> > sit on the floor when the other person stands, but I have no clue

> why

> > (of course, this is something you can't record cause I'm blind

and

> it

> > had no sound, but just an example). I could understand it was the

> > sitting on the floor that offended the staff cause the only thing

> I'd

> > changed doing just before the staff threatened to leave was

sitting

> on

> > the floor, but quite often it's something more complicated, like

> > things I say. I think the recording thing might be a good idea,

> but

> > I'm afraid it won't help me to just play back to me a scene in

> which I

> > upset someone. So does anyone have suggestions on how I/my staff

> can

> > help me to understand when I'm behaving inappropriately / saying

> > inappropriate things? We're going to ask psych nurse on Thursday

> but I

> > was just wondering if anyone of you had any suggestions.

> > Astrid

> >

>

______________________________________________________________________

______________

> Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your

story. Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games.

> http://sims.yahoo.com/

>

June 4, 2007

Hi Kayleigh,

Thanks for the ideas. May I ask, when they used to do a video of your

athletics, how would your coach evaluate it with you? Would they just

focus on a particular moment and expect you to realize that was wrong

or right and what to do about it? I mean, since my staff believes I

don't recall my own behavior, her idea (of recording my behavior)

becomes something like " if you just saw/heard what you did, you'd

change it " , when even when someone points out my behavior, I can't

instantly tell whether it was inappropriate, let alone think of an

alternative.

Quoting kayleighkyle :

> If you can interpret, remember and apply what you see in a video

> recording of events, then this could be a very good thing for you and

> everyone else involved. Sometimes, everyone becomes so angry or

> emotionally involved in a situation, they really can't remember what

> they were doing at the time.

>

> Being an athlete, video was the best way to improve my performance,

> because it was an objective, unbiased view of my performance. My

> coach and I could freeze a moment in time and determine a better

> course of action to take at that moment.

>

> The videos should not be only of you or focus on you, but the entire

> situation and environment. Maybe you are not catching all of the

> social signals being presented, maybe your staff is injecting

> negative signals they may not be aware of. Maybe the staff allows you

> to have too many adverse behavioral reactions before they try to

> resolve the issue. Just make sure that whenever there is a review of

> any video, all participants are evaluated, not just you. When you

> evaluate team sports videos, everyone's mistakes are evaluated to

> make the team play better.

>

>>

>> Hi everyone,

>> As you know, I am autistic and behavior problems have been a

> pretty

>> prominent feature of that for me. When I behave inappropriately,

> the

>> staff at independent living training home send me to my own

> apartment

>> or leave when they are in my apartment with me. I don't remember

> them

>> often correcting me in any other way than to threaten to leave me,

> or

>> to actually do so, but my staff says I am " unreachable " so it might

> be

>> I just don't pick it up. In any case, I often don't understand what

> I

>> did wrong. Sometimes I do, like when I scream, but many

> other " rules "

>> I don't understand, so I apply the general rule " you have to

> behave

>> and when you don't, the staff will leave you " . Yet this often

> leaves

>> me knowing I did something wrong but not what, and it makes it

>> impossible for me to improve, which is obviously something I want.

> A

>> few weeks ago, my staff even got to wonder w hether she should

> still

>> show when my behavior was upsetting her, and obviously I said yes

>> cause I won't learn when she just lets it happen (I'm not talking

>> about violence or anything). We discussed this with the psych nurse

> I

>> see for autism-related reasons and she suggested we discuss what

> went

>> wrong later when staff is not upset anymore and I am quiet. The

>> problem is I don't understand general statements like " you were

>> walking around in a way that draws attention " (since I wasn't

> meaning

>> to seek attention) and " you are constantly filling in for me " . Now

> my

>> staff recently voiced her suspection that I don't notice my own

>> behavior, so she proposed we record it. I saw someone else recently

> on

>> this lsist mentioned doing that. How did it work for their

>> son/daughter? What exaclty did they record and how did they show it

> to

>> their son/duaghter? (I don't remember who it was) For me, the

> primary

>> concern is, I'm afraid just playing a recording of my behavior to

> me

>> won't show me anything I didn't know yet, since I'm generally very

>> aware of what I did, like say this or that or walk around. I

> notice

>> I'm not aware of how that behavior is received by the other

> person,

>> and why it may offend them. Like, to give an example, a few weeks

> ago

>> I was having a discussion (quite heated already) with a staff and

> got

>> to sit on the floor in the middle of the discussion. This is

>> inappropriate but I didn't know it at the time, and the staff said

>> that she would leave me and said she didn't have the obligation to

>> watch me sitting on the floor. I now understand I'm not supposed

> to

>> sit on the floor when the other person stands, but I have no clue

> why

>> (of course, this is something you can't record cause I'm blind and

> it

>> had no sound, but just an example). I could understand it was the

>> sitting on the floor that offended the staff cause the only thing

> I'd

>> changed doing just before the staff threatened to leave was sitting

> on

>> the floor, but quite often it's something more complicated, like

>> things I say. I think the recording thing might be a good idea,

> but

>> I'm afraid it won't help me to just play back to me a scene in

> which I

>> upset someone. So does anyone have suggestions on how I/my staff

> can

>> help me to understand when I'm behaving inappropriately / saying

>> inappropriate things? We're going to ask psych nurse on Thursday

> but I

>> was just wondering if anyone of you had any suggestions.

>> Astrid

>>

>

June 4, 2007

Ron,

Thanks for the suggestion. I think you are right in your reply to

Kayleigh - I am blind, so I can't see myself walking around in a way

that draws attention if it were videotaped. And even if I could, I

doubt I could tell the difference between just walking around and

walking around in a way that draws attention simply by watching myself

walk around. Do you have any ideas as to how we can clarify what

behavior is expected of me and what is not? Like, I tend to get very

general feedback about my behavior that I cannot apply cause I don't

understand it (as I said in that particular situaiton I wasn't meaning

to seek attention, but I didn't know I was still drawing it and I

still don't know what I did to draw attention). I also don't tend to

understand what I should do as to not draw attention/offend others/etc.

By the way, what is " omission " and " shaping " ? It may be my poor

English but sounds like ABA speak to me.

Quoting ron petrucelli :

> I'm not so sure the video will work, as Astrid (please correct me if

> I'm wrong) is blind, so applying what she " sees " is out of the

> question. To me, videotaping " walking around in a manner that draws

> attention " is the same as videotaping Astrid sitting on the floor

> during a conversation - not a productive vehicle to changing this

> situation.

>

> I think with a precise definition of what the behaviors are, you

> (Astrid) can begin to change them through omission and then shaping.

>

> A. Petrucelli, MA

>

> Board Certified Behavior Analyst - #1031400

> Senior Behavior Analyst

> Allegro School & Programs

>

> Re: Question about understanding inappropriate behavior