vaccines

March 23, 2001

I agree, pediatricians push vaccines. That is how they make money. My

pediatrician's office always called my home to bring my children for a

" wellness check-up " but it has been primarily for the vaccines because

when I stopped the vaccines they stopped calling. It was not a wellness

visit, it was a jabbing visit. I swear my kids get sick everytime I go

there. Vicky V.

wbtori wrote:

>

> I took MJ to see a new pediatrician (for his medical clearance for

> surgery)

> using his Medicaid waiver card. MJ is 8 and in 3rd grade. The nurse

> asked

> for his immunization record and noted he'd only had 4 DPTs -- and must

> have

> another! He only had two MMRs -- and must have another! And he had

> no Hep

> B's and must begin the series today! When the female doctor came into

> the

> room, she says " it looks like he needs several shots, a DPT, MMR and a

> Hep B

> today. " I responded with " No other doctor or the school said he

> needed any

> additional vaccines. " Then she pondered " that's what I'm thinking "

> while

> studying his card. Then she reasserts herself and says, " Yes,

> Mom-ma! MJ

> is fine, other than he needs a DPT, MMR and Hep B today! " I said

> we'll

> bring him back after his surgery. NOT! She says, you don't want to

> do them

> today? My husband and I both said a resounding No! We've been using

> a

> family practitioner for MJ (since the peds never believed he was

> autistic -

> LOL) except for his DAN doctor (who is a retired ped.) and now only

> has his

> allergy/immunology practice. Are pediatricians more likely to push

> vaccines

> than other doctors? I'm outraged this doctor would give so many shots

> at

> one time to a child. My youngest daughter is in high school (hasn't

> had Hep

> Bs yet either), but I remember with our daughters, there came a time

> at 4

> y/o or kindergarten when vaccines were no longer needed. What's

> happened?

> Thanks. Wanda

>

October 4, 2001

> On one of the lists I'm on I saw a recommendation for the order to

give the

> individual mumps, measles and rubella. If it was this list would

someone

> please post that again.

>

I have my own recommendation

http://home.pacbell.net/cscomp/myvaxopn.htm

Here is a copy of the relevant section of my opinion.

1.Single dose vax, for example, not DTaP but D and then 6 months later

T and then 6 months later P (yes P at

the end, if at all, this vax causes a lot of neurological problems for

many kids). Not MMR but M and then 6

months later R and then 6 months later M. Be sure to separate the

measles and mumps vax by at least one full

year, because there is much evidence that children who contract both

measles and mumps within the same

year are at increased risk for autism and other neurological

difficulties. Also because measles virus has been

found in the gut of many autistic children, you may also consider

giving that vax last, then you would have

mumps, then rubella, then measles.

Dana

October 5, 2001

Thanks Dana - that's what I was looking for.

Elaine

At 03:09 PM 10/4/01 +0000, you wrote:

>I have my own recommendation

>

><http://home.pacbell.net/cscomp/myvaxopn.htm>http://home.pacbell.net/cscomp/myv\

axopn.htm

>

>Here is a copy of the relevant section of my opinion.

>

>1.Single dose vax, for example, not DTaP but D and then 6 months later

>T and then 6 months later P (yes P at

>the end, if at all, this vax causes a lot of neurological problems for

>many kids). Not MMR but M and then 6

>months later R and then 6 months later M. Be sure to separate the

>measles and mumps vax by at least one full

>year, because there is much evidence that children who contract both

>measles and mumps within the same

>year are at increased risk for autism and other neurological

>difficulties. Also because measles virus has been

>found in the gut of many autistic children, you may also consider

>giving that vax last, then you would have

>mumps, then rubella, then measles.

>

>Dana

>

October 5, 2001

Don't know if this was the info you were seeking, but I sent this out not too

long ago, it was from a Dan Doc...

1. Use Thimerasol free vaccines

2. Do not vaccinate ill children

3. Space vaccines-do not give multiple vaccines in one day

4. Give Vitamin C before and after vaccines

5. Use DTaP only, not the old DTP

6. Give a natural form of vitamin A (cod liver oil) to keep RDA's at

level at all times for the age

7. Seperate the MMR into 3...start with measles at 12-15 months,

then mumps at 18-21 months, rubella at 24-27 months.

8. Do not give live viral vaccines to immunodeficient children.

9. Do not give if allergic to any of these components:

Yeast-Hepatitis B

Eggs-MMR

Neomycian-MMR or Varicella

10. Consider delaying Hep-B until after 2 years if child is not in

daycare

11. Hold varicella until 10-12 years and if the child is shown not

immune to Chickenpox

12. Check vaccine titers before giving boosters at 4-5 years

Lynn in MD

[ ] Vaccines

On one of the lists I'm on I saw a recommendation for the order to give the

individual mumps, measles and rubella. If it was this list would someone

please post that again.

TIA

Elaine in GA

January 31, 2003

Hi Vi,

We went through a long discussion of it just a couple of weeks ago. If

you go to the RA-Support page at and do a search with

" smallpox " I'm sure you'll find a lot of it. The bottom line is that

you don't want it if you're on medications that suppress your immune

system. (They probably wouldn't let you get it, either). Not only

that, it is a danger for anyone in your household to have the vaccine,

as you could possibly catch it (cowpox, not smallpox).

Just one more risk for us.

Love and hugs,

Carol

[ ] Vaccines

a and all,

I was wondering about the smallpox vaccine and if people with psoriatic

arthritis should take it. I would like to take it because I feel that

there is a real threat for getting smallpox soon. The recommendations

are that people with eczema should not take it. I am wondering about

other skin conditions. For example, why is it that people with eczema

should not take the smallpox vaccine? Is it because of the allergy

issue or the weeping wound issue? I asked my rheumatologist and she

thought it was only for people with eczema because of the allergy issue.

However, now I am questioning that because since then I read that there

is a vaccinia virus in the pox that the vaccination makes, and that the

vaccinia virus is contagious and can spread to other parts of the body

as well as to other people. Does anybody have any information on this?

Vi Wilkes

January 31, 2003

Vi,

Here is an article that posted a few weeks ago. We just had this

discussion not long ago.

Update on Smallpox and Flu Vaccinations

(December 16, 2002)

D. Lockshin, MD

Professor of Medicine and Obstetrics-Gynecology, Weill College of

Medicine of Cornell University, Attending Rheumatologist, Hospital for

Special Surgery

At this time of year, patients with lupus, rheumatoid arthritis, and

other autoimmune diseases always ask, " Should I get a flu vaccination? "

At this time in our history, many patients are also asking, " Should I

get a smallpox vaccination? " ...

For more on this topic, please read here:

http://www.rheumatology.hss.edu/phys/specialReports/smallPox.asp

Please talk to your doctor about the vaccine. I will NOT get it now or

ever. My feelings are that the vaccine is not worth the risk to anyone with

an autoimmune disease.

a

> a and all,

>

> I was wondering about the smallpox vaccine and if people with psoriatic

> arthritis should take it. I would like to take it because I feel that there

> is a real threat for getting smallpox soon. The recommendations are that

> people with eczema should not take it. I am wondering about other skin

> conditions. For example, why is it that people with eczema should not take

> the smallpox vaccine? Is it because of the allergy issue or the weeping wound

> issue? I asked my rheumatologist and she thought it was only for people with

> eczema because of the allergy issue. However, now I am questioning that

> because since then I read that there is a vaccinia virus in the pox that the

> vaccination makes, and that the vaccinia virus is contagious and can spread to

> other parts of the body as well as to other people. Does anybody have any

> information on this?

>

> Vi Wilkes

>

January 31, 2003

Thanks a,

That was a good Web site article. I read it and saved the link. It looks like

smallpox vaccination is out for me.

Vi Wilkes, MS, MA, ACRN, EdD Candidate -

Faculty, University of Phoenix Online

viwilkes@...

309-241-8940 or 815-468-0531

Re: [ ] Vaccines

Vi,

Here is an article that posted a few weeks ago. We just had this

discussion not long ago.

Update on Smallpox and Flu Vaccinations

(December 16, 2002)

February 1, 2003

Carol,

Thanks Carol, I have decided not to ask for it. :-)

Vi Wilkes

RE: [ ] Vaccines

Hi Vi,

We went through a long discussion of it just a couple of weeks ago. If

you go to the RA-Support page at and do a search with

" smallpox " I'm sure you'll find a lot of it.

September 16, 2003

I am getting ready to go overseas in a couple of months and I have an 18

month old girl who has only been given one polio shot. I haven't

immunized her at all otherwise but am thinking about tetanus and

measles. Has anyone had any luck giving just measles, not included in

the usual MMR vaccine? I dont want to give any other shots yet, hence

the bare minimum.

Also, my son who is 8.5 yrs, autistic, needs Hep A vaccine. Has anyone

given their child that and had no problems?

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Sara

September 17, 2003

Hi -

The only tips I can mention regarding vaccines is what

Dr. Goldberg has said: Don't give them if there is

any sign of illness, have them off dairy (at least a

week prior if not on any dietary intervention), and

give Tylenol for 24 hours in advance. This will help

reduce probability of reaction to the vaccines.

In Alabama, there is no access to single shot Measles.

I believe this may be true everywhere, but you would

need to confirm this with your pediatrician or health

department. It's on back order - I believe supplies

are unavailable. Dr. G says if your child is well (no

signs of ?) and the tylenol/no dairy or whole

grains, the MMR should be fine. If you are very

concerned, or if your child has had a previous vaccine

reaction, you can see an immunologist prior to the

vaccines to evaluate her to make sure she can have

them.

We haven't had the 3rd DT (diptheria/ tetanus) yet

because my son reacted severely to both DTaP and DT,

but Dr. G wants him to have the third one (I suspect

the Tetanus part was the part that hurt him) and said

an immunologist could make sure all was okay for him

to get it. If your child is healthy and not having

chronic stomach pains all night, diahrea every day,

etc, then I would not worry about her with this, and

go ahead and get the shot. Tetanus is usually benign

for most people - my son's reaction was extremely

rare. But find out far enough in advance if 3 tetanus

shots are going to be required to provide sufficient

immunity so you will have time to get them if

necessary. If you have a history of ulcerative

colitis, though, you may want to ask more. (No one,

including Dr G has said anything relating to that - it

is just my personal theory!)

It should be fine to get the shots (even that scary

MMR) if your daughter is healthy. If you are

concerned, you could do the lab work ups (immune

panels) prior to it and make sure there are no

dramatic problems, and then you could feel safer.

(That said, I'm still postponing my little one's last

MMR and DT.)

Best of luck

--- Sara Suresh <sidman1@...> wrote:

> I am getting ready to go overseas in a couple of

> months and I have an 18

> month old girl who has only been given one polio

> shot. I haven't

> immunized her at all otherwise but am thinking about

> tetanus and

> measles. Has anyone had any luck giving just

> measles, not included in

> the usual MMR vaccine? I dont want to give any other

> shots yet, hence

> the bare minimum.

>

> Also, my son who is 8.5 yrs, autistic, needs Hep A

> vaccine. Has anyone

> given their child that and had no problems?

>

> Any input would be greatly appreciated.

> Thanks

> Sara

__________________________________

Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with

the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the

opinion of the Research Institute.

September 17, 2003

One more thing (after all my wordiness on the other

post) -

Keep in mind that if you are going oversees, where

vaccine protection is nowhere near what we have in the

states, that if your child would be likely to react to

these vaccines, those vaccine reactions would be

nowhere near what could happen to her if she obtained

the actual diseases. If an MMR could hurt a child,

Measles could kill them.

Per Dr. G.

Take care-

--- Sara Suresh <sidman1@...> wrote:

> I am getting ready to go overseas in a couple of

> months and I have an 18

> month old girl who has only been given one polio

> shot. I haven't

> immunized her at all otherwise but am thinking about

> tetanus and

> measles. Has anyone had any luck giving just

> measles, not included in

> the usual MMR vaccine? I dont want to give any other

> shots yet, hence

> the bare minimum.

>

> Also, my son who is 8.5 yrs, autistic, needs Hep A

> vaccine. Has anyone

> given their child that and had no problems?

>

> Any input would be greatly appreciated.

> Thanks

> Sara

__________________________________

Responsibility for the content of this message lies strictly with

the original author, and is not necessarily endorsed by or the

opinion of the Research Institute.

September 17, 2003

Measles is available as a separate shot but you may have to call around to

find it since recent reports said the demand for the separate shots was greater

than supply in many cases. If you're concerned about a negative reaction, you

might want to read up on the studies of vitamin A levels at the time of the

shot. I don't recall who was doing these studies but they should be complete

by now as the theory was suggested several years ago that low vitamin A levels

contributed to problems with the MMR. Wakefield's work would be a good place

to start.

Gaylen

September 17, 2003

Sara,

This is something I posted last year that might help... I found the posts in

the " Ask Dr. Goldberg " section of his website

( http://www.neuroimmunedr.com ).

Caroline

Topic: Recommended Delayed Immunization Schedule (1 of 2), Read 160 times

Conf: Ask Dr. Goldberg

Date: Sunday, July 22, 2001 05:16 PM

QUESTION posted to Dr. Goldberg...

" We have a 28 month old son who has been labeled autistic. We also have a 4

year old daughter (non-autistic) and a 4 month old son.

We are looking for a recommended schedule for delaying the immunization of

our 4 month old son.

Our questions are:

1.Which immunizations should be delayed, and how long?

2.Should each immunization be administered individually, and with what delay

in between?

3.What about mercury-free vaccinations?

4.Are there any vaccinations that should be delayed indefinitely for a child

at increased risk for ASD?

5.Should all immunizations be administered as a monovalent, or just the MMR?

Any advice that may help us reduce our risk would be greatly appreciated.

Topic: Recommended Delayed Immunization Schedule (2 of 2), Read 112 times

Conf: Ask Dr. Goldberg From: Dr. Goldberg office@...

Date: Thursday, August 16, 2001 09:20 PM

ANSWER posted by Dr. Goldberg...

Dear Dan,

Please review multiple postings on website. In general (depending upon the

child, general health, allergy prevention, etc.) I would give the DPT /

Polio / Hib (generally OK together) at 2, 4, 6 months old, DPT / Polio

booster at 18 months old (note: still believe in Tylenol or Advil or Motrin

for 24 hrs starting with a dose before heading to the physicians office), I

do not give Hepatitis B in the nursery but generally give it during baby

visits (not at same time as other vaccines). MMR (I do not generally

separate it) can be given 12 15 months old (depending on measles risk in

your area, time of year, etc.) ?? delay a little later (IF no exposure risk

to measles). I am not currently in favor of the chickenpox vaccine before

adolescence and do not recommend the 5 year MMR to any children in the

practice (believe 10 11 yr. old booster far more logical medically).

As I have discussed, the biggest key to lowering the risks for your son, is

good allergy control, dietary eliminations, ³maintain² a healthy not

stressed child (under which circumstances the vaccines are fine too give)

Again please see presentations and discussions on this site for further

discussion.

Take care, MJG

> On 9/16/03 2:20 PM, " Sara Suresh " <sidman1@...> wrote:

> I am getting ready to go overseas in a couple of months and I have an 18

> month old girl who has only been given one polio shot. I haven't

> immunized her at all otherwise but am thinking about tetanus and

> measles. Has anyone had any luck giving just measles, not included in

> the usual MMR vaccine? I dont want to give any other shots yet, hence

> the bare minimum.

>

> Also, my son who is 8.5 yrs, autistic, needs Hep A vaccine. Has anyone

> given their child that and had no problems?

>

> Any input would be greatly appreciated.

> Thanks

> Sara

[Edited to enable hyperlink]

September 19, 2003

----Original Message Follows----

From: Googahly@...

Reply-

Subject: Re: re:vaccines

Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 16:08:27 EDT

>Measles is available as a separate shot but you may have to call around to

>find it since recent reports said the demand for the separate shots was

>greater

>than supply in many cases. If you're concerned about a negative reaction,

>you

>might want to read up on the studies of vitamin A levels at the time of the

>shot. I don't recall who was doing these studies but they should be

>complete

>by now as the theory was suggested several years ago that low vitamin A

>levels

>contributed to problems with the MMR. Wakefield's work would be a good

>place

>to start.

>Gaylen

If I remember correctly........those studies had to do with very unhealthy

starving children in third world countries with a lot of disease. The

concern was that they were immune suppressed and might not develop

antibodies to protect them against further disease. I don't think that

would compare to the problems that many of our children have.

There are still many questions regarding Wakefields work. One thing that

has really bothered me is all the claims saying that other researchers are

validating his claims. There is only one researcher (O'leary?, or something

like that) that I'm aware of that says he found the measles virus and I

believe he hasn't claimed it was the vaccine strain. Other gastro research

that is mentioned a lot says absolutely nothing about measles. Even Dr.

Singh doesn't say that the vaccine is the cause, his research says that they

are having an abnormal immune response. That isn't surprising since they

have abnormal responses to many things.

There was a really interesting post to Dr. G about a month or two ago.

(neuroimmunedr.com) It was from a parent who had emailed Dr. Singh about

his studies. I thought the attached reply was very interesting. (if I

knew she had permission to share the email, I'd just attach it.) It was

about all the supplements being used and how certain doctors are doing

treatments " based on non-scientific unpublished information or at least the

ones that have not gone through any peer-review. "

He told her that he didn't think the clock was ticking away because the

brain continues to develop way into adulthood and so whatever the new

research shows, it will enhance their knowledge and lead to new treatment

options.

He also said that she " probably needs to consult with both a neurologist and

an immunologist or more appropiately a neuroimmunologist who specializes in

children rather than adults. Such a person would be extremely difficult to

find simply because they are the rare breeds of our medical education system

today "

This is what led up to her post asking if Dr. G. could help her.

Cheryl

Topic: Autism and Immune Dysfunction

Conf: Ask Dr. Goldberg

From: Dr. Goldberg office@...

Date: Monday, September 08, 2003 09:32 PM

Dear ,

I do not even want to think of the horror stories ahead, when many parents

out there wake up to the potential harm they have inadvertently (IT is NOT a

parent’s fault for trying, but it is time ALL parents had a chance to become

informed logically, scientifically) done to there children via ideas still

promoted thru “ well meaning” doctors, but it has become terrifying. I said

years ago, Dr. Singh was one of the few reputable Autism researchers and

stand strongly by that statement (and yet note how little funding or support

he has received from the “Autism” community). All too many out there

continue too follow 30 – 40 year old ideas, thinking that had potential

dangers then, but as commented, between immune factors and the inordinate

number of your children showing chronic viral issues, are potentially

disastrous now. How many supplements are potentially helping, feeding these

viruses or inappropriately activating the immune system further,

accelerating the rate of harm, rather than having the intended effect of

thinking they are going to help that child.

Please review my postings on this site, articles and presentations, obtain

the video tapes (off the .net) site, and you will be on your way to

understanding what is going on with your son and what to do until we do

establish a greater network of oriented physicians. There are steps

that can be taken now; there are ways to seek out additional medical help,

while “waiting” (Believe me, I AM far more upset and frustrated than any of

you can imagine). ALL these efforts have been delayed for years by the

misdirection of the current “autistic” groups and research efforts.

Fortunately, I believe things are about to change, and the concept of

“neuro-immunologists,” at minimum an outreach helping physician understand

and follow a pathway, could really happen, BUT it would be nice IF

parents helped. I believe there can be a much better future and path of

therapy for your son and so many others out there, but it’s time all of you

began challenging the false ideas that still so unfairly control the fate of

your families and your children.

Working as fast as I can (would be nice to see the effort receive more

help and support) . . .

MJG

September 19, 2003

The study I was referring to was about Vitamin A loading prior to getting an

MMR shot and if I recall correctly was being done here in the states and then

checking immune response. I really don't recall that much since I don't

follow the vaccine hubbub all that closely. My son got all of his vaccines

until

age 3 before I ever heard any mention of possible harm, then we stopped because

several docs felt he was too health compromised to handle them, then a few

years ago when he was healthy enough to possibly handle a shot, we tested titers

and he was still showing immunity to all but polio (which showed iffy) -- and

an excessive reaction to measles and mumps. I do still have some concerns

over the combined MMR which would make me at least want to significantly delay

the shot even in kids that seem healthy. If I had another child, I'd also try

to push a doc to run an immune panel prior to and maybe six months after any

shot so I'd have a better idea what I was dealing with. Of course, if I

understand the " research " (if you can call it that since both sides seem to pick

and choose how they'll look at issues and slant it in the direction they want)

they still don't know if a negative reaction would be due to a disordered

immune system prior to the shot, but I'd be willing to bet more on that than

anything else.

Gaylen

January 11, 2004

Becky,

Here is something I pulled from the " Ask Dr. Goldberg " section of his

website (www.neuroimmunedr.com)... it is an old message but I think his

opinion is probably basically the same on the issue.

Caroline

Topic: Recommended Delayed Immunization Schedule