Re: Re: Strong base note ratios for fixation not overdose!

[Guest guest]

I am not certain if this is the answer you are looking for. But when you are

building your base accords that contain such things as vetiver tobacco and

patchouli, you are generally not using them alone.

Certainly anything combined with 55% vetiver would be overpowered. When you

build the base accord, you do calm the vetiver with something that tones it down

for example I just did a base with vetiver and labdanum. The ratio was down to

9:1 Labdanum to Vetiver before I got to where I could take the vetiver without

it just taking over. In the same thing, I also had Patchouli, and I brought it

under control with benzoin 6:3 (in the same mix) Rounding the whole thign out

with Oakmoss and Cassia. As a base, the note is not so overpowering that you

can't smell the hearts and tops, but it is still fairly strong of a fixative

that it held the green top notes I used and rolled nicely into the geranium

middle as well.

I can't imagine using a single one of the strong base notes as an accord all by

itself. As " base notes " things like vetivert and labdanum and benzoin, oakmoss

and patchouli are very dense. They can easily overwhelm because they last so

long. They are all rated at 100 on Pouchers table for volatility, meaning they

don't evaporate with any appreciable speed at all. So I (personally) look for

ones in that similar volatility range to " calm " them down.

I am still very new at this myself, so my advice may not really be all that

helpful. It is just an observation.

`````

Hi there,

Your advice is very helpful and I really appreciate you taking the time to share

your experience.

When I look over my notes it definitely seems that I'm not toning them down

enough by a long shot. I'm making base accords out of

vetiver/patchouli/sandalwood with the ratio around 25/25/50% - not rounded out

enough for sure. Basically all of the trials where I've used vetiver, I'm not

happy with. Others using peru balsam, sandalwood and frankincense have been ok

but maybe still too distinct. I envy those who are able to allow a more

cohesive transition of odours to come through without anything poking out too

obviously.

That said, I have made a few (including a solid) that I'm quite proud of but

feel somehow that they were somewhat of a fluke or jag!

I would really like to obtain more base oils and abs as I feel that I am

somewhat limited in what types of fragrances I can produce. Labdanum is very

high on my want list as is oakmoss and cepes.

Thanks again for your advice - I am going to see if I can construct something

softer.

xo - P.S. If you've got a minute, I'd be curious to know what Labdanum

smells like to you

[Guest guest]

Try this as an experiment.

Take a test tube or vial or whatever you use to mix in.

Put a single drop of vetiver in it. Then choosing one of your softer (yet still

heavy bases, vanilla, benzoin, labdanum whatever) and add 2 drops of that to it

and cap it off and walk away. Go outside or whatever to clear your head. Sniff

some coffee and all that jazz. Then come back, and dip a strip in it and smell

it.

If it is still overpoweringly smokey or whatever you determine the vetiver

smells like to you, add 2 more drops and go away again.

It should get to a point when it seems right. If however you feel you are

getting close then just add one drop at a time. If you have lost the vetiver

altogether you can add one more drop of vetiver and then walk your other

ingredient back up a drop or two at a time.

When I was doing this for my last mix, I got to a 9:1 labdanum to vetiver before

I was happy.

I tried this before in one sitting, and with stuff as strong as veriver it is

difficult for me to get a good impression once I have been in its presence, so

after adding some more of something I cap it and walk away.

When I got to the ratio I was happy with I could no longer smell either

ingredient over the other, but they both had a new smell together. I don't know

a better way to describe it. You could tell it had vetiver in it, and you could

tell there was labdanum in it, but when you smelled it, neither one called out

to you more so than the other.

I hope that is useful.

-- B

[Guest guest]

 

I am not certain if this is the answer you are looking for. But when you

are building your base accords that contain such things as vetiver tobacco and

patchouli, you are generally not using them alone.

Certainly anything combined with 55% vetiver would be overpowered. When you

build the base accord, you do calm the vetiver with something that tones it down

for example I just did a base with vetiver and labdanum. The ratio was down to

9:1 Labdanum to Vetiver before I got to where I could take the vetiver without

it just taking over. In the same thing, I also had Patchouli, and I brought it

under control with benzoin 6:3 (in the same mix) Rounding the whole thign out

with Oakmoss and Cassia. As a base, the note is not so overpowering that you

can't smell the hearts and tops, but it is still fairly strong of a fixative

that it held the green top notes I used and rolled nicely into the geranium

middle as well.

I can't imagine using a single one of the strong base notes as an accord all by

itself. As " base notes " things like vetivert and labdanum and benzoin, oakmoss

and patchouli are very dense. They can easily overwhelm because they last so

long. They are all rated at 100 on Pouchers table for volatility, meaning they

don't evaporate with any appreciable speed at all. So I (personally) look for

ones in that similar volatility range to " calm " them down.

This is interesting, because I've found in a couple of my blends that the

labdanum can be overpowering, and recently I've been observing vetiver to be

well behaved, even taking a back seat.

[Guest guest]

________________________________

To: NaturalPerfumery

Sent: Mon, 28 February, 2011 8:04:26 PM

Subject: Re: Strong base note ratios for fixation not

overdose!

hi there, labdanum is a lovley oil and not too expensive, it is useful if you

wantto build an aber accord: ) it smells to me, resiny, balsamic,

vsnillary,leathery, sweet, warm and cinamon spicy, and goes well with benzoin

, vanilla, tobacco, but not tried it with vetiver tho i inagine it to go well.

bluebell

Sounds like my kind of oil! I wonder how different the eo is to the absolute.

I'm starting to accumulate more absolutes as I find them to be so much richer

and fuller and exciting in general. If only they weren't so damn expensive!