Re: Making Kefir from Kombucha

[Guest guest]

I would be interested in the microbiota in the brews you mentioned. I

am no microbiologist myself, but I understand that kombucha and vinegar

and kefir and other standardized and ancient cultures each have their

own symbiotic set of yeasts/bacteria that will culture true with

variations only for specific culturing conditions. There are published

charts of the different compositions of those 3 cultures.

However, your description of what you are assuming are kefir grains is

the " derived " kefir the commercial scientists make " commercially " . It

is NOT the REAL " kefir grains " that have origins back in antiquity so

far no one knows for sure and certain. Kefir grains may be used for

other juices, etc. to ferment different things but they only propagate

from other caulifflower-looking clumps of their particular mix of

bacteria/yeast. Once used for other things (as when one uses milk kefir

grains for water kefir, then it will not again produce new milk kefir

grains from itself. It will, I understand, cause milk kefir to culture.

You said, " generally, kefir refers to a " designer " blend of bacteria

precisely selected by

'professional' science persons in modernity to digest and convert many

forms of dairy|bovine carbohydrates/sugars. one can think of it as an

engineeredform of kombucha reformulated to ferment all sort of dairy

items-to produce a coconut kefir batch " etc.

That description describes the commercial kind ... NOT the REAL kefir,

the ancient one which will grown and reproduce true into perpetuity if

fed and kept right. It grew in goatbags, marebags, etc. in ancient

times in all kinds of temperatures .. they think originating in the

Caucasus area ..but there is much speculation. It is true that those

grains will " culture " many different types of milks ..including coconut.

Then you note, " in other words, it is crafted by biochemical

laboratories and biotech companies currently. unlike kombucha, these

grains have a " terminating " cycle of fermenting utilization. kefir can

be produced directly from a living healthy scoby. " I have no doubt from

my fermenting experiences with kefirs from REAL " grains " which

perpetuate true, and kombucha, water kefirs, and vinegars and a few

" whatevers " when I experiment that what you have is an interesting

fermentation from scoby-source.

I have posted my " giant kefir grains " pics many times and am including

the pics in a book I am writing. I thought I was wearing the available

" brewers " out with displaying them. They were an experiment of mine

which was to see just how large I could grow them and had fun with

updates to the kefir groups as we went along as to what to name " it " (I

started with 2). Take a look:

http://www.photobucket.com/Joyce-KefirMannaColony

Let's keep sharing and experimenting... always interesting!!! Joyce

Simmerman

[Guest guest]

I would be interested in the microbiota in the brews you mentioned. I

am no microbiologist myself, but I understand that kombucha and vinegar

and kefir and other standardized and ancient cultures each have their

own symbiotic set of yeasts/bacteria that will culture true with

variations only for specific culturing conditions. There are published

charts of the different compositions of those 3 cultures.

However, your description of what you are assuming are kefir grains is

the " derived " kefir the commercial scientists make " commercially " . It

is NOT the REAL " kefir grains " that have origins back in antiquity so

far no one knows for sure and certain. Kefir grains may be used for

other juices, etc. to ferment different things but they only propagate

from other caulifflower-looking clumps of their particular mix of

bacteria/yeast. Once used for other things (as when one uses milk kefir

grains for water kefir, then it will not again produce new milk kefir

grains from itself. It will, I understand, cause milk kefir to culture.

You said, " generally, kefir refers to a " designer " blend of bacteria

precisely selected by

'professional' science persons in modernity to digest and convert many

forms of dairy|bovine carbohydrates/sugars. one can think of it as an

engineeredform of kombucha reformulated to ferment all sort of dairy

items-to produce a coconut kefir batch " etc.

That description describes the commercial kind ... NOT the REAL kefir,

the ancient one which will grown and reproduce true into perpetuity if

fed and kept right. It grew in goatbags, marebags, etc. in ancient

times in all kinds of temperatures .. they think originating in the

Caucasus area ..but there is much speculation. It is true that those

grains will " culture " many different types of milks ..including coconut.

Then you note, " in other words, it is crafted by biochemical

laboratories and biotech companies currently. unlike kombucha, these

grains have a " terminating " cycle of fermenting utilization. kefir can

be produced directly from a living healthy scoby. " I have no doubt from

my fermenting experiences with kefirs from REAL " grains " which

perpetuate true, and kombucha, water kefirs, and vinegars and a few

" whatevers " when I experiment that what you have is an interesting

fermentation from scoby-source.

I have posted my " giant kefir grains " pics many times and am including

the pics in a book I am writing. I thought I was wearing the available

" brewers " out with displaying them. They were an experiment of mine

which was to see just how large I could grow them and had fun with

updates to the kefir groups as we went along as to what to name " it " (I

started with 2). Take a look:

http://www.photobucket.com/Joyce-KefirMannaColony

Let's keep sharing and experimenting... always interesting!!! Joyce

Simmerman

[Guest guest]

I wholeheartedly agree with this post ... All grains are not Kefir nor are all

SCOBYs Kombucha ...

Frantz

Subject: Re: Making Kefir from Kombucha

To: original_kombucha

Date: Friday, April 15, 2011, 7:11 PM

 

I would be interested in the microbiota in the brews you mentioned. I

am no microbiologist myself, but I understand that kombucha and vinegar

and kefir and other standardized and ancient cultures each have their

own symbiotic set of yeasts/bacteria that will culture true with

variations only for specific culturing conditions. There are published

charts of the different compositions of those 3 cultures.

However, your description of what you are assuming are kefir grains is

the " derived " kefir the commercial scientists make " commercially " . It

is NOT the REAL " kefir grains " that have origins back in antiquity so

far no one knows for sure and certain. Kefir grains may be used for

other juices, etc. to ferment different things but they only propagate

from other caulifflower-looking clumps of their particular mix of

bacteria/yeast. Once used for other things (as when one uses milk kefir

grains for water kefir, then it will not again produce new milk kefir

grains from itself. It will, I understand, cause milk kefir to culture.

You said, " generally, kefir refers to a " designer " blend of bacteria

precisely selected by

'professional' science persons in modernity to digest and convert many

forms of dairy|bovine carbohydrates/sugars. one can think of it as an

engineeredform of kombucha reformulated to ferment all sort of dairy

items-to produce a coconut kefir batch " etc.

That description describes the commercial kind ... NOT the REAL kefir,

the ancient one which will grown and reproduce true into perpetuity if

fed and kept right. It grew in goatbags, marebags, etc. in ancient

times in all kinds of temperatures .. they think originating in the

Caucasus area ..but there is much speculation. It is true that those

grains will " culture " many different types of milks ..including coconut.

Then you note, " in other words, it is crafted by biochemical

laboratories and biotech companies currently. unlike kombucha, these

grains have a " terminating " cycle of fermenting utilization. kefir can

be produced directly from a living healthy scoby. " I have no doubt from

my fermenting experiences with kefirs from REAL " grains " which

perpetuate true, and kombucha, water kefirs, and vinegars and a few

" whatevers " when I experiment that what you have is an interesting

fermentation from scoby-source.

I have posted my " giant kefir grains " pics many times and am including

the pics in a book I am writing. I thought I was wearing the available

" brewers " out with displaying them. They were an experiment of mine

which was to see just how large I could grow them and had fun with

updates to the kefir groups as we went along as to what to name " it " (I

started with 2). Take a look:

http://www.photobucket.com/Joyce-KefirMannaColony

Let's keep sharing and experimenting... always interesting!!! Joyce

Simmerman

<!--

#yivrial;margin:1hild {

border-right:none !important;

}

-->

[Guest guest]

I wholeheartedly agree with this post ... All grains are not Kefir nor are all

SCOBYs Kombucha ...

Frantz

Subject: Re: Making Kefir from Kombucha

To: original_kombucha

Date: Friday, April 15, 2011, 7:11 PM

 

I would be interested in the microbiota in the brews you mentioned. I

am no microbiologist myself, but I understand that kombucha and vinegar

and kefir and other standardized and ancient cultures each have their

own symbiotic set of yeasts/bacteria that will culture true with

variations only for specific culturing conditions. There are published

charts of the different compositions of those 3 cultures.

However, your description of what you are assuming are kefir grains is

the " derived " kefir the commercial scientists make " commercially " . It

is NOT the REAL " kefir grains " that have origins back in antiquity so

far no one knows for sure and certain. Kefir grains may be used for

other juices, etc. to ferment different things but they only propagate

from other caulifflower-looking clumps of their particular mix of

bacteria/yeast. Once used for other things (as when one uses milk kefir

grains for water kefir, then it will not again produce new milk kefir

grains from itself. It will, I understand, cause milk kefir to culture.

You said, " generally, kefir refers to a " designer " blend of bacteria

precisely selected by

'professional' science persons in modernity to digest and convert many

forms of dairy|bovine carbohydrates/sugars. one can think of it as an

engineeredform of kombucha reformulated to ferment all sort of dairy

items-to produce a coconut kefir batch " etc.

That description describes the commercial kind ... NOT the REAL kefir,

the ancient one which will grown and reproduce true into perpetuity if

fed and kept right. It grew in goatbags, marebags, etc. in ancient

times in all kinds of temperatures .. they think originating in the

Caucasus area ..but there is much speculation. It is true that those

grains will " culture " many different types of milks ..including coconut.

Then you note, " in other words, it is crafted by biochemical

laboratories and biotech companies currently. unlike kombucha, these

grains have a " terminating " cycle of fermenting utilization. kefir can

be produced directly from a living healthy scoby. " I have no doubt from

my fermenting experiences with kefirs from REAL " grains " which

perpetuate true, and kombucha, water kefirs, and vinegars and a few

" whatevers " when I experiment that what you have is an interesting

fermentation from scoby-source.

I have posted my " giant kefir grains " pics many times and am including

the pics in a book I am writing. I thought I was wearing the available

" brewers " out with displaying them. They were an experiment of mine

which was to see just how large I could grow them and had fun with

updates to the kefir groups as we went along as to what to name " it " (I

started with 2). Take a look:

http://www.photobucket.com/Joyce-KefirMannaColony

Let's keep sharing and experimenting... always interesting!!! Joyce

Simmerman

<!--

#yivrial;margin:1hild {

border-right:none !important;

}

-->

[Guest guest]

Hi joyce I enjoyed your post very much.

I am currently brewing kombucha and keiffer. I thought about adding water

keiffer but am concerned that the cultures might mix and cross each

other,which would throw everything off. What are your thoughts?

Peace and thanks

Natasha

> I would be interested in the microbiota in the brews you mentioned. I

> am no microbiologist myself, but I understand that kombucha and vinegar

> and kefir and other standardized and ancient cultures each have their

> own symbiotic set of yeasts/bacteria that will culture true with

> variations only for specific culturing conditions. There are published

> charts of the different compositions of those 3 cultures.

>

> However, your description of what you are assuming are kefir grains is

> the " derived " kefir the commercial scientists make " commercially " . It

> is NOT the REAL " kefir grains " that have origins back in antiquity so

> far no one knows for sure and certain. Kefir grains may be used for

> other juices, etc. to ferment different things but they only propagate

> from other caulifflower-looking clumps of their particular mix of

> bacteria/yeast. Once used for other things (as when one uses milk kefir

> grains for water kefir, then it will not again produce new milk kefir

> grains from itself. It will, I understand, cause milk kefir to culture.

>

> You said, " generally, kefir refers to a " designer " blend of bacteria

> precisely selected by

> 'professional' science persons in modernity to digest and convert many

> forms of dairy|bovine carbohydrates/sugars. one can think of it as an

> engineeredform of kombucha reformulated to ferment all sort of dairy

> items-to produce a coconut kefir batch " etc.

>

> That description describes the commercial kind ... NOT the REAL kefir,

> the ancient one which will grown and reproduce true into perpetuity if

> fed and kept right. It grew in goatbags, marebags, etc. in ancient

> times in all kinds of temperatures .. they think originating in the

> Caucasus area ..but there is much speculation. It is true that those

> grains will " culture " many different types of milks ..including coconut.

>

> Then you note, " in other words, it is crafted by biochemical

> laboratories and biotech companies currently. unlike kombucha, these

> grains have a " terminating " cycle of fermenting utilization. kefir can

> be produced directly from a living healthy scoby. " I have no doubt from

> my fermenting experiences with kefirs from REAL " grains " which

> perpetuate true, and kombucha, water kefirs, and vinegars and a few

> " whatevers " when I experiment that what you have is an interesting

> fermentation from scoby-source.

>

> I have posted my " giant kefir grains " pics many times and am including

> the pics in a book I am writing. I thought I was wearing the available

> " brewers " out with displaying them. They were an experiment of mine

> which was to see just how large I could grow them and had fun with

> updates to the kefir groups as we went along as to what to name " it " (I

> started with 2). Take a look:

> http://www.photobucket.com/Joyce-KefirMannaColony

>

> Let's keep sharing and experimenting... always interesting!!! Joyce

> Simmerman

[Guest guest]

Hi joyce I enjoyed your post very much.

I am currently brewing kombucha and keiffer. I thought about adding water

keiffer but am concerned that the cultures might mix and cross each

other,which would throw everything off. What are your thoughts?

Peace and thanks

Natasha

> I would be interested in the microbiota in the brews you mentioned. I

> am no microbiologist myself, but I understand that kombucha and vinegar

> and kefir and other standardized and ancient cultures each have their

> own symbiotic set of yeasts/bacteria that will culture true with

> variations only for specific culturing conditions. There are published

> charts of the different compositions of those 3 cultures.

>

> However, your description of what you are assuming are kefir grains is

> the " derived " kefir the commercial scientists make " commercially " . It

> is NOT the REAL " kefir grains " that have origins back in antiquity so

> far no one knows for sure and certain. Kefir grains may be used for

> other juices, etc. to ferment different things but they only propagate

> from other caulifflower-looking clumps of their particular mix of

> bacteria/yeast. Once used for other things (as when one uses milk kefir

> grains for water kefir, then it will not again produce new milk kefir

> grains from itself. It will, I understand, cause milk kefir to culture.

>

> You said, " generally, kefir refers to a " designer " blend of bacteria

> precisely selected by

> 'professional' science persons in modernity to digest and convert many

> forms of dairy|bovine carbohydrates/sugars. one can think of it as an

> engineeredform of kombucha reformulated to ferment all sort of dairy

> items-to produce a coconut kefir batch " etc.

>

> That description describes the commercial kind ... NOT the REAL kefir,

> the ancient one which will grown and reproduce true into perpetuity if

> fed and kept right. It grew in goatbags, marebags, etc. in ancient

> times in all kinds of temperatures .. they think originating in the

> Caucasus area ..but there is much speculation. It is true that those

> grains will " culture " many different types of milks ..including coconut.

>

> Then you note, " in other words, it is crafted by biochemical

> laboratories and biotech companies currently. unlike kombucha, these

> grains have a " terminating " cycle of fermenting utilization. kefir can

> be produced directly from a living healthy scoby. " I have no doubt from

> my fermenting experiences with kefirs from REAL " grains " which

> perpetuate true, and kombucha, water kefirs, and vinegars and a few

> " whatevers " when I experiment that what you have is an interesting

> fermentation from scoby-source.

>

> I have posted my " giant kefir grains " pics many times and am including

> the pics in a book I am writing. I thought I was wearing the available

> " brewers " out with displaying them. They were an experiment of mine

> which was to see just how large I could grow them and had fun with

> updates to the kefir groups as we went along as to what to name " it " (I

> started with 2). Take a look:

> http://www.photobucket.com/Joyce-KefirMannaColony

>

> Let's keep sharing and experimenting... always interesting!!! Joyce

> Simmerman