Guest guest Posted November 22, 2010 Report Share Posted November 22, 2010 I was still scared when I started, but again it was fear, by then fear of doing nothing was worse than doing it! Mandi x I do exactly the same as you, i was nervous to start chelation, fear of the unknown, so empowered myself by reading up on other peoples experiences and emailing people and asking the in's and out's of a duck's behind, knowledge is power and when i have the knowledge i feel confident, my only regret with chelation is i waited too long before i started because i was scared. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2010 Report Share Posted November 22, 2010 I was still scared when I started, but again it was fear, by then fear of doing nothing was worse than doing it! Mandi x I do exactly the same as you, i was nervous to start chelation, fear of the unknown, so empowered myself by reading up on other peoples experiences and emailing people and asking the in's and out's of a duck's behind, knowledge is power and when i have the knowledge i feel confident, my only regret with chelation is i waited too long before i started because i was scared. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2010 Report Share Posted November 22, 2010 I was still scared when I started, but again it was fear, by then fear of doing nothing was worse than doing it! Mandi x I do exactly the same as you, i was nervous to start chelation, fear of the unknown, so empowered myself by reading up on other peoples experiences and emailing people and asking the in's and out's of a duck's behind, knowledge is power and when i have the knowledge i feel confident, my only regret with chelation is i waited too long before i started because i was scared. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2010 Report Share Posted November 22, 2010 Yes the usual stuff, but never did DAN chelation high dose. Did do 9 months of Buttar style which was a waste of time and money. TD DMPS is good stuff IMO, like DMSA and ALA you just have to use it properly. We did use Activated Liuqid Zeolites with good effect cognition wise that was maintained after we stopped but gut feeling is that was working on virus, but could have been adressig ammonia, metals, and or pH issues. We had Yasko SNP testing done a couple of years back showing Sam has CBS699T ++ which suggests he would have done very badly on DAN chelation because of high dosing even without the complication of the timing. I used to be on 27 yahoo/e-groups, for nearly 3 years I read almost every post, tracked various kids, watched various protocols then made the decision. Its much easier these days with summary information more easily accessible. So many folks that didn't want to do Cutler come back after a while and do it, the only reason I can see for not wanting to try it not wanting to get up (not my favourite thing either but needs must) and if you do DMPS its 8 hourly dosing and you don't have to get up anyway. Many DAN's say my way is *quicker*, I do not believe there is anything quick about safe chelation although many folks see early gains, its a long haul treatment and after many years of collecting data is still the ARI parent feedback top intervention at 75% seeing good things. Last time I looked that was nearly 20% higher than GFCF............ Mandi x May I ask you, before you started ACP, did you have previous experience with DAN treatment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2010 Report Share Posted November 22, 2010 Yes the usual stuff, but never did DAN chelation high dose. Did do 9 months of Buttar style which was a waste of time and money. TD DMPS is good stuff IMO, like DMSA and ALA you just have to use it properly. We did use Activated Liuqid Zeolites with good effect cognition wise that was maintained after we stopped but gut feeling is that was working on virus, but could have been adressig ammonia, metals, and or pH issues. We had Yasko SNP testing done a couple of years back showing Sam has CBS699T ++ which suggests he would have done very badly on DAN chelation because of high dosing even without the complication of the timing. I used to be on 27 yahoo/e-groups, for nearly 3 years I read almost every post, tracked various kids, watched various protocols then made the decision. Its much easier these days with summary information more easily accessible. So many folks that didn't want to do Cutler come back after a while and do it, the only reason I can see for not wanting to try it not wanting to get up (not my favourite thing either but needs must) and if you do DMPS its 8 hourly dosing and you don't have to get up anyway. Many DAN's say my way is *quicker*, I do not believe there is anything quick about safe chelation although many folks see early gains, its a long haul treatment and after many years of collecting data is still the ARI parent feedback top intervention at 75% seeing good things. Last time I looked that was nearly 20% higher than GFCF............ Mandi x May I ask you, before you started ACP, did you have previous experience with DAN treatment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2010 Report Share Posted November 22, 2010 Yes the usual stuff, but never did DAN chelation high dose. Did do 9 months of Buttar style which was a waste of time and money. TD DMPS is good stuff IMO, like DMSA and ALA you just have to use it properly. We did use Activated Liuqid Zeolites with good effect cognition wise that was maintained after we stopped but gut feeling is that was working on virus, but could have been adressig ammonia, metals, and or pH issues. We had Yasko SNP testing done a couple of years back showing Sam has CBS699T ++ which suggests he would have done very badly on DAN chelation because of high dosing even without the complication of the timing. I used to be on 27 yahoo/e-groups, for nearly 3 years I read almost every post, tracked various kids, watched various protocols then made the decision. Its much easier these days with summary information more easily accessible. So many folks that didn't want to do Cutler come back after a while and do it, the only reason I can see for not wanting to try it not wanting to get up (not my favourite thing either but needs must) and if you do DMPS its 8 hourly dosing and you don't have to get up anyway. Many DAN's say my way is *quicker*, I do not believe there is anything quick about safe chelation although many folks see early gains, its a long haul treatment and after many years of collecting data is still the ARI parent feedback top intervention at 75% seeing good things. Last time I looked that was nearly 20% higher than GFCF............ Mandi x May I ask you, before you started ACP, did you have previous experience with DAN treatment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2010 Report Share Posted November 22, 2010 Mandi, May I ask you, before you started ACP, did you have previous experience with DAN treatment? Thanks, To: Autism-Biomedical-Europe Sent: Mon, November 22, 2010 5:14:41 PMSubject: Re: Re: Cutler or DAN! I was still scared when I started, but again it was fear, by then fear of doing nothing was worse than doing it! Mandi x I do exactly the same as you, i was nervous to start chelation, fear of the unknown, so empowered myself by reading up on other peoples experiences and emailing people and asking the in's and out's of a duck's behind, knowledge is power and when i have the knowledge i feel confident, my only regret with chelation is i waited too long before i started because i was scared. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2010 Report Share Posted November 22, 2010 Mandi, May I ask you, before you started ACP, did you have previous experience with DAN treatment? Thanks, To: Autism-Biomedical-Europe Sent: Mon, November 22, 2010 5:14:41 PMSubject: Re: Re: Cutler or DAN! I was still scared when I started, but again it was fear, by then fear of doing nothing was worse than doing it! Mandi x I do exactly the same as you, i was nervous to start chelation, fear of the unknown, so empowered myself by reading up on other peoples experiences and emailing people and asking the in's and out's of a duck's behind, knowledge is power and when i have the knowledge i feel confident, my only regret with chelation is i waited too long before i started because i was scared. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2010 Report Share Posted November 22, 2010 Mandi, May I ask you, before you started ACP, did you have previous experience with DAN treatment? Thanks, To: Autism-Biomedical-Europe Sent: Mon, November 22, 2010 5:14:41 PMSubject: Re: Re: Cutler or DAN! I was still scared when I started, but again it was fear, by then fear of doing nothing was worse than doing it! Mandi x I do exactly the same as you, i was nervous to start chelation, fear of the unknown, so empowered myself by reading up on other peoples experiences and emailing people and asking the in's and out's of a duck's behind, knowledge is power and when i have the knowledge i feel confident, my only regret with chelation is i waited too long before i started because i was scared. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 23, 2010 Report Share Posted November 23, 2010 That's a shame Margaret, my problem is the gut issue where the general thinking is to chelate in order to deal with the gut, but what if there are problems aside from mercury. Is it not possible to make a very fragile child worse? Having said that, now that I have waited to chelate I am delighted with AC protocol, we are seeing great cognitive gains, just wish there were more positive feedback from those chelating older children and not always being told how much harder it is, we are not finding it hard at all, but obviously what I don't know is how much damage leaving mercury there has done, but sometimes a decision has to be made based on the child in front of you. Vicky I read Dr Cutler's book some years ago and found it very hard to follow. At the end of it, I was far from clear that this was the way to go. I guess most people (I include myself) have very little scientific education and this means we are considerably disadvantaged in assessing the science behind anything.The first post I ever made on Autism-Mercury was quite a few years ago. I asked what the scientific evidence was and for references to papers that showed this. I received a rude and abrupt reply to the effect that if I wanted references I would have to do all the research myself and it wasn't going to be given to me. Since I am not a scientist and also didn't have the time or the resources to obtain all the original papers I was very put off. I was really being told to take it or leave it. Not very helpful.I decided in the circumstances,even though I knew he had a body burden of lead and I am still very concerned about this, not to do anything that might provoke more seizures in my child, alienate my child's father, get me in trouble with the child protection people and lead to my child being taken into care.Margaret> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > I agree with Mandi, we are doing Cutler protocol chelation> > > and> > > > > > only> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > seeing good things. Both the Autism Mercury and> > > > > Recoveryfromautism> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > yahoo groups are full of people whose children have regressed> > > > > > > following> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > high dose chelation and are now doing Cutler's protocol> > > > > (regardless> > > > > > of> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > income!) Here is a good post from Andy about the differences> > > > > > between> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > the two:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > http://onibasu.com/archives/am/53055.html> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > To: Autism-Biomedical-Europe > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > From: Mum231ASD@> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2010 13:22:34 -0500> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: Cutler or DAN!> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Cutler protocol is safest and most efficient IMHO and IMEO.> > > > > There> > > > > > is> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > nothing quick about chelation. I learned of 2 families this> > > > past> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > weekend who> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > have each spent over $50,000 on IV chelation just to get> > > their> > > > > kid> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > worse not> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > better............ > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Mandi x> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > In a message dated 16/11/2010 14:15:44 GMT Standard Time,> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > rodler14@ writes:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > I've been reading a lot, some people say that IV DAN!> > > > > chelation> > > > > > is> > > > > > > a> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > roulette, you can damage your child's brain and never get> > > > hime> > > > > > > back.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > They> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > recomend Andy Cutler oral chelation protocol as most safe> > > > and> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > controlled way> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > to detox metals.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Others say that AC protocol is for those who do not have> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > enough money for expensive DAN! treatment, or whose> > > children> > > > > > have> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > only mild> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > forms of ASD.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > What the truth is? > > > > > > My protocol is for parents who actually care enough about their children to want them to get better.> > > > > > DAN! doctors are for parents still torn between their child's health needs and the need for societal approval that they're seeing a D O C T O R who proclaims himself an E X P E R T at what they need.> > > > > > ly, most of you would do absolutely anything, no matter how shocking, if you KNEW it would get your child better. So dump the doctor worship and figure out what your child needs! Don't just go to a doctor and say "HELP ME!" You did that before and the pediatrician 'helped' you by vaccinating your child and turning him autistic. Don't repeat that error, no matter how socially unacceptable it is to make your own decisions.> > > > > > >>>>>>>>I am affraid to make a wrong decision.> > > > > > This is reasonable given the typical outcome of DAN! chelation, but fear leads to very bad decisions. You need to calm down (and may need care yourself to do that, e. g. anxiolytics if your doctor thinks your fear has an anxiety component) or adrenal cortex supplements so you can be CONCERNED and AWARE but not AFRAID. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please tell me what you guys think? I need your advice!> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > I hope this all helps.> > > > Andy> > > > http://www.noamalgam.com/index.html> > Amalgam Illness: Diagnosis and Treatment> > > > http://www.noamalgam.com/hairtestbook.html> > Hair Test Interpretation: Finding Hidden Toxicities> > > > http://www.noamalgam.com/nourishinghope.html> > Nourishing Hope for Autism: Nutrition Intervention for Healing Our Children> > > > http://www.noamalgam.com/biologicaltreatments.html> > Biological Treatments for Autism and PDD> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 Can we please just establish what the difference of opinion is here? I am getting confused (that's not hard for me to do!) I am thinking :- Andy believes Mercury is toxic, it is implicated as cause of some autism, it effects the immune system and organs as well as the brain and chelating safely using low frequent doses will help address the toxicity in individuals unable to effectively detox their own systems? Natasa believes Mercury is toxic but is not implicated as a cause of autism? She feels that chelation may help in autism but that is for other reasons than removing Mercury? If you plan to chelate she feels low frequent dosing is the way to go? As I recall she has used this protocol for her own son in the past. Please correct me if I have this wrong as if this discussion is going to continue on the list we all need to be quite sure what its about, as this is scarey for newbies and old timers alike when two smart folks disagree, in fact probably fair to say Natasa disagreeing with large majority of the autism biomed community not just Andy. Thanks folks Mandi x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 http://tuberose.com/Mercury.html There is a video on the above website about mercury and how it can cause brain neurondegeneration. Also and i quote:- One of the natural absorbers of heavy metals is candida albicans. The body attracts yeast into the intestines to act as a natural sponge for the mercury. Heavy metals such as mercury act as free radicals, which are highly reactive, charged particles that damage body tissues. Free radicals prevent nutrients from entering the cells and wastes from leaving and block enzymes necessary for the body's detoxification processes. Mercury can bind to the DNA of cells, as well as to the cell membranes, distoring them and interfering with normal cell functions. The immune system no longer recognizes the target as part of the body and will attack it. Once mercury reaches its destination tissue, it has many ways in which it may express its toxicity in many ways. 1. Altered cell membrane permeability 2. Alteration of tertiary structure 3. Alteration of enzyme function 4. Interference in nerve impulses 5. Alteration of the genetic code 6. Inhibition of DNA repair 7. Interference with endocrine function 8. Contribution to autoimmune disease 9. Digestion and absorption alteration 10. Contribution to the development of antibiotic resistance x To: Autism-Biomedical-Europe From: mbrookh@...Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2010 17:46:40 +0000Subject: Re: Cutler or DAN! Cult or not, he's right on as far as I'm concerned. If I had waited for a healed gut, I'd still be waiting. It's 10y now since I came across the Berard, Binstock etal paper comparing autism-mercury and found the autism-mercury group. My daughter was 16y, devastated by seizures, super aggression, hypotonia, hypothyroid, immune values that looked terrible, limbs that she could barely feel, episodes of self injury, a huge, bloated abdomen w food particles apparent in stool, very high level pain tolerance etc. We'd searched long and hard in mainstream, [private, university, Mayos] and found no help. Derision was especially apparent when I brought up the subject of vaccines. She had gone down the proverbial tubes at age 6y after a DPT. It was only her 3rd as she had reacted so badly as an infant to the first 2. She also had her only MMR within a year of that 3rd DPT. Thank heavens, no more `protective' vaccines were on the shelf at that time. All the degreed parties told me in no uncertain terms that it was NOT associated w vaccines. Berard's paper made perfect sense and I knew then without a doubt what had happened to my beautiful child. She had ~80% of that symptom list. A simple hair test confirmed it to my satisfaction – first I spent some time in the medical library here looking for the older internal medicine texts that Cutler says validated hair testing – they were there; and doing lots of other research. My own doc ran some tests for me as hers would not. Her neurologist would not read one item I brought him and abandoned her as a patient because I even suggested toxicity. We began chelation at the top end of Cutler's rec – a big mistake. After a break due to family disagreements, we continue now at a lower dose. What have we seen – NOT a healed gut, for sure. Those huge dilated[#8 on a formal scale], unreactive pupils have recovered; the constant complaints of numbness are gone, pain tolerance is approaching normal, the super aggression is gone, self injury is a thing of the past. She has become more mellow and clued in. Diet has been an essential part of seizure control for her – seizures appear 12-16h after gluten/casein. This also makes sense in the scheme of things if mercury knocks out the efficiency of the enzyme that helps to digest these as Berard etal suggest. Until the metals are gone, I would never expect a normal gut. imho, the body works overtime to keep an even keel. To me, that means it may wrap all those offending/toxic items in yeast or whatever else it can to protect itself. Strep, Lyme and co. and who knows what else has come her way. I also consider Cutler the only safe protocol. If one analogizes chelators to other meds, prescription/over the counter, a half life/recommended dosing schedule is common to all. It would take a big leap of faith to think that an anticonvulsant w a half life of 8h would do anything positive given once a week/month; same w blood pressure meds, antibiotics, cardio-regulators etc. For a common headache, the ibuprofen begins to wear off after 3-4h generally and the headache returns. Why would one ever want to bolus such a dangerous agent as a chelator? Like all, I've made mistakes along the way. I've also learned to `listen' to my child. After a couple doses of td dmps, she threw the container away on garbage day. The land fill had it before I knew. GSE caused terrible rages – much more than I thought should be ongoing for a `die-off'. Testing many years after I first tried GSE, showed an allergy to grapefruit. Her allergies exhibit in the neuro system and never seem to cause the `normal' respiratory distress on reads about. Most of you are very fortunate that your children are young without the years of ongoing damage; fortunate, too, to be such parent advocates – docs in disguise really as you investigate the best way to help your little ones. I've learned so much from all while reading on line. Please…… do read from the files of autism-mercury re safe chelation. herself to/about AC or another list member..........> > I thinks this happens because we are such a passionate bunch. I have been > reading Andys posts for over 10 years on A-M list and originally saw him > explaining over and over and being nicey nicey and so many times people just > don't get it until he just started saying it the way it is to him with no > frills. > > After tiddling about for such a long time and asking question after > question (delaying tactic I see now) that Andy suggested very bluntly that I stop > wittering and get on with it, can't say it would have taken this long to > get going with chelation but I suspect I could have easily wasted another > year and will ever be grateful that didn't. He is blunt because he cares IMHO> > Mx> > > > > I think it's very important that everyone in the biomed community shows > respect to others, even when we don't agree. I accept Dr Cutler's point that > our children's health is far more important than the social niceties, but I > don't see why we can't aim for both! The problem with being disrespectful, > quite apart from the offence it causes, is that it makes it very difficult > to engage in rational discussion. Ironically, in this thread there is the > basis of a productive debate, but sadly it has been undermined by the > language in which it is couched.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 http://tuberose.com/Mercury.html There is a video on the above website about mercury and how it can cause brain neurondegeneration. Also and i quote:- One of the natural absorbers of heavy metals is candida albicans. The body attracts yeast into the intestines to act as a natural sponge for the mercury. Heavy metals such as mercury act as free radicals, which are highly reactive, charged particles that damage body tissues. Free radicals prevent nutrients from entering the cells and wastes from leaving and block enzymes necessary for the body's detoxification processes. Mercury can bind to the DNA of cells, as well as to the cell membranes, distoring them and interfering with normal cell functions. The immune system no longer recognizes the target as part of the body and will attack it. Once mercury reaches its destination tissue, it has many ways in which it may express its toxicity in many ways. 1. Altered cell membrane permeability 2. Alteration of tertiary structure 3. Alteration of enzyme function 4. Interference in nerve impulses 5. Alteration of the genetic code 6. Inhibition of DNA repair 7. Interference with endocrine function 8. Contribution to autoimmune disease 9. Digestion and absorption alteration 10. Contribution to the development of antibiotic resistance x To: Autism-Biomedical-Europe From: mbrookh@...Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2010 17:46:40 +0000Subject: Re: Cutler or DAN! Cult or not, he's right on as far as I'm concerned. If I had waited for a healed gut, I'd still be waiting. It's 10y now since I came across the Berard, Binstock etal paper comparing autism-mercury and found the autism-mercury group. My daughter was 16y, devastated by seizures, super aggression, hypotonia, hypothyroid, immune values that looked terrible, limbs that she could barely feel, episodes of self injury, a huge, bloated abdomen w food particles apparent in stool, very high level pain tolerance etc. We'd searched long and hard in mainstream, [private, university, Mayos] and found no help. Derision was especially apparent when I brought up the subject of vaccines. She had gone down the proverbial tubes at age 6y after a DPT. It was only her 3rd as she had reacted so badly as an infant to the first 2. She also had her only MMR within a year of that 3rd DPT. Thank heavens, no more `protective' vaccines were on the shelf at that time. All the degreed parties told me in no uncertain terms that it was NOT associated w vaccines. Berard's paper made perfect sense and I knew then without a doubt what had happened to my beautiful child. She had ~80% of that symptom list. A simple hair test confirmed it to my satisfaction – first I spent some time in the medical library here looking for the older internal medicine texts that Cutler says validated hair testing – they were there; and doing lots of other research. My own doc ran some tests for me as hers would not. Her neurologist would not read one item I brought him and abandoned her as a patient because I even suggested toxicity. We began chelation at the top end of Cutler's rec – a big mistake. After a break due to family disagreements, we continue now at a lower dose. What have we seen – NOT a healed gut, for sure. Those huge dilated[#8 on a formal scale], unreactive pupils have recovered; the constant complaints of numbness are gone, pain tolerance is approaching normal, the super aggression is gone, self injury is a thing of the past. She has become more mellow and clued in. Diet has been an essential part of seizure control for her – seizures appear 12-16h after gluten/casein. This also makes sense in the scheme of things if mercury knocks out the efficiency of the enzyme that helps to digest these as Berard etal suggest. Until the metals are gone, I would never expect a normal gut. imho, the body works overtime to keep an even keel. To me, that means it may wrap all those offending/toxic items in yeast or whatever else it can to protect itself. Strep, Lyme and co. and who knows what else has come her way. I also consider Cutler the only safe protocol. If one analogizes chelators to other meds, prescription/over the counter, a half life/recommended dosing schedule is common to all. It would take a big leap of faith to think that an anticonvulsant w a half life of 8h would do anything positive given once a week/month; same w blood pressure meds, antibiotics, cardio-regulators etc. For a common headache, the ibuprofen begins to wear off after 3-4h generally and the headache returns. Why would one ever want to bolus such a dangerous agent as a chelator? Like all, I've made mistakes along the way. I've also learned to `listen' to my child. After a couple doses of td dmps, she threw the container away on garbage day. The land fill had it before I knew. GSE caused terrible rages – much more than I thought should be ongoing for a `die-off'. Testing many years after I first tried GSE, showed an allergy to grapefruit. Her allergies exhibit in the neuro system and never seem to cause the `normal' respiratory distress on reads about. Most of you are very fortunate that your children are young without the years of ongoing damage; fortunate, too, to be such parent advocates – docs in disguise really as you investigate the best way to help your little ones. I've learned so much from all while reading on line. Please…… do read from the files of autism-mercury re safe chelation. herself to/about AC or another list member..........> > I thinks this happens because we are such a passionate bunch. I have been > reading Andys posts for over 10 years on A-M list and originally saw him > explaining over and over and being nicey nicey and so many times people just > don't get it until he just started saying it the way it is to him with no > frills. > > After tiddling about for such a long time and asking question after > question (delaying tactic I see now) that Andy suggested very bluntly that I stop > wittering and get on with it, can't say it would have taken this long to > get going with chelation but I suspect I could have easily wasted another > year and will ever be grateful that didn't. He is blunt because he cares IMHO> > Mx> > > > > I think it's very important that everyone in the biomed community shows > respect to others, even when we don't agree. I accept Dr Cutler's point that > our children's health is far more important than the social niceties, but I > don't see why we can't aim for both! The problem with being disrespectful, > quite apart from the offence it causes, is that it makes it very difficult > to engage in rational discussion. Ironically, in this thread there is the > basis of a productive debate, but sadly it has been undermined by the > language in which it is couched.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 http://tuberose.com/Mercury.html There is a video on the above website about mercury and how it can cause brain neurondegeneration. Also and i quote:- One of the natural absorbers of heavy metals is candida albicans. The body attracts yeast into the intestines to act as a natural sponge for the mercury. Heavy metals such as mercury act as free radicals, which are highly reactive, charged particles that damage body tissues. Free radicals prevent nutrients from entering the cells and wastes from leaving and block enzymes necessary for the body's detoxification processes. Mercury can bind to the DNA of cells, as well as to the cell membranes, distoring them and interfering with normal cell functions. The immune system no longer recognizes the target as part of the body and will attack it. Once mercury reaches its destination tissue, it has many ways in which it may express its toxicity in many ways. 1. Altered cell membrane permeability 2. Alteration of tertiary structure 3. Alteration of enzyme function 4. Interference in nerve impulses 5. Alteration of the genetic code 6. Inhibition of DNA repair 7. Interference with endocrine function 8. Contribution to autoimmune disease 9. Digestion and absorption alteration 10. Contribution to the development of antibiotic resistance x To: Autism-Biomedical-Europe From: mbrookh@...Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2010 17:46:40 +0000Subject: Re: Cutler or DAN! Cult or not, he's right on as far as I'm concerned. If I had waited for a healed gut, I'd still be waiting. It's 10y now since I came across the Berard, Binstock etal paper comparing autism-mercury and found the autism-mercury group. My daughter was 16y, devastated by seizures, super aggression, hypotonia, hypothyroid, immune values that looked terrible, limbs that she could barely feel, episodes of self injury, a huge, bloated abdomen w food particles apparent in stool, very high level pain tolerance etc. We'd searched long and hard in mainstream, [private, university, Mayos] and found no help. Derision was especially apparent when I brought up the subject of vaccines. She had gone down the proverbial tubes at age 6y after a DPT. It was only her 3rd as she had reacted so badly as an infant to the first 2. She also had her only MMR within a year of that 3rd DPT. Thank heavens, no more `protective' vaccines were on the shelf at that time. All the degreed parties told me in no uncertain terms that it was NOT associated w vaccines. Berard's paper made perfect sense and I knew then without a doubt what had happened to my beautiful child. She had ~80% of that symptom list. A simple hair test confirmed it to my satisfaction – first I spent some time in the medical library here looking for the older internal medicine texts that Cutler says validated hair testing – they were there; and doing lots of other research. My own doc ran some tests for me as hers would not. Her neurologist would not read one item I brought him and abandoned her as a patient because I even suggested toxicity. We began chelation at the top end of Cutler's rec – a big mistake. After a break due to family disagreements, we continue now at a lower dose. What have we seen – NOT a healed gut, for sure. Those huge dilated[#8 on a formal scale], unreactive pupils have recovered; the constant complaints of numbness are gone, pain tolerance is approaching normal, the super aggression is gone, self injury is a thing of the past. She has become more mellow and clued in. Diet has been an essential part of seizure control for her – seizures appear 12-16h after gluten/casein. This also makes sense in the scheme of things if mercury knocks out the efficiency of the enzyme that helps to digest these as Berard etal suggest. Until the metals are gone, I would never expect a normal gut. imho, the body works overtime to keep an even keel. To me, that means it may wrap all those offending/toxic items in yeast or whatever else it can to protect itself. Strep, Lyme and co. and who knows what else has come her way. I also consider Cutler the only safe protocol. If one analogizes chelators to other meds, prescription/over the counter, a half life/recommended dosing schedule is common to all. It would take a big leap of faith to think that an anticonvulsant w a half life of 8h would do anything positive given once a week/month; same w blood pressure meds, antibiotics, cardio-regulators etc. For a common headache, the ibuprofen begins to wear off after 3-4h generally and the headache returns. Why would one ever want to bolus such a dangerous agent as a chelator? Like all, I've made mistakes along the way. I've also learned to `listen' to my child. After a couple doses of td dmps, she threw the container away on garbage day. The land fill had it before I knew. GSE caused terrible rages – much more than I thought should be ongoing for a `die-off'. Testing many years after I first tried GSE, showed an allergy to grapefruit. Her allergies exhibit in the neuro system and never seem to cause the `normal' respiratory distress on reads about. Most of you are very fortunate that your children are young without the years of ongoing damage; fortunate, too, to be such parent advocates – docs in disguise really as you investigate the best way to help your little ones. I've learned so much from all while reading on line. Please…… do read from the files of autism-mercury re safe chelation. herself to/about AC or another list member..........> > I thinks this happens because we are such a passionate bunch. I have been > reading Andys posts for over 10 years on A-M list and originally saw him > explaining over and over and being nicey nicey and so many times people just > don't get it until he just started saying it the way it is to him with no > frills. > > After tiddling about for such a long time and asking question after > question (delaying tactic I see now) that Andy suggested very bluntly that I stop > wittering and get on with it, can't say it would have taken this long to > get going with chelation but I suspect I could have easily wasted another > year and will ever be grateful that didn't. He is blunt because he cares IMHO> > Mx> > > > > I think it's very important that everyone in the biomed community shows > respect to others, even when we don't agree. I accept Dr Cutler's point that > our children's health is far more important than the social niceties, but I > don't see why we can't aim for both! The problem with being disrespectful, > quite apart from the offence it causes, is that it makes it very difficult > to engage in rational discussion. Ironically, in this thread there is the > basis of a productive debate, but sadly it has been undermined by the > language in which it is couched.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 26, 2010 Report Share Posted November 26, 2010 Hi Natasa - just to clarify I wasn't being sarcastic (thought I had better make this clear!!)  I was actually gobsmacked as to how involved this whole thing is, I am a parent on the cusp of starting AC chelation so want to hear everyone's views. Marina  Hi Marina that was actually a serious question, as those pathways areinvolved in any type of brain injury with different neurologicaloutcomes..> > > herself to/about AC or another list member..........> > > >> > > > I thinks this happens because we are such a passionate bunch. I have> > been> > > > reading Andys posts for over 10 years on A-M list and originallysaw> > him> > > > explaining over and over and being nicey nicey and so many times > > people just> > > > don't get it until he just started saying it the way it is tohim> > with no> > > > frills.> > > >> > > > After tiddling about for such a long time and asking question after> > > > question (delaying tactic I see now) that Andy suggested very> > bluntly that I stop> > > > wittering and get on with it, can't say it would have taken this> > long to > > > > get going with chelation but I suspect I could have easilywasted> > another> > > > year and will ever be grateful that didn't. He is blunt becausehe> > cares IMHO > > > >> > > > Mx> > > >> > > >> > > > In a message dated 24/11/2010 15:32:10 GMT Standard Time,> > > > joanneallman@ writes: > > > >> > > > I think it's very important that everyone in the biomedcommunity> > shows> > > > respect to others, even when we don't agree. I accept Dr Cutler's> > point that> > > > our children's health is far more important than the social> > niceties, but I> > > > don't see why we can't aim for both! The problem with being > > disrespectful,> > > > quite apart from the offence it causes, is that it makes it very> > difficult> > > > to engage in rational discussion. Ironically, in this thread there> > is the> > > > basis of a productive debate, but sadly it has been underminedby> > the> > > > language in which it is couched.> > > >> > > > >> >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 26, 2010 Report Share Posted November 26, 2010 Hi Natasa - just to clarify I wasn't being sarcastic (thought I had better make this clear!!)  I was actually gobsmacked as to how involved this whole thing is, I am a parent on the cusp of starting AC chelation so want to hear everyone's views. Marina  Hi Marina that was actually a serious question, as those pathways areinvolved in any type of brain injury with different neurologicaloutcomes..> > > herself to/about AC or another list member..........> > > >> > > > I thinks this happens because we are such a passionate bunch. I have> > been> > > > reading Andys posts for over 10 years on A-M list and originallysaw> > him> > > > explaining over and over and being nicey nicey and so many times > > people just> > > > don't get it until he just started saying it the way it is tohim> > with no> > > > frills.> > > >> > > > After tiddling about for such a long time and asking question after> > > > question (delaying tactic I see now) that Andy suggested very> > bluntly that I stop> > > > wittering and get on with it, can't say it would have taken this> > long to > > > > get going with chelation but I suspect I could have easilywasted> > another> > > > year and will ever be grateful that didn't. He is blunt becausehe> > cares IMHO > > > >> > > > Mx> > > >> > > >> > > > In a message dated 24/11/2010 15:32:10 GMT Standard Time,> > > > joanneallman@ writes: > > > >> > > > I think it's very important that everyone in the biomedcommunity> > shows> > > > respect to others, even when we don't agree. I accept Dr Cutler's> > point that> > > > our children's health is far more important than the social> > niceties, but I> > > > don't see why we can't aim for both! The problem with being > > disrespectful,> > > > quite apart from the offence it causes, is that it makes it very> > difficult> > > > to engage in rational discussion. Ironically, in this thread there> > is the> > > > basis of a productive debate, but sadly it has been underminedby> > the> > > > language in which it is couched.> > > >> > > > >> >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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