New to group

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

had a head tilt also. She has a neck condition called torticollis.

She receives physical therapy once per week - soon to be twice. You may

want to discuss this with your pediatrician. Savannah may need PT. I am

across the country in NJ so I am unable to help you with drs or

cranio-facial teams - sorry.

Good luck.

Amy :-)

----- Original Message -----

From: <jpayne1111@...>

<Plagiocephalyegroups>

Sent: Friday, June 30, 2000 8:08 PM

Subject: New to Group

> Hi

> I am and I am the Mom to one beautiful happy girl. She has

> never been Diagnosed with plagiocephaly..in fact first time I heard

> this word was a few months ago when I talked to my friend about my

> daughter Savannahs head. Pediatricians up until then said NO biggie

> it will take time but it will round out. She is also a nurse and

> found a link to a site about DOC bands...I learned the word

> Plagiocephaly there!! Her head has done remarkable things as far as

> shape the last year or so. Still I worry. My hubby says he cant

> notice it very well at all and I am overreacting...so I took pictures

> and would LOVE to share if someone could walk me thru on how I can

> post or even mail out. Her head still tilts towards her left

> shoulder and the back of her head on the left side is out further

> then the right....If I lay on my back and stand her at my shoulders I

> can see a difference in the cheek bones as well as far as how far one

> will go out versus the other....(See where my hubby sees I am a bit

> overreactive about this!!) We are in Northern Utah and I would love

> to talk to someone in this area even if possible about doctors and

> treatments. Please if anyone has any information to share I am

> interested and listening!!

>

> Thanks in advance,

> and Savannah 1/9/99

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Visit Ancestry.com for a FREE 14-Day Trial and find your ancestors now.

> Search over 550 million names and trace your family tree today. Click

here:

> 1/5528/5/_/689409/_/962420939/

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/1/00 11:46:38 AM Central Daylight Time,

jpayne1111@... writes:

<< Does anyone know what these bands run? Right

now we are without a good insurance plan. Thanks >>

We got the DOC Band in Madison, $2,500, that includes all adjustments. I

think I've read it could be up to $3,500 depending on location.

Tammy & 12/8/99

[Guest guest]

Thanks Amy!

I tried to post a picture in the files section it said there wasnt

enough space...I must have BIG pics! LOL Her neck tilt goes in

spurts. I read the archives and learning this is common. I went to

the Cranial Tech site they are the ones that will do the helmet up to

24 months. They dont have any docs here in our area however they do

in So California near my parents. We booked a flight leaving in a

couple weeks we are going to try and see if we can get Savannah to

see a doctor there. Does anyone know what these bands run? Right

now we are without a good insurance plan. Thanks

> Hi ,

>

> had a head tilt also. She has a neck condition called

torticollis.

> She receives physical therapy once per week - soon to be twice.

You may

> want to discuss this with your pediatrician. Savannah may need

PT. I am

> across the country in NJ so I am unable to help you with drs or

> cranio-facial teams - sorry.

>

> Good luck.

>

> Amy :-)

>

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: <jpayne1111@a...>

> <Plagiocephalyegroups>

> Sent: Friday, June 30, 2000 8:08 PM

> Subject: New to Group

>

>

> > Hi

> > I am and I am the Mom to one beautiful happy girl. She

has

> > never been Diagnosed with plagiocephaly..in fact first time I

heard

> > this word was a few months ago when I talked to my friend about my

> > daughter Savannahs head. Pediatricians up until then said NO

biggie

> > it will take time but it will round out. She is also a nurse and

> > found a link to a site about DOC bands...I learned the word

> > Plagiocephaly there!! Her head has done remarkable things as far

as

> > shape the last year or so. Still I worry. My hubby says he cant

> > notice it very well at all and I am overreacting...so I took

pictures

> > and would LOVE to share if someone could walk me thru on how I can

> > post or even mail out. Her head still tilts towards her left

> > shoulder and the back of her head on the left side is out further

> > then the right....If I lay on my back and stand her at my

shoulders I

> > can see a difference in the cheek bones as well as far as how far

one

> > will go out versus the other....(See where my hubby sees I am a

bit

> > overreactive about this!!) We are in Northern Utah and I would

love

> > to talk to someone in this area even if possible about doctors and

> > treatments. Please if anyone has any information to share I am

> > interested and listening!!

> >

> > Thanks in advance,

> > and Savannah 1/9/99

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------------------------------------

------

> > Visit Ancestry.com for a FREE 14-Day Trial and find your

ancestors now.

> > Search over 550 million names and trace your family tree today.

Click

> here:

> > 1/5528/5/_/689409/_/962420939/

> > ------------------------------------------------------------------

------

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 6/30/00 10:10:03 PM Central Daylight Time,

jpayne1111@... writes:

<< and Savannah 1/9/99 >>

Does Savannah have torticollis and are you getting physical therapy? Sorry

if you've already given out that info. I have a terrible time keeping

everyone straight.

What I've read 70% of all children with tort get/have plag. There is a Debby

and on the torticolliskids site who had facial asymmetry, ears out of

alignments, funky shaped head and looks so much like my son at the same age,

and today at age 3 she looks perfectly normal with no helmet or band. I

suspected tort/plag at 4 months with my son but didn't really get diagnosed

until about 5 months. got his DOC Band at 6 months and we didn't

really start pt with a professional until 5 1/2 months. I did stretches at

home a little until I got help in knowing exactly what to do. I guess since

my insurance was going to cover 100% of a helmet made locally, we went out of

network to get the DOC Band. I didn't take chances because my son was

basically born with a lot of facial asymmetry. I also got a late start in

diagnosing him. If is pediatrician had listened to my concerns earlier, he

had classic tort and even the folded ear at birth. If we had started pt at 8

weeks and repositioning him right off the bat, we may have not done the DOC

Band. I just didn't want to take chances. You can see a picture in plag

group and more in tort. Sorry, seems the plag group is all filled up so I

wasn't able to post more either. His tort isn't very noticeable in this

pictures, good tort day, but you should see his facial asymmetry. Mind you,

most people wouldn't notice looking at him. Maybe some people who have a lot

or old pictures can think about deleting to add some room for the new

people?? Just a thought?!

The DOC Band I believe they'll go up to 24 months. The sooner you put any

corrective device on the faster/better results. At 6 months we are looking

at about 12 weeks of treatment. If at 4 months some only have it on for 8

weeks. Really depends of severity and age.

You should see a cranial facial specialist if any in your area. We saw a

pediatric neurologist and a neurosurgeon. These are some of the doctors

used. I am sure someone else has experience with others like plastic

surgeons.

I hope this helped with some qestions.

Tammy & 12/8/99

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/27/00 11:23:55 AM Central Daylight Time,

kpolencheck@... writes:

<< So on Monday we are meeting

with a PT at the CT clinic in Madison. I'm very scared they might push the

band/helmet because I would really like improvement without. My appointment

is basically to get PT help for at home and try and get improvement that

way. Gunner did have x-rays at 4 months that showed his sutures are open

and no premature closing or assymetry #'s to be noted. I'm going on my

instincts at what this group has helped me to notice. His left ear sits a

bit more forward than the right. Best of luck to you!!

>>

- are you meeting with Kathy or ?

Tammy & 12/8/99

[Guest guest]

Welcome !

Your so lucky Dr's talked to you about this at 2 months. My son Gunner

favored his left side at his 2 month check up and was just told to

reposition him. Which didn't do much good because he would just turn

himself completely around in the crib keeping his head turned left. To try

to make a long story short at his 4 month check up they scared the crap out

of me with fused, not fused, neurosurgeon etc... Gunner will be 5 months

old in 1 1/2 weeks and he will be checked again. But if I knew some

positioning tricks at two months it would have been great.

1. Side sleeper - place on oposite of what he favors.

2. A towel under the sheet rolled up to hold his position.

3. Butterfly Pillow - We just received this from Snuglbuds in Canada. My

son just started taking his naps on his belly and when possible i turn his

head so he gets a good stretch to the right while he sleeps. The first day

we had it he slept 6 hours with his head stretched to the right which was

awesome. Yesterday wasn't so good, but will keep trying. www.snuglbuds.com

4. Travel Bud - We also just received this from Snuglbuds in Canada. If

the side sleeper does not work this will hold your child in position when he

sleeps on his side. We were able to the last two night keep Gunner on his

right side so he had no pressure on his left. I would of loved to have both

of these items two months ago.

5 TUMMY TIME My son never liked his tummy too much so I never pushed it.

I with I would of. He is getting to like it more and more each day.

6. - Even though your little man may be a bit small stuff soft

blankets around him, the less pressure the better.

I hope some of these ideas help. We have not decided what we are doing yet

about a band or helmet. Gunner has not even been diagnosed with anything

but I'm just following my mother instincts. So on Monday we are meeting

with a PT at the CT clinic in Madison. I'm very scared they might push the

band/helmet because I would really like improvement without. My appointment

is basically to get PT help for at home and try and get improvement that

way. Gunner did have x-rays at 4 months that showed his sutures are open

and no premature closing or assymetry #'s to be noted. I'm going on my

instincts at what this group has helped me to notice. His left ear sits a

bit more forward than the right. Best of luck to you!!

----- Original Message -----

From: <jabeamsley@...>

<Plagiocephalyegroups>

Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2000 10:17 AM

Subject: New to group

> Hi everyone,

>

> I've been viewing message now for last couple of days. Seems as if

> everyone has an answer or support provided which is great! My son

> just turned 2 mos old. At the Pedi check-up she noted abit of bossing

> on the rt forhead and that his head was flattened on the rt side.

> She didn't seem like I should be alarmed but gave a referral just for

> precautionary measures. Hence I rec'd a referral to a Pedi Neuro and

> he said he saw a mild cases that should improve w/ positioning he

> didn't seem that alarmed either and gave a follow up at 4 mos. He

> also stated that at this point we need not do anything such as x-rays

> or CT only at the 4 month check-up. Neither doctor called this

> Plagiocephaly. Did ya'll receive that as a diagnosis when you had

> your doctor visits. Needless to say we are trying to position him as

> much as possible on the opposite side. Just from reading messages I

> thought he may have some tort as well but seems to be getting use to

> using his left side although he still prefers his right. I usually

> do some stretching and position stimulating objects on the left. Do

> you think I'm being to laid back and hoping postioning techniques

> work or should I becom a bit more aggressive. I know the sooner you

> start therapy the less time it takes with such a pliable head at this

> point. thanks for reading this and hopefully I will receive some

> input.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

Thanks for the reply. I'm so glad you mentioned the use of products

from Snuglbugs. I had found that info on an earlier message and

copied the number only to find out it was a fax number. I didn't

realize they had a website. I just checked it out. You seem to

really like the products. What is the price range for the items you

bought. I'm printing out the order form as I type. I'll try

anything to get this baby to have a well formed head. I don't want

to have him grow up w/ all the stigma associtated w/ not

being " perfect " . It's hard enough on kids these days.

Thanks

& Derrian

> Welcome !

>

> Your so lucky Dr's talked to you about this at 2 months. My son

Gunner

> favored his left side at his 2 month check up and was just told to

> reposition him. Which didn't do much good because he would just

turn

> himself completely around in the crib keeping his head turned

left. To try

> to make a long story short at his 4 month check up they scared the

crap out

> of me with fused, not fused, neurosurgeon etc... Gunner will be 5

months

> old in 1 1/2 weeks and he will be checked again. But if I knew some

> positioning tricks at two months it would have been great.

>

> 1. Side sleeper - place on oposite of what he favors.

> 2. A towel under the sheet rolled up to hold his position.

> 3. Butterfly Pillow - We just received this from Snuglbuds in

Canada. My

> son just started taking his naps on his belly and when possible i

turn his

> head so he gets a good stretch to the right while he sleeps. The

first day

> we had it he slept 6 hours with his head stretched to the right

which was

> awesome. Yesterday wasn't so good, but will keep trying.

www.snuglbuds.com

> 4. Travel Bud - We also just received this from Snuglbuds in

Canada. If

> the side sleeper does not work this will hold your child in

position when he

> sleeps on his side. We were able to the last two night keep Gunner

on his

> right side so he had no pressure on his left. I would of loved to

have both

> of these items two months ago.

> 5 TUMMY TIME My son never liked his tummy too much so I never

pushed it.

> I with I would of. He is getting to like it more and more each day.

> 6. - Even though your little man may be a bit small stuff

soft

> blankets around him, the less pressure the better.

>

> I hope some of these ideas help. We have not decided what we are

doing yet

> about a band or helmet. Gunner has not even been diagnosed with

anything

> but I'm just following my mother instincts. So on Monday we are

meeting

> with a PT at the CT clinic in Madison. I'm very scared they might

push the

> band/helmet because I would really like improvement without. My

appointment

> is basically to get PT help for at home and try and get improvement

that

> way. Gunner did have x-rays at 4 months that showed his sutures

are open

> and no premature closing or assymetry #'s to be noted. I'm going

on my

> instincts at what this group has helped me to notice. His left ear

sits a

> bit more forward than the right. Best of luck to you!!

>

>

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: <jabeamsley@h...>

> <Plagiocephalyegroups>

> Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2000 10:17 AM

> Subject: New to group

>

>

> > Hi everyone,

> >

> > I've been viewing message now for last couple of days. Seems as

if

> > everyone has an answer or support provided which is great! My son

> > just turned 2 mos old. At the Pedi check-up she noted abit of

bossing

> > on the rt forhead and that his head was flattened on the rt side.

> > She didn't seem like I should be alarmed but gave a referral just

for

> > precautionary measures. Hence I rec'd a referral to a Pedi Neuro

and

> > he said he saw a mild cases that should improve w/ positioning he

> > didn't seem that alarmed either and gave a follow up at 4 mos. He

> > also stated that at this point we need not do anything such as x-

rays

> > or CT only at the 4 month check-up. Neither doctor called this

> > Plagiocephaly. Did ya'll receive that as a diagnosis when you had

> > your doctor visits. Needless to say we are trying to position

him as

> > much as possible on the opposite side. Just from reading messages

I

> > thought he may have some tort as well but seems to be getting use

to

> > using his left side although he still prefers his right. I

usually

> > do some stretching and position stimulating objects on the left.

Do

> > you think I'm being to laid back and hoping postioning techniques

> > work or should I becom a bit more aggressive. I know the sooner

you

> > start therapy the less time it takes with such a pliable head at

this

> > point. thanks for reading this and hopefully I will receive some

> > input.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

The Travelbud was $50.00 and the Butterfly $20.00 and $15.00 shipping from

Canada to Wisconsin. They may be a bit pricey but I'm not to crafty and if

it helps that is the main thing. Like I mentioned this is only our third

day, but I feel I am already late in the game for correction. Really wish I

had at 2 months. Laurie was able to ship my products the same day after I

gave her a credit card # and then I had it in 4 days.

Good Luck!

----- Original Message -----

From: <jabeamsley@...>

<Plagiocephalyegroups>

Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2000 12:41 PM

Subject: Re: New to group

> ,

>

> Thanks for the reply. I'm so glad you mentioned the use of products

> from Snuglbugs. I had found that info on an earlier message and

> copied the number only to find out it was a fax number. I didn't

> realize they had a website. I just checked it out. You seem to

> really like the products. What is the price range for the items you

> bought. I'm printing out the order form as I type. I'll try

> anything to get this baby to have a well formed head. I don't want

> to have him grow up w/ all the stigma associtated w/ not

> being " perfect " . It's hard enough on kids these days.

>

> Thanks

>

> & Derrian

>

> > Welcome !

> >

> > Your so lucky Dr's talked to you about this at 2 months. My son

> Gunner

> > favored his left side at his 2 month check up and was just told to

> > reposition him. Which didn't do much good because he would just

> turn

> > himself completely around in the crib keeping his head turned

> left. To try

> > to make a long story short at his 4 month check up they scared the

> crap out

> > of me with fused, not fused, neurosurgeon etc... Gunner will be 5

> months

> > old in 1 1/2 weeks and he will be checked again. But if I knew some

> > positioning tricks at two months it would have been great.

> >

> > 1. Side sleeper - place on oposite of what he favors.

> > 2. A towel under the sheet rolled up to hold his position.

> > 3. Butterfly Pillow - We just received this from Snuglbuds in

> Canada. My

> > son just started taking his naps on his belly and when possible i

> turn his

> > head so he gets a good stretch to the right while he sleeps. The

> first day

> > we had it he slept 6 hours with his head stretched to the right

> which was

> > awesome. Yesterday wasn't so good, but will keep trying.

> www.snuglbuds.com

> > 4. Travel Bud - We also just received this from Snuglbuds in

> Canada. If

> > the side sleeper does not work this will hold your child in

> position when he

> > sleeps on his side. We were able to the last two night keep Gunner

> on his

> > right side so he had no pressure on his left. I would of loved to

> have both

> > of these items two months ago.

> > 5 TUMMY TIME My son never liked his tummy too much so I never

> pushed it.

> > I with I would of. He is getting to like it more and more each day.

> > 6. - Even though your little man may be a bit small stuff

> soft

> > blankets around him, the less pressure the better.

> >

> > I hope some of these ideas help. We have not decided what we are

> doing yet

> > about a band or helmet. Gunner has not even been diagnosed with

> anything

> > but I'm just following my mother instincts. So on Monday we are

> meeting

> > with a PT at the CT clinic in Madison. I'm very scared they might

> push the

> > band/helmet because I would really like improvement without. My

> appointment

> > is basically to get PT help for at home and try and get improvement

> that

> > way. Gunner did have x-rays at 4 months that showed his sutures

> are open

> > and no premature closing or assymetry #'s to be noted. I'm going

> on my

> > instincts at what this group has helped me to notice. His left ear

> sits a

> > bit more forward than the right. Best of luck to you!!

> >

> >

> > ----- Original Message -----

> > From: <jabeamsley@h...>

> > <Plagiocephalyegroups>

> > Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2000 10:17 AM

> > Subject: New to group

> >

> >

> > > Hi everyone,

> > >

> > > I've been viewing message now for last couple of days. Seems as

> if

> > > everyone has an answer or support provided which is great! My son

> > > just turned 2 mos old. At the Pedi check-up she noted abit of

> bossing

> > > on the rt forhead and that his head was flattened on the rt side.

> > > She didn't seem like I should be alarmed but gave a referral just

> for

> > > precautionary measures. Hence I rec'd a referral to a Pedi Neuro

> and

> > > he said he saw a mild cases that should improve w/ positioning he

> > > didn't seem that alarmed either and gave a follow up at 4 mos. He

> > > also stated that at this point we need not do anything such as x-

> rays

> > > or CT only at the 4 month check-up. Neither doctor called this

> > > Plagiocephaly. Did ya'll receive that as a diagnosis when you had

> > > your doctor visits. Needless to say we are trying to position

> him as

> > > much as possible on the opposite side. Just from reading messages

> I

> > > thought he may have some tort as well but seems to be getting use

> to

> > > using his left side although he still prefers his right. I

> usually

> > > do some stretching and position stimulating objects on the left.

> Do

> > > you think I'm being to laid back and hoping postioning techniques

> > > work or should I becom a bit more aggressive. I know the sooner

> you

> > > start therapy the less time it takes with such a pliable head at

> this

> > > point. thanks for reading this and hopefully I will receive some

> > > input.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

:

2 months is still very young. It is good that you are aware of

the problem. Keep repositioning, and be aggressive. Use the

slogan "Back to Sleep, Tummy to Play"!! Tummy time is so important!

It will help round out that little head, and also help to stretch those

tight neck muscles.

You might want to seek advice from a children's physio therapist to

learn as many neck stretches as possible. Getting rid of that torticollis

is important.

Keep up all that good work! For some, positioning can work!

Kendra

jabeamsley@... wrote:

Hi everyone,

I've been viewing message now for last couple of days. Seems

as if

everyone has an answer or support provided which is great!

My son

just turned 2 mos old. At the Pedi check-up she noted abit of bossing

on the rt forhead and that his head was flattened on the rt side.

She didn't seem like I should be alarmed but gave a referral just

for

precautionary measures. Hence I rec'd a referral to a Pedi Neuro

and

he said he saw a mild cases that should improve w/ positioning

he

didn't seem that alarmed either and gave a follow up at 4 mos.

He

also stated that at this point we need not do anything such as

x-rays

or CT only at the 4 month check-up. Neither doctor called this

Plagiocephaly. Did ya'll receive that as a diagnosis when

you had

your doctor visits. Needless to say we are trying to position

him as

much as possible on the opposite side. Just from reading messages

I

thought he may have some tort as well but seems to be getting use

to

using his left side although he still prefers his right.

I usually

do some stretching and position stimulating objects on the left.

Do

you think I'm being to laid back and hoping postioning techniques

work or should I becom a bit more aggressive. I know the

sooner you

start therapy the less time it takes with such a pliable head at

this

point. thanks for reading this and hopefully I will receive

some

input.

[Guest guest]

I am meeting with , my pediatrician that gave a second opinion and

ordered the x-rays just sent a referral fax. I beleive the two have now

talked about my son. Even though I talked to about Home Therapy

exercises will she tell me if he has Tort or Positional Plagiocephaly? Or

will she keep strictly to exercises? I'm heading to Chicago to see family

and my husband is not going along as he has to work. But now I wish he was

going with me. I think now I have a friend in Madison who may go with me

just in case I get upset again like I did with my first Dr. To think I

probably could have prevented all of this, if only I do better positioning

and how important tummy time is.

----- Original Message -----

From: <bailykuhn@...>

<Plagiocephalyegroups>

Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2000 2:16 PM

Subject: Re: New to group

> In a message dated 7/27/00 11:23:55 AM Central Daylight Time,

> kpolencheck@... writes:

>

> << So on Monday we are meeting

> with a PT at the CT clinic in Madison. I'm very scared they might push

the

> band/helmet because I would really like improvement without. My

appointment

> is basically to get PT help for at home and try and get improvement that

> way. Gunner did have x-rays at 4 months that showed his sutures are

open

> and no premature closing or assymetry #'s to be noted. I'm going on my

> instincts at what this group has helped me to notice. His left ear sits

a

> bit more forward than the right. Best of luck to you!!

>

> >>

>

> - are you meeting with Kathy or ?

>

> Tammy & 12/8/99

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

At my four month visit we did not get a diagnosis- just advice from our

pediatrician to keep her off of her right side.

The best advice at this time is to get your son on his belly as much as

possible while he is awake. I wish I would have taken my pediatricians

advice more seriously about " belly time " , but my daughter hated it and would

cry when laid on her belly. Now we are being fitted for a Doc band in two

weeks ( the earliest they could get us in)! She is now 7 months old.

Good luck

Renetta in Kansas City

jabeamsley@... wrote:

> Hi everyone,

>

> I've been viewing message now for last couple of days. Seems as if

> everyone has an answer or support provided which is great! My son

> just turned 2 mos old. At the Pedi check-up she noted abit of bossing

> on the rt forhead and that his head was flattened on the rt side.

> She didn't seem like I should be alarmed but gave a referral just for

> precautionary measures. Hence I rec'd a referral to a Pedi Neuro and

> he said he saw a mild cases that should improve w/ positioning he

> didn't seem that alarmed either and gave a follow up at 4 mos. He

> also stated that at this point we need not do anything such as x-rays

> or CT only at the 4 month check-up. Neither doctor called this

> Plagiocephaly. Did ya'll receive that as a diagnosis when you had

> your doctor visits. Needless to say we are trying to position him as

> much as possible on the opposite side. Just from reading messages I

> thought he may have some tort as well but seems to be getting use to

> using his left side although he still prefers his right. I usually

> do some stretching and position stimulating objects on the left. Do

> you think I'm being to laid back and hoping postioning techniques

> work or should I becom a bit more aggressive. I know the sooner you

> start therapy the less time it takes with such a pliable head at this

> point. thanks for reading this and hopefully I will receive some

> input.

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi, and Kim!

From my understanding, many kids get out of whatever position their parents

put them in, so it's very difficult to keep them just on their backs or

sides. I think once a child is in a helmet or band, positioning's not as

important (unless the child has torticollis). If I'm wrong, someone please

jump in!

Good luck to you, and welcome to the group!

[Guest guest]

> Hi, I just joined the group. I want to learn about cleansing the

> gallbladder. My sister had hers taken out years ago and my brother died

> due to complications from gallbladder surgery. I have been having alot

> of the symtoms that came on the file you guys send out. I don't want to

> have surgery, so maybe this will take care of it.

>

> Angi

Hi Angi

I'm so sorry to hear about the loss of your brother from complications...and

I can fully understand your desire to avoid surgery. I felt the same way.

I did my first flush a couple of months back after a bout of Pancreatitis

caused by a gallstone. I have never looked back...

I have posted details of the flush I did and how it worked for me here:

http://www.cyberpog.com/health/index.htm

there are also links to other pages on the web with plenty of

information...I hope you find it useful.

Dax

[Guest guest]

You've come to the right place! The information I've learned here has changed my

life for the better.

I've had two flushes now and both were easy and successful. I have no more pain

and can now eat stuff that would

have me writhing in agony just ten months ago. By and large though I've cut out

fatty meats like hamburger

and deep fried crap and fibreless white flour and pasta. Why eat that

hydrogenated poop they sell in the supermarket

when I can have fresh salmon with beet greens and cress in a dressing with

olive oil and lemon. mmmmm. I can't believe my increase in energy. Yesterday I

moved 6 tons

of hay with my wife

and I still feel great and I sleep much better. My personal experience is that

MD's don't know anything about nutrition or prevention.

Why should they? There's no money in it. Thank god for the internet and all the

fine people on this list!!

Cheers,

Ken (who still has his gallbladder and is getting younger everyday)

[Guest guest]

Hi Kim,

I can try and suggest a few things. First of all, congradulations.

Thank God that you have found the right place. My pain was the same

as yours and just about everyone on here. It definitely sounds like a

liver/gb digestive problem that you have. Did your doctor do an

ultrasound to try and detect stones? He should have. Whereas some

stones do not show on ultrasound, if it does, you can have a definite

answer to your pain. Sluggish liver, GB stones, sludge in the ducts

can all be the cause of the pain. Years of eating fats, grease,

toxins, etc results in the bulidup of sludge and stones in your

system. You may only have small stones causing pain as they pass out

of the liver/gallbladder through the ducts to your intestine. Those

ducts may also be full of sludge. The pain may also be from a large

stone in your gallbladder that has grown too big to pass out through

the ducts. Eating fats causes your GB to contract and release bile to

the intestine to help in digestion. If the bile cannot pass because

of sludge or a stone blocking the way, then the GB becomes inflamed.

This is the cause of GB pain. Dieting properly will help to stop the

production of future stones and also assist in breaking down the

stones that you already may have. Dieting while cleansing through

flushes will eventually clean your digestive system and get your

organs in proper working order again. This seems the the best way to

go first instead of removing a vital digestive organ that God has

given you for a reason. I use the Dr. Hulga liver/gallstone

cleanse method for flsuhing. I have only done two flushes but have

eliminated over 100 stones from my liver and a lot of sludge along

the way. My pain has stopped but I will continue the program to

cleanse my liver and GB of all stones. Then proper dieting will keep

my system functioning normally. You can find the cleanse online by

searching or from a link posted on here. I am completely sold on this

method over surgery. Only because I see results of stones being

eliminated, and also because my pain has gone. I want to keep my GB

as well. Read all the messages here, search the links, and good luck.

I hope this helps you in some way.

Barry.

> Hi there, I am new to the group and also new to the idea of

> gallstones. I am 37 years old, have one child of 14 months. I have

> had pain under my right ribs for 10 years now, on and off. It

usually

> gets worse after eating dairy products for a few days. If I dont

back

> off it will become excruciating to the point that i cannot lie on

> that side and bending over is painful. It gets worse and worse if i

> keep eating, and will respond to ibuprofen.

>

> All this time i thought it was my ileo-ceacal valve, but Im

beginning

> to think it might be my liver or gall bladder. I recently bought a

> copy of the Liver Cleansing Diet, and from her descriptions, I

think

> i have a liver or gallstone problem.

>

> I went for a physical a few days ago and she has taken blood to do

> liver functions. She also noticed my thyroid was slightly enlarged.

I

> dont know if this is related.

>

> I would appreciate any suggestions or comments. I would not opt for

> gallbladder removal and would be interested in the diets people

have

> gone on to flush their gallbladders. How do the stones come out?

>

> Kim - chicago

[Guest guest]

claudiameydrech@... writes:

> Hi there - Someone from your group sent me an email letting me know

> about all of you, and I wanted to join to learn more!!! I see from

> past posts you have visited my web site and questioned some of the

> things I suggested.

Hi - welcome!

Yes, it was the whipped cream that caught my eye - as I mentioned to you in

another email. It does sound like a much more appetizing way to do the

cleanse!! I've been thinking about that one, since I'm usually looking for

variations. I just might try it that way one of these times.

Your site has some great information on it - I'm glad that you've joined us!

in health,

[Guest guest]

claudiameydrech@... writes:

> It seems to make more sense to have the intestinal system really clean

> before

> flushing. As I told you, that page on my site really needs

> an updating. Who is the list moderator?? May I direct

> people to this list from my web page??

I agree - that does make more sense to have the bowels as clean as possible.

(but hey - I just like the idea of the whipped cream - lol!)

There are several list moderators. I'm sure they would be happy to have you

direct people here. I think you can write them at

gallstones-moderator . But it's likely that one of them will

see your message out here and respond to it.

As for variations of the cleanse - I think it's good to have a variety of

possibilities of how to do it. Some people are ready/willing to do the

" flush " while others might want a milder way to do it. Each person needs to

find out what is best for themselves.

And yes, while I agree that cleansing isn't necessarily the most

'comfortable' thing in the world - I do think it's reasonable to seek out

something that isn't so dreadful that a person avoids it!

in health,

[Guest guest]

Thanks, - and thanks for letting me know about

the list. I am looking into variations of what I have posted

at my site :-) As for the whipped cream, I think it's just a

way to get the gall bladder primed :-) but am not sure - there

is a lot of fat in whipped cream. I think

I'd not use it the next time, by the time it was time to eat that,

I didn't have much of an appetite. It seems to make more

sense to have the intestinal system really clean before

flushing. As I told you, that page on my site really needs

an updating. Who is the list moderator?? May I direct

people to this list from my web page??

Always like to find new and different ways to

do things. I have rarely been able to do this flush without

nausea and some pretty miserable moments during

the night...but the results are usually worth it.

Would love to find a way that doesn't include the nausea,

but you know what they say, " no pain, no gain " :-))

L. Meydrech, CN

" A cheerful heart is good medicine " Prov. 17:22a

http://nutritionist.tripod.com

----- Original Message -----

From: Rachd1961@...

gallstones

Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 9:42 AM

Subject: Re: New to group

claudiameydrech@... writes:

> Hi there - Someone from your group sent me an email letting me know

> about all of you, and I wanted to join to learn more!!! I see from

> past posts you have visited my web site and questioned some of the

> things I suggested.

Hi - welcome!

Yes, it was the whipped cream that caught my eye - as I mentioned to you in

another email. It does sound like a much more appetizing way to do the

cleanse!! I've been thinking about that one, since I'm usually looking for

variations. I just might try it that way one of these times.

Your site has some great information on it - I'm glad that you've joined us!

in health,

[Guest guest]

Welcome , jump right in and share with us. of Dewberry

Hill

" People are like stain glass windows; they sparkle and shine when the sun is

out, but when the darkness sets in, their true beauty is revealed only if there

is alight within. " -Kubler Ross

" Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that

followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life. "

Holy Bible

---------------------------------

[Guest guest]

,

Welcome to the group. You will find a lot of useful info here. If you

are looking for a variety of cleanses, look at www.curezone.com

There are a few cleanses in there that most of the people in this

group use. At least in one variety or another. I personally use Dr.

s method with double the oil drink and 5 tbspns of Espom salts.

No whipped cream mentioned. I use whip cream for other purposes. :-)

By the way, I send you an e-mail question and you haven't replied yet.

???

Barry.

--- In gallstones@y..., " L. Meydrech " <claudiameydrech@c...>

wrote:

> Thanks, - and thanks for letting me know about

> the list. I am looking into variations of what I have posted

> at my site :-) As for the whipped cream, I think it's just a

> way to get the gall bladder primed :-) but am not sure - there

> is a lot of fat in whipped cream. I think

> I'd not use it the next time, by the time it was time to eat that,

> I didn't have much of an appetite. It seems to make more

> sense to have the intestinal system really clean before

> flushing. As I told you, that page on my site really needs

> an updating. Who is the list moderator?? May I direct

> people to this list from my web page??

>

> Always like to find new and different ways to

> do things. I have rarely been able to do this flush without

> nausea and some pretty miserable moments during

> the night...but the results are usually worth it.

> Would love to find a way that doesn't include the nausea,

> but you know what they say, " no pain, no gain " :-))

>

> L. Meydrech, CN

> " A cheerful heart is good medicine " Prov. 17:22a

> http://nutritionist.tripod.com

>

>

>

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: Rachd1961@a...

> gallstones@y...

> Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 9:42 AM

> Subject: Re: New to group

>

>

> claudiameydrech@c... writes:

> > Hi there - Someone from your group sent me an email letting me

know

> > about all of you, and I wanted to join to learn more!!! I see

from

> > past posts you have visited my web site and questioned some of

the

> > things I suggested.

>

> Hi - welcome!

> Yes, it was the whipped cream that caught my eye - as I mentioned

to you in

> another email. It does sound like a much more appetizing

way to do the

> cleanse!! I've been thinking about that one, since I'm usually

looking for

> variations. I just might try it that way one of these times.

>

> Your site has some great information on it - I'm glad that you've

joined us!

>

> in health,

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>By the way, I send you an e-mail question

>and you haven't replied yet.???

>Barry.

Hi Barry, Yes, that email is still in my inbox,

but truthfully, I just don't have an answer for

how to get rid of a stubborn stone that won't

come out of the gall bladder. I have heard that

Hydrangea helps with breaking down stones, so

have added that to my regimine (and am learning

lots of other ideas from you folks), and also beet

juice good for the liver and softening stones. I

have seen some pretty large size stones pass, and

don't know why yours is being so stubborn. Guess

it's just not sitting at the right place at the

right time when you flush :-) A good thing to

remember is it's the small stuff that really causes

a lot of the trouble as it comes out a bit at a

time, and you have surely gotten rid of that with

all the work you have been doing, so

should be greatly improved even if there is a stubborn

larger stone.

BTW, can you tell me how 2cm translates into inches

or fraction of inch? I have had ultrasounds and

asked about how large they thing stones are, and

never think to ask. Thanks!! claudia:-)

L. Meydrech, CN

" A cheerful heart is good medicine " Prov. 17:22a

http://nutritionist.tripod.com

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/16/02 7:17:10 PM Eastern Standard Time,

barry91162@... writes:

> By ultrasound, my duct measures 4mm (some people can have 2mm, 4mm,

> or even 6mm ducts). The stone is actually 11mm or 1.1cm in size. I

> know it could probably squeeze out sometime but I am still working on

> dilating the ducts, getting the floating stone in the right position,

> softering the stone as much as possible, to help get it out.

>

Just jumping in here to say that my duct (according to the ultrasound)

measures 6 mm and I have passed at least 3 stones that were about 1.5 cm.

So - it is possible.

keep the faith!

[Guest guest]

Thanks ,

I have cleaned out over 2,000 stones over 5 flushes but still have

the 1cm stone (hard calcified) in my gb which still causes colic.

This problem of pain is the same as when I started the flushing. So,

I'm guessing the softer (and sometimes bigger stones) that I've

eliminated were all from my liver and maybe even some from my gb.

But, I think most were from my liver. The gb stones are harder to

eliminate then a lot of people believe. At least in my case. I have

heard a few others on here who have to work for months or years to

finally get that 'problem' stone reduced and flushed out. I wish it

was easier, and maybe one day on a flush, it will finally come out.

By ultrasound, my duct measures 4mm (some people can have 2mm, 4mm,

or even 6mm ducts). The stone is actually 11mm or 1.1cm in size. I

know it could probably squeeze out sometime but I am still working on

dilating the ducts, getting the floating stone in the right position,

softering the stone as much as possible, to help get it out.

Most rulers or fabric measuring tapes, or metal measuring tapes have

inches and centimeters. It's good to just look at a ruler to get the

best perspective on sizes. There is roughly 2.5 cm (25mm) in an inch.

1/4 inch is roughly 6mm. 10mm in 1cm.

Hope this helps.

Be healthy.

Barry.

--- In gallstones@y..., " L. Meydrech " <claudiameydrech@c...>

wrote:

> >By the way, I send you an e-mail question

> >and you haven't replied yet.???

> >Barry.

>

> Hi Barry, Yes, that email is still in my inbox,

> but truthfully, I just don't have an answer for

> how to get rid of a stubborn stone that won't

> come out of the gall bladder. I have heard that

> Hydrangea helps with breaking down stones, so

> have added that to my regimine (and am learning

> lots of other ideas from you folks), and also beet

> juice good for the liver and softening stones. I

> have seen some pretty large size stones pass, and

> don't know why yours is being so stubborn. Guess

> it's just not sitting at the right place at the

> right time when you flush :-) A good thing to

> remember is it's the small stuff that really causes

> a lot of the trouble as it comes out a bit at a

> time, and you have surely gotten rid of that with

> all the work you have been doing, so

> should be greatly improved even if there is a stubborn

> larger stone.

>

> BTW, can you tell me how 2cm translates into inches

> or fraction of inch? I have had ultrasounds and

> asked about how large they thing stones are, and

> never think to ask. Thanks!! claudia:-)

>

> L. Meydrech, CN

> " A cheerful heart is good medicine " Prov. 17:22a

> http://nutritionist.tripod.com

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

The common duct is even bigger than the cystic duct I was referring

to. Was the 1.5 cm stone that you've seen of the softer, colesterol,

liver type? I have passed those 'easier' liver stones easily. Some

were 2 to 3 cm in size. They only need to pass through the 'larger'

common duct.

The gb stone (hard, calcified) is a different situation altogether.

You don't want one of those for sure. These are the types of stones

that and I, and some others on here are referring to. We still

have colic pain from the stone pushing up to the mouth of the gb and

because they are too hard (calcified) to pass through the smaller

cystic duct that leads to the common duct, they cause the gb to bloat

and colic results.

Even drinking tons of apple juice will not soften these stones. They

must be medicated, or treated with herbs, over several months just to

reduce them in size to be able to pass out in a cleanse.

Just clarifing stone type. :-)

Barry.

> In a message dated 2/16/02 7:17:10 PM Eastern Standard Time,

> barry91162@y... writes:

>

>

> > By ultrasound, my duct measures 4mm (some people can have 2mm,

4mm,

> > or even 6mm ducts). The stone is actually 11mm or 1.1cm in size.

I

> > know it could probably squeeze out sometime but I am still

working on

> > dilating the ducts, getting the floating stone in the right

position,

> > softering the stone as much as possible, to help get it out.

> >

>

> Just jumping in here to say that my duct (according to the

ultrasound)

> measures 6 mm and I have passed at least 3 stones that were about

1.5 cm.

> So - it is possible.

>

> keep the faith!

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>Just jumping in here to say that my

>duct (according to the ultrasound)

>measures 6 mm and I have passed at

>least 3 stones that were about 1.5 cm.

>So - it is possible.

It's my understanding that the ducts are

very elastic. Good thing :-) claudia