Re: Obesity and Will Power

[Guest guest]

With all this talk about will and will power, I can't help but think

back to my western philosophy studies. Has anyone every observed or

measured a will or will power through scientific means? No. It is a

metaphorical way of speaking. Positing a such a faculty and saying

some have it and others don't, or everyone has it and only some

choose to exercise it seems like thought scheme that is of limited

use. I think this way of speaking is useful only insofar as the

audience is susceptible to 'pep-talks' and other crafted motivational

speaking. In the end, I think this will fail to reach many, because

it is an appeal through emotional manipulation, like advertisement

and propaganda, and not an appeal to understanding. Although I don't

have a solution to what will motivate the seemingly uninspired and

unmotivated, I think the key is to reframe the problem in terms of

understanding instead of exhortation.

I was once overweight, though not obese. However, I was relatively

sednetary, and recreational overeating was a hobby, and even perhaps

a 'coping mechanism'. Over time, I have changed my habits and now my

former habits seem unthinkable to me. The difference does not seem

to me a matter of having activated my 'will' or 'will power', but

rather having changed my understanding about eating and exercising.

I do not find that my current habits are a struggle to maintain, or

that I am fighting the urge to eat pizzas and skip exercise

sessions. I see no stuggle of 'will power' whatsoever. This is how

I live now. I like it. I understand it. Pop-tarts and deep dish

pizza binges hold no attraction.

The tricky part is that this is an experiential understanding, not

just an intellectual one. Getting from there to here was not just a

matter of reviewing facts, but of experiencing a different way of

living. As I've said, I don't have the solution as to how to impart

such experiential understanding to others in need of it, but I think

investigations along these lines will prove more productive than

continuing with the philosophically bankrupt concepts of will and

willpower. Finding a way to impart understanding of the value of

changing entrenched habits in a real, concrete way is the key.

Wilbanks

ville, FL

> It was written:

>

> <However, don't you think there are/ will be problems with

labelling obesity

> as a 'disease.'>

>

> Liedel:

>

> It is a double edged sword. Obesity tends to lead to heart problems

and

> kidney problems, diabetes, pain in joints etc.

>

> *** One has to be careful to imply causal relationships here,

Obesity does

> not cause heart disease. Some more primary cause leads to obesity,

which also

> may be accompanied by heart disease, joint pain, diabetes and so

on, but

> obesity is not the prime cause. Some authorities might state that

stress

> leads to heart disease and cancer, so that stress is also a

disease. Others

> might state that hypokinesis (being a couch potato) leads to heart

disease,

> diabetes and osteoporosis, so that it, too, is a " disease " . On this

basis,

> almost every natural event in life could end up being classified as

disease.

> Labelling voluntary obesity as disease is offering far too many

people a " cop

> out " or rationalisation for staying as they are and existing in a

> never-ending victim state.

>

> My very disabled wife who suffers from severe chronic back pain and

> debilitating muscle spasm has every reason in the world not to

exercise, but

> she does so every day. Incidentally, her lack of balance means that

it takes

> her up to half an hour even to get dressed to go to the gym to

exercise.

>

> Liedel:

>

> <All which feed into, very often legitimate reasons, an obese

person cannot

> exercise, they become more sedentary and the vicious cycle starts

again. It

> is not a matter of being " lazy " as another respondant put it.

>

> *** I strongly disagree - many people with very high spinal

injuries do their

> utmost to exercise those few parts of the body which can be moved.

If there

> is a will, there is always a way. An obese person who has no spinal

> disability CAN exercise - they are not paralysed or brain

damaged. Sure,

> they have become so heavy and large that their lives have become a

mental

> and physical misery, but they have perfectly capable mechanical

apparatus and

> undamaged minds to provide all that is necessary to move SOMETHING.

>

> If joints and overall mass are a problem, the swimming pool is

always

> available and they can even do seated exercise - my disabled wife

teaches

> seated exercise to people who are FAR more immobilised than the

obese. She

> has also had many obese clients who have followed her program and

changed

> their lives. She still receives many requests for her special

seated exercise

> video for anyone who is limited in ability to move and a good

number of the

> orders come from overweight individuals. Between a third and a

half of her

> seated classes have always been overweight individuals.

>

> Those who drop out are invariably those who are always struggling

to control

> their minds - they are always bingeing, feeling " too tired " (good

grief - the

> teacher herself has taken ages to even put on one shoe or

leotards!), feeling

> " sick " , " not in the mood " , or creating some way of mentally dealing

with the

> cognitive dissonance associated with being overweight and knowing

that they

> alone have the power to change the status quo. Thank goodness,

there are

> some stalwart fatter people who conquer those selfsame excuses and

never miss

> a class, even though they often have heavy family demands. Not

surprisingly,

> it is these folk who lose the weight, regain their self-esteem and

go on to

> become role models for others.

>

> It may not be " lazy " not to exercise, but certainly a very clear

capitulation

> to the weaknesses and limitations imposed by one's own mind. Those

> voluntarily obese people should spend a little time at a spinal

hospital to

> see how the high paras and quads, as well as those with brain

injury, would

> give anything to be fat and mobile, so that at least they would

have the

> prospect of being able to become " normal " again.

>

> Liedel:

>

> <The human body is a very efficient machine and taking off as

little as 10%

> of bodyweight causes it to become more efficient. It is an

isostatic

> reaction. Our bodies want to put the weight back on. Our bodies

fight to

> re-gain lost weight and a cushion against future loss. Exercise

helps, not

> cutting calories drastically helps. There is no 100%

guarenteed " fix " for the

> entire population. Surgery seems to help in extremely obese

individuals. To

> say that it is a matter of willpower is innaccurate. Willpower

alone will not

> take the weight off.>

>

> *** Believe it or not, there is a great deal of similarity between

becoming

> slim and becoming an elite athlete. No will power, no unrelenting

pursuit of

> a series of very clear-cut goals, no ongoing motivation and one

will NEVER

> become a world champion OR thin. It is one's will, one's mind

power which

> initiates and continues the process of achieving one's goals,

whether they be

> aesthetic or competitive. It is one's will that tells you to

exercise, to

> stop overeating, to stop eating 'junk' foods, to overcome all

temptations to

> reaching one's goals - it is not the body which does any of those

things.

>

> Unfortunately, as one formely obese aunt of mine once said: " Almost

always,

> behind every fat person is a fat mind! " She was a fascinating

WYSIWYG woman

> who smoked, overate, overindulged, cussed and swore, and loathed

exercise for

> much of her life -- then one day, she said that she just looked at

herself

> naked and felt totally disgusted -- and the very next day, she

stopped

> smoking and overeating, but did very little exercise other than

some walking.

> When I complimented her some months later on her massive change in

lifestyle

> and appearance and how much will power it must have taken, she said

to me:

> " Rubbish (my polite rendition of what she really said!) - it didn't

take any

> will power at all - I was just disgusted with myself and that was

it! " . She

> even poked fun at all her fat friends who went to weight watchers,

had

> liposuction, attended motivational talks, bought all

those " exercise for

> fatties " videos, went on all the latest diets, yet never made any

long-term

> improvements.

>

> She said if she ( " I have absolutely no will power at all!) could

change her

> life like that, then ANYONE could - and I can corroborate that - if

I had to

> choose anyone who epitomised someone who has no self control it was

that

> aunt. If she hadn't been so fat and unattractive for so long, she

would have

> been seducing every male within reach - she didn't like to control

*anything*

> in her life. That is why I have never forgotten this story - it

still amazes

> me and shakes all that I learned in psychology. Maybe we make many

solutions

> far too complex and my aunt simply rediscovered the truth of the

idiom, KISS

> (Keep it Simple, Stupid).

>

> So, maybe in some cases will power is not the answer. As the sage

said:

> " actions speak louder than words " and my aunt just went out and did

what had

> to be done without all the speeches, the medical tales, the

excuses, the

> politically correct support groups, the " full catastrophe "

(apologies to

> Zorba the Greek!).

>

> Now this may seem contradictory - I have so often stated that will

power and

> motivation are vital keys to all success, but now I appear to have

> contradicted it with the above case study. Is it possible that

will power

> actually is NOT always a necessary ingredient for success? Can one

also not

> achieve success simply by means of a naive " just do it " , " laissez

faire " or

> " just have faith " attitude?

>

> For those who have trodden the paths of Eastern and

aboriginal/native

> philosophy, this will sound very familiar - their ways of living

are often

> characterised by an emphasis on " doing " , not thinking about doing,

on

> " accepting, not evaluating " , " doing by not doing " , " moving by being

still "

> and so forth.

>

> Does too much emphasis on " willing " and " motivating " sometimes lead

to

> " paralysis by analysis " , thereby leading one away from success? It

would

> appear that there may be two very different ways of reaching a goal:

>

> 1. By vigorous and unwavering focus of the mind

> 2. By just letting go and just being (call it seated or dynamic

Zen or what

> you will)

>

> How do we use this schema for helping us achieve our goals in

life? Well,

> just imagine that you are at all times living somewhere on a

continuum

> between the above two extremes. Then, you can choose by trial,

error and

> intuition which method is most appropriate any stage in any given

situation.

>

> Dr Mel C Siff

> Denver, USA

> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Supertraining/

>

> * Don't forget to sign all leters with full name and city if you

wish them to

> be published! *

[Guest guest]

With all this talk about will and will power, I can't help but think

back to my western philosophy studies. Has anyone every observed or

measured a will or will power through scientific means? No. It is a

metaphorical way of speaking. Positing a such a faculty and saying

some have it and others don't, or everyone has it and only some

choose to exercise it seems like thought scheme that is of limited

use. I think this way of speaking is useful only insofar as the

audience is susceptible to 'pep-talks' and other crafted motivational

speaking. In the end, I think this will fail to reach many, because

it is an appeal through emotional manipulation, like advertisement

and propaganda, and not an appeal to understanding. Although I don't

have a solution to what will motivate the seemingly uninspired and

unmotivated, I think the key is to reframe the problem in terms of

understanding instead of exhortation.

I was once overweight, though not obese. However, I was relatively

sednetary, and recreational overeating was a hobby, and even perhaps

a 'coping mechanism'. Over time, I have changed my habits and now my

former habits seem unthinkable to me. The difference does not seem

to me a matter of having activated my 'will' or 'will power', but

rather having changed my understanding about eating and exercising.

I do not find that my current habits are a struggle to maintain, or

that I am fighting the urge to eat pizzas and skip exercise

sessions. I see no stuggle of 'will power' whatsoever. This is how

I live now. I like it. I understand it. Pop-tarts and deep dish

pizza binges hold no attraction.

The tricky part is that this is an experiential understanding, not

just an intellectual one. Getting from there to here was not just a

matter of reviewing facts, but of experiencing a different way of

living. As I've said, I don't have the solution as to how to impart

such experiential understanding to others in need of it, but I think

investigations along these lines will prove more productive than

continuing with the philosophically bankrupt concepts of will and

willpower. Finding a way to impart understanding of the value of

changing entrenched habits in a real, concrete way is the key.

Wilbanks

ville, FL

> It was written:

>

> <However, don't you think there are/ will be problems with

labelling obesity

> as a 'disease.'>

>

> Liedel:

>

> It is a double edged sword. Obesity tends to lead to heart problems

and

> kidney problems, diabetes, pain in joints etc.

>

> *** One has to be careful to imply causal relationships here,

Obesity does

> not cause heart disease. Some more primary cause leads to obesity,

which also

> may be accompanied by heart disease, joint pain, diabetes and so

on, but

> obesity is not the prime cause. Some authorities might state that

stress

> leads to heart disease and cancer, so that stress is also a

disease. Others

> might state that hypokinesis (being a couch potato) leads to heart

disease,

> diabetes and osteoporosis, so that it, too, is a " disease " . On this

basis,

> almost every natural event in life could end up being classified as

disease.

> Labelling voluntary obesity as disease is offering far too many

people a " cop

> out " or rationalisation for staying as they are and existing in a

> never-ending victim state.

>

> My very disabled wife who suffers from severe chronic back pain and

> debilitating muscle spasm has every reason in the world not to

exercise, but

> she does so every day. Incidentally, her lack of balance means that

it takes

> her up to half an hour even to get dressed to go to the gym to

exercise.

>

> Liedel:

>

> <All which feed into, very often legitimate reasons, an obese

person cannot

> exercise, they become more sedentary and the vicious cycle starts

again. It

> is not a matter of being " lazy " as another respondant put it.

>

> *** I strongly disagree - many people with very high spinal

injuries do their

> utmost to exercise those few parts of the body which can be moved.

If there

> is a will, there is always a way. An obese person who has no spinal

> disability CAN exercise - they are not paralysed or brain

damaged. Sure,

> they have become so heavy and large that their lives have become a

mental

> and physical misery, but they have perfectly capable mechanical

apparatus and

> undamaged minds to provide all that is necessary to move SOMETHING.

>

> If joints and overall mass are a problem, the swimming pool is

always

> available and they can even do seated exercise - my disabled wife

teaches

> seated exercise to people who are FAR more immobilised than the

obese. She

> has also had many obese clients who have followed her program and

changed

> their lives. She still receives many requests for her special

seated exercise

> video for anyone who is limited in ability to move and a good

number of the

> orders come from overweight individuals. Between a third and a

half of her

> seated classes have always been overweight individuals.

>

> Those who drop out are invariably those who are always struggling

to control

> their minds - they are always bingeing, feeling " too tired " (good

grief - the

> teacher herself has taken ages to even put on one shoe or

leotards!), feeling

> " sick " , " not in the mood " , or creating some way of mentally dealing

with the

> cognitive dissonance associated with being overweight and knowing

that they

> alone have the power to change the status quo. Thank goodness,

there are

> some stalwart fatter people who conquer those selfsame excuses and

never miss

> a class, even though they often have heavy family demands. Not

surprisingly,

> it is these folk who lose the weight, regain their self-esteem and

go on to

> become role models for others.

>

> It may not be " lazy " not to exercise, but certainly a very clear

capitulation

> to the weaknesses and limitations imposed by one's own mind. Those

> voluntarily obese people should spend a little time at a spinal

hospital to

> see how the high paras and quads, as well as those with brain

injury, would

> give anything to be fat and mobile, so that at least they would

have the

> prospect of being able to become " normal " again.

>

> Liedel:

>

> <The human body is a very efficient machine and taking off as

little as 10%

> of bodyweight causes it to become more efficient. It is an

isostatic

> reaction. Our bodies want to put the weight back on. Our bodies

fight to

> re-gain lost weight and a cushion against future loss. Exercise

helps, not

> cutting calories drastically helps. There is no 100%

guarenteed " fix " for the

> entire population. Surgery seems to help in extremely obese

individuals. To

> say that it is a matter of willpower is innaccurate. Willpower

alone will not

> take the weight off.>

>

> *** Believe it or not, there is a great deal of similarity between

becoming

> slim and becoming an elite athlete. No will power, no unrelenting

pursuit of

> a series of very clear-cut goals, no ongoing motivation and one

will NEVER

> become a world champion OR thin. It is one's will, one's mind

power which

> initiates and continues the process of achieving one's goals,

whether they be

> aesthetic or competitive. It is one's will that tells you to

exercise, to

> stop overeating, to stop eating 'junk' foods, to overcome all

temptations to

> reaching one's goals - it is not the body which does any of those

things.

>

> Unfortunately, as one formely obese aunt of mine once said: " Almost

always,

> behind every fat person is a fat mind! " She was a fascinating

WYSIWYG woman

> who smoked, overate, overindulged, cussed and swore, and loathed

exercise for

> much of her life -- then one day, she said that she just looked at

herself

> naked and felt totally disgusted -- and the very next day, she

stopped

> smoking and overeating, but did very little exercise other than

some walking.

> When I complimented her some months later on her massive change in

lifestyle

> and appearance and how much will power it must have taken, she said

to me:

> " Rubbish (my polite rendition of what she really said!) - it didn't

take any

> will power at all - I was just disgusted with myself and that was

it! " . She

> even poked fun at all her fat friends who went to weight watchers,

had

> liposuction, attended motivational talks, bought all

those " exercise for

> fatties " videos, went on all the latest diets, yet never made any

long-term

> improvements.

>

> She said if she ( " I have absolutely no will power at all!) could

change her

> life like that, then ANYONE could - and I can corroborate that - if

I had to

> choose anyone who epitomised someone who has no self control it was

that

> aunt. If she hadn't been so fat and unattractive for so long, she

would have

> been seducing every male within reach - she didn't like to control

*anything*

> in her life. That is why I have never forgotten this story - it

still amazes

> me and shakes all that I learned in psychology. Maybe we make many

solutions

> far too complex and my aunt simply rediscovered the truth of the

idiom, KISS

> (Keep it Simple, Stupid).

>

> So, maybe in some cases will power is not the answer. As the sage

said:

> " actions speak louder than words " and my aunt just went out and did

what had

> to be done without all the speeches, the medical tales, the

excuses, the

> politically correct support groups, the " full catastrophe "

(apologies to

> Zorba the Greek!).

>

> Now this may seem contradictory - I have so often stated that will

power and

> motivation are vital keys to all success, but now I appear to have

> contradicted it with the above case study. Is it possible that

will power

> actually is NOT always a necessary ingredient for success? Can one

also not

> achieve success simply by means of a naive " just do it " , " laissez

faire " or

> " just have faith " attitude?

>

> For those who have trodden the paths of Eastern and

aboriginal/native

> philosophy, this will sound very familiar - their ways of living

are often

> characterised by an emphasis on " doing " , not thinking about doing,

on

> " accepting, not evaluating " , " doing by not doing " , " moving by being

still "

> and so forth.

>

> Does too much emphasis on " willing " and " motivating " sometimes lead

to

> " paralysis by analysis " , thereby leading one away from success? It

would

> appear that there may be two very different ways of reaching a goal:

>

> 1. By vigorous and unwavering focus of the mind

> 2. By just letting go and just being (call it seated or dynamic

Zen or what

> you will)

>

> How do we use this schema for helping us achieve our goals in

life? Well,

> just imagine that you are at all times living somewhere on a

continuum

> between the above two extremes. Then, you can choose by trial,

error and

> intuition which method is most appropriate any stage in any given

situation.

>

> Dr Mel C Siff

> Denver, USA

> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Supertraining/

>

> * Don't forget to sign all leters with full name and city if you

wish them to

> be published! *

[Guest guest]

OK I can buy what you say about willpower, although through

personal experience I tend to discount the " You cannot

measure it, so it must be related to manipulation " theory

you purport (yes I know it is a very bad paraphrase,

forgive me). So my question would be this. If you are

trying to motivate someone who is sedentary how do you go

about changing habits without using some form of mental

manipulation? I am not talking about mind control here,

but a good percentage of what I do is mental imagry,

including having my clients imagine themselves reaching a

sought after goal. I use this type of mental inagry myself

when I train, imagining the finish line. I think about 1/2

to 3/4 of what I do is to assist my clients to get through

difficult lunges, squats etc by helping them focus on what

they have and wish to accomplish. This, in turn, changes

their habits.

Liedel

Ann Arbor, MI

[Guest guest]

Dr Siff -I will disagree with one of your statements on that

MARVELOUS reply (your aunt sounds like my kind of woman).

Obesity can lead to joint pain, elevated triglyceride

levels and a host of other problem. Study after study

confirm it and I personal had terrible joint pain when I

was obese as well as cholesterol through the roof.

[Thanks for that kind comment, but you misunderstood what I

wrote on that one issue. Obesity does not just happen - it is

not a PRIMARY cause - it is the result of factors such as

overeating and hypokinesis. This means that obesity, joint pain,

unhealthy blood profiles, heart problems and so on are all effects

of more primary causes. Mel Siff]

Obesity is not an excuse to not exercise, and it seems that

I have purported the idea that it is. Obesity does however

tend to lead to someone doing too much too soon and giving

up in pain because of the additional load placed on the

joints. It is important for the obese person to begin at a

pace they are physically and emotionally comfortable with,

always being aware of heart rate levels and mental comfort

levels because in a gym enviroment the obese person will

usually feel " out of place " . Lifestyle changes should,

usually, be introduced gradually and always with a lot of

feedback from the person trying to make those changes.

There are very few people who cannot perform some physical

activity for fitness every day. However, someone with a

" fat mentality " will find an excuse why they " cannot " do

it. Yesterday I read that " any excuse not to do some

activity every day is a bad excuse " and think I am about

to adopt it as my motto for my clients.

Liedel

Ann Arbor, MI

[Guest guest]

> OK I can buy what you say about willpower, although through

> personal experience I tend to discount the " You cannot

> measure it, so it must be related to manipulation " theory

> you purport (yes I know it is a very bad paraphrase,

> forgive me). So my question would be this. If you are

> trying to motivate someone who is sedentary how do you go

> about changing habits without using some form of mental

> manipulation? I am not talking about mind control here,

> but a good percentage of what I do is mental imagery,

> including having my clients imagine themselves reaching a

> sought after goal. I use this type of mental imnagery myself

> when I train, imagining the finish line. I think about 1/2

> to 3/4 of what I do is to assist my clients to get through

> difficult lunges, squats etc by helping them focus on what

> they have and wish to accomplish. This, in turn, changes

> their habits.

Here's an extract from

<http://staff.washington.edu/griffin/mental.txt>

which Dr Siff wrote - may be applicable to a certain extent in this

case:

....It is nothing new for anyone to say that the most effective

training should involve both mind and body, both psychology and

physiology. Conferences nowadays are more frequently addressing the

use of the mind and so-called mind-body training regimes, with hosts

of speakers rehashing much the same types of mental training, ranging

from visualisation strategies, breathing regimes, meditative rituals,

NLP mantras and modified martial arts to chanting and yoga.

Certainly these mind games may work well in some cases, but only the

most intrepid and dedicated will apply these methods on a long-term

basis, largely because the 'average' fitness devotee wants

quick 'fixes' which require little additional work or single-minded

concentration.

ENTICING THE MIND

At this point some readers may be saying to themselves: " Aha , I know

what's coming next - some simple, new-sounding technique of mind

training! " . If so, they are going to be disappointed, because I am

almost going to suggest the opposite. Yes, by proposing that we

ignore conscious attempts to involve the mind, we may involve it even

more effectively!

How is this possible?

Well, the mind will involve itself in training to a greater extent if

you simply allow the exercise to entice or seduce the mind into

committing itself more sincerely to the action.

How does one do that? Let us begin by asking how strongly the mind

becomes involved in any gym exercise if you use light, unchallenging

movements, loads, reps, sets and workouts. We all know the answer to

that - under those conditions, the mind can go on holiday, keep

almost entirely out of the training process and even allow you to

read, talk or watch TV while you are exercising. Does this sound

familiar?

Now let's move to the exactly opposite scenario and use heavy

weights, use HIT methods, use heavy " Superslow " , use near maximal

loads, reps to failure, novel training variations, concentration

curls, minimal rest intervals and other very demanding or challenging

training strategies. Under these conditions, can you let the mind

relax, take a hike elsewhere and watch TV and complete the exercise

effectively? Not a chance!

There we have it - a very real reason why any of the apparently

different methods of bodybuilding development may work! It may well

be that all of these methods force the training to go beyond mere use

of the body and reflexively compel the mind to involve itself very

powerfully in the action.

The more demanding the exercise (within limits - because the mind can

switch off or dissociate to avoid supreme pain), the more the mind

and body are compelled to join each other in the enterprise. Voila!-

automatic mind-body training without the need for any special

rituals! The exercise becomes the ritual, as well as the training

method.

Now let's go back to those warring factions - can anyone name any

successful bodybuilding or hypertrophy training technique which does

NOT compel the mind to become powerfully involved in the action?

Whether it is counting time under tension, fighting

against " superslow " movements, tensing every muscle fibre in working

to failure or against a near maximal load, or counting the

concentric and eccentric phases of a movement, the mind is

automatically enticed or bullied into the action.

CONCLUSION

In other words, if you are doing anything effectively to the utmost

of your capabilities, the mind usually does automatically what needs

to be done.

Maybe this is a good reason why it is often very difficult to single

out any one training method against another in producing good

results. It certainly goes a long way to explaining why a lot of

folk just don't have much success with any method - their minds just

aren't involved in the appropriate manner when they exercise with

whatever method they are using!

Any thoughts?

Carruthers

Wakefield

UK

[Guest guest]

> OK I can buy what you say about willpower, although through

> personal experience I tend to discount the " You cannot

> measure it, so it must be related to manipulation " theory

> you purport (yes I know it is a very bad paraphrase,

> forgive me). So my question would be this. If you are

> trying to motivate someone who is sedentary how do you go

> about changing habits without using some form of mental

> manipulation? I am not talking about mind control here,

> but a good percentage of what I do is mental imagery,

> including having my clients imagine themselves reaching a

> sought after goal. I use this type of mental imnagery myself

> when I train, imagining the finish line. I think about 1/2

> to 3/4 of what I do is to assist my clients to get through

> difficult lunges, squats etc by helping them focus on what

> they have and wish to accomplish. This, in turn, changes

> their habits.

Here's an extract from

<http://staff.washington.edu/griffin/mental.txt>

which Dr Siff wrote - may be applicable to a certain extent in this

case:

....It is nothing new for anyone to say that the most effective

training should involve both mind and body, both psychology and

physiology. Conferences nowadays are more frequently addressing the

use of the mind and so-called mind-body training regimes, with hosts

of speakers rehashing much the same types of mental training, ranging

from visualisation strategies, breathing regimes, meditative rituals,

NLP mantras and modified martial arts to chanting and yoga.

Certainly these mind games may work well in some cases, but only the

most intrepid and dedicated will apply these methods on a long-term

basis, largely because the 'average' fitness devotee wants

quick 'fixes' which require little additional work or single-minded

concentration.

ENTICING THE MIND

At this point some readers may be saying to themselves: " Aha , I know

what's coming next - some simple, new-sounding technique of mind

training! " . If so, they are going to be disappointed, because I am

almost going to suggest the opposite. Yes, by proposing that we

ignore conscious attempts to involve the mind, we may involve it even

more effectively!

How is this possible?

Well, the mind will involve itself in training to a greater extent if

you simply allow the exercise to entice or seduce the mind into

committing itself more sincerely to the action.

How does one do that? Let us begin by asking how strongly the mind

becomes involved in any gym exercise if you use light, unchallenging

movements, loads, reps, sets and workouts. We all know the answer to

that - under those conditions, the mind can go on holiday, keep

almost entirely out of the training process and even allow you to

read, talk or watch TV while you are exercising. Does this sound

familiar?

Now let's move to the exactly opposite scenario and use heavy

weights, use HIT methods, use heavy " Superslow " , use near maximal

loads, reps to failure, novel training variations, concentration

curls, minimal rest intervals and other very demanding or challenging

training strategies. Under these conditions, can you let the mind

relax, take a hike elsewhere and watch TV and complete the exercise

effectively? Not a chance!

There we have it - a very real reason why any of the apparently

different methods of bodybuilding development may work! It may well

be that all of these methods force the training to go beyond mere use

of the body and reflexively compel the mind to involve itself very

powerfully in the action.

The more demanding the exercise (within limits - because the mind can

switch off or dissociate to avoid supreme pain), the more the mind

and body are compelled to join each other in the enterprise. Voila!-

automatic mind-body training without the need for any special

rituals! The exercise becomes the ritual, as well as the training

method.

Now let's go back to those warring factions - can anyone name any

successful bodybuilding or hypertrophy training technique which does

NOT compel the mind to become powerfully involved in the action?

Whether it is counting time under tension, fighting

against " superslow " movements, tensing every muscle fibre in working

to failure or against a near maximal load, or counting the

concentric and eccentric phases of a movement, the mind is

automatically enticed or bullied into the action.

CONCLUSION

In other words, if you are doing anything effectively to the utmost

of your capabilities, the mind usually does automatically what needs

to be done.

Maybe this is a good reason why it is often very difficult to single

out any one training method against another in producing good

results. It certainly goes a long way to explaining why a lot of

folk just don't have much success with any method - their minds just

aren't involved in the appropriate manner when they exercise with

whatever method they are using!

Any thoughts?

Carruthers

Wakefield

UK

[Guest guest]

> OK I can buy what you say about willpower, although through

> personal experience I tend to discount the " You cannot

> measure it, so it must be related to manipulation " theory

> you purport (yes I know it is a very bad paraphrase,

> forgive me). So my question would be this. If you are

> trying to motivate someone who is sedentary how do you go

> about changing habits without using some form of mental

> manipulation? I am not talking about mind control here,

> but a good percentage of what I do is mental imagery,

> including having my clients imagine themselves reaching a

> sought after goal. I use this type of mental imnagery myself

> when I train, imagining the finish line. I think about 1/2

> to 3/4 of what I do is to assist my clients to get through

> difficult lunges, squats etc by helping them focus on what

> they have and wish to accomplish. This, in turn, changes

> their habits.

Here's an extract from

<http://staff.washington.edu/griffin/mental.txt>

which Dr Siff wrote - may be applicable to a certain extent in this

case:

....It is nothing new for anyone to say that the most effective

training should involve both mind and body, both psychology and

physiology. Conferences nowadays are more frequently addressing the

use of the mind and so-called mind-body training regimes, with hosts

of speakers rehashing much the same types of mental training, ranging

from visualisation strategies, breathing regimes, meditative rituals,

NLP mantras and modified martial arts to chanting and yoga.

Certainly these mind games may work well in some cases, but only the

most intrepid and dedicated will apply these methods on a long-term

basis, largely because the 'average' fitness devotee wants

quick 'fixes' which require little additional work or single-minded

concentration.

ENTICING THE MIND

At this point some readers may be saying to themselves: " Aha , I know

what's coming next - some simple, new-sounding technique of mind

training! " . If so, they are going to be disappointed, because I am

almost going to suggest the opposite. Yes, by proposing that we

ignore conscious attempts to involve the mind, we may involve it even

more effectively!

How is this possible?

Well, the mind will involve itself in training to a greater extent if

you simply allow the exercise to entice or seduce the mind into

committing itself more sincerely to the action.

How does one do that? Let us begin by asking how strongly the mind

becomes involved in any gym exercise if you use light, unchallenging

movements, loads, reps, sets and workouts. We all know the answer to

that - under those conditions, the mind can go on holiday, keep

almost entirely out of the training process and even allow you to

read, talk or watch TV while you are exercising. Does this sound

familiar?

Now let's move to the exactly opposite scenario and use heavy

weights, use HIT methods, use heavy " Superslow " , use near maximal

loads, reps to failure, novel training variations, concentration

curls, minimal rest intervals and other very demanding or challenging

training strategies. Under these conditions, can you let the mind

relax, take a hike elsewhere and watch TV and complete the exercise

effectively? Not a chance!

There we have it - a very real reason why any of the apparently

different methods of bodybuilding development may work! It may well

be that all of these methods force the training to go beyond mere use

of the body and reflexively compel the mind to involve itself very

powerfully in the action.

The more demanding the exercise (within limits - because the mind can

switch off or dissociate to avoid supreme pain), the more the mind

and body are compelled to join each other in the enterprise. Voila!-

automatic mind-body training without the need for any special

rituals! The exercise becomes the ritual, as well as the training

method.

Now let's go back to those warring factions - can anyone name any

successful bodybuilding or hypertrophy training technique which does

NOT compel the mind to become powerfully involved in the action?

Whether it is counting time under tension, fighting

against " superslow " movements, tensing every muscle fibre in working

to failure or against a near maximal load, or counting the

concentric and eccentric phases of a movement, the mind is

automatically enticed or bullied into the action.

CONCLUSION

In other words, if you are doing anything effectively to the utmost

of your capabilities, the mind usually does automatically what needs

to be done.

Maybe this is a good reason why it is often very difficult to single

out any one training method against another in producing good

results. It certainly goes a long way to explaining why a lot of

folk just don't have much success with any method - their minds just

aren't involved in the appropriate manner when they exercise with

whatever method they are using!

Any thoughts?

Carruthers

Wakefield

UK

[Guest guest]

<nliedel@p...> wrote:

> Obesity is not an excuse to not exercise, and it seems that

> I have purported the idea that it is. Obesity does however

> tend to lead to someone doing too much too soon and giving

> up in pain because of the additional load placed on the

> joints. It is important for the obese person to begin at a

> pace they are physically and emotionally comfortable with,

> always being aware of heart rate levels and mental comfort

> levels because in a gym enviroment the obese person will

> usually feel " out of place " . Lifestyle changes should,

> usually, be introduced gradually and always with a lot of

> feedback from the person trying to make those changes.

I can agree to that..

While I've been quite fit as far as cycling exercise is concerned, I even

participated in 3 spinning

sessions/week by late February and also cycled around 150 K /week, I was and

still am unable to do

many other forms of exercise, apart from weight lifting.

From late February on to early May I've been unable to cycle in the weekends

because of a single session

of skipping rope which I did in order to shed some weight...

Six weeks ago, I injured my right shoulder rather badly (I've got RSI since

1993-1994) and am still

squirming with pain today as I cycled a rather hilly 150K on Saturday (you do

tend to pull at the bars

when going uphill).

Even swimming hurts either my shoulders or my feet (love to swim on my back

using feet as flippers).

With a rather decent heart (my lowest recorded HR is now 27 bpm) it's really a

complete chagrin to not

be able to exercise vigorously other than cycling and lower leg exercises...

BTW, I'm grateful for the

physiotherapy i received as I now have much stronger ankles.. but still a far

too short achilles tendon,

so skipping rope is probably still not an option!

Ivana van den Hork

Wageningen, Gelderland, NL

*Don't forget to sign all letters with full name and city of residence if you

wish them to be published!