Re: Re/ Base vs Trace

[Guest guest]

, HI! I am just getting back since Frances knocked me offline. I have

been reading these posts, and I am wondering what if any difference it makes

as to benefits of castor oil added at trace or from the beginning as a base

oil. It seems to me the soap would retain hardness better as a base oil, ( I

use about average 6 oz in a 5lb batch) I am pretty new at the veggie soaps,

and your advice to me has always been right on. I'd like your feedback on this,

too. It's NICE to be back!! R Orlando PS Actually, the only oils

I add at trace, usually are shea butter, jojoba 'oil, " or a little almond. I

have used almond as a base, 10 oz in one recipe I tried.

[Guest guest]

Who me, right on????? wow, I can finally give back. Although Castor Oil

has a low idodine factor, too much can soften a bar. Castor Oil makes BIG

BUBBLES, so I add just a bit at trace.

I make 11 lb. batches, and add 4 tablespoons of castor oil at trace. I

don't figure it into the lye calulations at all. I use the MMS lye calculator

and do the lye recomendations for as close to 5% as I can get, usually between

5%, 6% (first in ounces, then converting into grams to get me the closest to

5)

I figure with the extra oil at trace, this will let me fall between the 6,

7, 8% of the lye calulations err... somewhere in there. If I didn't do it

this way, I would end up with a soap that was 10% superfatted. (I know this as

someone on the MMS list yelled at me for being so stupid)

I also add a couple of tablespoons of stearic acid (with I also don't figure

in) - with my base oils to insure I'll get a hard bar. I'm not precise,

just dump some in.

I just checked, go to the files section of our group (on yahoo) - I uploaded

an oil properties spreadsheet, that will allow you to figure out the

properties of your soap formulas. There are other oil properties charts up

there

with even more information.

Everyone has their own way of doing things. What works for me, may not work

for you, or what I like you might not like and so on and so forth.

Soapmaking is a learning curve. At some point you'll come to the most

wonderful formula, that will be all yours and will make you and your

friends/family/customers so happy they will keep coming back for more.

One of my customers, came today and asked if I had a brochure. His sister

lives in the Bahamas and wants to do business with me, she owns a few beauty

salons. It's nice to have happy customers/friends/relatives.

Now remember TOO MUCH CASTOR OIL, will give you a soft bar of soap (period).

Also Castor Oil will give you BIG BUBBLES (people like big bubbles) also if

you are going to use castor oil and list your ingredients call it " Palm

Christi " it's the same thing just sounds better.

in Cambridge

, HI! I am just getting back since Frances knocked me offline. I

have

been reading these posts, and I am wondering what if any difference it

makes

as to benefits of castor oil added at trace or from the beginning as a base

oil. It seems to me the soap would retain hardness better as a base oil, (

I

use about average 6 oz in a 5lb batch) I am pretty new at the veggie soaps,

and your advice to me has always been right on. I'd like your feedback on

this,

too. It's NICE to be back!! R Orlando PS Actually, the only

oils

I add at trace, usually are shea butter, jojoba 'oil, " or a little almond.

I

have used almond as a base, 10 oz in one recipe I tried.

[Guest guest]

I use the MMS lye calc also. I figure my oils/fats to 5-6%, including the

castor oil. Then, for example, add shea and or jojoba at trace. The castor would

give the same qualities either way, wouldn't it? I am paranoid of

overfatting, I guess, uck rancid soap. By the way, I put a 12 inch piece of

silk ribbon

in my lye, I read that in Mcs book, I believe. Thanks for the links.

How much oil at trace is too much? I usually make soap in 5lb batches.

R

[Guest guest]

I use the MMS lye calc also. I figure my oils/fats to 5-6%, including the

castor oil. Then, for example, add shea and or jojoba at trace. The castor would

give the same qualities either way, wouldn't it? I am paranoid of

overfatting, I guess, uck rancid soap. By the way, I put a 12 inch piece of

silk ribbon

in my lye, I read that in Mcs book, I believe. Thanks for the links.

How much oil at trace is too much? I usually make soap in 5lb batches.

R

[Guest guest]

You have me wondering about what you were doing to end up with 10%

SUPERFAT-- what were you doing that someone at MMS ''corrected " you?lol I would

like

to know in case I am doing it! lol R

[Guest guest]

You have me wondering about what you were doing to end up with 10%

SUPERFAT-- what were you doing that someone at MMS ''corrected " you?lol I would

like

to know in case I am doing it! lol R

[Guest guest]

(I know this as

someone on the MMS list yelled at me for being so stupid)

Whot's the MMS list so I can stay away from it? and thanks for the

Palm Christi idea, That's what I'm gonna do.

[Guest guest]

A note on the castor added at trace. I had read a long while back that one way

to get rid of soda ash was to add a couple oz.s of castor at trace. I usually

make at least a 8-10 lb. batch and have been adding 2 oz. or so to every 8 lbs.

ever since and I never get soda ash (although some of my recipes call for more

than that, I always keep out those 2 oz.s and add them at trace)

Alice ~

MooseCreekBathandBody.com

^-^-^-@@-^-^-^

(..)--

||---||

^^ ^^

Re: Re/ Base vs Trace

Who me, right on????? wow, I can finally give back. Although Castor Oil

has a low idodine factor, too much can soften a bar. Castor Oil makes BIG

BUBBLES, so I add just a bit at trace.

I make 11 lb. batches, and add 4 tablespoons of castor oil at trace. I

don't figure it into the lye calulations at all. I use the MMS lye

calculator

and do the lye recomendations for as close to 5% as I can get, usually

between

5%, 6% (first in ounces, then converting into grams to get me the closest to

5)

I figure with the extra oil at trace, this will let me fall between the 6,

7, 8% of the lye calulations err... somewhere in there. If I didn't do it

this way, I would end up with a soap that was 10% superfatted. (I know this

as

someone on the MMS list yelled at me for being so stupid)

I also add a couple of tablespoons of stearic acid (with I also don't figure

in) - with my base oils to insure I'll get a hard bar. I'm not precise,

just dump some in.

I just checked, go to the files section of our group (on yahoo) - I uploaded

an oil properties spreadsheet, that will allow you to figure out the

properties of your soap formulas. There are other oil properties charts up

there

with even more information.

Everyone has their own way of doing things. What works for me, may not work

for you, or what I like you might not like and so on and so forth.

Soapmaking is a learning curve. At some point you'll come to the most

wonderful formula, that will be all yours and will make you and your

friends/family/customers so happy they will keep coming back for more.

One of my customers, came today and asked if I had a brochure. His sister

lives in the Bahamas and wants to do business with me, she owns a few beauty

salons. It's nice to have happy customers/friends/relatives.

Now remember TOO MUCH CASTOR OIL, will give you a soft bar of soap (period).

Also Castor Oil will give you BIG BUBBLES (people like big bubbles) also if

you are going to use castor oil and list your ingredients call it " Palm

Christi " it's the same thing just sounds better.

in Cambridge

, HI! I am just getting back since Frances knocked me offline. I

have

been reading these posts, and I am wondering what if any difference it

makes

as to benefits of castor oil added at trace or from the beginning as a base

oil. It seems to me the soap would retain hardness better as a base oil, (

I

use about average 6 oz in a 5lb batch) I am pretty new at the veggie soaps,

and your advice to me has always been right on. I'd like your feedback on

this,

too. It's NICE to be back!! R Orlando PS Actually, the only

oils

I add at trace, usually are shea butter, jojoba 'oil, " or a little almond.

I

have used almond as a base, 10 oz in one recipe I tried.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/14/2004 7:59:19 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

catlarue@... writes:

You have me wondering about what you were doing to end up with 10%

SUPERFAT-- what were you doing that someone at MMS ''corrected " you?lol I

would like

to know in case I am doing it! lol R

I was adding castor at trace, and doing my lye calculations at 7 or 8%

scale.

in Cambridge

~~Madness takes its toll, please have the exact change~~

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/14/2004 7:59:19 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

catlarue@... writes:

You have me wondering about what you were doing to end up with 10%

SUPERFAT-- what were you doing that someone at MMS ''corrected " you?lol I

would like

to know in case I am doing it! lol R

I was adding castor at trace, and doing my lye calculations at 7 or 8%

scale.

in Cambridge

~~Madness takes its toll, please have the exact change~~

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/14/2004 7:49:29 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

moosecreekcreations@... writes:

A note on the castor added at trace. I had read a long while back that one

way to get rid of soda ash was to add a couple oz.s of castor at trace. I

usually make at least a 8-10 lb. batch and have been adding 2 oz. or so to

every

8 lbs. ever since and I never get soda ash (although some of my recipes call

for more than that, I always keep out those 2 oz.s and add them at trace)

Alice ~

No kidding, I've never tried that but when I used same recipe with

individual molds, I did get soda ash. Haven't tried it with the slab mold.

Too

scared.

in Cambridge

~~Madness takes its toll, please have the exact change~~

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/14/2004 7:49:29 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

moosecreekcreations@... writes:

A note on the castor added at trace. I had read a long while back that one

way to get rid of soda ash was to add a couple oz.s of castor at trace. I

usually make at least a 8-10 lb. batch and have been adding 2 oz. or so to

every

8 lbs. ever since and I never get soda ash (although some of my recipes call

for more than that, I always keep out those 2 oz.s and add them at trace)

Alice ~

No kidding, I've never tried that but when I used same recipe with

individual molds, I did get soda ash. Haven't tried it with the slab mold.

Too

scared.

in Cambridge

~~Madness takes its toll, please have the exact change~~

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/14/2004 7:53:10 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

joyces0@... writes:

Whot's the MMS list so I can stay away from it? and thanks for the

Palm Christi idea, That's what I'm gonna do.

Oh the MMS soap list was my very first soap list. It was actually one of

the owners who probably got over excited that my soap was going to come out too

soft, they're very nice over there.

One day (not too long ago) - my stick blender broke mid batch and I was

using a cake mixer instead. I called MMS frantically and Steph answered the

phone. She told me not to worry, just put the soap in the oven and when I woke

up I could start stirring it again (the soap had a very high olive oil

content) - I was going to be two days bringing it to trace.

I ended up dashing out to get a new stick blender. And nothing dreadful

happend to the soap. I thought you had to keep stirring it continously. Not

in

this case.

Palm Christi (aka castor oil) is from the Soapmakers Companion, a true bible

of the soapmaking books. I use her Hemp Oil soap recipe (just do my own lye

calculations) - It seems very very high in both coconut and palm, but it

makes an excellent hemp oil soap.

But then what do I know.

in Cambridge

~~Madness takes its toll, please have the exact change~~

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/14/2004 7:53:10 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

joyces0@... writes:

Whot's the MMS list so I can stay away from it? and thanks for the

Palm Christi idea, That's what I'm gonna do.

Oh the MMS soap list was my very first soap list. It was actually one of

the owners who probably got over excited that my soap was going to come out too

soft, they're very nice over there.

One day (not too long ago) - my stick blender broke mid batch and I was

using a cake mixer instead. I called MMS frantically and Steph answered the

phone. She told me not to worry, just put the soap in the oven and when I woke

up I could start stirring it again (the soap had a very high olive oil

content) - I was going to be two days bringing it to trace.

I ended up dashing out to get a new stick blender. And nothing dreadful

happend to the soap. I thought you had to keep stirring it continously. Not

in

this case.

Palm Christi (aka castor oil) is from the Soapmakers Companion, a true bible

of the soapmaking books. I use her Hemp Oil soap recipe (just do my own lye

calculations) - It seems very very high in both coconut and palm, but it

makes an excellent hemp oil soap.

But then what do I know.

in Cambridge

~~Madness takes its toll, please have the exact change~~

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/14/2004 7:53:19 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

catlarue@... writes:

I use the MMS lye calc also. I figure my oils/fats to 5-6%, including the

castor oil. Then, for example, add shea and or jojoba at trace. The castor

would

give the same qualities either way, wouldn't it? I am paranoid of

overfatting, I guess, uck rancid soap. By the way, I put a 12 inch piece of

silk ribbon

in my lye, I read that in Mcs book, I believe. Thanks for the links.

How much oil at trace is too much? I usually make soap in 5lb batches.

R

I would think they'd have the same qualities, just a matter of prefference.

For me to add silk ribbon or fabric in the lye water would make me unsure of

what else besides silk was in there. Chemicals and/or dye. I also have the

Mcs book. He's a cool dude and contributes greatly on a number of

soap lists.

I make 11 lb. batches and add 4 tablespoons. If I made a 5 or 6 lb. batch I

would probably add 2 tbls.

in Cambridge

~~Madness takes its toll, please have the exact change~~

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/14/2004 7:53:19 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

catlarue@... writes:

I use the MMS lye calc also. I figure my oils/fats to 5-6%, including the

castor oil. Then, for example, add shea and or jojoba at trace. The castor

would

give the same qualities either way, wouldn't it? I am paranoid of

overfatting, I guess, uck rancid soap. By the way, I put a 12 inch piece of

silk ribbon

in my lye, I read that in Mcs book, I believe. Thanks for the links.

How much oil at trace is too much? I usually make soap in 5lb batches.

R

I would think they'd have the same qualities, just a matter of prefference.

For me to add silk ribbon or fabric in the lye water would make me unsure of

what else besides silk was in there. Chemicals and/or dye. I also have the

Mcs book. He's a cool dude and contributes greatly on a number of

soap lists.

I make 11 lb. batches and add 4 tablespoons. If I made a 5 or 6 lb. batch I

would probably add 2 tbls.

in Cambridge

~~Madness takes its toll, please have the exact change~~

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/14/2004 12:19:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

joyces0@... writes:

What? What's this?

You said:

I put a 12 inch piece of silk ribbon

Whassat do?

I didn't say that, someone else said that.

in Cambridge

~~Madness takes its toll, please have the exact change~~

[Guest guest]

To add silk, I read it in Mcs book. R

[Guest guest]

What? What's this?

You said:

I put a 12 inch piece of silk ribbon

Whassat do?

[Guest guest]

What? What's this?

You said:

I put a 12 inch piece of silk ribbon

Whassat do?

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/14/2004 4:52:22 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

joyces0@... writes:

Oh, I know, I just flubbed on my editing. I have some stuff floating

around, too, under my name I didn't write. Sorry.

I saw the answer to my question, already, anyway. It's to add silk

fibers to a recipe. Don't know why I didn't figure it out, since

that was the topic.

Oh don't mind me, I was just fooling around. It's so common when someone on

a list gets blamed for saying something else. Was goofing.

in Cambridge

~~Madness takes its toll, please have the exact change~~

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/14/2004 4:54:59 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

joyces0@... writes:

I saw a recipe I want to try that uses alot of castor oil for a

shampoo bar. It said the soap would come out softer than usual, but

to just let it cure longer, and it would end up fine, hard bars in

the end.

And whattya mean, whattya know? Lots!

A lot of soft oils that would make a soft bar at first will harden into

fabulous soap. I had tons of rice bran oil that did that. I had tons of soft

soap that I pictched cause I was mad that I regretted later on. It will

harden, it just takes time. (some times a long time)

in Cambridge

~~Madness takes its toll, please have the exact change~~

[Guest guest]

I saw a recipe I want to try that uses alot of castor oil for a

shampoo bar. It said the soap would come out softer than usual, but

to just let it cure longer, and it would end up fine, hard bars in

the end.

And whattya mean, whattya know? Lots!

>

>

> In a message dated 9/14/2004 7:53:10 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

>>

>

>

> one of

> the owners who probably got over excited that my soap was going

to come out too

> soft, they're very nice over there.

>

> > Palm Christi (aka castor oil) > But then what do I know.

>

> in Cambridge

> ~~Madness takes its toll, please have the exact change~~

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Oh, I know, I just flubbed on my editing. I have some stuff floating

around, too, under my name I didn't write. Sorry.

I saw the answer to my question, already, anyway. It's to add silk

fibers to a recipe. Don't know why I didn't figure it out, since

that was the topic.

>

>

> In a message dated 9/14/2004 12:19:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

> joyces0@y... writes:

>

> What? What's this?

> You said:

> I put a 12 inch piece of silk ribbon

>

> Whassat do?

>

>

>

> I didn't say that, someone else said that.

>

> in Cambridge

> ~~Madness takes its toll, please have the exact change~~

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I made the mistake of adding my olive oil twice to a recipe. A friend did

the math for me and said that I had superfated it at 23%. It was very soft

to say the least. I had to wait about 2 weeks just to get it out of the

mold. It took another 6 months to get hard but everyone that use it just

loved it.

Chris

> You have me wondering about what you were doing to end up with 10%

> SUPERFAT-- what were you doing that someone at MMS ''corrected " you?lol I

> would like

> to know in case I am doing it! lol R

> I was adding castor at trace, and doing my lye calculations at 7 or 8%

> scale.