Re: Re: Got slammed by mycotoxins again,

[Guest guest]

,

So just to be clear, you can have mycotoxins

without VOCs but not VOCS without mycotoxins IF

VOCS are from mold (not bacteria). Wouldn't you

say that would be true? Since you would not have

MOLD VOCs without mold colony near. It just

would be a matter of telling mold VOCS from

another organism emitting VOCS.

--- erikmoldwarrior

<erikmoldwarrior@...> wrote:

>

>

> The neurotoxic mycotoxins have no odor per se.

> It creates an " acrid " olfactory sensation;

> " Burning " .

> The trick to to distinguish acridity from

> stench so there is no

> need to run from harmless mVOC's.

> I only respond to " sensation " and not to musty

> smells.

> I had heard of " spore clouds " but this didn't

> reflect the action of

> movement necessary to create a mental picture

> of how these clouds

> travel and " hit " you, so I started calling them

> " spore plumes " .

> Think " cigarette smoke " .

> You can get a lungful, while it passes

> unnoticed right past the

> person sitting next to you.

> -

[Guest guest]

, but people tell you to suspect mold if you

room is musty or stinky and there has been water

leak, even if now fixed. I know there can be

VOCs in an unvented bathroom that someone just

vacated, but I mean a room that noone lives in

smelling musty. Wouldn't one assume then mold

colony and if mold colony, wouldn't they

undoubtedly have emitted spores that would

produce mycotoxins.

For mycotoxins without VOC odor, wouldn't that be

when wind picks up mycotoxins and carry them away

from colony, then they are airbourne mycotoxins

without any associated VOCs? ...your term, a

mold plume, which could also be called a

mycotoxic plume

--- erikmoldwarrior

<erikmoldwarrior@...> wrote:

> mVOC's are just the farts from what microbes

> eat.

> It's the " chemical weapons " that some can

> produce that we have to

> watch out for.

> Sure we can have VOC's without mycotoxins.

> Lot's of 'em.

> That's why I don't bother to run unless I

> perceive something a little

> stronger. Either VOC's that happen to ALSO have

> secondary metabolites,

> or just the reaction, even if I don't smell

> anything.

> -

[Guest guest]

I have a theory about closed off rooms--they harbor humidity and mold blooms.

bbw <barb1283@...> wrote: , but

people tell you to suspect mold if you

room is musty or stinky and there has been water

leak, even if now fixed. I know there can be

VOCs in an unvented bathroom that someone just

vacated, but I mean a room that noone lives in

smelling musty. Wouldn't one assume then mold

colony and if mold colony, wouldn't they

undoubtedly have emitted spores that would

produce mycotoxins.

For mycotoxins without VOC odor, wouldn't that be

when wind picks up mycotoxins and carry them away

from colony, then they are airbourne mycotoxins

without any associated VOCs? ...your term, a

mold plume, which could also be called a

mycotoxic plume

--- erikmoldwarrior

<erikmoldwarrior@...> wrote:

> mVOC's are just the farts from what microbes

> eat.

> It's the " chemical weapons " that some can

> produce that we have to

> watch out for.

> Sure we can have VOC's without mycotoxins.

> Lot's of 'em.

> That's why I don't bother to run unless I

> perceive something a little

> stronger. Either VOC's that happen to ALSO have

> secondary metabolites,

> or just the reaction, even if I don't smell

> anything.

> -

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[Guest guest]

Hi Leigh, Well they shouldn't. One test for mold

to see which room may have problem is to shut all

rooms off for awhile. When you open them, if one

of them smells, that is where problem is, or

adjacent to there. I have done this and most

rooms smell fine after being shut for awhile but

I do keep humidity low in my house for the last

year or more due to previous problems. I have

one room that is stinky and I keep it shut. I

put a mask on if I have to go in there for

anything and can even smell it through mask. It

has crack in ceiling and attic above has mold

problem, so VOCs coming down from there I'm sure.

I'm going to work on attic first before

repairing crack in ceiling just so I can test the

theory. If attic mold problem is fixed, will

bedroom again smell okay? If it doesn, problem

was found and fixed and I will repair crack in

ceiling.

--- Leigh McCall-Alton <mccallalton@...>

wrote:

> I have a theory about closed off rooms--they

> harbor humidity and mold blooms.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Actually, that can be true, but just as common is a situation where a

home is much dryer when its unoccupied. People transpire a lot of

water. Their activities also genaret water. (cooking, bathing, etc.

Even sweat.) Another example, because of leaky plumbing (that has to

be used to leak) or simply because the way the walls handle vapor

from, say, people taking showers situations change.

Basically, never trust that a moldy building has been 'fixed' unless

you have lived there and verified this for yourself over a period of

time.. Expensive root causes must also be fixed. It could take a long

time to tell that. Chances are that there are things you don't know

that others do.. They won't tell you..Count on that..

If a shower has been built without a proper vapor barrier, the insides

of walls behind it might be moldy when it has been used normally, but

if the house is closed up for a month or two, its possible that that

mold might not be detectable unless you break into the wall.

Also, wind conditions and especially, the temperature/relative

humidity and weather such as sunlight interact to support a steady

updraft at certain times.. (the stack effect) if that is carrying mold

from say, a basement upward, the situation might be much worse at some

times than others..

All in all, I'd say that unoccupied buildings often sustain water

intrusion that isn't fixed because nobody catches it in time, but

occupied buildings also get used in ways that can reveal problems in

ways that don't happen when nobody is LIVING there..

[Guest guest]

I don't trust a house which is unoccupied because usually people turn off their

heat and ac and that makes a house smell musty. Leigh

LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

Actually, that can be true, but just as common is a situation where a

home is much dryer when its unoccupied. People transpire a lot of

water. Their activities also genaret water. (cooking, bathing, etc.

Even sweat.) Another example, because of leaky plumbing (that has to

be used to leak) or simply because the way the walls handle vapor

from, say, people taking showers situations change.

Basically, never trust that a moldy building has been 'fixed' unless

you have lived there and verified this for yourself over a period of

time.. Expensive root causes must also be fixed. It could take a long

time to tell that. Chances are that there are things you don't know

that others do.. They won't tell you..Count on that..

If a shower has been built without a proper vapor barrier, the insides

of walls behind it might be moldy when it has been used normally, but

if the house is closed up for a month or two, its possible that that

mold might not be detectable unless you break into the wall.

Also, wind conditions and especially, the temperature/relative

humidity and weather such as sunlight interact to support a steady

updraft at certain times.. (the stack effect) if that is carrying mold

from say, a basement upward, the situation might be much worse at some

times than others..

All in all, I'd say that unoccupied buildings often sustain water

intrusion that isn't fixed because nobody catches it in time, but

occupied buildings also get used in ways that can reveal problems in

ways that don't happen when nobody is LIVING there..

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[Guest guest]

The only way could live in it for awhile is see

if seller would be willing to rent it for awhile.

If they are desperate due to lack of interest

(since it is a buyers market now I've heard),

then maybe they will. But I would think most

people are not interested in renters. I could be

wrong. It might be better than having an empty

house and they have a person there to 'show'

house to prospective buyers. Who knows? I guess

you'd just have to ask. It would be great test

though.

> LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

>> Basically, never trust that a moldy building

> has been 'fixed' unless

> you have lived there and verified this for

> yourself over a period of

> time.. Expensive root causes must also be

> fixed. It could take a long

> time to tell that. Chances are that there are

> things you don't know

> that others do.. They won't tell you..Count on

> that..

>

>

[Guest guest]

If nobody is living there, is it really too much of a mental jump

to realize that its possible its unlivable? I think that a lot of

houses that had been abandoned or occupied by people who did not

maintain their property are going on the market now, and this is a

recipe for disaster.

I would be very leery about buying any house that was not actually

being lived in.

Well, I guess I am just wishing out loud, as this would never happen

in America, but seriously... there really SHOULD be a law allowing

buyers to back out of a home sale if they discover problems in, say

the first month of occupation.

Kind of like the 'lemon law' for cars.. you know what I mean?

It really does take longer than that, to know the situation,

especially in areas that have a rainy season, like California, but I

suspect that one month would be the longest amount of time that could

go over politically.

There just are too many instances of people buying homes and then,

slowly - or quickly - finding out that they are mold nightmares, and

they are then stuck with them...

When people's life savings are at stake, they don't get a second

chance at this..

On 8/4/06, bbw <barb1283@...> wrote:

> The only way could live in it for awhile is see

> if seller would be willing to rent it for awhile.

> If they are desperate due to lack of interest

> (since it is a buyers market now I've heard),

> then maybe they will. But I would think most

> people are not interested in renters. I could be

> wrong. It might be better than having an empty

> house and they have a person there to 'show'

> house to prospective buyers. Who knows? I guess

> you'd just have to ask. It would be great test

> though.

>

> > LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

> >> Basically, never trust that a moldy building

> > has been 'fixed' unless

> > you have lived there and verified this for

> > yourself over a period of

> > time.. Expensive root causes must also be

> > fixed. It could take a long

> > time to tell that. Chances are that there are

> > things you don't know

> > that others do.. They won't tell you..Count on

> > that..

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

> FAIR USE NOTICE:

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

You are so right about that.

bbw <barb1283@...> wrote: The only way

could live in it for awhile is see

if seller would be willing to rent it for awhile.

If they are desperate due to lack of interest

(since it is a buyers market now I've heard),

then maybe they will. But I would think most

people are not interested in renters. I could be

wrong. It might be better than having an empty

house and they have a person there to 'show'

house to prospective buyers. Who knows? I guess

you'd just have to ask. It would be great test

though.

> LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

>> Basically, never trust that a moldy building

> has been 'fixed' unless

> you have lived there and verified this for

> yourself over a period of

> time.. Expensive root causes must also be

> fixed. It could take a long

> time to tell that. Chances are that there are

> things you don't know

> that others do.. They won't tell you..Count on

> that..

>

>

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