Re: Sick building syndrome: why do some doctor's not want to put this for diagnosis

[Guest guest]

Welcome to " Our World " Darlene! Unfortunately, it's

not a very nice place.

I just finished reading your post, and was not shocked

or surprised by anything you wrote, because I've been

there, and I think I'd be correct in saying, just

about everyone in this group has been there.

I can't even begin to count how many times my doctor

has told me I had a " URI " Upper Respiratory Infection,

or Sinusitis, or Rhinitis, since I moved into this

mold-infested building.

And when it comes to the Health Department, or the

local Code Enforcement Office, forget it, they don't

care. In fact, when the Health Dept. came to my apt.

not too long ago, the woman told me, if she can't see

the mold, then as far as she is concerned, there isn't

any. And when I asked her to take samples and send to

a lab, she told me, she couldn't do that, because the

Health Dept. didn't have a lab to send them to.

My best advice to you is, if you can move, get out of

there as quickly as possible, because if there is mold

in there, the longer you stay, the sicker you will

get.

And I definitely would not allow a doctor to operate

on me, if they told me they couldn't send a specimen

to a lab to be tested. Did she give you a reason why

she wouldn't be able to send it?

As far as a doctor in your immediate area, I don't

know of any, but hopefully someone else in the group

will be able to help you with that.

Take care, and good luck.

Barb E.

--- darlenesb2000 <darlenesb2000@...> wrote:

> I started getting sick in Feb. 2006 with what I had

> thought to be a

> cold. It being winter time, this is what I blamed

> my symptoms on.

> Well I let it go and symptoms seemed to be getting

> worse, March went

> by, now April was upon us and I was still very sick.

> I had called the

> doctor's office to be seen. While at the doctor's I

> had explained

> that I suspected now the cold that I had thought I

> had with continuous

> headaches, fatigue, horseness in my throat (which

> felt like someone

> was choking me all the time), the only thing that

> was coming out of my

> nose occassionally a little blood,fatigue like I

> hadn't experienced

> before, sweats all the time, not just at night, eyes

> burn and

> redness,ect.,ect, and just never ending symptoms

> that were getting

> worse. I had explained to my doctor that I knew

> that the apartment

> building was full of mold,because that is all I had

> heard about right

> after I had moved in. I told him that yes I did

> suspect mold to be in

> my apartment, and had explained about water leaks,

> and spots that I

> thought to be mold in my apartment.

> So he started questioning, sick building syndrome in

> which I had

> suspected this was the case before I had seen him.

> I had been going

> over and over in my mind, while I lay awake at night

> listening to my

> heating system go on and off, and wandered if there

> were toxic mold in

> the ducts. Well after I had seen the doctor, he was

> referring me to

> an allergist. I then had talked to one of my sons,

> and he decided to

> get my apartment tested for mold by a mycologist. We

> did have the

> testing done, and our suspicions were correct.

> Toxic molds and

> deteriorating fiberglass lining in the air handling

> system, both the

> return and supply ducts. Allergy testing turned up

> negative results

> for all molds, inside and out, and all other

> allergens. So then some

> doctors were saying i had chronic rhinitis or

> allergic rhinitis or

> upper respiratory illenss, diagnosis are all over

> the place. Now it

> is from an ENT expert, nasal mucus membranes all

> swollen from an

> allergy or irritant, so what is it i asked. Sinus

> cat scan and all.

> Well she couldn't tell me what had caused this to

> happen and all of a

> sudden is talking surgery. She wants me to be on

> medication for 4

> weeks, see her again and talk surgery. I asked her

> if she it was

> possible to send samples to pathology for testing if

> I had decided to

> have the surgery so we would know what had caused

> this, she told me it

> would be impossible to do that. So now where am I,

> a doctor wanting

> me to have nose surgery, and not know what the true

> cause is for the

> illness. She couldnt answer my questions, after I

> started talking

> sick building syndrome, and telling her about the

> toxic molds and

> fiberglass in the ducts. So does anyone out there

> know of any doctor

> that will diagnose sick building syndrome, when it

> is really sick

> building syndrome. I am almost 50, and never had

> this problem my

> whole life up until this past February and

> everything points to sick

> building syndrome. If there is any hope in

> Worcester Mass, for a

> doctor being able to diagnose this, and able to put

> this in writing, I

> would like their name because they would probably be

> the first in this

> county to state this is the cause on paper. If i

> dont get answers

> soon, my next step would be contacting the attorney

> generals office,

> because the local board of health did not seem to

> concerned with the

> mycology report that I gave to them and they didn't

> inspect my air

> handling system while they were here. Does anyone

> have any help out

> there with this illness, and who to turn to. I am

> at a loss, and very

> sick. One other question, while a primary care

> physician can put on

> your medical record time after time he is

> questioning sick building

> syndrome, why doesnt the others take the time to

> listen to what is

> happening to me, and take the time for this. It is

> like I had three

> heads, when talking to and seeing some of these

> doctor's. What is

> happening here?

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Barbara < wrote:

>

> Welcome to " Our World " Darlene! Unfortunately, it's

> not a very nice place.

> My best advice to you is, if you can move, get out of

> there as quickly as possible, because if there is mold

> in there, the longer you stay, the sicker you will

> get.

Don't let Darlene get away without describing easy it is to take the

illness with you by bringing contaminated possessions along when you

move.

Terrible when people have to move three or four times because they

didn't know this the first time.

-

[Guest guest]

Would it be too strong to say that there are 'powers that be' that

literally ATTACK doctors and other health professionals who make the

connection between mold, mycotoxins and illness in humans (even though

the connection has been established clearly in animals- because that

is not a political minefield, I guess.)

The situation was different in the 1990s, but the last few years have

seen the politicization of every aspect of science, particularly

ANYTHING having to do with the environment. It's a war, and mold is a

good example of how real, human peoples interests are at the bottom of

the priority list for many in Washington. (I guess we don't 'pay their

bills', so we don't deserve access? But corporations clearly do.)

Please, everyone, VOTE...

Let your representatives know that MOLD IS AN IMPORTANT ISSUE...

[Guest guest]

LiveSimply wrote:

Would it be too strong to say that there are 'powers that be' that

literally ATTACK doctors and other health professionals who make the

connection between mold, mycotoxins and illness in humans (even

though the connection has been established clearly in animals-

because that is not a political minefield, I guess.)

> The situation was different in the 1990s, ...

Perhaps you've heard of how bitterly doctors attacked CFS in the

book " Osler's Web " .

This didn't emanate as a policy from the political establishement

and work it's way down to doctors at first. It was the other way

around. Other than Dr Cheney and Dr , the " fellows "

and " colleagues " of medicine sent their denial of CFS right up to

the CDC - who responded as if taking a poll, rather than assessing

the facts.

Doctors, as an entire profession, went out of their way to attack

and suppress anyone who was complaining of something that was

outside of their conceptual model.

Their battle cry is " YOU CAN'T PROVE IT " , and cite lack of " peer

reviewed evidence " as " proof " that whatever it is that you are

claiming cannot be substantiated and needs no research.

Barry Marshall and Robin Warrens H Pylori debacle is a terrific

representative of a mental process that the medical profession

passes off as an aberration that could never happen again.

When the reality is that this level of " scientific skepticism " is

applied virtually every time to any novel concept: " We are FAR too

scientific to be fooled by your ancecdotal evidence, no matter HOW

many times you reproduce it " .

When Dr Cheney asked me to volunteer to be in the CDC study group

to define the emerging illness that came to be called " CFS " in the

original Holmes et al definition, at that very moment I was telling

him about the mold. That was back in 1988. I volunteered thinking

that this would force doctors to look into my mold complaints.

Until Dr Shoemaker, this never happened.

I was able to observe an incredible dynamic of obliviousness in

which sufferers and doctors fed their skepticism back to each other

in an endless loop of negative reinforcement. I led sufferers into

mold exposures, only to have them later return and say " I thought

you were really onto something, because I could feel it myself. But

my doctor told me this is impossible, so I guess that mold cannot be

the problem " .

The basis for denial goes beyond political motivations.

It is a fundamental epistemological problem.

-

[Guest guest]

your right about that eric, and how did we ever get to the point of

placeing so much trust in doctors, when they only spend a average of

seven minutes with each patient, and I wonder how many spend their

free time researching to keep up with the latest scientific finds or

are out golfing instead. Im not putting down all doctors but I cant

help but fell that my own family doctor has never learned how to

reconize anything beyond the common flu or cold. has no research

abilitys and tottally didn't care enough about me to look into my

complaints, didn't know enough to even recomend me to a specialest.

and was just so lazy that it was easier to just treat me like I was

nuts, because he didn't have time to give a shit about my health. one

thing he could of did was just look back through my file at some

point and notice that many symptoms that he had no answer for and

just take one minute to wonder if something was causeing these

symptoms. for example, dead white blood cells in the urine, he

strugged his shoulders, I researched it and the first thing that came

up was that a doctor should not ignore it because it could mean

kidney failure. to bad I didn't think to do it at the time because i

put all my faith in my doctor, if he didn't know, who would? stupied

thinking on my part, but cant say i was thinking the best at the time

anyway.

> Would it be too strong to say that there are 'powers that be' that

> literally ATTACK doctors and other health professionals who make

the

> connection between mold, mycotoxins and illness in humans (even

> though the connection has been established clearly in animals-

> because that is not a political minefield, I guess.)

> > The situation was different in the 1990s, ...

>

>

> Perhaps you've heard of how bitterly doctors attacked CFS in the

> book " Osler's Web " .

> This didn't emanate as a policy from the political establishement

> and work it's way down to doctors at first. It was the other way

> around. Other than Dr Cheney and Dr , the " fellows "

> and " colleagues " of medicine sent their denial of CFS right up to

> the CDC - who responded as if taking a poll, rather than assessing

> the facts.

> Doctors, as an entire profession, went out of their way to attack

> and suppress anyone who was complaining of something that was

> outside of their conceptual model.

> Their battle cry is " YOU CAN'T PROVE IT " , and cite lack of " peer

> reviewed evidence " as " proof " that whatever it is that you are

> claiming cannot be substantiated and needs no research.

> Barry Marshall and Robin Warrens H Pylori debacle is a terrific

> representative of a mental process that the medical profession

> passes off as an aberration that could never happen again.

> When the reality is that this level of " scientific skepticism " is

> applied virtually every time to any novel concept: " We are FAR too

> scientific to be fooled by your ancecdotal evidence, no matter HOW

> many times you reproduce it " .

>

> When Dr Cheney asked me to volunteer to be in the CDC study group

> to define the emerging illness that came to be called " CFS " in the

> original Holmes et al definition, at that very moment I was telling

> him about the mold. That was back in 1988. I volunteered thinking

> that this would force doctors to look into my mold complaints.

> Until Dr Shoemaker, this never happened.

> I was able to observe an incredible dynamic of obliviousness in

> which sufferers and doctors fed their skepticism back to each other

> in an endless loop of negative reinforcement. I led sufferers into

> mold exposures, only to have them later return and say " I thought

> you were really onto something, because I could feel it myself.

But

> my doctor told me this is impossible, so I guess that mold cannot

be

> the problem " .

> The basis for denial goes beyond political motivations.

> It is a fundamental epistemological problem.

>

> -

>

[Guest guest]

Jeanine, its like that for everyone.

Your situation is not unusual.

Its the way our health care system is structured that is

dysfunctional. And its getting worse all the time.

In five years, your doctor will probably be overseas - seen via the

Internet - or a machine.

Seriously.

[Guest guest]

I know, it just really makes me made to know that he could have helped

me not end up so ill if he would have just took a little time to

care.

>

> Jeanine, its like that for everyone.

> Your situation is not unusual.

>

> Its the way our health care system is structured that is

> dysfunctional. And its getting worse all the time.

>

> In five years, your doctor will probably be overseas - seen via the

> Internet - or a machine.

>

> Seriously.

>

[Guest guest]

> In five years, your doctor will probably be overseas - seen via the

> Internet - or a machine.

That is really scary! I had problems with my laptop a couple of years

ago and of course all customer " support " and technical " support " was

from off-shore phone centers. I thought I was finally going to get

the help I needed after 9 weeks and 3 repair attempts when they

assigned me to " Customer Retention. " Unfortuanely, the true meaning

of that was I was assigned to one and only one person, , in

Turkey, and she was almost never available. It took 2 weeks of

focused effort to break out of that trap! Fortunately it was only a

laptop that was replaceable if worse came to worse.

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

[Guest guest]

Well, I'm not going to worry about it, because

personally, I don't think a doctor overseas could be

any worse than the doctors I've been to lately.

And if I remember correctly, I think surgeons in other

countries have already guided doctors in this country

through an operation/s, via the internet, in the OR.

Seems as though I saw that on TV a while back.

Barb E.

--- LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

> Jeanine, its like that for everyone.

> Your situation is not unusual.

>

> Its the way our health care system is structured

> that is

> dysfunctional. And its getting worse all the time.

>

> In five years, your doctor will probably be overseas

> - seen via the

> Internet - or a machine.

>

> Seriously.

>

>

>

__________________________________________________