Guest guest Posted May 5, 2004 Report Share Posted May 5, 2004 We have been doing neurofeedback with Kirk's office in Austin since October. It is quite a commute from San . We actually purchased the Thought Technology equipment with a special laptop and they trained us to use all of this. They monitor the program we have but we are currently on a break. I will say that this intervention is very delicate and can cause severe regression or harm. You must have someone that is excellent with autism and that knows how to use a QEEG to set up a protocol. Theresa, SA > Have any of you tried or even heard of neurofeedback? What are your > experiences? > > Thanks > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 6, 2004 Report Share Posted May 6, 2004 I know of several kids who have really benefitted from traditional neurofeedback/biofeedback -- the kind that is active, where the person plays games during the process. We have not tried that form yet. My son did about 10 rounds of Flexyx Neurofeedback -- which is a passive form of stimulating the brain. It was a very bad experience for him that took several months to regain his overall balance. Gaylen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2007 Report Share Posted February 21, 2007 I know it's quite expensive. A child in my son's school has been having this therapy for some time and I'm sorry to say( as an outsider who doesn't know the child well I can't see it's made any difference - but then I don't know the child well. > > I saw a fascinating talk on this subject tonight at my university. Incredibly good results in ADHD people. Can anybody here tell me how much they are charged for neurofeedback sessions? > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2007 Report Share Posted February 21, 2007 I know it's quite expensive. A child in my son's school has been having this therapy for some time and I'm sorry to say( as an outsider who doesn't know the child well I can't see it's made any difference - but then I don't know the child well. > > I saw a fascinating talk on this subject tonight at my university. Incredibly good results in ADHD people. Can anybody here tell me how much they are charged for neurofeedback sessions? > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2007 Report Share Posted February 21, 2007 Thanks Margaret for your comments. It's a shame it's not working for him as I have seen a lot of positive reports on Autism-mercury about the method. It's awfully expensive thogh if it doesn't produce results. Best, mcollins2001uk wrote: I know it's quite expensive. A child in my son's school has been having this therapy for some time and I'm sorry to say( as an outsider who doesn't know the child well I can't see it's made any difference - but then I don't know the child well.>> I saw a fascinating talk on this subject tonight at my university. Incredibly good results in ADHD people. Can anybody here tell me how much they are charged for neurofeedback sessions?> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2007 Report Share Posted February 21, 2007 Look at www.brainmaster.comThe equipment is the main cost.Brainmaster state that their equipment is " so easy to use " , that you might be able to teach yourself th equipment. If you are not confident to start experimenting,- some training might be done in courses - or with Neurofeedback providers.One statement from a father:NF was the best investment he`d ever done for his son. ( Not autist, but learning difficulties, develpmentally delayed - approx £ 2 100 a few years ago)Geir Flatabø2007/2/21, JULIE GRIFFITHS < moppett1@...>: Thanks Margaret for your comments. It's a shame it's not working for him as I have seen a lot of positive reports on Autism-mercury about the method. It's awfully expensive thogh if it doesn't produce results. Best, mcollins2001uk < m.collins9@...> wrote: I know it's quite expensive. A child in my son's school has been having this therapy for some time and I'm sorry to say( as an outsider who doesn't know the child well I can't see it's made any difference - but then I don't know the child well.>> I saw a fascinating talk on this subject tonight at my university. Incredibly good results in ADHD people. Can anybody here tell me how much they are charged for neurofeedback sessions?> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2007 Report Share Posted February 21, 2007 Thanks Geir. This looks very interesting. They have a machine for commercial purposes in my department. I think I'm going to try this on my daughter and my husband. Re: Re: neurofeedback Look at www.brainmaster.comThe equipment is the main cost.Brainmaster state that their equipment is "so easy to use", that you might be able to teach yourself th equipment. If you are not confident to start experimenting,- some training might be done in courses - or with Neurofeedback providers.One statement from a father:NF was the best investment he`d ever done for his son. ( Not autist, but learning difficulties, develpmentally delayed - approx £ 2 100 a few years ago)Geir Flatabø 2007/2/21, JULIE GRIFFITHS < moppett1btinternet>: Thanks Margaret for your comments. It's a shame it's not working for him as I have seen a lot of positive reports on Autism-mercury about the method. It's awfully expensive thogh if it doesn't produce results. Best, mcollins2001uk < m.collins9ntlworld> wrote: I know it's quite expensive. A child in my son's school has been having this therapy for some time and I'm sorry to say( as an outsider who doesn't know the child well I can't see it's made any difference - but then I don't know the child well.>> I saw a fascinating talk on this subject tonight at my university. Incredibly good results in ADHD people. Can anybody here tell me how much they are charged for neurofeedback sessions?> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2007 Report Share Posted February 21, 2007 Thanks Geir. This looks very interesting. They have a machine for commercial purposes in my department. I think I'm going to try this on my daughter and my husband. Re: Re: neurofeedback Look at www.brainmaster.comThe equipment is the main cost.Brainmaster state that their equipment is "so easy to use", that you might be able to teach yourself th equipment. If you are not confident to start experimenting,- some training might be done in courses - or with Neurofeedback providers.One statement from a father:NF was the best investment he`d ever done for his son. ( Not autist, but learning difficulties, develpmentally delayed - approx £ 2 100 a few years ago)Geir Flatabø 2007/2/21, JULIE GRIFFITHS < moppett1btinternet>: Thanks Margaret for your comments. It's a shame it's not working for him as I have seen a lot of positive reports on Autism-mercury about the method. It's awfully expensive thogh if it doesn't produce results. Best, mcollins2001uk < m.collins9ntlworld> wrote: I know it's quite expensive. A child in my son's school has been having this therapy for some time and I'm sorry to say( as an outsider who doesn't know the child well I can't see it's made any difference - but then I don't know the child well.>> I saw a fascinating talk on this subject tonight at my university. Incredibly good results in ADHD people. Can anybody here tell me how much they are charged for neurofeedback sessions?> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2007 Report Share Posted February 21, 2007 There aren't many practitioners in the UK, unfortunately. Among them are Beverley Steffert and Foks. both of whom specialise in ADHD I think. Hi there do you know where these people are based. Thnaks LUV caroline xxx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2007 Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 Hi , I too think NFB has a lot of potential...... but there are arguments as to the placing of electrodes. Some practitioners say if doesn't matter where they're placed; others argue strongly that location matters, especially in autism. A couple of useful groups are autism-nf and , which helps both professionals and home trainers. You might like to take a look at the work of Mark Darling in Australia too There aren't many practitioners in the UK, unfortunately. Among them are Beverley Steffert and Foks. both of whom specialise in ADHD I think. Best wishes PatienceJULIE GRIFFITHS wrote: Thanks Geir. This looks very interesting. They have a machine for commercial purposes in my department. I think I'm going to try this on my daughter and my husband. Re: Re: neurofeedback Look at www.brainmaster.comThe equipment is the main cost.Brainmaster state that their equipment is "so easy to use", that you might be able to teach yourself th equipment. If you are not confident to start experimenting,- some training might be done in courses - or with Neurofeedback providers.One statement from a father:NF was the best investment he`d ever done for his son. ( Not autist, but learning difficulties, develpmentally delayed - approx £ 2 100 a few years ago)Geir Flatabø 2007/2/21, JULIE GRIFFITHS < moppett1btinternet>: Thanks Margaret for your comments. It's a shame it's not working for him as I have seen a lot of positive reports on Autism-mercury about the method. It's awfully expensive thogh if it doesn't produce results. Best, mcollins2001uk < m.collins9ntlworld> wrote: I know it's quite expensive. A child in my son's school has been having this therapy for some time and I'm sorry to say( as an outsider who doesn't know the child well I can't see it's made any difference - but then I don't know the child well.>> I saw a fascinating talk on this subject tonight at my university. Incredibly good results in ADHD people. Can anybody here tell me how much they are charged for neurofeedback sessions?> > > The all-new goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2007 Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 Thanks Patience! It all looks quite interesting. Co-incidentally, it looks as if my favourite Omega3s have a similar effect on the alpha/theta brain waves. Best, Re: Re: neurofeedback Look at www.brainmaster.comThe equipment is the main cost.Brainmaster state that their equipment is "so easy to use", that you might be able to teach yourself th equipment. If you are not confident to start experimenting,- some training might be done in courses - or with Neurofeedback providers.One statement from a father:NF was the best investment he`d ever done for his son. ( Not autist, but learning difficulties, develpmentally delayed - approx £ 2 100 a few years ago)Geir Flatabø 2007/2/21, JULIE GRIFFITHS < moppett1btinternet>: Thanks Margaret for your comments. It's a shame it's not working for him as I have seen a lot of positive reports on Autism-mercury about the method. It's awfully expensive thogh if it doesn't produce results. Best, mcollins2001uk < m.collins9ntlworld> wrote: I know it's quite expensive. A child in my son's school has been having this therapy for some time and I'm sorry to say( as an outsider who doesn't know the child well I can't see it's made any difference - but then I don't know the child well.>> I saw a fascinating talk on this subject tonight at my university. Incredibly good results in ADHD people. Can anybody here tell me how much they are charged for neurofeedback sessions?> > > The all-new goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2007 Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 Hi , Please let us know what you think please - this is something Tim and I might be able to investigate (as a work project). Best wishes, Sandy > > > > I saw a fascinating talk on this subject tonight at my university. > Incredibly good results in ADHD people. Can anybody here tell me how > much they are charged for neurofeedback sessions? > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2007 Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 thank you for this patience, luv carolinexx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2007 Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 thank you for this patience, luv carolinexx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2007 Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 Hi Caroline, Beverley Steffert is in Cambridge. Male of same surname ( husband? son?) has done NFB work with musicians at Imperial College, London. Foks is in London and I feel sure there is someone on Harley Street, but the potential cost held me back from even investigating further! HTH PatienceCarolineTraa@... wrote: In a message dated 22/02/2007 10:41:21 GMT Standard Time, onthesosh (DOT) co.uk writes: There aren't many practitioners in the UK, unfortunately. Among them are Beverley Steffert and Foks. both of whom specialise in ADHD I think. Hi there do you know where these people are based. Thnaks LUV caroline xxx What kind of emailer are you? Find out today - get a free analysis of your email personality. Take the quiz at the Championship. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2007 Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 Sandy, I saw enough of the lecture to tell you that I am intrigued by this. Look up "Gruzelier" on pubmed or maybe he has a website at UCL (London) for more information. And... I have a really good idea for a work project leading to a really good journal article. Maybe we can collaborate. Give me a moment to think about the design. What I have in mind would be right up your street. Re: neurofeedback Hi ,Please let us know what you think please - this is something Tim and Imight be able to investigate (as a work project).Best wishes,Sandy> >> > I saw a fascinating talk on this subject tonight at myuniversity. > Incredibly good results in ADHD people. Can anybody here tellme how > much they are charged for neurofeedback sessions?> > > > > >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2007 Report Share Posted February 22, 2007 I thought he was based at Goldsmiths college in New Cross. He had a small exhibition about his work with musicians in the Science Museum. I emailed him at Goldsmiths but he did not reply. Maybe I have some fundamentally wrong info. Sally JULIE GRIFFITHS wrote: Sandy, I saw enough of the lecture to tell you that I am intrigued by this. Look up "Gruzelier" on pubmed or maybe he has a website at UCL (London) for more information. And... I have a really good idea for a work project leading to a really good journal article. Maybe we can collaborate. Give me a moment to think about the design. What I have in mind would be right up your street. Re: neurofeedback Hi , Please let us know what you think please - this is something Tim and I might be able to investigate (as a work project). Best wishes, Sandy > > > > I saw a fascinating talk on this subject tonight at my university. > Incredibly good results in ADHD people. Can anybody here tell me how > much they are charged for neurofeedback sessions? > > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.441 / Virus Database: 268.18.3/696 - Release Date: 21/02/2007 15:19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 Eva, Yes, I think you're right. It's Goldsmith. Sorry about the confusion. Re: neurofeedback Hi ,Please let us know what you think please - this is something Tim and Imight be able to investigate (as a work project).Best wishes,Sandy> >> > I saw a fascinating talk on this subject tonight at myuniversity. > Incredibly good results in ADHD people. Can anybody here tellme how > much they are charged for neurofeedback sessions?> > > > > >> No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.441 / Virus Database: 268.18.3/696 - Release Date: 21/02/2007 15:19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 Good Afternoon, Is there anyone out there who bills the 90876 and gets paid by insurance companies? Thanks Barbara Prater CPC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 Barbara,It is not the code that is billed that is important but the service that is provided under that code. Several companies have told me that 90876 is a reimbursable code, but also say they do not cover NFB. I bill this but the only payor that accepts the code for NFB is the State Medical Assistance program. (MN)On Oct 13, 2011, at 2:04 PM, Barbara Prater wrote:Good Afternoon, Is there anyone out there who bills the 90876 and gets paid by insurance companies?ThanksBarbara Prater CPC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 ,Could you pls explain a bit further... Are you saying, that the 'several companies' will reimburse for 'talk therapy face to face with peripheral biofeedback', but not if it is talk with Neurofeedback? Tx. Sitar On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 4:34 PM, <gmartin@...> wrote:  Barbara,It is not the code that is billed that is important but the service that is provided under that code.  Several companies have told me that 90876 is a reimbursable code, but also say they do not cover NFB.  I bill this but the only payor that accepts the code for NFB is the State Medical Assistance program.  (MN)On Oct 13, 2011, at 2:04 PM, Barbara Prater wrote: Good Afternoon, Is there anyone out there who bills the 90876 and gets paid by insurance companies? ThanksBarbara Prater CPC -- ____________________________________________ A. Sitar, PhD, BCNPsychologistBoard Certified in Neurofeedback President-Elect, Mid-Atlantic Society for Biofeedback & Behavioral MedicinePsychotherapy, Biofeedback, and Neurofeedback7910 Woodmont Ave.  Suite 1309Bethesda, MD  20814301.718.3588michaelasitar@... Because e-mail is not a secure form of communication, confidentiality of e-mail messages cannot be guaranteed. If you are not the intended recipient of this message, please be advised that you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, or disseminate any part of or any attachment to this message. If the message has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by replying to this transmission. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 I always ask the company if Biofeedback is covered as 90876. (or any other code) If the answer is yes I always as if Neurofeedback is a covered type of Biofeedback. Most say no. Even though 908.76 is a covered service I do not bill if NFB is not covered. Early on in my NFB career I did bill 908.76 and was reimbursed. Somehow (I think through a conversation with my client about an authorization to go beyond 5 sessions) the HMO heard Neureofeedback. I was sent a letter saying that they would no longer cover the services. I called them to verify and they confirmed that decision. To protect myself and my clients I no longer bill without confirming and do not bill if NFB is not a covered service.On Oct 13, 2011, at 3:41 PM, michael sitar wrote:,Could you pls explain a bit further... Are you saying, that the 'several companies' will reimburse for 'talk therapy face to face with peripheral biofeedback', but not if it is talk with Neurofeedback?Tx. Sitar On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 4:34 PM, <gmartin@...> wrote: Barbara,It is not the code that is billed that is important but the service that is provided under that code. Several companies have told me that 90876 is a reimbursable code, but also say they do not cover NFB. I bill this but the only payor that accepts the code for NFB is the State Medical Assistance program. (MN)On Oct 13, 2011, at 2:04 PM, Barbara Prater wrote:Good Afternoon, Is there anyone out there who bills the 90876 and gets paid by insurance companies?ThanksBarbara Prater CPC-- ____________________________________________ A. Sitar, PhD, BCNPsychologistBoard Certified in NeurofeedbackPresident-Elect, Mid-Atlantic Society for Biofeedback & Behavioral MedicinePsychotherapy, Biofeedback, and Neurofeedback7910 Woodmont Ave. Suite 1309Bethesda, MD 20814301.718.3588michaelasitar@...Because e-mail is not a secure form of communication, confidentiality of e-mail messages cannot be guaranteed. If you are not the intended recipient of this message, please be advised that you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, or disseminate any part of or any attachment to this message. If the message has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by replying to this transmission. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 As I've added in other conversations about this, it's not just about the code and the procedure, it's also about the diagnosis. With the two insurers I work with (United and Oxford (although Oxford was just recently bought by United, so I guess they're the same now -- sort of)) they will cover biofeedback (not including neurofeedback) ONLY for a few conditions, such as panic attacks, hypertension that is not responding well to medication, and all that pelvic floor stuff (that I don't do), and a few others. You can't do a procedure to treat a condition that the insurance company says is not efficacious For That Condition. I think this is an important point to keep in mind if you're going to bill insurance companies. LizOn Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 5:06 PM, <gmartin@...> wrote:  I always ask the company if Biofeedback is covered as 90876. (or any other code)  If the answer is yes I always as if Neurofeedback is a covered type of Biofeedback.  Most say no.  Even though 908.76 is a covered service I do not bill if NFB is not covered.  Early on in my NFB career I did bill 908.76 and was reimbursed.  Somehow (I think through a conversation with my client about an authorization to go beyond 5 sessions) the HMO heard Neureofeedback.  I was sent a letter saying that they would no longer cover the services.  I called them to verify and they confirmed that decision.   To protect myself and my clients I no longer  bill without confirming and do not bill if NFB is not a covered service. On Oct 13, 2011, at 3:41 PM, michael sitar wrote: ,Could you pls explain a bit further... Are you saying, that the 'several companies' will reimburse for 'talk therapy face to face with peripheral biofeedback', but not if it is talk with Neurofeedback? Tx. Sitar On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 4:34 PM,  <gmartin@...> wrote:  Barbara, It is not the code that is billed that is important but the service that is provided under that code.  Several companies have told me that 90876 is a reimbursable code, but also say they do not cover NFB.  I bill this but the only payor that accepts the code for NFB is the State Medical Assistance program.  (MN)On Oct 13, 2011, at 2:04 PM, Barbara Prater wrote: Good Afternoon, Is there anyone out there who bills the 90876 and gets paid by insurance companies?ThanksBarbara Prater CPC -- ____________________________________________ A. Sitar, PhD, BCNPsychologistBoard Certified in NeurofeedbackPresident-Elect, Mid-Atlantic Society for Biofeedback & Behavioral Medicine Psychotherapy, Biofeedback, and Neurofeedback7910 Woodmont Ave.  Suite 1309Bethesda, MD  20814301.718.3588michaelasitar@... Because e-mail is not a secure form of communication, confidentiality of e-mail messages cannot be guaranteed. If you are not the intended recipient of this message, please be advised that you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, or disseminate any part of or any attachment to this message. If the message has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by replying to this transmission. Thank you. -- Margoshes, Ph.D.New York State Licensed Psychologist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 Liz,Absolutely. I forgot to mention it but I always include the diagnosis when inquiring.On Oct 13, 2011, at 4:27 PM, Margoshes wrote:As I've added in other conversations about this, it's not just about the code and the procedure, it's also about the diagnosis. With the two insurers I work with (United and Oxford (although Oxford was just recently bought by United, so I guess they're the same now -- sort of)) they will cover biofeedback (not including neurofeedback) ONLY for a few conditions, such as panic attacks, hypertension that is not responding well to medication, and all that pelvic floor stuff (that I don't do), and a few others. You can't do a procedure to treat a condition that the insurance company says is not efficacious For That Condition. I think this is an important point to keep in mind if you're going to bill insurance companies.LizOn Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 5:06 PM, <gmartin@...> wrote: I always ask the company if Biofeedback is covered as 90876. (or any other code) If the answer is yes I always as if Neurofeedback is a covered type of Biofeedback. Most say no. Even though 908.76 is a covered service I do not bill if NFB is not covered. Early on in my NFB career I did bill 908.76 and was reimbursed. Somehow (I think through a conversation with my client about an authorization to go beyond 5 sessions) the HMO heard Neureofeedback. I was sent a letter saying that they would no longer cover the services. I called them to verify and they confirmed that decision. To protect myself and my clients I no longer bill without confirming and do not bill if NFB is not a covered service.On Oct 13, 2011, at 3:41 PM, michael sitar wrote:,Could you pls explain a bit further... Are you saying, that the 'several companies' will reimburse for 'talk therapy face to face with peripheral biofeedback', but not if it is talk with Neurofeedback?Tx. Sitar On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 4:34 PM, <gmartin@...> wrote: Barbara,It is not the code that is billed that is important but the service that is provided under that code. Several companies have told me that 90876 is a reimbursable code, but also say they do not cover NFB. I bill this but the only payor that accepts the code for NFB is the State Medical Assistance program. (MN)On Oct 13, 2011, at 2:04 PM, Barbara Prater wrote:Good Afternoon, Is there anyone out there who bills the 90876 and gets paid by insurance companies?ThanksBarbara Prater CPC-- ____________________________________________ A. Sitar, PhD, BCNPsychologistBoard Certified in NeurofeedbackPresident-Elect, Mid-Atlantic Society for Biofeedback & Behavioral MedicinePsychotherapy, Biofeedback, and Neurofeedback7910 Woodmont Ave. Suite 1309Bethesda, MD 20814301.718.3588michaelasitar@...Because e-mail is not a secure form of communication, confidentiality of e-mail messages cannot be guaranteed. If you are not the intended recipient of this message, please be advised that you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy, or disseminate any part of or any attachment to this message. If the message has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by replying to this transmission. Thank you. -- Margoshes, Ph.D.New York State Licensed Psychologist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 Thank you everyone for your responses. Good Afternoon, Is there anyone out there who bills the 90876 and gets paid by insurance companies? Thanks Barbara Prater CPC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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