Re: Insurance coverage--now stopped- Need to Vent

[Guest guest]

Hi Diane, Yes, that was my post you referred to, and your present frustration is just another example and verification of what I was talking about. The thing which doesn't make sense to me about it all is the idea that, if neurofeedback truly helps, then you would think it would be in their best financial interests (and what else do they care about?) to finance it. This is logical, because the alternative to doing 20-30 sessions of neurofeedback might well be years of the having to pay for comparatively expensive psychotherapy, as well as paying for years of medicines. Surely that can't be in their best interest, when weighing & comparing the two options. It would be interesting to learn about the way they go about deciding which procedures to cover and which to deny. To me, it would seem to be a matter of rather simple statistical analysis, such as is used by the insurance industry, in general. That's what actuarials are paid to do. As the hackneyed terms goes, "Do the math." I realize there are probably claims made by neurotherapists which might be rather wide-ranging and unsubstantiated, in some cases, but, in several areas, such as ADD, the record seems to be pretty clear: it works. How can they not see this and want to save themselves money? --Ray Cole neuroField ; Neuroguide ; brainm ; ; Lens_User_group From: diane@...Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2012 12:26:50 -0500Subject: Insurance coverage--now stopped- Need to Vent

Since 1997 each insurance carrier one by one has gradually stopped

reimbursing neurofeedback. I was just informed by Aetna last

week, this is the last of all the insurances that were paying ,

that they will no longer cover neurofeedback, because they said

that neurofeedback was experimental. Many years ago, I spoke

at Future Health about marketing neurofeedback about how the

establishment is not aware that most of our equipment is FDA approved and

all the medical trials.

Recently a person question about Neurofeedback and if it is so good why

don't people know about it and why isn't covered by insurance.

Here is my reply.

*******

To answer your question, it is poor marketing.

Period. The Pharmacial Companies have money. I know

personally because I have two patients who work for two major ones and I

know the training, marketing, visits, etc., etc., that they do to

get to hospitals, doctors, and the general populace to know their

products. Prior to my becoming a neuropsychologist and board

certified health psychologist, I was a cost accounting and also taught

marketing at several colleges.

Five years ago, I gave a speech at Future Health on the Marketing of

Neurofeedback. At that time Blue Cross/ Blue Shield and most

of the major health insurance was covering neurofeedback. As of

yesterday, Aetna was the last to cover it now says it is experimental and

will NOT cover Neurofeedback Yet, many of the equipment we

use in Neurofeedback is FDA approved medical devices and there are lots

of clinical trials.

I personally will address this as my cause after I finish my 2nd Edition

of my book on Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury, which

Neurofeedback is a major focus of helping myself to recover and all of my

patients in the last 19 years.

I joke, I'm not just a practitioner, I'm also a client with a stroke and

4 traumatic brain injury. I know Neurofeedback works.

*********

I would hope that those of you who make the equipment, which is FDA

approved and know of the clinical trials would write to the insurance

companies. It is not fair that people who need to use this

type of equipment and can't pay fee for service, are going to be deprived

of treatment.

Thank you for letting me vent.

Diane

Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC

P.O. Box 148

town, MA 01833

Toll Free in US 888.760.8730

Direct Dial 978.352.6349

For information on how to obtain books:

" Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury:

A Guide to Living with the Challenges Associated with Concussion/

Brain Injury"

"Timeless- a novel:

Who Am I? "

Click the link below

<http://

www.drdiane.com

>

Neuroband:

For the Professional and Home User of

Neurofeedback equipment:

Clink the link below

http://www.drdiane.com/products-neuroband-buy.php

Confidentiality:

This electronic message (E-mail) and any files

attached hereto contain confidential, legally

privileged and protected by copyright. If you

are not the intended recipient, dissemination or copying of this

E-mail is prohibited. If you have received this in error,

please notify the sender by telephone 978.352.8269 or replying by

E-mail to info@..., then delete the E-mail completely from your

system.

This E-mail and any attachments have been scanned for viruses, but it is

the responsibility of the recipient to conduct their own security

measures and no responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler,

Ed,D. , LLC d/b/a -Dr. Diane for loss or damage from receipt or use of

this E-mail.

No responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC

d/b/a-Dr. Diane for personal E-mails, or E-mails unconnected with Dr.

Diane Stoler, Ed.D, LLC patients' or client

business.

Dr. Diane ~

Catalyst for Change® - A neuropsychologist who works with

individuals and organizations worldwide, to help them find Solutions

and Resources® to overcome life’s challenges and reach their

goals.

[Guest guest]

Ray, so far, insurance companies have calculated that it IS in their financial interests to deny coverage. If neurofeedback is used for mental health care reasons, then it is far more expensive than many companies' coverage for psychotherapy, simply because many limit visits significantly. And, an increasing number of psychiatrists have stopped participating with insurance companies, meaning that those who want expert guidance for receiving meds are paying out of pocket. I'll grant you that some pharmaceuticals are super expensive, especially over time, but I'd be willing to bet that the numbers still go in favor of denying coverage, simply because many people switch insurance companies fairly regularly.

An orthopedist I saw years ago put the whole issue of insurance coverage in a different light for me. He said that health insurance should be like car insurance. We don't use our car insurance to replace the brakes, rotate the tires, or flush the radiator system; rather, we use it accidents and acts of God like trees falling on our vehicle. Similarly, we'll be better off when most of us consider that maintaining our health is not the purpose for health insurance. When we rely on it for trips to the emergency room, surgeries, and serious illnesses like cancer and not daily maintenance, we may take better care of ourselves and we may revolutionize what it means to maintain our health (which, surprise surprise, may be lifestyle changes and not scripts).

Tamera

[Guest guest]

Dr. ,

I am a certified coder in a Neurologists office that does Neurofeedback. I was given the task several months ago in researching insurances that will pay for Neurofeedback. Like you, I came up with only Aetna at the time but the diagnosis codes that were covered under their plan was not the ones that we use. I too am a firm believer that Neurofeedback does work as I have seen the results on many patients that we see in the office. I am totally blown away that "we" cannot get the insurance companies to recognize this and that we have to bill patients for this treatment, because yes, the office still has to pay it's bills.

Thank you for lettinng me vent

Barbara Prater CPC,CCP

From: Diane Stoler, Ed.D. <diane@...>Subject: Insurance coverage--now stopped- Need to VentneuroField , Neuroguide , brainm , , Lens_User_group Date: Friday, January 27, 2012, 12:26 PM

Since 1997 each insurance carrier one by one has gradually stopped reimbursing neurofeedback. I was just informed by Aetna last week, this is the last of all the insurances that were paying , that they will no longer cover neurofeedback, because they said that neurofeedback was experimental. Many years ago, I spoke at Future Health about marketing neurofeedback about how the establishment is not aware that most of our equipment is FDA approved and all the medical trials.Recently a person question about Neurofeedback and if it is so good why don't people know about it and why isn't covered by insurance.Here is my reply.*******To answer your question, it is poor marketing. Period. The Pharmacial Companies have money. I know personally because I have two patients who work for two major ones and I know the training, marketing, visits, etc., etc.,

that they do to get to hospitals, doctors, and the general populace to know their products. Prior to my becoming a neuropsychologist and board certified health psychologist, I was a cost accounting and also taught marketing at several colleges.Five years ago, I gave a speech at Future Health on the Marketing of Neurofeedback. At that time Blue Cross/ Blue Shield and most of the major health insurance was covering neurofeedback. As of yesterday, Aetna was the last to cover it now says it is experimental and will NOT cover Neurofeedback Yet, many of the equipment we use in Neurofeedback is FDA approved medical devices and there are lots of clinical trials. I personally will address this as my cause after I finish my 2nd Edition of my book on Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury, which Neurofeedback is a major focus of helping myself to recover and all of my patients in the last 19

years.I joke, I'm not just a practitioner, I'm also a client with a stroke and 4 traumatic brain injury. I know Neurofeedback works. *********I would hope that those of you who make the equipment, which is FDA approved and know of the clinical trials would write to the insurance companies. It is not fair that people who need to use this type of equipment and can't pay fee for service, are going to be deprived of treatment.Thank you for letting me vent.Diane

Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC P.O. Box 148town, MA 01833Toll Free in US 888.760.8730Direct Dial 978.352.6349For information on how to obtain books:" Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury: A Guide to Living with the Challenges Associated with Concussion/ Brain Injury" "Timeless- a novel: Who Am I? " Click the link below <http:// www.drdiane.com >Neuroband: For the Professional and Home User of Neurofeedback equipment: Clink the link belowhttp://www.drdiane.com/products-neuroband-buy.phpConfidentiality: This electronic message (E-mail) and any files attached hereto contain confidential, legally privileged and protected by copyright. If you are not the intended recipient, dissemination or copying of this E-mail is prohibited. If you have received this in error, please notify the sender by telephone 978.352.8269 or replying by E-mail to info@..., then delete the E-mail completely from your system. This E-mail and any attachments have been scanned for viruses, but it is the responsibility of the recipient to conduct their own security measures and no responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed,D. , LLC d/b/a -Dr. Diane for loss or damage from receipt or use of this E-mail. No responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC

d/b/a-Dr. Diane for personal E-mails, or E-mails unconnected with Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D, LLC patients' or client business.Dr. Diane ~ Catalyst for Change® - A neuropsychologist who works with individuals and organizations worldwide, to help them find Solutions and Resources® to overcome life’s challenges and reach their goals.

[Guest guest]

Hi Ray,

The Association of applied psychophysiology which is one of Neurofeedback's trade organizations and therefore which would be more likely to review NF studies in a favorable light has not even given NF the designation of "efficacious and specific. So there the experimetal evidence can not support the claim that there is an "it" (NF) that is causing the results. What can be said in terms of experimental support is when NF is part of an intervention, the evidence supports efficacy.

Bruce

From: "Ray Cole" <RayRoshi@...>"Braintrainer Group" < >Sent: Friday, January 27, 2012 5:11:42 PMSubject: RE: Insurance coverage--now stopped- Need to Vent

Hi Diane, Yes, that was my post you referred to, and your present frustration is just another example and verification of what I was talking about. The thing which doesn't make sense to me about it all is the idea that, if neurofeedback truly helps, then you would think it would be in their best financial interests (and what else do they care about?) to finance it. This is logical, because the alternative to doing 20-30 sessions of neurofeedback might well be years of the having to pay for comparatively expensive psychotherapy, as well as paying for years of medicines. Surely that can't be in their best interest, when weighing & comparing the two options. It would be interesting to learn about the way they go about deciding which procedures to cover and which to deny. To me, it would seem to be a matter of rather simple statistical analysis, such as is used by the insurance industry, in general. That's what actuarials are paid to do. As the hackneyed terms goes, "Do the math." I realize there are probably claims made by neurotherapists which might be rather wide-ranging and unsubstantiated, in some cases, but, in several areas, such as ADD, the record seems to be pretty clear: it works. How can they not see this and want to save themselves money? --Ray Cole

neuroField ; Neuroguide ; brainm ; ; Lens_User_group From: diane@...Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2012 12:26:50 -0500Subject: Insurance coverage--now stopped- Need to Vent

Since 1997 each insurance carrier one by one has gradually stopped reimbursing neurofeedback. I was just informed by Aetna last week, this is the last of all the insurances that were paying , that they will no longer cover neurofeedback, because they said that neurofeedback was experimental. Many years ago, I spoke at Future Health about marketing neurofeedback about how the establishment is not aware that most of our equipment is FDA approved and all the medical trials.Recently a person question about Neurofeedback and if it is so good why don't people know about it and why isn't covered by insurance.Here is my reply.*******To answer your question, it is poor marketing. Period. The Pharmacial Companies have money. I know personally because I have two patients who work for two major ones and I know the training, marketing, visits, etc., etc., that they do to get to hospitals, doctors, and the general populace to know their products. Prior to my becoming a neuropsychologist and board certified health psychologist, I was a cost accounting and also taught marketing at several colleges.Five years ago, I gave a speech at Future Health on the Marketing of Neurofeedback. At that time Blue Cross/ Blue Shield and most of the major health insurance was covering neurofeedback. As of yesterday, Aetna was the last to cover it now says it is experimental and will NOT cover Neurofeedback Yet, many of the equipment we use in Neurofeedback is FDA approved medical devices and there are lots of clinical trials. I personally will address this as my cause after I finish my 2nd Edition of my book on Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury, which Neurofeedback is a major focus of helping myself to recover and all of my patients in the last 19 years.I joke, I'm not just a practitioner, I'm also a client with a stroke and 4 traumatic brain injury. I know Neurofeedback works. *********I would hope that those of you who make the equipment, which is FDA approved and know of the clinical trials would write to the insurance companies. It is not fair that people who need to use this type of equipment and can't pay fee for service, are going to be deprived of treatment.Thank you for letting me vent.DianeDr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC P.O. Box 148town, MA 01833Toll Free in US 888.760.8730Direct Dial 978.352.6349For information on how to obtain books:" Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury: A Guide to Living with the Challenges Associated with Concussion/ Brain Injury" "Timeless- a novel: Who Am I? " Click the link below <http:// www.drdiane.com >Neuroband: For the Professional and Home User of Neurofeedback equipment: Clink the link belowhttp://www.drdiane.com/products-neuroband-buy.phpConfidentiality: This electronic message (E-mail) and any files attached hereto contain confidential, legally privileged and protected by copyright. If you are not the intended recipient, dissemination or copying of this E-mail is prohibited. If you have received this in error, please notify the sender by telephone 978.352.8269 or replying by E-mail to info@..., then delete the E-mail completely from your system. This E-mail and any attachments have been scanned for viruses, but it is the responsibility of the recipient to conduct their own security measures and no responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed,D. , LLC d/b/a -Dr. Diane for loss or damage from receipt or use of this E-mail. No responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC d/b/a-Dr. Diane for personal E-mails, or E-mails unconnected with Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D, LLC patients' or client business.Dr. Diane ~ Catalyst for Change® - A neuropsychologist who works with individuals and organizations worldwide, to help them find Solutions and Resources® to overcome life’s challenges and reach their goals.

[Guest guest]

Hi Barbara,

What CPT codes and diagnosis codes did they say they would reimburse your office

for when Neurofeedback was the procedure that would be used?

Did they put this in writing?

What position in the insurance company did the people saying such things have?

I have had people from the claims department of UBH tell me when I asked if

biofeedback was a covered service that it is not. When I asked if psychotherapy

with biofeedback as part of the psychotherapy was covered they said that they

have paid for it if was done within the time span that the psychotherapy was

provided.

I didn't trust the answer as I have known of providers who have battled

insurance companies for fraudulent billing even when they were told to go ahead

and bill 90806 if that was what your were providing and when biofeedback was

part of that.

I keep this topic clear in my old mind by filing it under;

Neurofeedback is not a covered service for any of the diagnosis codes and CPT

codes that I use with my clients by any of the insurance companies my clients

use in massachusetts.

In Massachusetts I am aware of providers that have recieved insurance

reimbursement for QEEG's to guide NF and for NF that was provided under the

billing of a few CPT codes that don't say " biofeedback " . While such providers

may be getting reimbursement from the insurance companies and may have been lead

to believe that the insurance companies are reimbursing them for QEEG's and for

NF, I don't believe they are inspite of what someone on the other end of the

phone from such an isurance company has said.

These insurance companies have brought providers up on charges later down the

line in order to recoup there money

Bruce

>

>

> From: Diane Stoler, Ed.D. <diane@...>

> Subject: Insurance coverage--now stopped- Need to Vent

> neuroField , Neuroguide ,

brainm , ,

Lens_User_group

> Date: Friday, January 27, 2012, 12:26 PM

>

>

>

>  

>

>

>

> Since 1997 each insurance carrier one by one has gradually stopped reimbursing

neurofeedback.   I was just informed by Aetna last week, this is the last of

all the insurances that were paying , that  they will no longer cover

neurofeedback, because they said that neurofeedback was experimental.   Many

years ago, I spoke at Future Health about marketing neurofeedback about how the

establishment is not aware that most of our equipment is FDA approved and all

the medical trials.

>

> Recently a person question about Neurofeedback and if it is so good why don't

people know about it and why isn't covered by insurance.

>

> Here is my reply.

>

> *******

>

> To answer your question, it is poor marketing.  Period.  The Pharmacial

Companies have money.   I know personally because I have two patients who work

for two major ones and I know the training, marketing, visits, etc., etc., 

that they do to get to hospitals, doctors, and the general populace to know

their products.   Prior to my becoming a neuropsychologist and board certified

health psychologist, I was a cost accounting and also taught marketing at

several colleges.

>

> Five years ago, I gave a speech at Future Health on the Marketing of

Neurofeedback.   At that time Blue Cross/ Blue Shield and most of the major

health insurance was covering neurofeedback.  As of yesterday, Aetna was the

last to cover it now says it is experimental and will NOT cover

Neurofeedback   Yet, many of the equipment we use in Neurofeedback is FDA

approved medical devices and there are lots of clinical trials.

>

> I personally will address this as my cause after I finish my 2nd Edition of my

book on Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury, which Neurofeedback is a major

focus of helping myself to recover and all of my patients in the last 19 years.

>

> I joke, I'm not just a practitioner, I'm also a client with a stroke and 4

traumatic brain injury.   I know Neurofeedback works.

>

> *********

>

> I would hope that those of you who make the equipment, which is FDA approved

and know of the clinical trials would write to the insurance companies.   It

is not fair that people who need to use this type of equipment and can't pay fee

for service, are going to be deprived of treatment.

>

>

> Thank you for letting me vent.

>

> Diane

>

>

> Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC

> P.O. Box 148

> town, MA 01833

>

> Toll Free in US  888.760.8730

> Direct Dial     978.352.6349

>

>

> For information on how to obtain books:

>

> " Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury:

> A  Guide to Living with the Challenges Associated with Concussion/ Brain

Injury "

>

> " Timeless- a novel:

> Who Am I? "

>

> Click the link below

> <http:// www.drdiane.com >

>

>

>

>

> Neuroband:  For the Professional and Home User of Neurofeedback equipment:

> Clink the link below

> http://www.drdiane.com/products-neuroband-buy.php

> Confidentiality:

>

> This electronic message (E-mail)  and any files attached hereto contain 

confidential, legally privileged and protected by copyright.  If you are not

the intended recipient, dissemination or copying of this E-mail  is

prohibited.  If you have received this in error, please notify the sender by 

telephone 978.352.8269 or replying by E-mail to info@..., then delete the E-mail

completely from your system.

>

> This E-mail and any attachments have been scanned for viruses, but it is the

responsibility of the recipient to conduct their own security measures and no

responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed,D. , LLC d/b/a -Dr.

Diane for loss or damage from receipt or use of this E-mail. 

>

> No responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC

d/b/a-Dr. Diane for personal E-mails, or E-mails unconnected with Dr. Diane

Stoler, Ed.D, LLC  patients' or client business.

>

> Dr. Diane ~ Catalyst for Change® - A neuropsychologist who works with

individuals and organizations worldwide, to help them find Solutions and

Resources® to overcome life’s challenges and reach their goals.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Barbara,

What CPT codes and diagnosis codes did they say they would reimburse your office

for when Neurofeedback was the procedure that would be used?

Did they put this in writing?

What position in the insurance company did the people saying such things have?

I have had people from the claims department of UBH tell me when I asked if

biofeedback was a covered service that it is not. When I asked if psychotherapy

with biofeedback as part of the psychotherapy was covered they said that they

have paid for it if was done within the time span that the psychotherapy was

provided.

I didn't trust the answer as I have known of providers who have battled

insurance companies for fraudulent billing even when they were told to go ahead

and bill 90806 if that was what your were providing and when biofeedback was

part of that.

I keep this topic clear in my old mind by filing it under;

Neurofeedback is not a covered service for any of the diagnosis codes and CPT

codes that I use with my clients by any of the insurance companies my clients

use in massachusetts.

In Massachusetts I am aware of providers that have recieved insurance

reimbursement for QEEG's to guide NF and for NF that was provided under the

billing of a few CPT codes that don't say " biofeedback " . While such providers

may be getting reimbursement from the insurance companies and may have been lead

to believe that the insurance companies are reimbursing them for QEEG's and for

NF, I don't believe they are inspite of what someone on the other end of the

phone from such an isurance company has said.

These insurance companies have brought providers up on charges later down the

line in order to recoup there money

Bruce

>

>

> From: Diane Stoler, Ed.D. <diane@...>

> Subject: Insurance coverage--now stopped- Need to Vent

> neuroField , Neuroguide ,

brainm , ,

Lens_User_group

> Date: Friday, January 27, 2012, 12:26 PM

>

>

>

>  

>

>

>

> Since 1997 each insurance carrier one by one has gradually stopped reimbursing

neurofeedback.   I was just informed by Aetna last week, this is the last of

all the insurances that were paying , that  they will no longer cover

neurofeedback, because they said that neurofeedback was experimental.   Many

years ago, I spoke at Future Health about marketing neurofeedback about how the

establishment is not aware that most of our equipment is FDA approved and all

the medical trials.

>

> Recently a person question about Neurofeedback and if it is so good why don't

people know about it and why isn't covered by insurance.

>

> Here is my reply.

>

> *******

>

> To answer your question, it is poor marketing.  Period.  The Pharmacial

Companies have money.   I know personally because I have two patients who work

for two major ones and I know the training, marketing, visits, etc., etc., 

that they do to get to hospitals, doctors, and the general populace to know

their products.   Prior to my becoming a neuropsychologist and board certified

health psychologist, I was a cost accounting and also taught marketing at

several colleges.

>

> Five years ago, I gave a speech at Future Health on the Marketing of

Neurofeedback.   At that time Blue Cross/ Blue Shield and most of the major

health insurance was covering neurofeedback.  As of yesterday, Aetna was the

last to cover it now says it is experimental and will NOT cover

Neurofeedback   Yet, many of the equipment we use in Neurofeedback is FDA

approved medical devices and there are lots of clinical trials.

>

> I personally will address this as my cause after I finish my 2nd Edition of my

book on Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury, which Neurofeedback is a major

focus of helping myself to recover and all of my patients in the last 19 years.

>

> I joke, I'm not just a practitioner, I'm also a client with a stroke and 4

traumatic brain injury.   I know Neurofeedback works.

>

> *********

>

> I would hope that those of you who make the equipment, which is FDA approved

and know of the clinical trials would write to the insurance companies.   It

is not fair that people who need to use this type of equipment and can't pay fee

for service, are going to be deprived of treatment.

>

>

> Thank you for letting me vent.

>

> Diane

>

>

> Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC

> P.O. Box 148

> town, MA 01833

>

> Toll Free in US  888.760.8730

> Direct Dial     978.352.6349

>

>

> For information on how to obtain books:

>

> " Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury:

> A  Guide to Living with the Challenges Associated with Concussion/ Brain

Injury "

>

> " Timeless- a novel:

> Who Am I? "

>

> Click the link below

> <http:// www.drdiane.com >

>

>

>

>

> Neuroband:  For the Professional and Home User of Neurofeedback equipment:

> Clink the link below

> http://www.drdiane.com/products-neuroband-buy.php

> Confidentiality:

>

> This electronic message (E-mail)  and any files attached hereto contain 

confidential, legally privileged and protected by copyright.  If you are not

the intended recipient, dissemination or copying of this E-mail  is

prohibited.  If you have received this in error, please notify the sender by 

telephone 978.352.8269 or replying by E-mail to info@..., then delete the E-mail

completely from your system.

>

> This E-mail and any attachments have been scanned for viruses, but it is the

responsibility of the recipient to conduct their own security measures and no

responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed,D. , LLC d/b/a -Dr.

Diane for loss or damage from receipt or use of this E-mail. 

>

> No responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC

d/b/a-Dr. Diane for personal E-mails, or E-mails unconnected with Dr. Diane

Stoler, Ed.D, LLC  patients' or client business.

>

> Dr. Diane ~ Catalyst for Change® - A neuropsychologist who works with

individuals and organizations worldwide, to help them find Solutions and

Resources® to overcome life’s challenges and reach their goals.

>

[Guest guest]

Bruce,

90876 aetna will pay but for adhd or anxiety.

From: thor432001 <MindFitness@...>Subject: Re: Insurance coverage--now stopped- Need to Vent Date: Saturday, January 28, 2012, 11:10 AM

Hi Barbara,What CPT codes and diagnosis codes did they say they would reimburse your office for when Neurofeedback was the procedure that would be used?Did they put this in writing?What position in the insurance company did the people saying such things have?I have had people from the claims department of UBH tell me when I asked if biofeedback was a covered service that it is not. When I asked if psychotherapy with biofeedback as part of the psychotherapy was covered they said that they have paid for it if was done within the time span that the psychotherapy was provided.I didn't trust the answer as I have known of providers who have battled insurance companies for fraudulent billing even when they were told to go ahead and bill 90806 if that was what your were providing and when biofeedback was part of that.I keep this topic clear in my old mind by filing it under;Neurofeedback is not a

covered service for any of the diagnosis codes and CPT codes that I use with my clients by any of the insurance companies my clients use in massachusetts. In Massachusetts I am aware of providers that have recieved insurance reimbursement for QEEG's to guide NF and for NF that was provided under the billing of a few CPT codes that don't say "biofeedback". While such providers may be getting reimbursement from the insurance companies and may have been lead to believe that the insurance companies are reimbursing them for QEEG's and for NF, I don't believe they are inspite of what someone on the other end of the phone from such an isurance company has said.These insurance companies have brought providers up on charges later down the line in order to recoup there moneyBruce> > > From: Diane Stoler, Ed.D. <diane@...>> Subject: Insurance coverage--now stopped- Need to Vent> neuroField , Neuroguide , brainm , , Lens_User_group > Date: Friday, January 27, 2012, 12:26 PM> > > >  > > > > Since 1997 each insurance carrier one by one has gradually stopped reimbursing neurofeedback.  I was just informed by Aetna last week, this is the last of all the insurances that were paying , that they will no longer cover neurofeedback, because they said that neurofeedback was experimental.  Many years ago, I spoke at Future Health about marketing neurofeedback about how the establishment is not aware that most of our equipment is FDA approved and all the medical trials.> > Recently a person question about Neurofeedback and if it is so good why don't people know about it and

why isn't covered by insurance.> > Here is my reply.> > *******> > To answer your question, it is poor marketing. Period. The Pharmacial Companies have money.  I know personally because I have two patients who work for two major ones and I know the training, marketing, visits, etc., etc., that they do to get to hospitals, doctors, and the general populace to know their products.  Prior to my becoming a neuropsychologist and board certified health psychologist, I was a cost accounting and also taught marketing at several colleges.> > Five years ago, I gave a speech at Future Health on the Marketing of Neurofeedback.  At that time Blue Cross/ Blue Shield and most of the major health insurance was covering neurofeedback. As of yesterday, Aetna was the last to cover it now says it is experimental and will NOT cover

Neurofeedback  Yet, many of the equipment we use in Neurofeedback is FDA approved medical devices and there are lots of clinical trials. > > I personally will address this as my cause after I finish my 2nd Edition of my book on Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury, which Neurofeedback is a major focus of helping myself to recover and all of my patients in the last 19 years.> > I joke, I'm not just a practitioner, I'm also a client with a stroke and 4 traumatic brain injury.  I know Neurofeedback works. > > *********> > I would hope that those of you who make the equipment, which is FDA approved and know of the clinical trials would write to the insurance companies.  It is not fair that people who need to use this type of equipment and can't pay fee for service, are going to be deprived of treatment.> > > Thank you for letting me

vent.> > Diane> > > Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC > P.O. Box 148> town, MA 01833> > Toll Free in US 888.760.8730> Direct Dial    978.352.6349> > > For information on how to obtain books:> > " Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury: > A Guide to Living with the Challenges Associated with Concussion/ Brain Injury" > > "Timeless- a novel: > Who Am I? " > > Click the link below > <http:// www.drdiane.com >> > > > > Neuroband: For the Professional and Home User of Neurofeedback equipment: > Clink the link below> http://www.drdiane.com/products-neuroband-buy.php> Confidentiality: >

> This electronic message (E-mail) and any files attached hereto contain confidential, legally privileged and protected by copyright. If you are not the intended recipient, dissemination or copying of this E-mail is prohibited. If you have received this in error, please notify the sender by telephone 978.352.8269 or replying by E-mail to info@..., then delete the E-mail completely from your system. > > This E-mail and any attachments have been scanned for viruses, but it is the responsibility of the recipient to conduct their own security measures and no responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed,D. , LLC d/b/a -Dr. Diane for loss or damage from receipt or use of this E-mail. > > No responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC d/b/a-Dr. Diane for personal E-mails, or E-mails unconnected with Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D,

LLC patients' or client business.> > Dr. Diane ~ Catalyst for Change® - A neuropsychologist who works with individuals and organizations worldwide, to help them find Solutions and Resources® to overcome life’s challenges and reach their goals.>

[Guest guest]

Bruce,

90876 aetna will pay but for adhd or anxiety.

From: thor432001 <MindFitness@...>Subject: Re: Insurance coverage--now stopped- Need to Vent Date: Saturday, January 28, 2012, 11:10 AM

Hi Barbara,What CPT codes and diagnosis codes did they say they would reimburse your office for when Neurofeedback was the procedure that would be used?Did they put this in writing?What position in the insurance company did the people saying such things have?I have had people from the claims department of UBH tell me when I asked if biofeedback was a covered service that it is not. When I asked if psychotherapy with biofeedback as part of the psychotherapy was covered they said that they have paid for it if was done within the time span that the psychotherapy was provided.I didn't trust the answer as I have known of providers who have battled insurance companies for fraudulent billing even when they were told to go ahead and bill 90806 if that was what your were providing and when biofeedback was part of that.I keep this topic clear in my old mind by filing it under;Neurofeedback is not a

covered service for any of the diagnosis codes and CPT codes that I use with my clients by any of the insurance companies my clients use in massachusetts. In Massachusetts I am aware of providers that have recieved insurance reimbursement for QEEG's to guide NF and for NF that was provided under the billing of a few CPT codes that don't say "biofeedback". While such providers may be getting reimbursement from the insurance companies and may have been lead to believe that the insurance companies are reimbursing them for QEEG's and for NF, I don't believe they are inspite of what someone on the other end of the phone from such an isurance company has said.These insurance companies have brought providers up on charges later down the line in order to recoup there moneyBruce> > > From: Diane Stoler, Ed.D. <diane@...>> Subject: Insurance coverage--now stopped- Need to Vent> neuroField , Neuroguide , brainm , , Lens_User_group > Date: Friday, January 27, 2012, 12:26 PM> > > >  > > > > Since 1997 each insurance carrier one by one has gradually stopped reimbursing neurofeedback.  I was just informed by Aetna last week, this is the last of all the insurances that were paying , that they will no longer cover neurofeedback, because they said that neurofeedback was experimental.  Many years ago, I spoke at Future Health about marketing neurofeedback about how the establishment is not aware that most of our equipment is FDA approved and all the medical trials.> > Recently a person question about Neurofeedback and if it is so good why don't people know about it and

why isn't covered by insurance.> > Here is my reply.> > *******> > To answer your question, it is poor marketing. Period. The Pharmacial Companies have money.  I know personally because I have two patients who work for two major ones and I know the training, marketing, visits, etc., etc., that they do to get to hospitals, doctors, and the general populace to know their products.  Prior to my becoming a neuropsychologist and board certified health psychologist, I was a cost accounting and also taught marketing at several colleges.> > Five years ago, I gave a speech at Future Health on the Marketing of Neurofeedback.  At that time Blue Cross/ Blue Shield and most of the major health insurance was covering neurofeedback. As of yesterday, Aetna was the last to cover it now says it is experimental and will NOT cover

Neurofeedback  Yet, many of the equipment we use in Neurofeedback is FDA approved medical devices and there are lots of clinical trials. > > I personally will address this as my cause after I finish my 2nd Edition of my book on Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury, which Neurofeedback is a major focus of helping myself to recover and all of my patients in the last 19 years.> > I joke, I'm not just a practitioner, I'm also a client with a stroke and 4 traumatic brain injury.  I know Neurofeedback works. > > *********> > I would hope that those of you who make the equipment, which is FDA approved and know of the clinical trials would write to the insurance companies.  It is not fair that people who need to use this type of equipment and can't pay fee for service, are going to be deprived of treatment.> > > Thank you for letting me

vent.> > Diane> > > Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC > P.O. Box 148> town, MA 01833> > Toll Free in US 888.760.8730> Direct Dial    978.352.6349> > > For information on how to obtain books:> > " Coping with Mild Traumatic Brain Injury: > A Guide to Living with the Challenges Associated with Concussion/ Brain Injury" > > "Timeless- a novel: > Who Am I? " > > Click the link below > <http:// www.drdiane.com >> > > > > Neuroband: For the Professional and Home User of Neurofeedback equipment: > Clink the link below> http://www.drdiane.com/products-neuroband-buy.php> Confidentiality: >

> This electronic message (E-mail) and any files attached hereto contain confidential, legally privileged and protected by copyright. If you are not the intended recipient, dissemination or copying of this E-mail is prohibited. If you have received this in error, please notify the sender by telephone 978.352.8269 or replying by E-mail to info@..., then delete the E-mail completely from your system. > > This E-mail and any attachments have been scanned for viruses, but it is the responsibility of the recipient to conduct their own security measures and no responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed,D. , LLC d/b/a -Dr. Diane for loss or damage from receipt or use of this E-mail. > > No responsibility is accepted by Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D., LLC d/b/a-Dr. Diane for personal E-mails, or E-mails unconnected with Dr. Diane Stoler, Ed.D,

LLC patients' or client business.> > Dr. Diane ~ Catalyst for Change® - A neuropsychologist who works with individuals and organizations worldwide, to help them find Solutions and Resources® to overcome life’s challenges and reach their goals.>