Re: Prenups WAS: Thinking Deep Thoughts

April 20, 2006

In a message dated 4/20/2006 1:54:46 PM Eastern Standard Time, ravenmagic2003@... writes:

It's not just celebrities that have prenuptial agreements and it isn'ta recent thing either. When my parents married in the late 1940s, my mother was required bylaw (in the province of Quebec) to have a prenuptial agreement inplace prior to the religious ceremony. In it, it not only made clearwhat the obligations were, but what the responsibilities wer as welland included such nuggets as the right for my mother to demand the sumof $10,000 at any time from my father and that he provide that sum of$10,000 with the need to know what the purpose of the request.

It should be a legal requirement for everyone. I would not marry anyone without a prenup. Several years ago there was one lady who was interesting, but when I brought up the subject of prenuptual agreements just in conversation, she was against them. Well, that was that for her.

April 20, 2006

In a message dated 4/20/2006 6:01:21 PM Eastern Standard Time, ravenmagic2003@... writes:

The time to make wise decisions about future divisions of property and accountability and responsibility is when everyone is thinking about what is best for all parties involved, not when everyone is out for blood.Raven

Very true, which is why I want to have a prenup, so any agreements can be reasonable.

April 20, 2006

wrote: " Several years ago there was one lady who was

interesting, but when I brought up the subject of prenuptual

agreements just in conversation, she was against them. Well, that was

that for her. "

The time to make wise decisions about future divisions of property and

accountability and responsibility is when everyone is thinking about

what is best for all parties involved, not when everyone is out for

blood.

Raven

April 21, 2006

Absolutely, and to protect both partners interests, not just the

woman. I believe that when two people set up home even if only one

works that they have both contributed to that home and therefore

neither deserves to be out of pocket or worse still homeless.

The concept that one partner is to 'blame' for the break up to me is

childish, even if the issue is adultery. It takes two to tango as

it were, and if one partner has strayed they hey there must be a

problem in that department.

Kate2

In , VISIGOTH@... wrote:

>

> Very true, which is why I want to have a prenup, so any agreements

can be

> reasonable.

>

April 21, 2006

" It takes two to tango as it were, and if one partner has strayed

they hey there must be a problem in that department. "

I don't fully agree with the above, what if one partner just fancies

having sex with other people? It happens you know, despite having it

at home (perhaps even lots) they may seek it elswhere too.

I think some people treat sex like fast food and just nip out for

some, some may even go to a restraunt a little further away from

home; maybe they have exhausted their local ones.

>

> Absolutely, and to protect both partners interests, not just the

> woman. I believe that when two people set up home even if only one

> works that they have both contributed to that home and therefore

> neither deserves to be out of pocket or worse still homeless.

>

> The concept that one partner is to 'blame' for the break up to me

is

> childish, even if the issue is adultery. It takes two to tango as

> it were, and if one partner has strayed they hey there must be a

> problem in that department.

>

> Kate2

April 21, 2006

Then if a prenup had been made the partner who was feeling 'wronged'

by this behaviour could/should feel in a strong enough position

financially to take off and live the way they choose.

The point I am making is that we are, or should be, all free as human

beings to live how we choose.

Two people who have differing views on sex or any other issue sensibly

should not be together in the first place, but having made that

mistake they should both be able to part without having their wrists

slapped like naughty children or losing all their worldly goods to

their former partner.

Kate2

In , " greebohere "

<julie.stevenson16@...> wrote:

>

> I don't fully agree with the above, what if one partner just fancies

> having sex with other people? It happens you know, despite having it

> at home (perhaps even lots) they may seek it elswhere too.

>

> I think some people treat sex like fast food and just nip out for

> some, some may even go to a restraunt a little further away from

> home; maybe they have exhausted their local ones.

>

April 21, 2006

>

> " It should be a legal requirement for everyone. I would not marry

anyone

> without a prenup. Several years ago there was one lady who was

interesting, but

> when I brought up the subject of prenuptual agreements just in

conversation,

> she was against them. Well, that was that for her. "

I wouldn't get involved with someone who wanted a prenup. I think it

lays a foundation of mistrust from the beginning. Marriage needs to

be built on trust. I do understand that today's world is rocky and

people are selfish and have lost a lot of the understanding of how to

make a marriage work and what it requires, and I also understand the

desire to protect oneself, but I don't think a prenup is the way to

go. I also understand that if I were the one with money I would be

nervous, but I would make sure that the person I was marrying was a

good person. I never thought I would get married again because it's

hard to find someone, but I was sure that if I did, they better be a

good person. (And he is. ) I think the real issue is finding a

good person and the right person for you, which is difficult.

April 21, 2006

I am curious - I have been married once and divorced - I have never re-

married; if it is not too personal how old were you when you married

the second time?

> I wouldn't get involved with someone who wanted a prenup. I think it

> lays a foundation of mistrust from the beginning. Marriage needs to

> be built on trust. I do understand that today's world is rocky and

> people are selfish and have lost a lot of the understanding of how to

> make a marriage work and what it requires, and I also understand the

> desire to protect oneself, but I don't think a prenup is the way to

> go. I also understand that if I were the one with money I would be

> nervous, but I would make sure that the person I was marrying was a

> good person. I never thought I would get married again because it's

> hard to find someone, but I was sure that if I did, they better be a

> good person. (And he is. ) I think the real issue is finding a

> good person and the right person for you, which is difficult.

>

April 21, 2006

I don't agree with the 'takes two to tango' truism, either. I think

it has been accepted as a truth, but is not. All it takes is one

partner to mess up a marriage.

> >

> > Absolutely, and to protect both partners interests, not just the

> > woman. I believe that when two people set up home even if only

one

> > works that they have both contributed to that home and therefore

> > neither deserves to be out of pocket or worse still homeless.

> >

> > The concept that one partner is to 'blame' for the break up to me

> is

> > childish, even if the issue is adultery. It takes two to tango

as

> > it were, and if one partner has strayed they hey there must be a

> > problem in that department.

> >

> > Kate2

>

April 21, 2006

Along these same lines of thought, I was very frank with my husband

to be about where I would draw the line. People will do what they

want to, can't change um'. I let him know for me it was not a huge

deal where he got his " appetite " as long as he ate at home. :~)

Kim

> > >

> > > Absolutely, and to protect both partners interests, not just

the

> > > woman. I believe that when two people set up home even if

only

> one

> > > works that they have both contributed to that home and

therefore

> > > neither deserves to be out of pocket or worse still homeless.

> > >

> > > The concept that one partner is to 'blame' for the break up to

me

> > is

> > > childish, even if the issue is adultery. It takes two to

tango

> as

> > > it were, and if one partner has strayed they hey there must be

a

> > > problem in that department.

> > >

> > > Kate2

> >

>

April 21, 2006

Along these same lines of thought, I was very frank with my husband

to be about where I would draw the line. People will do what they

want to, can't change um'. I let him know for me it was not a huge

deal where he got his " appetite " as long as he ate at home. :~)

Kim

> > >

> > > Absolutely, and to protect both partners interests, not just

the

> > > woman. I believe that when two people set up home even if

only

> one

> > > works that they have both contributed to that home and

therefore

> > > neither deserves to be out of pocket or worse still homeless.

> > >

> > > The concept that one partner is to 'blame' for the break up to

me

> > is

> > > childish, even if the issue is adultery. It takes two to

tango

> as

> > > it were, and if one partner has strayed they hey there must be

a

> > > problem in that department.

> > >

> > > Kate2

> >

>

April 21, 2006

Along these same lines of thought, I was very frank with my husband

to be about where I would draw the line. People will do what they

want to, can't change um'. I let him know for me it was not a huge

deal where he got his " appetite " as long as he ate at home. :~)

Kim

> > >

> > > Absolutely, and to protect both partners interests, not just

the

> > > woman. I believe that when two people set up home even if

only

> one

> > > works that they have both contributed to that home and

therefore

> > > neither deserves to be out of pocket or worse still homeless.

> > >

> > > The concept that one partner is to 'blame' for the break up to

me

> > is

> > > childish, even if the issue is adultery. It takes two to

tango

> as

> > > it were, and if one partner has strayed they hey there must be

a

> > > problem in that department.

> > >

> > > Kate2

> >

>

April 21, 2006

I was married at 20 which was dumb, but I was on my own and couldn't

take care of myself and so married the first person to come along,

practically. Somehow I made it 8 years in that bad marriage (though I

admit it did provide something of a haven for me to be able to grow

and so I could live on my own--who knows what would have happened to

me had I stayed on my own). Then I was single from 28 to 37--got

married at 37, and now I'm 42.

> > I wouldn't get involved with someone who wanted a prenup. I think

it

> > lays a foundation of mistrust from the beginning. Marriage needs

to

> > be built on trust. I do understand that today's world is rocky

and

> > people are selfish and have lost a lot of the understanding of

how to

> > make a marriage work and what it requires, and I also understand

the

> > desire to protect oneself, but I don't think a prenup is the way

to

> > go. I also understand that if I were the one with money I would

be

> > nervous, but I would make sure that the person I was marrying was

a

> > good person. I never thought I would get married again because

it's

> > hard to find someone, but I was sure that if I did, they better

be a

> > good person. (And he is. ) I think the real issue is finding a

> > good person and the right person for you, which is difficult.

> >

>

April 21, 2006

I thought I knew more than I did, at 20. I knew I was somewhat

clueless, but not to the extent that I actually was!

> >

> > I was married at 20 which was dumb, but I was on my own and

couldn't

> > take care of myself and so married the first person to come

along,

> > practically. Somehow I made it 8 years in that bad marriage

(though I

> > admit it did provide something of a haven for me to be able to

grow

> > and so I could live on my own--who knows what would have happened

to

> > me had I stayed on my own). Then I was single from 28 to 37--got

> > married at 37, and now I'm 42.

>

April 21, 2006

I married when I was 18.

Kate2

In , " greebohere "

<julie.stevenson16@...> wrote:

>

> Thanks - I married when I was 21.

>

> >

> > I was married at 20 which was dumb, but I was on my own and

couldn't

> > take care of myself and so married the first person to come

along,

> > practically. Somehow I made it 8 years in that bad marriage

(though I

> > admit it did provide something of a haven for me to be able to

grow

> > and so I could live on my own--who knows what would have

happened to

> > me had I stayed on my own). Then I was single from 28 to 37--got

> > married at 37, and now I'm 42.

>

April 21, 2006

Do you think we married young for similar reasons--our Aspie

difficulty with the world?

> > >

> > > I was married at 20 which was dumb, but I was on my own and

> couldn't

> > > take care of myself and so married the first person to come

> along,

> > > practically. Somehow I made it 8 years in that bad marriage

> (though I

> > > admit it did provide something of a haven for me to be able to

> grow

> > > and so I could live on my own--who knows what would have

> happened to

> > > me had I stayed on my own). Then I was single from 28 to 37--

got

> > > married at 37, and now I'm 42.

> >

>

April 21, 2006

Definately, I knew that I had some kind of difficulty with the

workplace and I was a bit hurt about that but I also was a home

lover/maker with great ambition to climb the housing ladder. I

chose a partner with the same ideals and who also was quiet and shy

and with whom there was a spark between us. After marrying I

withdrew from the social scene that I had always found so painful

and concentrated on homemaking and bringing up a family.

However you can never hide entirely away from socialising, there is

still a point at which, if only for your childrens benefit, you have

to interact with others.

Kate2

In , " mikecarrie01 "

<mikecarrie01@...> wrote:

>

> Do you think we married young for similar reasons--our Aspie

> difficulty with the world?

>

> >

> > I married when I was 18.

> >

> > Kate2

April 21, 2006

wrote: " Marriage needs to be built on trust. I do understand

that today's world is rocky and people are selfish and have lost a

lot of the understanding of how to make a marriage work and what it

requires, and I also understand the desire to protect oneself, but I

don't think a prenup is the way to go. "

While I can respect your point of view, I would like to add

something. Sometimes a prenup is one person's way of saying, with

love, that nothing the other person owns will ever be as important

as that other person is. I know that if I found myself in such a

position where there were more assets on my intended's side than my

own, I would have no difficulty whatsoever signing a prenup. And

love would tell me that the prenup would never be needed ... even if

a 'demand loan' clause existed in it ... because my partner -- like

myself -- would be the sort of person you spoke of, ... a

good person.

Raven

April 21, 2006

I agree that real caring people would ensure that each other were not

left in dire straights, thats the way it should be.

Unfortunately in a lot of cases people become irrational and want to

see their ex partner suffer. Its very sad really.

Kate2

In , " ravenmagic2003 "

<ravenmagic2003@...> wrote:

And

> love would tell me that the prenup would never be needed ... even if

> a 'demand loan' clause existed in it ... because my partner -- like

> myself -- would be the sort of person you spoke of, ... a

> good person.

>

> Raven

>

April 21, 2006

Actually that was a serious statement, my home is a very important

part of my life. I was brought up in quite poor conditions even

though my Grandparents (who brought me up) had their own home there

was not much money left for DIY and home improvements etc. I think

this left me with a strong desire for a nice home of my own.

Kate2

In , " mikecarrie01 "

<mikecarrie01@...> wrote:

>

> >

> > but I also was a home

> > lover/maker with great ambition to climb the housing ladder.

>

> LOL!

>

April 21, 2006

Actually that was a serious statement, my home is a very important

part of my life. I was brought up in quite poor conditions even

though my Grandparents (who brought me up) had their own home there

was not much money left for DIY and home improvements etc. I think

this left me with a strong desire for a nice home of my own.

Kate2

In , " mikecarrie01 "

<mikecarrie01@...> wrote:

>

> >

> > but I also was a home

> > lover/maker with great ambition to climb the housing ladder.

>

> LOL!

>

April 21, 2006

>

> While I can respect your point of view, I would like to add

> something. Sometimes a prenup is one person's way of saying, with

> love, that nothing the other person owns will ever be as important

> as that other person is. I know that if I found myself in such a

> position where there were more assets on my intended's side than my

> own, I would have no difficulty whatsoever signing a prenup. And

> love would tell me that the prenup would never be needed ... even if

> a 'demand loan' clause existed in it ... because my partner -- like

> myself -- would be the sort of person you spoke of, ... a

> good person.

>

If you were the one without the assets suggesting a prenup to protect

the other person, I can see where you would be doing it unselfishly for

the other person's benefit. I'm a little tired so I'm having trouble

seeing exactly what you're saying, especially the line 'that nothing

the other person owns will ever be as important as that other person

is' but I guess if both parties really are fine with a prenup...

>

April 21, 2006