More on Raw Milk and Alvin's Battle

[Guest guest]

Here's how you can help both causes....this from yesterday's entry from the

excellent

blog of local lawyer/advocate, see nathanmhansen.blogspot.com......

State of Minnesota brings criminal charges for distribution of raw milk.

MINNEAPOLIS, MINNESOTA

The state of Minnesota has brought criminal charges against an individual, Alvin

Schlangen, for assisting citizens of Minnesota in lawfully obtaining raw milk.

Raw milk is unpasteurized milk that is legal to obtain and consume in Minnesota

and most of the rest of the world, including Iran, Egypt, Libya and Syria.

Alvin Schlangen is part of a private buying club that obtains raw milk directly

from a farm and distributes it only to other members of this club. He does not

sell raw milk to the general public. Minnesota Statute allows people to obtain

raw milk, however, the authorities in the state of Minnesota interpret this law

to mean that there is no practical legal circumstance under which anyone could

lawfully obtain and consume raw milk.

A copy of the criminal complaint is here.

Alvin Schlangen faces jail time for a legal and beneficial activity - helping

people obtain healthful and good food.

Call Minnesota Department of Agriculture Dave Frederickson at 651-201-6000 and

demand that he stop his prosecution of Alvin Schlangen. Call Minneapolis City

Attorney L. Segal at 612-673-2010 and demand that she stop her cooperation

with the Minnesota Department of Agriculture in these oppressive and ridiculous

charges. Also, contact Governor Mark Dayton at 651-201-3400 and demand that he

stop wasting Minnesota taxpayer dollars on ridiculous prosecutions for legal

activities. Call these people and tell them that you would like your freedom

back.

It's utterly absurd that the US is killing people in countries where persons who

consume raw milk are not prosecuted to bring them freedom. The United States is

becoming known as one of the most oppressive police states on earth. Mr.

Schlangen's criminal trial on his raw milk charges is set for May 14, 2012 in

Minneapolis, Minnesota. He faces 90 days in jail on each of 4 counts for

possessing raw milk.

[Guest guest]

Thanks for bringing this to everyone's attention Will. I think contacting these

officials may be the best thing that everyone can do for Alvin AND to help pass

the Raw Milk Bill which would legalize delivery. I will keep up with this issue

as best I can on my website. Right now, I have an article about 's post

under Activism.

www.optimalhealthconnection.com

You will also hear a little bit more about this tomorrow at the Swap!

Kathy

[Guest guest]

Kathy and Will, I will disagree with your advice about the best thing to do.

While I agree with the positive work to educate our legislators, I believe that

I have a few better ideas about the most important thing to do NOW. First, and

most importantly, we must keep making progress toward a healthy new economy

built around local resources. Freedom Farms Coop was robbed ($5000+ of whlse

value) on March 9th of 2011. We were 60 member families at that time. The

objective was to stop this activity that was allowing families to become

independently healthy. How well did that work out? We are now over 120 families

strong, even with the fear factor of not giving up our farmer to the feds. We

need to continue to support the Hartmann farm, Honeymoon Creamery and every

other local resource. My advice is this. In a world where every stock option is

a considerable risk, gold is likely a good buy, but an investment in your local

food source has incredible potential. Secondly, decide to add your energy to the

collective movement that will push this local, healthy food issue into the

mainstream media. Talk about your options for real food and join the urban

farmers that are lending incredible support to the few farmers that are brazen

enough to allow this kind of pressure to influence (or not) their farm and

family. Join us tomorrow if you can. Support this movement when you can. My

latest blurb about food - Eat twice as good, half as much! Be well, Alvin

>

> Thanks for bringing this to everyone's attention Will.

[Guest guest]

Kathy and Will, I will disagree with your advice about the best thing to do.

While I agree with the positive work to educate our legislators, I believe that

I have a few better ideas about the most important thing to do NOW. First, and

most importantly, we must keep making progress toward a healthy new economy

built around local resources. Freedom Farms Coop was robbed ($5000+ of whlse

value) on March 9th of 2011. We were 60 member families at that time. The

objective was to stop this activity that was allowing families to become

independently healthy. How well did that work out? We are now over 120 families

strong, even with the fear factor of not giving up our farmer to the feds. We

need to continue to support the Hartmann farm, Honeymoon Creamery and every

other local resource. My advice is this. In a world where every stock option is

a considerable risk, gold is likely a good buy, but an investment in your local

food source has incredible potential. Secondly, decide to add your energy to the

collective movement that will push this local, healthy food issue into the

mainstream media. Talk about your options for real food and join the urban

farmers that are lending incredible support to the few farmers that are brazen

enough to allow this kind of pressure to influence (or not) their farm and

family. Join us tomorrow if you can. Support this movement when you can. My

latest blurb about food - Eat twice as good, half as much! Be well, Alvin

>

> Thanks for bringing this to everyone's attention Will.

[Guest guest]

Brainstorming other ways to get attention on the issue.

When the trial comes up in May, will it be public? If so, could we go en

masse,(kids and all), and fill the courtroom, the hallway etc

(respectfully)? And could we alert the media somehow?

Or perhaps as a group request a meeting with the governor, and pack the

meeting room? Show that there really is a critical mass of people who are

serious about this issue.

Something?

On Fri, Feb 10, 2012 at 9:48 AM, holisticminnesota <holistic@...>wrote:

> **

>

>

> Here's how you can help both causes....this from yesterday's entry from

> the excellent

> blog of local lawyer/advocate, see nathanmhansen.blogspot.com......

>

> State of Minnesota brings criminal charges for distribution of raw milk.

> MINNEAPOLIS, MINNESOTA

>

> The state of Minnesota has brought criminal charges against an individual,

> Alvin Schlangen, for assisting citizens of Minnesota in lawfully obtaining

> raw milk. Raw milk is unpasteurized milk that is legal to obtain and

> consume in Minnesota and most of the rest of the world, including Iran,

> Egypt, Libya and Syria.

>

> Alvin Schlangen is part of a private buying club that obtains raw milk

> directly from a farm and distributes it only to other members of this club.

> He does not sell raw milk to the general public. Minnesota Statute allows

> people to obtain raw milk, however, the authorities in the state of

> Minnesota interpret this law to mean that there is no practical legal

> circumstance under which anyone could lawfully obtain and consume raw milk.

>

> A copy of the criminal complaint is here.

>

> Alvin Schlangen faces jail time for a legal and beneficial activity -

> helping people obtain healthful and good food.

>

> Call Minnesota Department of Agriculture Dave Frederickson at 651-201-6000and

demand that he stop his prosecution of Alvin Schlangen. Call

> Minneapolis City Attorney L. Segal at 612-673-2010 and demand that

> she stop her cooperation with the Minnesota Department of Agriculture in

> these oppressive and ridiculous charges. Also, contact Governor Mark Dayton

> at 651-201-3400 and demand that he stop wasting Minnesota taxpayer

> dollars on ridiculous prosecutions for legal activities. Call these people

> and tell them that you would like your freedom back.

>

> It's utterly absurd that the US is killing people in countries where

> persons who consume raw milk are not prosecuted to bring them freedom. The

> United States is becoming known as one of the most oppressive police states

> on earth. Mr. Schlangen's criminal trial on his raw milk charges is set for

> May 14, 2012 in Minneapolis, Minnesota. He faces 90 days in jail on each of

> 4 counts for possessing raw milk.

>

>

>

--

* J. Elias*

The Professor Coach

http://pronunciationcoach.com/

http://pronunciationcoach.wordpress.com/

[Guest guest]

I don't think we are in disagreement. We have to do it all! There is rarely just

one approach to solving a problem, because rarely does the problem have only one

cause..

This is a very complicated issue and the solution will come when we get off of

our duffs and focus on what is important like " where does our food come from? "

and " do we have the right to choose what we eat? "

Remember Henry Kissinger said " If you control the food supply, you control the

people. "

Kathy

>Kathy and Will, I will disagree with your advice about the best thing to do>

[Guest guest]

Kathy, you are absolutely right. All parts of the solution include some effort

from each of us to build a collective effort that can accomplish anything. Your

work at the Capitol and other venues has tremendous value. We really need to

focus on every positive option for gaining momentum as we promote natural health

in this state. IF you want to taste a bit of local farm fare, plan to be part of

this event today. I'll bring Lucky Pig pastured bacon, etc as well as Amish,

100% grass-fed summer butter, as well as our bulk values of raw and expeller

pressed Coconut Oil. This is obviously not local, but comes to us from WFN. We

will be taking orders for spring and summer pork as well as the new order of

South Texas Grapefruit and Oranges that will arrive for next weeks delivery. All

of these items will require a membership in Freedom Farms Coop, but keep in mind

that your commitment to the seasonal connection is only $5. See you today in

Lauderdale. 1982 Walnut Street -from 2 to 5 pm if I have it right. Be well,

Alvin

> We

have to do it all!

[Guest guest]

Lots of parallels between raw milk (and similar farming rights) and other

grassroots legislation such as homeschooling, homebirth midwifery, and the

homecare death and dying act that passed recently in MN.

Every one of these bills (with possible exception of the last one) was up

against major obstacles and high powered lobbying organizations (teachers'

unions and the MN DOE for homeschooling, and AMA and MN DOH in the case of

homebirth). These folks fought a very similar battle and they won.

I'm not personally connected to anyone who pioneered homeschooling legislation

but am with homebirth and death and dying bills. The death and dying movement

used religious rights and environmental concerns (avoiding embalming, etc.).

Homebirth draws the most parallels with raw milk (and other farming issues like

slaughtering/processing on farm - more complicated than raw milk bc it's

federal, not state, and the Dept. of Ag. policy vs. regular statutes).

Here are some of the similarities:

Raw milk is legal to drink, it's the business of selling it that is persecuted.

Homebirth was legal, but the business of being a homebirth MW was not.

Raw milk is attacked by the MN DOH, as was homebirth midwifery.

Raw milk is enjoyed by a relatively small, but vocal, number of folks, as is

homebirth.

Both issues have a controversy that centers on differing interpretations of

health and science.

Both issues have strong opposition with deep pockets from the industry.

The restrictions/persecutions directly affect the ability of the farmer or MW to

practice their trade and make a living.

Yet homebirth midwifery is now legal in MN. It remains illegal in many of our

surrounding states, such as IA, IL, and SD. So that makes the climate in MN all

the more interesting and impressive. The key lies in an interesting tactic used

by a single homebirth MW. She delivered one of my kids and I was intrigued by

her story:

_________

We had tried everything to legalize in MN and we kept getting lobbied against by

a branch of the DOH year after year. Finally, I met with a lawyer who agreed to

cap his fees and suggested a new strategy: a civil lawsuit against the DOH for

infringement of right to practice a trade. My attorney told me that this is the

most successful type of lawsuit, with the plaintiff winning more than 70% of the

time. The DOH balked when we brought this lawsuit to the table and they were

already being sued by a chiropratic organization under a similar claim. They

told us to resubmit our legislation to legalize homebirth midwifery and that

they would not lobby against it. We told them we'd pull the suit and put it in

a safe, ready to file the instant we detected any lobbying. They let our bill

go through, without interference, and it passed - we got legalized homebirth

midwifery in MN.

_________

As she explained it, burden of proof is on the defendant to prove they are *not*

infringing on right of trade. Damages, usually hard to prove in a suit, were

clear in this case - a career's worth of missed income. I haven't spoken with

her attorney so I don't know the technicalities of how he filed but I'm

guessing... Tort Law: Restraint of Trade; and possibly Interference with

Business Relations. Trover might also apply for raw milk farmers, TF Warehouse,

etc. for restoration of seized property. Possibly dairy lobbying organizations

as much as the DOH. Furthermore, her attorney had threatened the DOH with

making this class action... think about if raw milk/potential raw milk farmers

in MN joined force. Her attorney may be available for consultation.

Also keep in mind that targeting legislators to sponsor a raw milk/farming

rights bill who have already supported bills like the above stuff and have a

history of working with grassroots concerns is the way to go, but this is

probably already the strategy?

Farmers in MN need to have their rights restored and this strategy may be worth

checking out. I've been wanting to do more with it for a while, but our family

has had a lot on our plate lately. But I think it's time to get serious about

ending persecution of people like Alvin so I'm putting this out there. Did a

quick google and seems like Schmidt has been batting this idea around a

bit too

http://thebovine.wordpress.com/2010/05/22/collusion-and-restraint-of-trade/

Faith

(who wishes she could have checked out some of Alvin's tasties today)

> We

have to do it all!

>

[Guest guest]

Those are all great ideas! We are in. Just let us know when and where and

whether or not to bring little ones

On Feb 10, 2012, at 9:12 PM, Elias <laura.j.elias@...> wrote:

Brainstorming other ways to get attention on the issue.

When the trial comes up in May, will it be public? If so, could we go en

masse,(kids and all), and fill the courtroom, the hallway etc

(respectfully)? And could we alert the media somehow?

Or perhaps as a group request a meeting with the governor, and pack the

meeting room? Show that there really is a critical mass of

[Guest guest]

So who is the attorney that helped the midwives? Would he be willing to do

something similar for farmers & raw milk? Or could he suggest some other

lawyer who could do this?

On Sat, Feb 11, 2012 at 11:46 PM, bubblingovernow <fhwhelan@...>wrote:

> **

>

>

> Lots of parallels between raw milk (and similar farming rights) and other

> grassroots legislation such as homeschooling, homebirth midwifery, and the

> homecare death and dying act that passed recently in MN.

>

> Every one of these bills (with possible exception of the last one) was up

> against major obstacles and high powered lobbying organizations (teachers'

> unions and the MN DOE for homeschooling, and AMA and MN DOH in the case of

> homebirth). These folks fought a very similar battle and they won.

>

> I'm not personally connected to anyone who pioneered homeschooling

> legislation but am with homebirth and death and dying bills. The death and

> dying movement used religious rights and environmental concerns (avoiding

> embalming, etc.). Homebirth draws the most parallels with raw milk (and

> other farming issues like slaughtering/processing on farm - more

> complicated than raw milk bc it's federal, not state, and the Dept. of Ag.

> policy vs. regular statutes).

>

> Here are some of the similarities:

> Raw milk is legal to drink, it's the business of selling it that is

> persecuted. Homebirth was legal, but the business of being a homebirth MW

> was not.

> Raw milk is attacked by the MN DOH, as was homebirth midwifery.

> Raw milk is enjoyed by a relatively small, but vocal, number of folks, as

> is homebirth.

> Both issues have a controversy that centers on differing interpretations

> of health and science.

> Both issues have strong opposition with deep pockets from the industry.

> The restrictions/persecutions directly affect the ability of the farmer or

> MW to practice their trade and make a living.

>

> Yet homebirth midwifery is now legal in MN. It remains illegal in many of

> our surrounding states, such as IA, IL, and SD. So that makes the climate

> in MN all the more interesting and impressive. The key lies in an

> interesting tactic used by a single homebirth MW. She delivered one of my

> kids and I was intrigued by her story:

> _________

> We had tried everything to legalize in MN and we kept getting lobbied

> against by a branch of the DOH year after year. Finally, I met with a

> lawyer who agreed to cap his fees and suggested a new strategy: a civil

> lawsuit against the DOH for infringement of right to practice a trade. My

> attorney told me that this is the most successful type of lawsuit, with the

> plaintiff winning more than 70% of the time. The DOH balked when we brought

> this lawsuit to the table and they were already being sued by a chiropratic

> organization under a similar claim. They told us to resubmit our

> legislation to legalize homebirth midwifery and that they would not lobby

> against it. We told them we'd pull the suit and put it in a safe, ready to

> file the instant we detected any lobbying. They let our bill go through,

> without interference, and it passed - we got legalized homebirth midwifery

> in MN.

> _________

>

> As she explained it, burden of proof is on the defendant to prove they are

> *not* infringing on right of trade. Damages, usually hard to prove in a

> suit, were clear in this case - a career's worth of missed income. I

> haven't spoken with her attorney so I don't know the technicalities of how

> he filed but I'm guessing... Tort Law: Restraint of Trade; and possibly

> Interference with Business Relations. Trover might also apply for raw milk

> farmers, TF Warehouse, etc. for restoration of seized property. Possibly

> dairy lobbying organizations as much as the DOH. Furthermore, her attorney

> had threatened the DOH with making this class action... think about if raw

> milk/potential raw milk farmers in MN joined force. Her attorney may be

> available for consultation.

>

> Also keep in mind that targeting legislators to sponsor a raw milk/farming

> rights bill who have already supported bills like the above stuff and have

> a history of working with grassroots concerns is the way to go, but this is

> probably already the strategy?

>

> Farmers in MN need to have their rights restored and this strategy may be

> worth checking out. I've been wanting to do more with it for a while, but

> our family has had a lot on our plate lately. But I think it's time to get

> serious about ending persecution of people like Alvin so I'm putting this

> out there. Did a quick google and seems like Schmidt has been

> batting this idea around a bit too

> http://thebovine.wordpress.com/2010/05/22/collusion-and-restraint-of-trade/

>

> Faith

> (who wishes she could have checked out some of Alvin's tasties today)

>

>

>

> > We have to do it all!

> >

>

>

>

--

* J. Elias*

The Professor Coach

http://pronunciationcoach.com/

http://pronunciationcoach.wordpress.com/

[Guest guest]

Thanks Faith! That was some great information and included some things I want to

check into! Do you know when the midwifery bill passed?

Kathy

[Guest guest]

I have a post on my website www.optimalhealthconnection.com about what you can

do NOW if you are outraged about Alvin's situation.

Kathy