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Re: Plugged liver [update]

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Posted
Posted

Saul,

I have been following your directions below, only doing 20 minute

saunas instead of 30 minutes, but I'm running into the same problem.

The (non ozone) steam saunas seemed to clear my mind up noticeably

for a week but now I'm getting the same kind of sore throats, mental

fatigue and other sorts of symptoms. I feel fairly certain that the

cause of this is the that while the sauna is eliminating some toxins

through the skin, it is stirring up more toxins within the body than

it is eliminating. So the liver is being burdened by the saunas. My

first experience with a (non ozone) steam sauna caused the worst

month of my life (severe depression started literally about 30

minutes after the sauna), and that was only a 15 minute sauna (my

body seems significantly 'clearer' than it was at that time though).

I have no idea the nature of the toxins in my body, but it seems

clear that in my case what is prescribed below is very

counterproductive. I may be able to get away with a sauna every 2 or

3 days, so I will have to experiment.

I am continuing with the liver flush every 2 weeks, and doing various

exercises to keep lymph moving ..

brian

> > Dear Ron,

> >

> > Cut the recipe in half for her.

> >

> > Poor thing, battered so early...

> >

> > Too bad she didn't get ozone instead of poison...

> >

> > Oh well, make up for lost time now.

> >

> > Best of health!

> > Dr. Saul

> >

> > -----------------------------------------------------------------

---

> ----

> >

> >

> > ----Original Message Follows----

> > From: " Ron Petruccione " <petruccione@s...>

> > Reply-oxyplus

> > <oxyplus >

> > Subject: RE: Re: Plugged liver

> > Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 08:38:04 -0800

> >

> > Saul,

> > If I want my 9yr. daughter to do the H.C. liver flush should I

cut

> > everything by 1/2 or 1/3?

> > She has been on antibiotics for a good portion of her early years

> and only

> > on again off again the last 4yrs. She was a preemie and was on

> antibiotics

> > her first 15days of life. (suspected sepsis)

> > Take Care,

> >

> > Enjoying you book immensely.

> >

> > Re: Re: Plugged liver

> > Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:40:33 -0600

> >

> > Hello,

> > I have always wondered if this cleanse is safe for people who

have

> had their

> > gallbladder taken out????

> > Thanks

> > Joan

> > Re: Ozone injections--and ozonated water

etc

> > > Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:55:07 +1000

> > >

> > > Can someone tell me exactly what a 'plugged liver' actually

> means?

> > > What is plugged and by what?

> > >

> > > Thanks,

> > >

> > > Sue

> > >

> > >

_________________________________________________________________

> > > MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*.

> > >

> > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

> > <http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus & pgmarket=en-ca & RU=http%

3a%

> 2f%2fjoi

> > n> & pgmarket=en-ca & RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin

> > .msn.com%2f%3fpage%3dmisc%2fspecialoffers%26pgmarket%3den-ca

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > OxyPLUS is an unmoderated e-ring dealing with oxidative

> therapies, and

> > other alternative self-help subjects.

> > >

> > > THERE IS NO MEDICAL ADVICE HERE!

> > >

> > > This list is the 1st Amendment in action. The things you will

> find here

> > are for information and research purposes only. We are people

> sharing

> > information we believe in. If you act on ideas found here, you do

> so at your

> > own risk. Self-help requires intelligence, common sense, and the

> ability to

> > take responsibility for your own actions. By joining the list you

> agree to

> > hold yourself FULLY responsible FOR yourself. Do not use any

ideas

> found

> > here without consulting a medical professional, unless you are a

> researcher

> > or health care provider.

> > >

> > > You can unsubscribe via e-mail by sending A NEW e-mail to the

> following

> > address - NOT TO THE OXYPLUS LIST! -

> > > DO NOT USE REPLY BUTTON & DO NOT PUT THIS IN THE SUBJECT LINE

or

> BODY of

> > the message! :

> > >

> > > oxyplus-unsubscribeegroups

> > >

> > > oxyplus-normalonelist - switch your subscription to

> normal

> > mode.

> > >

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Posted
Posted

Dear ,

Are you drinking ozonated water?

Best of health!

Dr. Saul Pressman

--------------------------------------------------------------

----Original Message Follows----

From: " brian " <fade_216@...>

Reply-oxyplus

oxyplus

Subject: Re: Plugged liver [update]

Date: Sat, 03 Apr 2004 20:21:27 -0000

Saul,

I have been following your directions below, only doing 20 minute

saunas instead of 30 minutes, but I'm running into the same problem.

The (non ozone) steam saunas seemed to clear my mind up noticeably

for a week but now I'm getting the same kind of sore throats, mental

fatigue and other sorts of symptoms. I feel fairly certain that the

cause of this is the that while the sauna is eliminating some toxins

through the skin, it is stirring up more toxins within the body than

it is eliminating. So the liver is being burdened by the saunas. My

first experience with a (non ozone) steam sauna caused the worst

month of my life (severe depression started literally about 30

minutes after the sauna), and that was only a 15 minute sauna (my

body seems significantly 'clearer' than it was at that time though).

I have no idea the nature of the toxins in my body, but it seems

clear that in my case what is prescribed below is very

counterproductive. I may be able to get away with a sauna every 2 or

3 days, so I will have to experiment.

I am continuing with the liver flush every 2 weeks, and doing various

exercises to keep lymph moving ..

brian

> > Dear Ron,

> >

> > Cut the recipe in half for her.

> >

> > Poor thing, battered so early...

> >

> > Too bad she didn't get ozone instead of poison...

> >

> > Oh well, make up for lost time now.

> >

> > Best of health!

> > Dr. Saul

> >

> > -----------------------------------------------------------------

---

> ----

> >

> >

> > ----Original Message Follows----

> > From: " Ron Petruccione " <petruccione@s...>

> > Reply-oxyplus

> > <oxyplus >

> > Subject: RE: Re: Plugged liver

> > Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 08:38:04 -0800

> >

> > Saul,

> > If I want my 9yr. daughter to do the H.C. liver flush should I

cut

> > everything by 1/2 or 1/3?

> > She has been on antibiotics for a good portion of her early years

> and only

> > on again off again the last 4yrs. She was a preemie and was on

> antibiotics

> > her first 15days of life. (suspected sepsis)

> > Take Care,

> >

> > Enjoying you book immensely.

> >

> > Re: Re: Plugged liver

> > Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:40:33 -0600

> >

> > Hello,

> > I have always wondered if this cleanse is safe for people who

have

> had their

> > gallbladder taken out????

> > Thanks

> > Joan

> > Re: Ozone injections--and ozonated water

etc

> > > Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:55:07 +1000

> > >

> > > Can someone tell me exactly what a 'plugged liver' actually

> means?

> > > What is plugged and by what?

> > >

> > > Thanks,

> > >

> > > Sue

> > >

> > >

_________________________________________________________________

> > > MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*.

> > >

> > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

> > <http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus & pgmarket=en-ca & RU=http%

3a%

> 2f%2fjoi

> > n> & pgmarket=en-ca & RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin

> > .msn.com%2f%3fpage%3dmisc%2fspecialoffers%26pgmarket%3den-ca

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > OxyPLUS is an unmoderated e-ring dealing with oxidative

> therapies, and

> > other alternative self-help subjects.

> > >

> > > THERE IS NO MEDICAL ADVICE HERE!

> > >

> > > This list is the 1st Amendment in action. The things you will

> find here

> > are for information and research purposes only. We are people

> sharing

> > information we believe in. If you act on ideas found here, you do

> so at your

> > own risk. Self-help requires intelligence, common sense, and the

> ability to

> > take responsibility for your own actions. By joining the list you

> agree to

> > hold yourself FULLY responsible FOR yourself. Do not use any

ideas

> found

> > here without consulting a medical professional, unless you are a

> researcher

> > or health care provider.

> > >

> > > You can unsubscribe via e-mail by sending A NEW e-mail to the

> following

> > address - NOT TO THE OXYPLUS LIST! -

> > > DO NOT USE REPLY BUTTON & DO NOT PUT THIS IN THE SUBJECT LINE

or

> BODY of

> > the message! :

> > >

> > > oxyplus-unsubscribeegroups

> > >

> > > oxyplus-normalonelist - switch your subscription to

> normal

> > mode.

> > >

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Posted
Posted

Nope, would that help?

> > > Dear Ron,

> > >

> > > Cut the recipe in half for her.

> > >

> > > Poor thing, battered so early...

> > >

> > > Too bad she didn't get ozone instead of poison...

> > >

> > > Oh well, make up for lost time now.

> > >

> > > Best of health!

> > > Dr. Saul

> > >

> > > --------------------------------------------------------------

---

> ---

> > ----

> > >

> > >

> > > ----Original Message Follows----

> > > From: " Ron Petruccione " <petruccione@s...>

> > > Reply-oxyplus

> > > <oxyplus >

> > > Subject: RE: Re: Plugged liver

> > > Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 08:38:04 -0800

> > >

> > > Saul,

> > > If I want my 9yr. daughter to do the H.C. liver flush should I

> cut

> > > everything by 1/2 or 1/3?

> > > She has been on antibiotics for a good portion of her early

years

> > and only

> > > on again off again the last 4yrs. She was a preemie and was

on

> > antibiotics

> > > her first 15days of life. (suspected sepsis)

> > > Take Care,

> > >

> > > Enjoying you book immensely.

> > >

> > > Re: Re: Plugged liver

> > > Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:40:33 -0600

> > >

> > > Hello,

> > > I have always wondered if this cleanse is safe for people who

> have

> > had their

> > > gallbladder taken out????

> > > Thanks

> > > Joan

> > > Re: Ozone injections--and ozonated water

> etc

> > > > Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:55:07 +1000

> > > >

> > > > Can someone tell me exactly what a 'plugged liver' actually

> > means?

> > > > What is plugged and by what?

> > > >

> > > > Thanks,

> > > >

> > > > Sue

> > > >

> > > >

> _________________________________________________________________

> > > > MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*.

> > > >

> > > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

> > > <http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus & pgmarket=en-

ca & RU=http%

> 3a%

> > 2f%2fjoi

> > > n> & pgmarket=en-ca & RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin

> > > .msn.com%2f%3fpage%3dmisc%2fspecialoffers%26pgmarket%3den-ca

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > OxyPLUS is an unmoderated e-ring dealing with oxidative

> > therapies, and

> > > other alternative self-help subjects.

> > > >

> > > > THERE IS NO MEDICAL ADVICE HERE!

> > > >

> > > > This list is the 1st Amendment in action. The things you

will

> > find here

> > > are for information and research purposes only. We are people

> > sharing

> > > information we believe in. If you act on ideas found here,

you do

> > so at your

> > > own risk. Self-help requires intelligence, common sense, and

the

> > ability to

> > > take responsibility for your own actions. By joining the list

you

> > agree to

> > > hold yourself FULLY responsible FOR yourself. Do not use any

> ideas

> > found

> > > here without consulting a medical professional, unless you

are a

> > researcher

> > > or health care provider.

> > > >

> > > > You can unsubscribe via e-mail by sending A NEW e-mail to

the

> > following

> > > address - NOT TO THE OXYPLUS LIST! -

> > > > DO NOT USE REPLY BUTTON & DO NOT PUT THIS IN THE SUBJECT

LINE

> or

> > BODY of

> > > the message! :

> > > >

> > > > oxyplus-unsubscribeegroups

> > > >

> > > > oxyplus-normalonelist - switch your subscription

to

> > normal

> > > mode.

> > > >

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Posted
Posted

Yup.

Dr. S

---------------------------------------------------------

----Original Message Follows----

From: " brian " <fade_216@...>

Reply-oxyplus

oxyplus

Subject: Re: Plugged liver [update]

Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2004 00:11:40 -0000

Nope, would that help?

> > > Dear Ron,

> > >

> > > Cut the recipe in half for her.

> > >

> > > Poor thing, battered so early...

> > >

> > > Too bad she didn't get ozone instead of poison...

> > >

> > > Oh well, make up for lost time now.

> > >

> > > Best of health!

> > > Dr. Saul

> > >

> > > --------------------------------------------------------------

---

> ---

> > ----

> > >

> > >

> > > ----Original Message Follows----

> > > From: " Ron Petruccione " <petruccione@s...>

> > > Reply-oxyplus

> > > <oxyplus >

> > > Subject: RE: Re: Plugged liver

> > > Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 08:38:04 -0800

> > >

> > > Saul,

> > > If I want my 9yr. daughter to do the H.C. liver flush should I

> cut

> > > everything by 1/2 or 1/3?

> > > She has been on antibiotics for a good portion of her early

years

> > and only

> > > on again off again the last 4yrs. She was a preemie and was

on

> > antibiotics

> > > her first 15days of life. (suspected sepsis)

> > > Take Care,

> > >

> > > Enjoying you book immensely.

> > >

> > > Re: Re: Plugged liver

> > > Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:40:33 -0600

> > >

> > > Hello,

> > > I have always wondered if this cleanse is safe for people who

> have

> > had their

> > > gallbladder taken out????

> > > Thanks

> > > Joan

> > > Re: Ozone injections--and ozonated water

> etc

> > > > Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:55:07 +1000

> > > >

> > > > Can someone tell me exactly what a 'plugged liver' actually

> > means?

> > > > What is plugged and by what?

> > > >

> > > > Thanks,

> > > >

> > > > Sue

> > > >

> > > >

> _________________________________________________________________

> > > > MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*.

> > > >

> > > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

> > > <http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus & pgmarket=en-

ca & RU=http%

> 3a%

> > 2f%2fjoi

> > > n> & pgmarket=en-ca & RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin

> > > .msn.com%2f%3fpage%3dmisc%2fspecialoffers%26pgmarket%3den-ca

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > OxyPLUS is an unmoderated e-ring dealing with oxidative

> > therapies, and

> > > other alternative self-help subjects.

> > > >

> > > > THERE IS NO MEDICAL ADVICE HERE!

> > > >

> > > > This list is the 1st Amendment in action. The things you

will

> > find here

> > > are for information and research purposes only. We are people

> > sharing

> > > information we believe in. If you act on ideas found here,

you do

> > so at your

> > > own risk. Self-help requires intelligence, common sense, and

the

> > ability to

> > > take responsibility for your own actions. By joining the list

you

> > agree to

> > > hold yourself FULLY responsible FOR yourself. Do not use any

> ideas

> > found

> > > here without consulting a medical professional, unless you

are a

> > researcher

> > > or health care provider.

> > > >

> > > > You can unsubscribe via e-mail by sending A NEW e-mail to

the

> > following

> > > address - NOT TO THE OXYPLUS LIST! -

> > > > DO NOT USE REPLY BUTTON & DO NOT PUT THIS IN THE SUBJECT

LINE

> or

> > BODY of

> > > the message! :

> > > >

> > > > oxyplus-unsubscribeegroups

> > > >

> > > > oxyplus-normalonelist - switch your subscription

to

> > normal

> > > mode.

> > > >

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Posted
Posted

Hi ,

I know this wasn't addressed to me, but thought I would jump in, I hope you

don't mind.

I wonder what makes you think you are so special? I don't mean this in any

negative way and you are not the only one who feels this way. But why do you

have toxins that no one else in the world has? Why are you the only person out

of the thousands who have followed this protocol who it is counter-productive

for? What is so special about you that cleansing the body is not the way to go?

Again I mean no ill-will here, I really just want people to pay attention to the

words they are using and that their subconscious is dealing with. It has no

intellect, and so only hears what you are saying " I can't be cleansed like

everyone else " " This is counter-productive " " This is a burden " " Worst month of

my life " . All these statements will be processed literally by your subconsious

and more damage than good will be done.

What liver cleanse are you doing? Is it the two day one Saul recommends based on

Hulda 's?

If not then I would agree that your liver is burdened and you are adding to that

burden. We encourage anyone with a chronic illness who is going to embark on a

series of saunas to do this liver cleanse at least once. Because if the liver is

plugged then you aren't doing it any favours by dumping more toxins for it to

process. And we have found the best cleanse by far, with the quickest more

dramatic results for healing is the one we suggest.

The sauna works as you suggest. It oxidizes toxins that are excreted through the

sweat in the sauna. Once out of the sauna, the ozone will continue to oxidize

toxins for the next 24 hours and those toxins will have to be processed through

the liver and then excreted through urine and fecal matter. A liver cleanse and

drinking plenty of water (ozonated or not) will help this process substantially.

From my experience, I would say you are going through another valley in the

healing journey. You will feel worse before you get better and it will be a

series of peaks, plateaus and valleys. The peaks are like your beginning,

feeling great, more energy, sleeping better etc, then we plateau and just sort

of stand still for a bit and then we crash into the next valley and feel like

crap, perhaps worse than before and have to tough it out again. This continues

until the plateau lasts so long, you don't remember when your next valley was.

This is the pattern of literally thousands of people, at least all the ones who

stick it out. Some start with a peak, some with a plateau, some with a valley,

but it is all the same in the end. Why would you (or anyone) be different?

It doesn't matter what the toxins in your body are made up of. The bottom line

is you want to get them out, and the ozone sauna's are the best way to do it.

They are the most effecient and productive for the length of the treatment and

the most reliable. They are also unpleasant, painful and miserable. Which is one

way to word it or they are enlightening, educative and character building. You

chose.

You can do this, keep up the good work and keep at it. When you feel crappy,

listen to your body and stay in bed, drink lots of fluids and take care of

yourself as you heal. When you feel better, enjoy that and appreciate each and

every baby step your body is taking towards healing. But most of all, don't

believe this won't work for you, because then it likely won't and you will keep

your illness. Don't look for excuses why you can't do this because you will find

them. If you don't want to do it, then don't. But if you want to get rid of your

illness then pull up some more resources, use us for support and get at it.

Keep us posted,

Sherri-Lee

Looking for safe and natural health products?

http://www.aloeessence.com

Re: Ozone injections--and ozonated water

etc

> > > Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:55:07 +1000

> > >

> > > Can someone tell me exactly what a 'plugged liver' actually

> means?

> > > What is plugged and by what?

> > >

> > > Thanks,

> > >

> > > Sue

> > >

> > >

_________________________________________________________________

> > > MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*.

> > >

> > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

> > <http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus & pgmarket=en-ca & RU=http%

3a%

> 2f%2fjoi

> > n> & pgmarket=en-ca & RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin

> > .msn.com%2f%3fpage%3dmisc%2fspecialoffers%26pgmarket%3den-ca

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > OxyPLUS is an unmoderated e-ring dealing with oxidative

> therapies, and

> > other alternative self-help subjects.

> > >

> > > THERE IS NO MEDICAL ADVICE HERE!

> > >

> > > This list is the 1st Amendment in action. The things you will

> find here

> > are for information and research purposes only. We are people

> sharing

> > information we believe in. If you act on ideas found here, you do

> so at your

> > own risk. Self-help requires intelligence, common sense, and the

> ability to

> > take responsibility for your own actions. By joining the list you

> agree to

> > hold yourself FULLY responsible FOR yourself. Do not use any

ideas

> found

> > here without consulting a medical professional, unless you are a

> researcher

> > or health care provider.

> > >

> > > You can unsubscribe via e-mail by sending A NEW e-mail to the

> following

> > address - NOT TO THE OXYPLUS LIST! -

> > > DO NOT USE REPLY BUTTON & DO NOT PUT THIS IN THE SUBJECT LINE

or

> BODY of

> > the message! :

> > >

> > > oxyplus-unsubscribeegroups

> > >

> > > oxyplus-normalonelist - switch your subscription to

> normal

> > mode.

> > >

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Posted
Posted

-Hi Brain,

I have a few thoughts that may or may not relate to your situation.

When I first started doing the Beck Protocol for cfids (that includes

blood electrification, CS, magnetic pulsing & drinking ozonated

water), I got so depressed. I really didn't know if I could

continue. It was the kind of depression where I would cry for hours,

keep the curtains closed and not answer the phone. Well, I did

continue the 90 recommended hours to cure cfids, which I'm still

battling with. But looking back (I was new to alternative therapies

and didn't know much of anything about anything) I hadn't done any

cleansing before I started his protocol. Later I learned about the

liver cleanses and have been doing them ever since. That alone has

made a bid difference in my health. I just don't think you can go

wrong with them, if you are strong enough. But I think other factors

might also play into saunas or any form of detoxing but especially

the sauna. I would think it be utmost important to drink plenty of

water and keep yourself hydrated. But I'm also thinking you might

need to supplement with some minerals. I would think you lose a lot

of minerals during the sweating. Are you taking potassium? Are you

taking EFAs? I do think/know the toxins have to go, but I also think

it's important to make sure you are covered nutritionally at the same

time. Perhaps some extra B's to help handle the stress. I also

don't have a problem with not being able to keep up with the

recommended amount of saunas or anything else people tell me to do.

This is my body and my pace. I'm still trying to find what that pace

is that I can tolerate. I know I'm pretty toxic and I have no doubt

the saunas can do the job. I really do have a great confidence in

them, but I'm not going to put myself through what I did with the

Beck Protocol. All I want to do it go in the right direction and

sooner or later I'll get there. I did ask Saul what is the minimual

one can do to obtain healing. He said 1 sauna twice a week, so that

is what I'm working on, plus a little insufflation. If I need to

back down to only one sauna for a while, that's fine, too. As long

as I don't stay at only doing one and will gradually work up to

more. I guess what I'm saying is everybody is somewhat different and

somewhat alike at the same time. Finding what works for you can be a

format for another but is not necessarily so. But it does take work;

it doesn't just " happen " .

Gail

-- In oxyplus , " brian " <fade_216@y...> wrote:

>

So the liver is being burdened by the saunas. My

> first experience with a (non ozone) steam sauna caused the worst

> month of my life (severe depression started literally about 30

> minutes after the sauna), and that was only a 15 minute sauna (my

> body seems significantly 'clearer' than it was at that time

though).

> I have no idea the nature of the toxins in my body, but it seems

> clear that in my case what is prescribed below is very

> counterproductive. I may be able to get away with a sauna every 2

or

> 3 days, so I will have to experiment.

>

> I am continuing with the liver flush every 2 weeks, and doing

various

> exercises to keep lymph moving ..

>

> brian

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Posted
Posted

Hi Sherri-Lee,

> Hi ,

>

> I know this wasn't addressed to me, but thought I would jump in, I

hope you don't mind.

>

> I wonder what makes you think you are so special? I don't mean this

in any negative way and you are not the only one who feels this way.

But why do you have toxins that no one else in the world has? Why are

--

The fact that Saul's recommendations both now and in the past have

produced results different than he expected leads me to believe that

my situation may be a little different.

I don't know what is in me as far as toxins go.

---

>you the only person out of the thousands who have followed this

protocol who it is counter-productive for? What is so special about

you that cleansing the body is not the way to go? Again I mean no ill-

will here, I really just want people to pay attention to the words

---

Just a note - it sure sounds like 'ill will' to me. I have no desire

to think of myself as 'special', 'untreatable' or anything like

that. I'm just giving my experiences, and trying to figure out what

I need to do. I'm sorry if you perceive that as a threat for

whatever reason.

>they are using and that their subconscious is dealing with. It has

no intellect, and so only hears what you are saying " I can't be

cleansed like everyone else " " This is counter-productive " " This is a

burden " " Worst month of my life " . All these statements will be

processed literally by your subconsious and more damage than good

will be done.

--

that is not at all the attitude I am taking. I am open to any

suggestions - my initial opinion of the liver cleanses was that the

claims sounded unsubstantiated. At the urging of Saul and other

members on this forum I began them with an open mind, and am

committed to continuing them.

>

> What liver cleanse are you doing? Is it the two day one Saul

recommends based on Hulda 's?

>

I don't know Saul's exact procedure, it is the hulda clarke cleanse

that I am doing.

> It doesn't matter what the toxins in your body are made up of.

It may, in that if they are toxins secreted by a pathogen that the

accumulation is ongoing as opposed to exposure to something like

mercury in the past, which would never increase.

brian

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Posted
Posted

Hi Gail,

Thanks for the thoughts and glad to hear another case that has been

helped by the liver cleanses. Hopefully I will notice similar

positive effects soon. As far as vitamins and minerals go I should

be pretty well covered (EFAs, potassium, b vits, magnesium, etc)

brian

> >

> So the liver is being burdened by the saunas. My

> > first experience with a (non ozone) steam sauna caused the worst

> > month of my life (severe depression started literally about 30

> > minutes after the sauna), and that was only a 15 minute sauna (my

> > body seems significantly 'clearer' than it was at that time

> though).

> > I have no idea the nature of the toxins in my body, but it seems

> > clear that in my case what is prescribed below is very

> > counterproductive. I may be able to get away with a sauna every

2

> or

> > 3 days, so I will have to experiment.

> >

> > I am continuing with the liver flush every 2 weeks, and doing

> various

> > exercises to keep lymph moving ..

> >

> > brian

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Posted
Posted

> Hi Gail,

>

> Thanks for the thoughts and glad to hear another case that has been

> helped by the liver cleanses. Hopefully I will notice similar

> positive effects soon. As far as vitamins and minerals go I should

> be pretty well covered (EFAs, potassium, b vits, magnesium, etc)

>

> brian

, Gail makes a good point. Perhaps you have become mineral

deficient. Otoh, if you are reacting to even just steam saunas,

maybe you are reacting to the heat. Who knows why. Do you have the

same reaction to ear or rectal insufflation?

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Posted
Posted

brian

i agree with you that in certain cases the particular offending agent may be

relevant.

have you checked into andy cutler's book 'amalgam illness'. alot of mercury

toxic people are very heat sensitive, and some types of saunas can stir up

mercury without releasing it. with mercury in particular this is not a good

thing to do.

also with regard to mercury, people who have had their fillings out may

react very differently than people that have their fillings still in... even

if the amalgam was not the main source of exposure, the body might begin a

dumping process after amalgams are removed. i had mine removed 10 years ago

and i am still dumping mercury

in my experience, far infrared sauna is a much much more effective way to

sweat than steam sauna. i sweat about 5 times more in a fir sauna than in

steam. this is what i used last year to alleviate symptoms from cleansing

and it worked great for this purpose... reversing dyslexia caused by merc

detox.

according to andy cutler liver flushes are too traumatic for severely

mercury toxic people. he also is not a proponent of ozone as a mercury

treatment. though i chose to go the route of liver flushes, i think his

caution is well warranted. i have met others who also feel the flush is too

traumatic. i have met others who feel that the liver should be taken care of

before any other cleansing is attempted.

everyone has a different way go about this process, even though the main

goal is detoxification. the devil is in the details. i don't think it is

reasonable for anyone to be able to predict exactly what is going to happen

when you start detoxing

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Posted
Posted

Hi ,

--

The fact that Saul's recommendations both now and in the past have

produced results different than he expected leads me to believe that

my situation may be a little different.

I don't know what is in me as far as toxins go.

---

I don't know if they are " different " reactions than he expected, definately they

are the healing crisis, perhaps they are stronger or more intense, or you aren't

handling them as he thought you would. We never know how someone will react to

the healing crisis, or where their personal threshold is. I have had a woman

come in with everything under the sun wrong, copd, cancer, MS you name it. She

could barely make it up the stairs. I thought she would make it one session and

that would be it. Well 31 sessions later, she was not using her puffers or

oxygen anymore and coming daily still, until this week, then all of a sudden

things seemed to " take a turn for the worse " she was a little concerned when she

came in, until she heard me say " this is great! you are at a new level of

healing! " and she has kept going. Conversely, I have had other people come in

with one thing wrong (minor in comparison) and have bolted after one or two

sessions because they couldn't handle the healing reaction. How we personally

handle each faze of the reaction is individual. So maybe Saul can clarify, but I

am not sure that you are having " different " as much as perhaps " stronger "

reactions than he expected.

---

Just a note - it sure sounds like 'ill will' to me. I have no desire

to think of myself as 'special', 'untreatable' or anything like

that. I'm just giving my experiences, and trying to figure out what

I need to do. I'm sorry if you perceive that as a threat for

whatever reason.

-----

Well I am sorry if it sounded like ill-will to you, it was not my intent. You

are giving your experiences yes, with your bias and personal feelings mixed it.

It is not a subjective reporting if you are saying things as

" counter-productive " " burden " and " worse " . These are words that your

sub-consious will not be able to process intellectually and will leave it

feeling as if what you are doing is " counter-productive " a " burden " and " worse " .

I am sorry if I sound mean spirited again, but I think what you might need to do

is suck it up and believe in what you are doing and tough it out. Easier said

than done I know, it just seems to be the way that this works. Accept that you

will feel worse before you will feel better. And when you do congratulate

yourself for being tough and doing what is best for your body.

--

that is not at all the attitude I am taking. I am open to any

suggestions - my initial opinion of the liver cleanses was that the

claims sounded unsubstantiated. At the urging of Saul and other

members on this forum I began them with an open mind, and am

committed to continuing them.

---

I would challenge you about whether this was the attitude you are taking or not.

Certainly I am not in your head or talking to you for hours on end, but there

are the words you use that have a negative effect on your sub-consious. Why

would you feel that the liver cleanse claims were unsubstantiated? Saul and

other members of this forum have endorsed the value of the liver cleanse to you

as part of your healing journey, so what more do you need to make it

substantiated? Just physically doing them is not enough, your mind must be

commited to it too. Your mind has to be commited to the value of it. The fact

that you are so strongly resistant to believing in the liver cleanse, tells me

that this is exactly what you need. As we are trained in EFT, what is resisted

is needed most and what we think sub-consiously affects the outcome of what we

are doing.

----

I don't know Saul's exact procedure, it is the hulda clarke cleanse

that I am doing.

----

Well I don't think there is much difference. Are you seeing much in the way of

stones each time? What kinds of results are you getting from it?

----

It may, in that if they are toxins secreted by a pathogen that the

accumulation is ongoing as opposed to exposure to something like

mercury in the past, which would never increase.

----

It really doesn't matter the source of the toxins. Even if you had no

" pathogens " that might be creating new toxins, you would come into contact with

new toxins daily in your life for the rest of your life. The water you shower

in: do you have a filter system that removes all the crap in the water? The

shampoo you use: Does it contain SLS or any of the other potentially harmful

ingredients used in commercial products? The soap you use: what are those

ingredients? Processed food at all? Do you breath while you are outside? Toxins

live in our air and are ingested into your lungs daily. Our contact with toxins

is ever present and not something we have much control over. What you do have

control over is how much stay in your body. The ozone saunas will eliminate

them. The problem is, if you are sick, you are overloaded with toxins and you

have to remove the toxic heap in your body and then you can keep up on the daily

new load.

Saul's analogy is the rain barrel on the porch. When it rains water drips into

the barrel and slowly over years fills the barrel up. Slowly it fills until it

overflows. But daily water still drips in. So if you want to make it so water

can come in without overflowing (illness), you must remove some of the water in

the barrel first. If you use a teaspoon and only do one teaspoon a day, you are

probably not removing more than is going in daily. So you take out one teaspoon

and more comes in and it still overflows. You don't get anywhere. If, however

you use a tablespoon you take out more than goes in and before long you are

ahead of the flow and the water no longer overflows. This is what you are doing

to your body with the ozone sauna. If you have one sauna a week you are using a

teaspoon on the toxins and you are retaining more than you are getting out. If

you are having 2 or 3 or more a week you are getting ahead of the flow and

making head way on the reserve and in time will see the benefit of this. Then

when you get the barrel almost empty, you can cut down to one or two saunas a

week and you won't have an overflow situation and can keep up on it. But when

you body is in toxic crisis, you have to get in there and scoop it out like

crazy.

I hope I have clarified what I am saying and any tone of " ill-will " is gone.

That is not what I am feeling, I just want to see everyone benefit and have

their illnesses gone and their lives back as I have experienced.

Sherri-Lee

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Posted
Posted

Dear brian,

It is not so much that your results are so different, but that

you found it so difficult to live with them, and so I have been

advising you to lower the intensity of the cleanse to get to

a level you are more comfortable with, and then slowly increase

as you can handle it.

The other option seemd to be that you would quit the whole process,

which I did not want to see happen.

If you are coming to our clinic, it is a different matter, because each

problem can be addressed as it comes up, and you can be encouraged

verbally, which is much more effective. When you are self-treating, and

we are at a distance, it is harder to get across the message, and I did

not want to see you stop outright.

Sherri-Lee has become very effective at dealing with emotional responses

to healing, and has had great success with EFT on people who were

willing to allow it. This is most effective when in contact with the person,

so that the tapping of the specific acupuncture points can be done, with

the proper verbal prompts.

Long distance, and in print, this is much more difficult to do.

This weekend, I am doing my semi-annual liver cleanse, and it has been

a bit rough. I had a BIG headache all day yesterday, from not eating. I

could have used the hour we lost overnight to the Daylight Savings Time

change!

Today I am a lot better, the headache is down to a dull roar, and I'm just

kind

of spaced out, but weak. Saw some chaff in the toilet, and a couple of

" green

peas " . I am looking forward to the last drink of Epsom salts (yum yum ) in

one hour.

And then some apple + beet juice at 1:00 pm...

Best of health!

Dr. Saul Pressman

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------\

-----------------------

----Original Message Follows----

From: " brian " <fade_216@...>

Reply-oxyplus

oxyplus

Subject: Re: Plugged liver [update]

Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2004 13:07:42 -0000

Hi Sherri-Lee,

> Hi ,

>

> I know this wasn't addressed to me, but thought I would jump in, I

hope you don't mind.

>

> I wonder what makes you think you are so special? I don't mean this

in any negative way and you are not the only one who feels this way.

But why do you have toxins that no one else in the world has? Why are

--

The fact that Saul's recommendations both now and in the past have

produced results different than he expected leads me to believe that

my situation may be a little different.

I don't know what is in me as far as toxins go.

---

>you the only person out of the thousands who have followed this

protocol who it is counter-productive for? What is so special about

you that cleansing the body is not the way to go? Again I mean no ill-

will here, I really just want people to pay attention to the words

---

Just a note - it sure sounds like 'ill will' to me. I have no desire

to think of myself as 'special', 'untreatable' or anything like

that. I'm just giving my experiences, and trying to figure out what

I need to do. I'm sorry if you perceive that as a threat for

whatever reason.

>they are using and that their subconscious is dealing with. It has

no intellect, and so only hears what you are saying " I can't be

cleansed like everyone else " " This is counter-productive " " This is a

burden " " Worst month of my life " . All these statements will be

processed literally by your subconsious and more damage than good

will be done.

--

that is not at all the attitude I am taking. I am open to any

suggestions - my initial opinion of the liver cleanses was that the

claims sounded unsubstantiated. At the urging of Saul and other

members on this forum I began them with an open mind, and am

committed to continuing them.

>

> What liver cleanse are you doing? Is it the two day one Saul

recommends based on Hulda 's?

>

I don't know Saul's exact procedure, it is the hulda clarke cleanse

that I am doing.

> It doesn't matter what the toxins in your body are made up of.

It may, in that if they are toxins secreted by a pathogen that the

accumulation is ongoing as opposed to exposure to something like

mercury in the past, which would never increase.

brian

OxyPLUS is an unmoderated e-ring dealing with oxidative therapies, and other

alternative self-help subjects.

THERE IS NO MEDICAL ADVICE HERE!

This list is the 1st Amendment in action. The things you will find here are

for information and research purposes only. We are people sharing

information we believe in. If you act on ideas found here, you do so at your

own risk. Self-help requires intelligence, common sense, and the ability to

take responsibility for your own actions. By joining the list you agree to

hold yourself FULLY responsible FOR yourself. Do not use any ideas found

here without consulting a medical professional, unless you are a researcher

or health care provider.

You can unsubscribe via e-mail by sending A NEW e-mail to the following

address - NOT TO THE OXYPLUS LIST! -

DO NOT USE REPLY BUTTON & DO NOT PUT THIS IN THE SUBJECT LINE or BODY of the

message! :

oxyplus-unsubscribeegroups

oxyplus-normalonelist - switch your subscription to normal mode.

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Posted
Posted

Hi Saul,

> Dear brian,

>

> It is not so much that your results are so different, but that

> you found it so difficult to live with them, and so I have been

Actually it was just the first liver cleanse that seemed to be a bit

rough. The second, modifying the protocol to include water intake

was not too bad at all. It really seemed to be the saunas that were

causing the problem, as I noticed that at first the saunas made me

feel great, but the past two or three days I definitely felt worse

after them (but nowhere near as bad as the ozone saunas were making

me feel).

One factor that may be causing a difference is that I have been using

FIR heaters + steam, instead of a pure steam sauna. I am told that

FIR stirs up more nasty stuff, my experiences with dry heat saunas in

general *seem* to fit that assertation. I'll try it with just the

steam in addition to reducing the frequency of saunas. Thanks for

all your advice, it really is appreciated (even if it sounds like I'm

always telling you it's not working!!). I think you are dead on when

you say that the problem is in the liver, because it would really

make lots of my observations make sense. So I'll just keep at it,

reducing the intensity as necessary.

brian

> advising you to lower the intensity of the cleanse to get to

> a level you are more comfortable with, and then slowly increase

> as you can handle it.

>

> The other option seemd to be that you would quit the whole process,

> which I did not want to see happen.

>

> If you are coming to our clinic, it is a different matter, because

each

> problem can be addressed as it comes up, and you can be encouraged

> verbally, which is much more effective. When you are self-treating,

and

> we are at a distance, it is harder to get across the message, and I

did

> not want to see you stop outright.

>

> Sherri-Lee has become very effective at dealing with emotional

responses

> to healing, and has had great success with EFT on people who were

> willing to allow it. This is most effective when in contact with

the person,

> so that the tapping of the specific acupuncture points can be done,

with

> the proper verbal prompts.

>

> Long distance, and in print, this is much more difficult to do.

>

> This weekend, I am doing my semi-annual liver cleanse, and it has

been

> a bit rough. I had a BIG headache all day yesterday, from not

eating. I

> could have used the hour we lost overnight to the Daylight Savings

Time

> change!

> Today I am a lot better, the headache is down to a dull roar, and

I'm just

> kind

> of spaced out, but weak. Saw some chaff in the toilet, and a couple

of

> " green

> peas " . I am looking forward to the last drink of Epsom salts (yum

yum ) in

> one hour.

> And then some apple + beet juice at 1:00 pm...

>

> Best of health!

> Dr. Saul Pressman

>

> --------------------------------------------------------------------

-----------------------------------

>

> ----Original Message Follows----

> From: " brian " <fade_216@y...>

> Reply-oxyplus

> oxyplus

> Subject: Re: Plugged liver [update]

> Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2004 13:07:42 -0000

>

> Hi Sherri-Lee,

>

> > Hi ,

> >

> > I know this wasn't addressed to me, but thought I would jump in,

I

> hope you don't mind.

> >

> > I wonder what makes you think you are so special? I don't mean

this

> in any negative way and you are not the only one who feels this way.

> But why do you have toxins that no one else in the world has? Why

are

> --

> The fact that Saul's recommendations both now and in the past have

> produced results different than he expected leads me to believe that

> my situation may be a little different.

>

> I don't know what is in me as far as toxins go.

> ---

>

> >you the only person out of the thousands who have followed this

> protocol who it is counter-productive for? What is so special about

> you that cleansing the body is not the way to go? Again I mean no

ill-

> will here, I really just want people to pay attention to the words

> ---

> Just a note - it sure sounds like 'ill will' to me. I have no

desire

> to think of myself as 'special', 'untreatable' or anything like

> that. I'm just giving my experiences, and trying to figure out what

> I need to do. I'm sorry if you perceive that as a threat for

> whatever reason.

>

>

> >they are using and that their subconscious is dealing with. It has

> no intellect, and so only hears what you are saying " I can't be

> cleansed like everyone else " " This is counter-productive " " This is a

> burden " " Worst month of my life " . All these statements will be

> processed literally by your subconsious and more damage than good

> will be done.

> --

> that is not at all the attitude I am taking. I am open to any

> suggestions - my initial opinion of the liver cleanses was that the

> claims sounded unsubstantiated. At the urging of Saul and other

> members on this forum I began them with an open mind, and am

> committed to continuing them.

>

>

> >

> > What liver cleanse are you doing? Is it the two day one Saul

> recommends based on Hulda 's?

> >

>

> I don't know Saul's exact procedure, it is the hulda clarke cleanse

> that I am doing.

>

>

> > It doesn't matter what the toxins in your body are made up of.

>

> It may, in that if they are toxins secreted by a pathogen that the

> accumulation is ongoing as opposed to exposure to something like

> mercury in the past, which would never increase.

>

> brian

>

>

>

> OxyPLUS is an unmoderated e-ring dealing with oxidative therapies,

and other

> alternative self-help subjects.

>

> THERE IS NO MEDICAL ADVICE HERE!

>

> This list is the 1st Amendment in action. The things you will find

here are

> for information and research purposes only. We are people sharing

> information we believe in. If you act on ideas found here, you do

so at your

> own risk. Self-help requires intelligence, common sense, and the

ability to

> take responsibility for your own actions. By joining the list you

agree to

> hold yourself FULLY responsible FOR yourself. Do not use any ideas

found

> here without consulting a medical professional, unless you are a

researcher

> or health care provider.

>

> You can unsubscribe via e-mail by sending A NEW e-mail to the

following

> address - NOT TO THE OXYPLUS LIST! -

> DO NOT USE REPLY BUTTON & DO NOT PUT THIS IN THE SUBJECT LINE or

BODY of the

> message! :

>

> oxyplus-unsubscribeegroups

>

> oxyplus-normalonelist - switch your subscription to

normal mode.

>

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Posted
Posted

> > Hi Gail,

> >

> > Thanks for the thoughts and glad to hear another case that has

been

> > helped by the liver cleanses. Hopefully I will notice similar

> > positive effects soon. As far as vitamins and minerals go I

should

> > be pretty well covered (EFAs, potassium, b vits, magnesium, etc)

> >

> > brian

>

> , Gail makes a good point. Perhaps you have become mineral

> deficient. Otoh, if you are reacting to even just steam saunas,

> maybe you are reacting to the heat. Who knows why. Do you have the

> same reaction to ear or rectal insufflation?

I have no reaction at all to ear insufflation (I was doing it for 30

min a day for a couple of months a while back), I have not done

rectal. I think the heat may be an issue, as I have been using FIR

heaters, so I'll change this around a bit and see how it goes.

brian

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Posted
Posted

, I cannot tolerate the FIR (well I have a bulb sauna). I tried

it and it gave me enormous muscle pain and my headaches came back. I

don't know, each to their own, but I had no such reaction to the

steam sauna. Each body is individual. I gave up on FIR, whereas for

Arthur for instance it is obviously really helpful.

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Posted
Posted

Just to clarify, EFT is extremely effective done over the phone, as long as the

client has a diagram of the tapping points.

Sherri-Lee

Looking for safe and natural health products?

http://www.aloeessence.com

Re: Plugged liver [update]

Date: Sun, 04 Apr 2004 13:07:42 -0000

Hi Sherri-Lee,

> Hi ,

>

> I know this wasn't addressed to me, but thought I would jump in, I

hope you don't mind.

>

> I wonder what makes you think you are so special? I don't mean this

in any negative way and you are not the only one who feels this way.

But why do you have toxins that no one else in the world has? Why are

--

The fact that Saul's recommendations both now and in the past have

produced results different than he expected leads me to believe that

my situation may be a little different.

I don't know what is in me as far as toxins go.

---

>you the only person out of the thousands who have followed this

protocol who it is counter-productive for? What is so special about

you that cleansing the body is not the way to go? Again I mean no ill-

will here, I really just want people to pay attention to the words

---

Just a note - it sure sounds like 'ill will' to me. I have no desire

to think of myself as 'special', 'untreatable' or anything like

that. I'm just giving my experiences, and trying to figure out what

I need to do. I'm sorry if you perceive that as a threat for

whatever reason.

>they are using and that their subconscious is dealing with. It has

no intellect, and so only hears what you are saying " I can't be

cleansed like everyone else " " This is counter-productive " " This is a

burden " " Worst month of my life " . All these statements will be

processed literally by your subconsious and more damage than good

will be done.

--

that is not at all the attitude I am taking. I am open to any

suggestions - my initial opinion of the liver cleanses was that the

claims sounded unsubstantiated. At the urging of Saul and other

members on this forum I began them with an open mind, and am

committed to continuing them.

>

> What liver cleanse are you doing? Is it the two day one Saul

recommends based on Hulda 's?

>

I don't know Saul's exact procedure, it is the hulda clarke cleanse

that I am doing.

> It doesn't matter what the toxins in your body are made up of.

It may, in that if they are toxins secreted by a pathogen that the

accumulation is ongoing as opposed to exposure to something like

mercury in the past, which would never increase.

brian

OxyPLUS is an unmoderated e-ring dealing with oxidative therapies, and other

alternative self-help subjects.

THERE IS NO MEDICAL ADVICE HERE!

This list is the 1st Amendment in action. The things you will find here are

for information and research purposes only. We are people sharing

information we believe in. If you act on ideas found here, you do so at your

own risk. Self-help requires intelligence, common sense, and the ability to

take responsibility for your own actions. By joining the list you agree to

hold yourself FULLY responsible FOR yourself. Do not use any ideas found

here without consulting a medical professional, unless you are a researcher

or health care provider.

You can unsubscribe via e-mail by sending A NEW e-mail to the following

address - NOT TO THE OXYPLUS LIST! -

DO NOT USE REPLY BUTTON & DO NOT PUT THIS IN THE SUBJECT LINE or BODY of the

message! :

oxyplus-unsubscribeegroups

oxyplus-normalonelist - switch your subscription to normal mode.

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Posted
Posted

Nice to hear from you Sherri-Lee I like your view and your style.

Dwight Munson

Re: Re: Plugged liver [update]

Hi ,

--

The fact that Saul's recommendations both now and in the past have

produced results different than he expected leads me to believe that

my situation may be a little different.

I don't know what is in me as far as toxins go.

---

I don't know if they are " different " reactions than he expected, definately

they are the healing crisis, perhaps they are stronger or more intense, or you

aren't handling them as he thought you would. We never know how someone will

react to the healing crisis, or where their personal threshold is. I have had a

woman come in with everything under the sun wrong, copd, cancer, MS you name it.

She could barely make it up the stairs. I thought she would make it one session

and that would be it. Well 31 sessions later, she was not using her puffers or

oxygen anymore and coming daily still, until this week, then all of a sudden

things seemed to " take a turn for the worse " she was a little concerned when she

came in, until she heard me say " this is great! you are at a new level of

healing! " and she has kept going. Conversely, I have had other people come in

with one thing wrong (minor in comparison) and have bolted after one or two

sessions because they! couldn't handle the healing reaction. How we personally

handle each faze of the reaction is individual. So maybe Saul can clarify, but I

am not sure that you are having " different " as much as perhaps " stronger "

reactions than he expected.

---

Just a note - it sure sounds like 'ill will' to me. I have no desire

to think of myself as 'special', 'untreatable' or anything like

that. I'm just giving my experiences, and trying to figure out what

I need to do. I'm sorry if you perceive that as a threat for

whatever reason.

-----

Well I am sorry if it sounded like ill-will to you, it was not my intent. You

are giving your experiences yes, with your bias and personal feelings mixed it.

It is not a subjective reporting if you are saying things as

" counter-productive " " burden " and " worse " . These are words that your

sub-consious will not be able to process intellectually and will leave it

feeling as if what you are doing is " counter-productive " a " burden " and " worse " .

I am sorry if I sound mean spirited again, but I think what you might need to do

is suck it up and believe in what you are doing and tough it out. Easier said

than done I know, it just seems to be the way that this works. Accept that you

will feel worse before you will feel better. And when you do congratulate

yourself for being tough and doing what is best for your body.

--

that is not at all the attitude I am taking. I am open to any

suggestions - my initial opinion of the liver cleanses was that the

claims sounded unsubstantiated. At the urging of Saul and other

members on this forum I began them with an open mind, and am

committed to continuing them.

---

I would challenge you about whether this was the attitude you are taking or

not. Certainly I am not in your head or talking to you for hours on end, but

there are the words you use that have a negative effect on your sub-consious.

Why would you feel that the liver cleanse claims were unsubstantiated? Saul and

other members of this forum have endorsed the value of the liver cleanse to you

as part of your healing journey, so what more do you need to make it

substantiated? Just physically doing them is not enough, your mind must be

commited to it too. Your mind has to be commited to the value of it. The fact

that you are so strongly resistant to believing in the liver cleanse, tells me

that this is exactly what you need. As we are trained in EFT, what is resisted

is needed most and what we think sub-consiously affects the outcome of what we

are doing.

----

I don't know Saul's exact procedure, it is the hulda clarke cleanse

that I am doing.

----

Well I don't think there is much difference. Are you seeing much in the way of

stones each time? What kinds of results are you getting from it?

----

It may, in that if they are toxins secreted by a pathogen that the

accumulation is ongoing as opposed to exposure to something like

mercury in the past, which would never increase.

----

It really doesn't matter the source of the toxins. Even if you had no

" pathogens " that might be creating new toxins, you would come into contact with

new toxins daily in your life for the rest of your life. The water you shower

in: do you have a filter system that removes all the crap in the water? The

shampoo you use: Does it contain SLS or any of the other potentially harmful

ingredients used in commercial products? The soap you use: what are those

ingredients? Processed food at all? Do you breath while you are outside? Toxins

live in our air and are ingested into your lungs daily. Our contact with toxins

is ever present and not something we have much control over. What you do have

control over is how much stay in your body. The ozone saunas will eliminate

them. The problem is, if you are sick, you are overloaded with toxins and you

have to remove the toxic heap in your body and then you can keep up on the daily

new load.

Saul's analogy is the rain barrel on the porch. When it rains water drips into

the barrel and slowly over years fills the barrel up. Slowly it fills until it

overflows. But daily water still drips in. So if you want to make it so water

can come in without overflowing (illness), you must remove some of the water in

the barrel first. If you use a teaspoon and only do one teaspoon a day, you are

probably not removing more than is going in daily. So you take out one teaspoon

and more comes in and it still overflows. You don't get anywhere. If, however

you use a tablespoon you take out more than goes in and before long you are

ahead of the flow and the water no longer overflows. This is what you are doing

to your body with the ozone sauna. If you have one sauna a week you are using a

teaspoon on the toxins and you are retaining more than you are getting out. If

you are having 2 or 3 or more a week you are getting ahead of the flow and

making head way on the reserve and in time wi! ll see the benefit of this. Then

when you get the barrel almost empty, you can cut down to one or two saunas a

week and you won't have an overflow situation and can keep up on it. But when

you body is in toxic crisis, you have to get in there and scoop it out like

crazy.

I hope I have clarified what I am saying and any tone of " ill-will " is gone.

That is not what I am feeling, I just want to see everyone benefit and have

their illnesses gone and their lives back as I have experienced.

Sherri-Lee

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Posted
Posted

-

Hi ,

Well, I've still got you on my mind and would just like to chat a

little more. I think it is so important that we find a balance in

all areas of our life, healing being only one factor. What I have

read/heard is when one is detoxing too quickly and overburdening the

liver, it will shut down and that can and does cause death. I know

this might sound tramatic, but it really is. People have actually

died from detoxing too fast causing the liver to shut down.

You know I really don't know what caused my depression when doing the

Beck Protocol, but I always thought it was due to the liver being

overburdened. I can still remember how that felt. When I heard

about the liver actually shuting down and one dieing from detoxing

too fast, I thought it was worth mentioning. Now maybe there are

many informed people here that already knew that. However, I think

it is really hard to truly comprehend exactly what another person is

going throug via the internet. We have ones' words and that is all.

No eye examination to even go on. And even if we did, how many of us

have the proper training to recognize if a liver is shuting down or

even how to treat it.

So.... without out being over tramatic and with the above already

mentioned, please, please closely listen to what your own body is

telling you. Although the norm is what will usually happen, there is

always the exception. And what works for one does not always work

for the other. So if the saunas are causing too much stress on your

body, honor that and back off a little. Our body is really very

smart and how often we fail to listen.

Do take care,

Gail

-- In oxyplus , " brian " <fade_216@y...> wrote:

> Saul,

>

> I have been following your directions below, only doing 20 minute

> saunas instead of 30 minutes, but I'm running into the same

problem.

> The (non ozone) steam saunas seemed to clear my mind up noticeably

> for a week but now I'm getting the same kind of sore throats,

mental

> fatigue and other sorts of symptoms. I feel fairly certain that

the

> cause of this is the that while the sauna is eliminating some

toxins

> through the skin, it is stirring up more toxins within the body

than

> it is eliminating. So the liver is being burdened by the saunas.

My

> first experience with a (non ozone) steam sauna caused the worst

> month of my life (severe depression started literally about 30

> minutes after the sauna), and that was only a 15 minute sauna (my

> body seems significantly 'clearer' than it was at that time

though).

> I have no idea the nature of the toxins in my body, but it seems

> clear that in my case what is prescribed below is very

> counterproductive. I may be able to get away with a sauna every 2

or

> 3 days, so I will have to experiment.

>

> I am continuing with the liver flush every 2 weeks, and doing

various

> exercises to keep lymph moving ..

>

> brian

>

>

> > > Dear Ron,

> > >

> > > Cut the recipe in half for her.

> > >

> > > Poor thing, battered so early...

> > >

> > > Too bad she didn't get ozone instead of poison...

> > >

> > > Oh well, make up for lost time now.

> > >

> > > Best of health!

> > > Dr. Saul

> > >

> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------

--

> ---

> > ----

> > >

> > >

> > > ----Original Message Follows----

> > > From: " Ron Petruccione " <petruccione@s...>

> > > Reply-oxyplus

> > > <oxyplus >

> > > Subject: RE: Re: Plugged liver

> > > Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 08:38:04 -0800

> > >

> > > Saul,

> > > If I want my 9yr. daughter to do the H.C. liver flush should I

> cut

> > > everything by 1/2 or 1/3?

> > > She has been on antibiotics for a good portion of her early

years

> > and only

> > > on again off again the last 4yrs. She was a preemie and was on

> > antibiotics

> > > her first 15days of life. (suspected sepsis)

> > > Take Care,

> > >

> > > Enjoying you book immensely.

> > >

> > > Re: Re: Plugged liver

> > > Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:40:33 -0600

> > >

> > > Hello,

> > > I have always wondered if this cleanse is safe for people who

> have

> > had their

> > > gallbladder taken out????

> > > Thanks

> > > Joan

> > > Re: Ozone injections--and ozonated water

> etc

> > > > Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:55:07 +1000

> > > >

> > > > Can someone tell me exactly what a 'plugged liver' actually

> > means?

> > > > What is plugged and by what?

> > > >

> > > > Thanks,

> > > >

> > > > Sue

> > > >

> > > >

> _________________________________________________________________

> > > > MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*.

> > > >

> > > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

> > > <http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus & pgmarket=en-

ca & RU=http%

> 3a%

> > 2f%2fjoi

> > > n> & pgmarket=en-ca & RU=http%3a%2f%2fjoin

> > > .msn.com%2f%3fpage%3dmisc%2fspecialoffers%26pgmarket%3den-ca

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > OxyPLUS is an unmoderated e-ring dealing with oxidative

> > therapies, and

> > > other alternative self-help subjects.

> > > >

> > > > THERE IS NO MEDICAL ADVICE HERE!

> > > >

> > > > This list is the 1st Amendment in action. The things you

will

> > find here

> > > are for information and research purposes only. We are people

> > sharing

> > > information we believe in. If you act on ideas found here, you

do

> > so at your

> > > own risk. Self-help requires intelligence, common sense, and

the

> > ability to

> > > take responsibility for your own actions. By joining the list

you

> > agree to

> > > hold yourself FULLY responsible FOR yourself. Do not use any

> ideas

> > found

> > > here without consulting a medical professional, unless you are

a

> > researcher

> > > or health care provider.

> > > >

> > > > You can unsubscribe via e-mail by sending A NEW e-mail to

the

> > following

> > > address - NOT TO THE OXYPLUS LIST! -

> > > > DO NOT USE REPLY BUTTON & DO NOT PUT THIS IN THE SUBJECT

LINE

> or

> > BODY of

> > > the message! :

> > > >

> > > > oxyplus-unsubscribeegroups

> > > >

> > > > oxyplus-normalonelist - switch your subscription

to

> > normal

> > > mode.

> > > >

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Posted
Posted

,

I have been thinking about you today and have some thoughts. You commented that

the sauna without the ozone brought on a very difficult faze for you that lasted

a long time. I think it was Arthur (correct me if I am wrong) that suggested the

heat might be causing a problem if you are mercury loaded, which I believe you

told me was an issue for you.I then thought about what my holistic dentist told

me when we talked about removing my amalgams and I told him I did ozone saunas.

His recommendation was to discontinue the saunas because of the heats ability to

mobilize the mercury and move it around the body causing problems, but on it's

own it did not oxidize or remove the mercury. With ozone however the mercury is

oxidized and then excreted out.

So thinking that I can see how the saunas without ozone caused you more

discomfort than the ones with ozone. Perhaps you were mobilizing the mercury but

not eliminating it. Just a thought.

Given the info my dentist gave me, I know I would not do saunas without ozone,

but I would feel completely comfortable with doing saunas with ozone, simply

because of the difference reaction the mercury has with and without it.

Hope you had a good day

Sherri-Lee

Looking for safe and natural health products?

http://www.aloeessence.com

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Posted
Posted

,

I have been thinking about you today and have some thoughts. You commented that

the sauna without the ozone brought on a very difficult faze for you that lasted

a long time. I think it was Arthur (correct me if I am wrong) that suggested the

heat might be causing a problem if you are mercury loaded, which I believe you

told me was an issue for you.I then thought about what my holistic dentist told

me when we talked about removing my amalgams and I told him I did ozone saunas.

His recommendation was to discontinue the saunas because of the heats ability to

mobilize the mercury and move it around the body causing problems, but on it's

own it did not oxidize or remove the mercury. With ozone however the mercury is

oxidized and then excreted out.

So thinking that I can see how the saunas without ozone caused you more

discomfort than the ones with ozone. Perhaps you were mobilizing the mercury but

not eliminating it. Just a thought.

Given the info my dentist gave me, I know I would not do saunas without ozone,

but I would feel completely comfortable with doing saunas with ozone, simply

because of the difference reaction the mercury has with and without it.

Hope you had a good day

Sherri-Lee

Looking for safe and natural health products?

http://www.aloeessence.com

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Posted
Posted

Ummmm.. thank you:) (blushing)....

Sherri-Lee

Looking for safe and natural health products?

http://www.aloeessence.com

Re: Re: Plugged liver [update]

Hi ,

--

The fact that Saul's recommendations both now and in the past have

produced results different than he expected leads me to believe that

my situation may be a little different.

I don't know what is in me as far as toxins go.

---

I don't know if they are " different " reactions than he expected, definately

they are the healing crisis, perhaps they are stronger or more intense, or you

aren't handling them as he thought you would. We never know how someone will

react to the healing crisis, or where their personal threshold is. I have had a

woman come in with everything under the sun wrong, copd, cancer, MS you name it.

She could barely make it up the stairs. I thought she would make it one session

and that would be it. Well 31 sessions later, she was not using her puffers or

oxygen anymore and coming daily still, until this week, then all of a sudden

things seemed to " take a turn for the worse " she was a little concerned when she

came in, until she heard me say " this is great! you are at a new level of

healing! " and she has kept going. Conversely, I have had other people come in

with one thing wrong (minor in comparison) and have bolted after one or two

sessions because they!

---

Just a note - it sure sounds like 'ill will' to me. I have no desire

to think of myself as 'special', 'untreatable' or anything like

that. I'm just giving my experiences, and trying to figure out what

I need to do. I'm sorry if you perceive that as a threat for

whatever reason.

-----

Well I am sorry if it sounded like ill-will to you, it was not my intent.

You are giving your experiences yes, with your bias and personal feelings mixed

it. It is not a subjective reporting if you are saying things as

" counter-productive " " burden " and " worse " . These are words that your

sub-consious will not be able to process intellectually and will leave it

feeling as if what you are doing is " counter-productive " a " burden " and " worse " .

I am sorry if I sound mean spirited again, but I think what you might need to do

is suck it up and believe in what you are doing and tough it out. Easier said

than done I know, it just seems to be the way that this works. Accept that you

will feel worse before you will feel better. And when you do congratulate

yourself for being tough and doing what is best for your body.

--

that is not at all the attitude I am taking. I am open to any

suggestions - my initial opinion of the liver cleanses was that the

claims sounded unsubstantiated. At the urging of Saul and other

members on this forum I began them with an open mind, and am

committed to continuing them.

---

I would challenge you about whether this was the attitude you are taking or

not. Certainly I am not in your head or talking to you for hours on end, but

there are the words you use that have a negative effect on your sub-consious.

Why would you feel that the liver cleanse claims were unsubstantiated? Saul and

other members of this forum have endorsed the value of the liver cleanse to you

as part of your healing journey, so what more do you need to make it

substantiated? Just physically doing them is not enough, your mind must be

commited to it too. Your mind has to be commited to the value of it. The fact

that you are so strongly resistant to believing in the liver cleanse, tells me

that this is exactly what you need. As we are trained in EFT, what is resisted

is needed most and what we think sub-consiously affects the outcome of what we

are doing.

----

I don't know Saul's exact procedure, it is the hulda clarke cleanse

that I am doing.

----

Well I don't think there is much difference. Are you seeing much in the way

of stones each time? What kinds of results are you getting from it?

----

It may, in that if they are toxins secreted by a pathogen that the

accumulation is ongoing as opposed to exposure to something like

mercury in the past, which would never increase.

----

It really doesn't matter the source of the toxins. Even if you had no

" pathogens " that might be creating new toxins, you would come into contact with

new toxins daily in your life for the rest of your life. The water you shower

in: do you have a filter system that removes all the crap in the water? The

shampoo you use: Does it contain SLS or any of the other potentially harmful

ingredients used in commercial products? The soap you use: what are those

ingredients? Processed food at all? Do you breath while you are outside? Toxins

live in our air and are ingested into your lungs daily. Our contact with toxins

is ever present and not something we have much control over. What you do have

control over is how much stay in your body. The ozone saunas will eliminate

them. The problem is, if you are sick, you are overloaded with toxins and you

have to remove the toxic heap in your body and then you can keep up on the daily

new load.

Saul's analogy is the rain barrel on the porch. When it rains water drips

into the barrel and slowly over years fills the barrel up. Slowly it fills until

it overflows. But daily water still drips in. So if you want to make it so water

can come in without overflowing (illness), you must remove some of the water in

the barrel first. If you use a teaspoon and only do one teaspoon a day, you are

probably not removing more than is going in daily. So you take out one teaspoon

and more comes in and it still overflows. You don't get anywhere. If, however

you use a tablespoon you take out more than goes in and before long you are

ahead of the flow and the water no longer overflows. This is what you are doing

to your body with the ozone sauna. If you have one sauna a week you are using a

teaspoon on the toxins and you are retaining more than you are getting out. If

you are having 2 or 3 or more a week you are getting ahead of the flow and

making head way on the reserve and in time wi!

I hope I have clarified what I am saying and any tone of " ill-will " is gone.

That is not what I am feeling, I just want to see everyone benefit and have

their illnesses gone and their lives back as I have experienced.

Sherri-Lee

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Posted
Posted

Ummmm.. thank you:) (blushing)....

Sherri-Lee

Looking for safe and natural health products?

http://www.aloeessence.com

Re: Re: Plugged liver [update]

Hi ,

--

The fact that Saul's recommendations both now and in the past have

produced results different than he expected leads me to believe that

my situation may be a little different.

I don't know what is in me as far as toxins go.

---

I don't know if they are " different " reactions than he expected, definately

they are the healing crisis, perhaps they are stronger or more intense, or you

aren't handling them as he thought you would. We never know how someone will

react to the healing crisis, or where their personal threshold is. I have had a

woman come in with everything under the sun wrong, copd, cancer, MS you name it.

She could barely make it up the stairs. I thought she would make it one session

and that would be it. Well 31 sessions later, she was not using her puffers or

oxygen anymore and coming daily still, until this week, then all of a sudden

things seemed to " take a turn for the worse " she was a little concerned when she

came in, until she heard me say " this is great! you are at a new level of

healing! " and she has kept going. Conversely, I have had other people come in

with one thing wrong (minor in comparison) and have bolted after one or two

sessions because they!

---

Just a note - it sure sounds like 'ill will' to me. I have no desire

to think of myself as 'special', 'untreatable' or anything like

that. I'm just giving my experiences, and trying to figure out what

I need to do. I'm sorry if you perceive that as a threat for

whatever reason.

-----

Well I am sorry if it sounded like ill-will to you, it was not my intent.

You are giving your experiences yes, with your bias and personal feelings mixed

it. It is not a subjective reporting if you are saying things as

" counter-productive " " burden " and " worse " . These are words that your

sub-consious will not be able to process intellectually and will leave it

feeling as if what you are doing is " counter-productive " a " burden " and " worse " .

I am sorry if I sound mean spirited again, but I think what you might need to do

is suck it up and believe in what you are doing and tough it out. Easier said

than done I know, it just seems to be the way that this works. Accept that you

will feel worse before you will feel better. And when you do congratulate

yourself for being tough and doing what is best for your body.

--

that is not at all the attitude I am taking. I am open to any

suggestions - my initial opinion of the liver cleanses was that the

claims sounded unsubstantiated. At the urging of Saul and other

members on this forum I began them with an open mind, and am

committed to continuing them.

---

I would challenge you about whether this was the attitude you are taking or

not. Certainly I am not in your head or talking to you for hours on end, but

there are the words you use that have a negative effect on your sub-consious.

Why would you feel that the liver cleanse claims were unsubstantiated? Saul and

other members of this forum have endorsed the value of the liver cleanse to you

as part of your healing journey, so what more do you need to make it

substantiated? Just physically doing them is not enough, your mind must be

commited to it too. Your mind has to be commited to the value of it. The fact

that you are so strongly resistant to believing in the liver cleanse, tells me

that this is exactly what you need. As we are trained in EFT, what is resisted

is needed most and what we think sub-consiously affects the outcome of what we

are doing.

----

I don't know Saul's exact procedure, it is the hulda clarke cleanse

that I am doing.

----

Well I don't think there is much difference. Are you seeing much in the way

of stones each time? What kinds of results are you getting from it?

----

It may, in that if they are toxins secreted by a pathogen that the

accumulation is ongoing as opposed to exposure to something like

mercury in the past, which would never increase.

----

It really doesn't matter the source of the toxins. Even if you had no

" pathogens " that might be creating new toxins, you would come into contact with

new toxins daily in your life for the rest of your life. The water you shower

in: do you have a filter system that removes all the crap in the water? The

shampoo you use: Does it contain SLS or any of the other potentially harmful

ingredients used in commercial products? The soap you use: what are those

ingredients? Processed food at all? Do you breath while you are outside? Toxins

live in our air and are ingested into your lungs daily. Our contact with toxins

is ever present and not something we have much control over. What you do have

control over is how much stay in your body. The ozone saunas will eliminate

them. The problem is, if you are sick, you are overloaded with toxins and you

have to remove the toxic heap in your body and then you can keep up on the daily

new load.

Saul's analogy is the rain barrel on the porch. When it rains water drips

into the barrel and slowly over years fills the barrel up. Slowly it fills until

it overflows. But daily water still drips in. So if you want to make it so water

can come in without overflowing (illness), you must remove some of the water in

the barrel first. If you use a teaspoon and only do one teaspoon a day, you are

probably not removing more than is going in daily. So you take out one teaspoon

and more comes in and it still overflows. You don't get anywhere. If, however

you use a tablespoon you take out more than goes in and before long you are

ahead of the flow and the water no longer overflows. This is what you are doing

to your body with the ozone sauna. If you have one sauna a week you are using a

teaspoon on the toxins and you are retaining more than you are getting out. If

you are having 2 or 3 or more a week you are getting ahead of the flow and

making head way on the reserve and in time wi!

I hope I have clarified what I am saying and any tone of " ill-will " is gone.

That is not what I am feeling, I just want to see everyone benefit and have

their illnesses gone and their lives back as I have experienced.

Sherri-Lee

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Share on other sites
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Guest guest

Posted
Posted

..I then thought about what my holistic dentist told me when we

talked about removing my amalgams and I told him I did ozone saunas.

His recommendation was to discontinue the saunas because of the

heats ability to mobilize the mercury and move it around the body

causing problems, but on it's own it did not oxidize or remove the

mercury. With ozone however the mercury is oxidized and then

excreted out.

Hello Sherri-Lee,

If you are aware of any source of information that would

explain or verify how ozone can OXIDIZE mercury, could you

please post more about it.

good wishes,

Moria

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Posted
Posted

Hi Gail,

I think it is clear to me now what is going on. Many observations

from the past 6 months make more sense now. My doctor ran a list

of 'checkup' tests 2 months ago and liver function was very low, he

referred to the condition as 'hepatitis'. A month later it was back

into the lower end of the normal range. I noticed that DMSA doses

for mercury were making me sicker and sicker and the ozone saunas

seemed to gradually have the exact opposite effect that they had in

the beginning. My vision was getting blurrier, teeth started aching,

more sleep disturbances etc. So it's really clear that I need to

stop any kind of ozone or mercury chelation and just do the liver

cleanse for a while. I can imagine how death could result from

states like this...

Saul (if you're reading this) - do you believe it's safer to do mild

saunas in a severely liver burdened state, or safer to do no saunas

at all for a little while? Unfortunately I tried your suggestion of

drinking ozone water yesterday (I drank about 1/4-1/3 gallon

throughout the day between meals), but it seemed to cause a nasty

psychotic-like depression (which is a little better today). I was

hoping the ozone water would cause diarrhea in order to get that

stuff out of my system, but no such luck. Would fiber supplements

help this liver detox? Or laxatives taken in moderation (such as

epsom salts)?

brian

> > > > Dear Ron,

> > > >

> > > > Cut the recipe in half for her.

> > > >

> > > > Poor thing, battered so early...

> > > >

> > > > Too bad she didn't get ozone instead of poison...

> > > >

> > > > Oh well, make up for lost time now.

> > > >

> > > > Best of health!

> > > > Dr. Saul

> > > >

> > > > -------------------------------------------------------------

--

> --

> > ---

> > > ----

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ----Original Message Follows----

> > > > From: " Ron Petruccione " <petruccione@s...>

> > > > Reply-oxyplus

> > > > <oxyplus >

> > > > Subject: RE: Re: Plugged liver

> > > > Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 08:38:04 -0800

> > > >

> > > > Saul,

> > > > If I want my 9yr. daughter to do the H.C. liver flush should

I

> > cut

> > > > everything by 1/2 or 1/3?

> > > > She has been on antibiotics for a good portion of her early

> years

> > > and only

> > > > on again off again the last 4yrs. She was a preemie and was

on

> > > antibiotics

> > > > her first 15days of life. (suspected sepsis)

> > > > Take Care,

> > > >

> > > > Enjoying you book immensely.

> > > >

> > > > Re: Re: Plugged liver

> > > > Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:40:33 -0600

> > > >

> > > > Hello,

> > > > I have always wondered if this cleanse is safe for people

who

> > have

> > > had their

> > > > gallbladder taken out????

> > > > Thanks

> > > > Joan

> > > > Re: Ozone injections--and ozonated

water

> > etc

> > > > > Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2004 11:55:07 +1000

> > > > >

> > > > > Can someone tell me exactly what a 'plugged liver'

actually

> > > means?

> > > > > What is plugged and by what?

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks,

> > > > >

> > > > > Sue

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > _________________________________________________________________

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> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > OxyPLUS is an unmoderated e-ring dealing with oxidative

> > > therapies, and

> > > > other alternative self-help subjects.

> > > > >

> > > > > THERE IS NO MEDICAL ADVICE HERE!

> > > > >

> > > > > This list is the 1st Amendment in action. The things you

> will

> > > find here

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people

> > > sharing

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you

> do

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