Re: Chronic Diarrhea - is it related?

[Guest guest]

Actually, that is a possibility. Have you mentioned the chronic diarrhea

to the doctor??? I was told that Sam's IgG was lost through the proteins

in his bowel movements. I've heard of situations where the chronic

diarrhea was stopped and the IgG levels increased. Seems like that has

happened to a member of this group. (?) You might find some info in the

archives on this.

Which of 's level's were tested? Just basic IgG, or the sub-levels

and IgA?

IgA is the antibody found in the respiratory and digestive systems, so the

kids with low or no IgA do not have as much defense in those systems,

though my son, whose IgA counts measure less than 6 (and the test they did

only goes down to 6), rarely has these problems anymore, but his PID is

genetic so the low IgG exists regardless.

I've been meaning to welcome you to the group and also was going to mention

that people always want to handle babies, even more so when they belong to

the pastor and his wife. If you haven't already done so, you may want to

caution your congregation about washing their hands before handling

. You may even want to consider carrying around a hand sanitizer,

at least until you have more info about what is going on with his health.

Another thought, allergies can cause diarrhea. You may want to look for a

pattern in his eating. There are other things that contribute to

malabsorption, and there are probably others on the list that can offer

more suggestions from personal experience. Sometimes it's due to the

" good " bacteria having been eradicated from use of antibiotics. My son is

on daily antibiotics, so I make sure that there is always yogurt in the

refrig. Luckily, it's one of his favorite snacks.

Praying you get some answers.

God bless,

Wenoka ( AMY - 10 / - 7, Hyper IgM Syndrome, Sensory Integration

Disorder, Seizure Disorder, / Christi - 3, but says she's 5 when she wants

to be a " big girl " and says that she's 2 when she wants to be a " little

bitty girl " )

At 09:33 PM 08/27/2004 -0000, you wrote:

> Hi!

>

> I was curious if any

> of you know of a connection between immune system problems and

> has had chronic

> In one day, he'll have 5 or 6

> episodes of diarrhea, but sometimes in the middle of that, he can

> He usually has an episode within 30 minutes of a> Many times, his food

goes through totally undigested.

>

> He weighed 24 pounds at his 15 month check up and now at 18 months

> old, he only weighs 23 pounds.

>

> He just had another stool culture done and it came back negative, so

> that is not the culprit.

>

> All of this may be normal, common, toddler diarrhea, but I'm curious

> if there is a connection between his constant illnesses, frequent

> Sometimes I just wonder if we have a

> bunch of pieces to a puzzle and we're just waiting for someone to put

> it all together.....

>

> Thanks,

> Connie (Mommy to - 18 months old with low IgG)

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you for replying, Wenoka. It is interesting that your son has

sensory issues. does as well. For the past year we've been

trying to rule out seizures and determine if his " unusual movements "

are seizures or some kind of sensory " stimming " . One E.E.G. came

back abnormal, but the next one came back " normal " . Our pediatrician

wants to do another one in the near future to see what it says. He

has been in Occupational Therapy since he was 10 months old.

Thank you also for what you said about him being in church. Trust

me - that has been a HUGE battle and I have taken a alot of flack for

it too. Our church nursery does not have a " no sick kids " policy and

there are always sick children in there. I've never left in

the nursery and that has never gone over well with our church

members. There are a few people who understand and support our

decision, but most people feel that I am over-reacting and snobbish.

I think 's diarrhea may be allergy related. My grandmother

had severe food allergies. It took 7 formulas to finally find one

that he could keep down. We have not been able to take him off

Isomil (soy formula) and switch him to milk or even soy milk because

it appears to make his diarrhea worse.

He is such a complex little boy -- he has had so many issues that i

often wonder if they're all related or if they're all seperate

issues. I just hope and pray that some doctor will eventually put

all the pieces together and figure out how to help him.

Thanks again,

Connie - Mommy to (18 months old) - on day 6 of a NASTY cold

that just won't go away!

[Guest guest]

from Dale, Mom to Katy, CVID, age 20

> I was curious if any

>of you know of a connection between immune system problems and

>chronic diarrhea (not caused by infections).

>

YES, YES, YES, YES!!!!!!

Let's see if I can remember all the possible reasons the gut can be

involved with PID.

#1 There could be something totally unrelated going on - like

allergies, or maladsorption, etc.

#2 The diarrhea could be caused by parasites -- especially giardia --

not something they automatically check for if you've not traveled

outside the U.S. but is VERY common for PIDs.

#3 The diarrhea could be caused by bacteria in the gut (but you've

ruled that out with stool studies).

#4 The diarrhea could be caused by bacterial overgrowth in the gut.

While the bacteria is normal for " normal " people and doesn't show up on

a stool study, it could still be causing problems. That's usually

tested with a " breath test " .

#5 The diarrhea could be caused by trace amounts of bacteria in food,

etc. that is triggering an immune response that is attacking everything

and making it raw! Once the lining of the gut has been irritated --

then you can get into a cascade of worsening symptoms. That's why a

normal person must watch what they eat right after a diarrhea attack so

that it doesn't further irritate the gut. for Katy, this phenomena

led to 3 years of diarrhea that almost killed her -- yet, nothing showed

up on the stool studies, no bacterial overgrowth was found. But on

endoscopy they found that her gut was just majorly inflamed. We had to

break the cycle of diarrhea by first a liquid diet and then soft foods,

etc. While that would break the cycle for a day or two, she would be

back into trouble within 2 days. We now believe that #6 was the

primary problem.

#6 The diarrhea could be caused by food in the gut that is not

protected by IgA. In a healthy person, IgA molecules attach to the

food so that it passes through the gut without being attacked. If you

are low on IgA, you'll have more stomach irritations just because the

body starts attacking food -- thinking it is a germ! However, IgM can

compensate -- so more problems are seen with CVID than with selective

IgA deficiency.

The figures I have based on a lecture at IDF back in 2000 was that CVID

is the most common PID to have GI problems. IgA deficiency have much

less problems because they can compensate with IgM. This

gastroenterologist's figure was that 60% of CVID patients also report

chronic diarrhea. The IDF survey of 1999 shows 30% of PID's in general

have chronic diarrhea.

Then, #7 is that the diarrhea may be caused by frequent use of

antibiotics. We also saw this with Katy and found that anytime she's on

antibiotics -- we also treat with Acidophilos. Talk to your

pediatrician about dosage, etc.

And #8 is that auto-immune inflammatory diseases sometimes become a

problem for PIDs. And that just means that while our immune system

doesn't work well -- it over compensates in some areas -- and that quite

often results in an attack of the gut. However, Irritable Bowel

Disease is only seen in 5.6% of CVID'ers according to this

gastroenterologist.

And #9 is very, very rare but is called nodular lymphoid hyperplasia and

is caused by lymph nodes in the bowel wall becoming too large and the

gut trying to " dump " them causing major problems.

Is Chronic Diarrhea related to PIDs - YUP!!!

Once Katy started IVIG, stopped all lactose intake (because her

endoscope showed her to be lactose intolerant), went to a soft diet for

about a month -- her gut began to heal. When she was home this summer

she was eating ice cream and even putting milk on her cereal. When I

commented, she said that as long as she didn't drink a whole glass of

milk, or eat ice cream two days in a row, she was fine. She still has

very loose stool more than she has " normal " stool. But most days it's

not more than once or twice and she considers that normal and healthy

for her. She doesn't tolerate a lot of fat and if she overeats fat,

she'll have a major " dump " . We don't know what causes that -- but

she's willing to live with it.

Hope that helps you to think through some of the possibilities.

In His service,

Dale

[Guest guest]

Hi Connie,

My name is Amy and my son Bradley (2 years old) also has chronic diarrhea. He

will also have 5 to 6 in a day. Then the next day he might not go at all. In

May at his 2 year check up he weighed only 24lbs. He does not eat well on most

days or he only eats " bad " foods. I do think that it is related to his low IGA.

I sure that does not help you too much but I thought you might like to know that

there is another kiddo with this problem. Best of luck to you.....Potty

training is hard with this problem.

God bless and Best of health to all.

Amy (mom to Bradley 2 iga def, and 6)

Chronic Diarrhea - is it related?

Hi!

Thanks again for the welcome and information. I was curious if any

of you know of a connection between immune system problems and

chronic diarrhea (not caused by infections). has had chronic

diarrhea for the past 6 months or so. In one day, he'll have 5 or 6

episodes of diarrhea, but sometimes in the middle of that, he can

have a normal BM. He usually has an episode within 30 minutes of a

meal. Many times, his food goes through totally undigested.

He weighed 24 pounds at his 15 month check up and now at 18 months

old, he only weighs 23 pounds.

He just had another stool culture done and it came back negative, so

that is not the culprit.

All of this may be normal, common, toddler diarrhea, but I'm curious

if there is a connection between his constant illnesses, frequent

fevers, and this diarrhea. Sometimes I just wonder if we have a

bunch of pieces to a puzzle and we're just waiting for someone to put

it all together.....

Thanks,

Connie (Mommy to - 18 months old with low IgG)

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[Guest guest]

Just a thought to anyone struggling with chronic diarrhea -- my two daughters

both had frequent loose stools, and it turned out to be a reaction to dairy.

The dairy even gets in your breast milk, so if you are nursing your child can

react to YOUR dairy. I mention it because the peds did not figure this out,

even when eventually GERD, eczema and intermittent facial rashes factored in.

And horrible diaper rashes as if the stool was acid! In hindsight it was so

obvious! And there is dairy in nearly all packaged food, there are many hidden

forms of it. You can e-mail me privately for more information.

Hope that helps --

(mom to , age 5-1/2, dairy intolerant-related GERD -- currently

has polysaccharide antibody def, previously had transient IgG, IgA, t-cell &

other defs... and also to Kate, born 9/19/02, dairy intolerant)