Re: Stress symptoms?

[Guest guest]

>: "What are your symptoms of stress?"TMJ, see: http://www.med.umich.edu/1libr/aha/aha_tempmanj_crs.htm"Frequent clenching of the jaw or grinding of the teeth (the most common cause). You may clench your jaws or grind your teeth when you are feeling stressed or sleeping."Rainbow

[Guest guest]

I would say yes I definately stim more when I am under stress. I am

also more sensitive to background sounds, tactile sensitivity and

other stimulus when under stress, which in turn makes me more easily

irritable. Communication (talking) gets harder too although it only

gets to a point where I can't really control it under exteme

stress. I will also notice that I am more detached, flighty,

unfocus when under stress. Severe stress can also make my

personality more childlike.

Ilah

>

> Hi,

>

> just thinking of the symptoms of stress and do they bring out more

> autistic/AS symptoms in a person?

>

> I found I stim more when under stress and if I stop myself from

> stimming I am likely to self harm.

>

> Also I find I have more unwanted thoughts (and they are

overwhelming)

> when under stress - though I am currently on medication for them.

>

> Also I find myself running through my mind over and over again,

> whatever is the cause of my stress to try and get it straight - to

> try and gain clarification - or at least a satisfactory answer to

> whatever it is causing me stress.

>

> I am also finding myself detaching more - like going into my own

> world more - but still with a foot in the door of reality - like

just

> functioning at the bare necessity - but I kind of find the

detaching

> helpful and am used to it anyway.

>

> What are your symptoms of stress?

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

said:

" just thinking of the symptoms of stress and do they bring out more

autistic/AS symptoms in a person? "

For me they do.

" I found I stim more when under stress and if I stop myself from

stimming I am likely to self harm. "

I will bounce my lejft leg when stressed, tap pens, chew them, etc.

" Also I find I have more unwanted thoughts (and they are overwhelming)

when under stress - though I am currently on medication for them. "

I give voice to unwanted thoughts, but seldom think of actually

ACTING upon them.

" Also I find myself running through my mind over and over again,

whatever is the cause of my stress to try and get it straight - to

try and gain clarification - or at least a satisfactory answer to

whatever it is causing me stress. "

I used to do this, but through counseling I was able to realign my

manner of thinking in this area. I have come to realize that there

are only so many variables that are possible when the data is

limited, and so once I feel I have exhausted all possible avenues of

thought, I stop myself and turn my mind elsewhere.

It was not easy to achieve this, but I seemed to have mastered it as

far as moderately stressful situations are concerned. I still have

some work to do when the stress is extreme. Then I constantly think

worst case scenarios and cannot get them out of my mind.

I " am also finding myself detaching more - like going into my own

world more - but still with a foot in the door of reality - like just

functioning at the bare necessity - but I kind of find the detaching

helpful and am used to it anyway. "

This is my most common symptom. I actually develop a sort of tunnel

vision and begin to feel as though my body is a vessel which I reside

inside of. The more I am stressed, the deeper I live in it until it

seems as though everyone and everything is more like a movie I watch

on TV than anything real.

Tom

Administrator

[Guest guest]

I understand that this is called dissociation. As far as I understand many people on the autism spectrum are able to dissociate.

I know I live the biggest part of my days in dissociation; it is a 'tool' for me to live my life and I like it. A friend of mine also dissociates but uses medication for it because he really feels dissociating is a problem to him. I never understood why he expierences this as a problem.

Lida

Tom and wrote:

I" am also finding myself detaching more - like going into my ownworld more - but still with a foot in the door of reality - like justfunctioning at the bare necessity - but I kind of find the detachinghelpful and am used to it anyway."This is my most common symptom. I actually develop a sort of tunnel vision and begin to feel as though my body is a vessel which I reside inside of. The more I am stressed, the deeper I live in it until it seems as though everyone and everything is more like a movie I watch on TV than anything real.TomAdministrator

[Guest guest]

Lida:

> I understand that this is called dissociation. As far as I understand many

people on the autism spectrum are able to dissociate.

>

> I know I live the biggest part of my days in dissociation; it is a 'tool'

for me to live my life and I like it. A friend of mine also

> dissociates but uses medication for it because he really feels

dissociating is a problem to him. I never understood why he

> expierences this as a problem.

Neither do I. He probably has been taught this by NTs that think this is

problematic behavior.

: (?)

> I " am also finding myself detaching more - like going into my own

> world more - but still with a foot in the door of reality - like just

> functioning at the bare necessity - but I kind of find the detaching

> helpful and am used to it anyway. "

Tom:

> This is my most common symptom. I actually develop a sort of tunnel

> vision and begin to feel as though my body is a vessel which I reside

> inside of. The more I am stressed, the deeper I live in it until it

> seems as though everyone and everything is more like a movie I watch

> on TV than anything real.

Yes, me too. I think I've developped a rather useful response to stress

which rarely makes me reach high levels of frustration. As people start

to put more and more conflicting demands on me I simply detach more

and more. When I do this I am also able to hyperfocus on the important

points instead of all the irrelevant stimuli the environment feeds you with.

That's why I think I work most effiently under stress but still never comes

anywhere near being burnt out.

Leif

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Lida:>> I understand that this is called dissociation. As far as I understand manypeople on the autism spectrum are able to dissociate.>>> I know I live the biggest part of my days in dissociation; it is a 'tool'for me to live my life and I like it. A friend of mine also>> dissociates but uses medication for it because he really feelsdissociating is a problem to him. I never understood why he>> expierences this as a problem.

Leif: >Neither do I. He probably has been taught this by NTs that think this isproblematic behavior.

I think you are right about this. I have noticed during the time that psychologists were trying to figure what was 'wrong' with me, that they seem to think that if you avoid (emotional) pain or unpleasant situations and have found a way to not let that overtake you, they think this is a very bad thing to do. As if the idea has been grounded in their brains that "you must suffer before you are allowed to feel fine'. In the Netherlands with its strong calvinistic influences, this is a general idea in society here.

Of course it is good to notice painful situations, because it helps one to change strategy or concepts, or whatever. It is a sign to do things in a different way. But if you have found a way to handle painful situations (f.e. dissociation) and you really handle that (knowing how to change not being dissociated when reality needs you to be 'present') I think it is a great tool to avoid unnecessary stress.

There seem to be many assumptions/concepts like the one that 'one should suffer befor being allowed to feel fine'. I used to believe these ideas, but I have left most of them behind me during my life when I could see for myself that many of those assumptions are just not true to me. I think that learning how to deal with pain is one of life's challenges and where one is supposed to be 'creative'. (By 'creative' I mean: one must create his/her own way. In my opinion creativity is what life is about. I don't mean that everybody should do some painting or things like that, but one should create his/her own personal way to solve life problems. One can take an example in others, but everyone needs to do things his/her own way and copying is not creative. Accepting concepts without rethink them for yourself is a way of living in which one avoids to take responsability for oneself, I think.)

Leif:

>Yes, me too. I think I've developped a rather useful response to stresswhich rarely makes me reach high levels of frustration. As people startto put more and more conflicting demands on me I simply detach moreand more. When I do this I am also able to hyperfocus on the importantpoints instead of all the irrelevant stimuli the environment feeds you with.That's why I think I work most effiently under stress but still never comesanywhere near being burnt out.

I agree on this. My burnout was because I was doing the job of 4 fulltimers just on my own. Not enough hours in a day to also being able to rest. But the stress of a company who got franchised, reorganized and many around me being fired did not cause me stress-overload.

Lida

[Guest guest]

Lida:

> I think you are right about this. I have noticed during the time that

psychologists were trying to

> figure what was 'wrong' with me, that they seem to think that if you avoid

(emotional) pain

> or unpleasant situations and have found a way to not let that overtake

you, they think this

> is a very bad thing to do.

I've always avoided painful and dangerous situations. This is probably close

to " innate "

to me.

> As if the idea has been grounded in their brains that " you must suffer

before you are allowed

> to feel fine'.

There might be something to this, because I always feel especially good

after having

handled a hard situation, especially an intellectual one, but this doesn't

mean I need to

seek painful situations just for the thrill of it. I tend to seek

intellectual challenges instead

of painful situations. That gives the greatest reward for me.

> In the Netherlands with its strong calvinistic influences, this is a

general idea in society here.

> Of course it is good to notice painful situations, because it helps one to

change strategy

> or concepts, or whatever. It is a sign to do things in a different way.

But if you have found

> a way to handle painful situations (f.e. dissociation) and you really

handle that (knowing

> how to change not being dissociated when reality needs you to be

'present') I think it is a

> great tool to avoid unnecessary stress.

Yes, I need to dissociate regulary to feel good. It seems to be just as

necesary as sleep.

> I agree on this. My burnout was because I was doing the job of 4

fulltimers just on my own.

Ouch.

I think the most dangerous for me is when I have too many things that should

be done. I

work best with one task at a time, hyperfocusing on it. If I have to switch

a lot between

tasks I get stressed in the NT-sense of it. In such situations I'm very

ineffiecient and need

extraordinary motivation to get started, especially if I know something

hinders the completion

of the task.

Leif

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Leif and (I) Lida wrote:

Lida:>>> I think you are right about this. I have noticed during the time thatpsychologists were trying to>>> figure what was 'wrong' with me, that they seem to think that if you avoid(emotional) pain>>> or unpleasant situations and have found a way to not let that overtakeyou, they think this>>> is a very bad thing to do.>>I've always avoided painful and dangerous situations. This is probably closeto "innate"to me.>>> As if the idea has been grounded in their brains that "you must sufferbefore you are allowed>>> to feel fine'.

Leif:>There might be something to this, because I always feel especially goodafter havinghandled a hard situation, especially an intellectual one, but this doesn'tmean I need toseek painful situations just for the thrill of it. I tend to seekintellectual challenges insteadof painful situations. That gives the greatest reward for me.

I can understand that: if one is able to bring up selfdisciplin that can make you feel better about yourself. But that is not what I tried to write I think... I meant the idea that one must 'suffer', kind of 'life is a suffer', like life is meant to be a kind of torture but we must be sort of victims of life who are able to understand that we must suffer in silence, 'be strong' by confronting ourselves with lots of pain. (There seems to be this mystical way of thinking that the more you suffer and you were able to survive that, the more was your life worth and the more you prooved to being strong.) More an idea of "pain makes you stronger". While what I see around is that emotional pain mostly is not making people stronger but insecure, uncertain about life, things like that. What makes people stronger is to be able to make changes.

I don't think pain is something that one needs to 'go trough' as deep as one can, but one has to notice it and look for the reason of the pain and see if one can change anything to make that one doesn't need that pain as a warning again that something is not going right.

Lida

[Guest guest]

Lida:

> I can understand that: if one is able to bring up selfdisciplin that can

make you feel better

>about yourself. But that is not what I tried to write I think... I meant

the idea that one must

> 'suffer', kind of 'life is a suffer', like life is meant to be a kind of

torture but we must be sort

> of victims of life who are able to understand that we must suffer in

silence, 'be strong' by

> confronting ourselves with lots of pain.

I really cannot understand why this would be something to seek. Logically,

there is massive

proof that such things will cause long-time adversive effects (PTS for

instance).

> (There seems to be this mystical way of thinking that the more you suffer

and you were able

> to survive that, the more was your life worth and the more you prooved to

being strong.)

I would attribute this as a NT trait. Kind of like their yearning to kill

each others in wars and

street-fights. I cannot understand why they would feel good about such

terrible things. It only

makes me sick.

> More an idea of " pain makes you stronger " . While what I see around is that

emotional pain

> mostly is not making people stronger but insecure, uncertain about life,

things like that.

Yep, this is the way I see it too, and probably psychology does the same.

> What makes people stronger is to be able to make changes.

> I don't think pain is something that one needs to 'go trough' as deep as

one can, but one has to

> notice it and look for the reason of the pain and see if one can change

anything to make that one

> doesn't need that pain as a warning again that something is not going

right.

No, pain is something I would avoid. Maybe it is " cool " to be able to

sustain pain, and therefore

NTs go through this to be " cool " ? In initiation rites at least this seems to

be the case. The motivation

is acceptance into society.

Leif

[Guest guest]

Leif and Lida wrote:

Lida

> (There seems to be this mystical way of thinking that the more you sufferand you were able> to survive that, the more was your life worth and the more you prooved tobeing strong.)Leif

I would attribute this as a NT trait. Kind of like their yearning to killeach others in wars andstreet-fights. I cannot understand why they would feel good about suchterrible things. It onlymakes me sick.

Lida> More an idea of "pain makes you stronger". While what I see around is thatemotional pain> mostly is not making people stronger but insecure, uncertain about life,things like that.

LeifYep, this is the way I see it too, and probably psychology does the same.

Lida> What makes people stronger is to be able to make changes.> I don't think pain is something that one needs to 'go trough' as deep asone can, but one has to> notice it and look for the reason of the pain and see if one can changeanything to make that one> doesn't need that pain as a warning again that something is not goingright.

Leif>No, pain is something I would avoid. Maybe it is "cool" to be able tosustain pain, and thereforeNTs go through this to be "cool"? In initiation rites at least this seems tobe the case. The motivationis acceptance into society.Yes. I think it probably has to do with that.

Lida

[Guest guest]

Lida & Leif,

I've been reading this fascinating exchange and just have to comment on it.

Lida:

>> I have noticed during the time that psychologists were trying to figure

>> what was 'wrong' with me, that they seem to think that if you avoid

>> (emotional) pain or unpleasant situations and have found a way to not let

>> that overtake you, they think this is a very bad thing to do.

>

Leif:

> I've always avoided painful and dangerous situations. This is probably

> close to " innate " to me.

I too tend to avoid stress and pain if I can. I think that's a very good

strategy if you're as sensitive as Aspies often are. The things that work

for non-autistics would probably have a detrimental effect on us.

Lida:

>> As if the idea has been grounded in their brains that " you must suffer

>> before you are allowed to feel fine'.

Leif:

> There might be something to this, because I always feel especially good

> after having handled a hard situation, especially an intellectual one, but

> this doesn't mean I need to seek painful situations just for the thrill of

> it. I tend to seek intellectual challenges instead of painful situations.

> That gives the greatest reward for me.

That's probably because you are mentally oriented rather than physical. I

too feel good after sorting out a challenge, be it physical, emotional or

intellectual. And even after being ill or having an accident, from the

release of endorphins. I guess that's why I used to enjoy some types of

physical pain too; getting high on natural opiates. Now that I no longer

like getting high, I also don't particularly like physical pain anymore.

Interesting, huh?

Leif:

>I think the most dangerous for me is when I have too many things that

>should be done. I work best with one task at a time, hyperfocusing on it.

>If I have to switch a lot between tasks I get stressed in the NT-sense of

>it. In such situations I'm very ineffiecient and need extraordinary

>motivation to get started, especially if I know something hinders the

>completion of the task.

Same here. I easily get overwhelmed, especially from my own THOUGHTS of all

that needs to be done. But if I have too little to do I get bored. I prefer

a moderate amount of challenge.

Lida:

> I can understand that: if one is able to bring up selfdisciplin that can

> make you feel better about yourself. But that is not what I tried to write

> I think... I meant the idea that one must 'suffer', kind of 'life is a

> suffer', like life is meant to be a kind of torture but we must be sort of

> victims of life who are able to understand that we must suffer in silence,

> 'be strong' by confronting ourselves with lots of pain.

In Chinese and Japanese religions there are these views that having it too

good makes you too soft, in Hinduism that its good to suffer because you

then make a mortgage on your karmic debts, in Buddhism that abstaining from

all you desire will get you quicker to Nirvana.

In the West, we have the Stoic school of thought where you just ignore the

pain of life and do your best anyway, the Spartan view, which is pretty much

like the Samurai view that lack of suffering makes you useless as a warrior,

and Christianity which implies that your reward will be all the greater in

heaven if you only endure some hardships in this life. (Perhaps Islam too?)

And then the 'social Darwinism' idea of the 'survival of the fittest'.

All of which COULD be true, but they could also be devised or at least used

by those in power to make people more compliant, put up with endless amounts

of stress & suffering and willing to do whatever they are told without

complaining.

Lida:

> I really cannot understand why this would be something to seek. Logically,

> there is massive

proof that such things will cause long-time adversive effects (PTS for

instance).

Right. Though that also depends on the type and amount of stress, as well as

on how sensitive the individual is. For highly sensitive people, even an

everyday thing that others don't even think twice about can be intensely

traumatic.

Lida:

>> (There seems to be this mystical way of thinking that the more you suffer

>> and you were able to survive that, the more was your life worth and the

>> more you prooved to being strong.)

>

Leif:

> I would attribute this as a NT trait. Kind of like their yearning to kill

> each others in wars and

street-fights. I cannot understand why they would feel good about such

terrible things. It only

makes me sick.

Leif, not every non-autistic person yearns to kill, and not everyone on the

spectrum is free from such urges, so let's not oversimplify things into

unnecessary prejudices, please. Tolerance or non-tolerane for violence is

often more tied to class, culture, personality type, spiritual maturity etc.

Though I have to admit that mainstream culture sure gives mixed messages

when, on the one hand, it is not acceptable at all to be violent or even

'rude' enough to tell your honest opinion about things, but on the other

hand overwhelms everyone from an early age with floods of sickening

violence, crime and horror for 'entertainment'. Just doesn't make sense.

Lida:

>> More an idea of " pain makes you stronger " . While what I see around is

>> that emotional pain mostly is not making people stronger but insecure,

>> uncertain about life, things like that.

>

Leif:

> Yep, this is the way I see it too, and probably psychology does the same.

I suspect that psychologists don't understand emotionally hypersensitive

people. With the people who have 'turned off' as their 'default state' (as

Lida calls it) it is usually very healing and liberating to get in touch

with their feelings and inner pain. But those who are just TOO in touch with

their pain on a daily basis, it is probably more helpful and healing to get

a REST from it. Psychologists seem to assume that everyone is the same and

that only the first type exists.

Lida:

> What makes people stronger is to be able to make changes. I don't think

> pain is something that one needs to 'go trough' as deep as one can, but

> one has to notice it and look for the reason of the pain and see if one

> can change anything to make that one doesn't need that pain as a warning

> again that something is not going right.

That's after all what pain is there for: to alert us that something is

wrong, so that we get a clue as to what needs to be changed. When we remove

the cause, the pain stops.

Leif:

> No, pain is something I would avoid. Maybe it is " cool " to be able to

> sustain pain, and therefore

NTs go through this to be " cool " ? In initiation rites at least this seems to

be the case. The motivation

is acceptance into society.

Yes, sensitivity is equalled to weakness. The idea is to toughen you up. The

cruder the culture, the more focus is put on enduring physical pain, while

the more 'sophisticated' is mainly about enduring verbal insults and

humiliation. I frankly don't see why one should have to endure either. :-?

Inger

P.S. Thanks everyone for giving me some new insights here. I may have to

revise some of my own views on this subject.

[Guest guest]

Lida,

Somehow, I have gotten the impression from non-Aspies that the

PROCESS of valiaintly struggling against the odds whilst suffering

terribly and then recovering is of more importance than simply

working hard to overcome the odds and succeeding.

This must be some sort of social thing. If you " play the tragic

hero " then you are " more the man " if you are male or " more the

woman " if you are female. But if you simply do what needs to be done

in the most simple and straightforward manner, you are ridiculed.

When I was five my mom took me to a baby shower because she could

not find a sitter for me, and the women were talking about the

arduous and painful childbirths they had to endure.

One woman said, " I took drugs and got it over with. I didn't feel a

thing. It was quick, painless, no-muss, no fuss. "

One of the women just looked at her and said, " Oh. "

And the rest of them went back to talking about painful births.

Tom

Hi,

I meant the idea that one must 'suffer', kind of 'life is a suffer',

like life is meant to be a kind of torture but we must be sort of

victims of life who are able to understand that we must suffer in

silence, 'be strong' by confronting ourselves with lots of pain.

(There seems to be this mystical way of thinking that the more you

suffer and you were able to survive that, the more was your life

worth and the more you prooved to being strong.) More an idea

of " pain makes you stronger " . While what I see around is that

emotional pain mostly is not making people stronger but insecure,

uncertain about life, things like that. What makes people stronger

is to be able to make changes.

I don't think pain is something that one needs to 'go trough' as

deep as one can, but one has to notice it and look for the reason of

the pain and see if one can change anything to make that one doesn't

need that pain as a warning again that something is not going right.

Lida

[Guest guest]

" Christianity which implies that your reward will be all the greater in

heaven if you only endure some hardships in this life. "

That is incorrect. It is said in the Bible that God will give you all

that you need provided you follow His laws and do what He says. The

more you serve God and help your fellow man, the easier your life will

be on earth. But the more you work against man, or the more you sin,

the more hardships you will endure. These hardships are not so much

punishments as lessons to keep people in line and remind them what

they stand to sacrifice in the afterlife if they persist with

disobeying God and living in sin.

Tom

[Guest guest]

But then, many are quick to be jealous of you if they think you

have/had it easier than then in any way. Huh? Another example of the

confusing social ideas of NT's.

> Somehow, I have gotten the impression from non-Aspies that the

> PROCESS of valiaintly struggling against the odds whilst suffering

> terribly and then recovering is of more importance than simply

> working hard to overcome the odds and succeeding.

>

> This must be some sort of social thing. If you " play the tragic

> hero " then you are " more the man " if you are male or " more the

> woman " if you are female. But if you simply do what needs to be

done

> in the most simple and straightforward manner, you are ridiculed.

>

> When I was five my mom took me to a baby shower because she could

> not find a sitter for me, and the women were talking about the

> arduous and painful childbirths they had to endure.

>

> One woman said, " I took drugs and got it over with. I didn't feel a

> thing. It was quick, painless, no-muss, no fuss. "

>

> One of the women just looked at her and said, " Oh. "

>

> And the rest of them went back to talking about painful births.

>

> Tom

>

>

>

> Hi,

>

> I meant the idea that one must 'suffer', kind of 'life is a

suffer',

> like life is meant to be a kind of torture but we must be sort of

> victims of life who are able to understand that we must suffer in

> silence, 'be strong' by confronting ourselves with lots of pain.

> (There seems to be this mystical way of thinking that the more you

> suffer and you were able to survive that, the more was your life

> worth and the more you prooved to being strong.) More an idea

> of " pain makes you stronger " . While what I see around is that

> emotional pain mostly is not making people stronger but insecure,

> uncertain about life, things like that. What makes people stronger

> is to be able to make changes.

>

> I don't think pain is something that one needs to 'go trough' as

> deep as one can, but one has to notice it and look for the reason

of

> the pain and see if one can change anything to make that one

doesn't

> need that pain as a warning again that something is not going

right.

>

> Lida

>

[Guest guest]

By the way, how did you remember that experience, being only five

years old?! (Maybe Aspie children could be recruited as child spies,

since many NTs don't realize how well they can understand adult

conversations!)

> >

> > Hi,

> >

> > I meant the idea that one must 'suffer', kind of 'life is a

> suffer',

> > like life is meant to be a kind of torture but we must be sort of

> > victims of life who are able to understand that we must suffer in

> > silence, 'be strong' by confronting ourselves with lots of pain.

> > (There seems to be this mystical way of thinking that the more

you

> > suffer and you were able to survive that, the more was your life

> > worth and the more you prooved to being strong.) More an idea

> > of " pain makes you stronger " . While what I see around is that

> > emotional pain mostly is not making people stronger but insecure,

> > uncertain about life, things like that. What makes people

stronger

> > is to be able to make changes.

> >

> > I don't think pain is something that one needs to 'go trough' as

> > deep as one can, but one has to notice it and look for the reason

> of

> > the pain and see if one can change anything to make that one

> doesn't

> > need that pain as a warning again that something is not going

> right.

> >

> > Lida

> >

>

[Guest guest]

,

I still have memories of being in my crib.

Many Aspies seem to have memories from when they were babies or

young children. A conversation about this subject took place many

months ago, but perhaps we should revisit it.

How many of you folks remember things from your early childhoods, or

from when you were babies?

Tom

By the way, how did you remember that experience, being only five

years old?! (Maybe Aspie children could be recruited as child spies,

since many NTs don't realize how well they can understand adult

conversations!)

[Guest guest]

I think I have a memory of being in my crib but it's hazy. I was at

least very young. I have a lot of memories from ages 2 and 3. I

shocked my father by remembering the house, yard and person of my

great grandfather who died when I was 3. When I said there was a

white picket fence around the yard, my father said, no there wasn't.

But he didn't remember. My grandmother said that there was. I even

have an impression of the kind of person he was, at least to me--very

kind and warm.

>

> By the way, how did you remember that experience, being only five

> years old?! (Maybe Aspie children could be recruited as child spies,

> since many NTs don't realize how well they can understand adult

> conversations!)

>

[Guest guest]

>Tom: "How many of you folks remember things from your early childhoods, or from when you were babies?"My earliest memory is of carving a truck out of a piece of wood when I was three years of age. Specifically, I learned just how much more difficult it is to cut across the grain of the wood than with the grain. I will never forget this lesson! I can still feel the feelings, see the images, and relive my frustrations.....  Rainbow

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/7/2005 3:37:27 PM Eastern Standard Time, ururu@... writes:

Tom,

As a translator I am aware of the fact that translations always are interpretations as well. No one can ever claim to know what a writer wanted to say with his words, apart from the writer himself. It already happens in a forum like this: how many times did persons misunderstand what someone else has written, although both even were brought up in the same country and speak the same language?

It probably took you a lot of work to put all the examples of bible texts, I suppose. That was nice of you. Personally I have nothing special with the bible or with any other religion.

Lida

Idiums are also a problem because they don't translate directly from one language to the next. There is a good example from a fiction novel. The novel was set oddly enough in Iran (or was it Iraq?) where the Russians were trying the Afganistan thing again but hoping for better luck, that is they were expanding territory and looking for oil and warm water ports. The US was invited in to help oppose them, that is regular forces, not just commandoes. Eventually it is learned that a third part has developed nuclear weapons and is going to strike in the middle of a battle in an effort to trick the US and Russia into going nuclear.

There was a joint US/Russian commando raid on the nuclear facility to knock it out. The Russian Spetnaz was going to conduct the raid of the actual facility while the Americans secured the perimeter and maintained security for them. At one point, the lead American character says to the lead Russian character: "You watch your ass." The Russian looks at him funny and says, "I can't do that, you will have to look at it for me", or something to that effect.

In American English, "Watch you ass" means "be careful", not to actually twist around and stare at your own posterior.

P.S. This book was written in the late 1980s when the Russians were still capable of attempting such a thing.

[Guest guest]

The earliest verifiable memory was when I was about 3 or 4 when we were in ton, SC. I can recall bits and pieces about the harbor tour that we took. There are some other memories, little vingettes, but I'm not sure just when they were nor really if they are my memories or visualizations created from other people's memories of my childhood.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/7/2005 9:52:00 AM Eastern Standard Time, no_reply writes:

"Christianity which implies that your reward will be all the greater inheaven if you only endure some hardships in this life." That is incorrect. It is said in the Bible that God will give you all that you need provided you follow His laws and do what He says. The more you serve God and help your fellow man, the easier your life will be on earth. But the more you work against man, or the more you sin, the more hardships you will endure. These hardships are not so much punishments as lessons to keep people in line and remind them what they stand to sacrifice in the afterlife if they persist with disobeying God and living in sin.Tom

Tom,

Good answer. God doesn't want his followers to suffer and wants them to thrive and do well. If you look at the laws they really are a good way to live. This is not to say that bad things won't happen to you, they will. No matter how great your faith, bad things will still happen. I don't think these things are necessarily trials from God, but are just the way things are in the mortal realm.

In my opinion, God created the universe according to a set of laws. We call those laws physics, meteorology, biology, geology, etc. Those laws work well most of the time, but inevitably something will build up and cause a problem. That could be techtonic pressure and earthquakes, sea and air temperatures and hurricanes and so on. That is just the system trying to achieve balance. I do not believe God directs storms and so forth to deliberately smite individual people. The people that get hurt, its just the nature of the storm. That is not to say God can't influence events, of course He could. I simply mean that every little detail is probably not personally supervised by Him.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/7/2005 2:58:58 AM Eastern Standard Time, ururu@... writes:

I understand that this is called dissociation. As far as I understand many people on the autism spectrum are able to dissociate.

I know I live the biggest part of my days in dissociation; it is a 'tool' for me to live my life and I like it. A friend of mine also dissociates but uses medication for it because he really feels dissociating is a problem to him. I never understood why he expierences this as a problem.

Lida

I dissociated a lot as well. I have my affairs organized so that this is not normally a problem. Focussing on the real world isn't a problem either. Rather the real world seems so full of silly people trying to make a mess of things I try to avoid paying too much attention to it.

Dissociating is also useful if I have to wait a long time for something. If I have to wait for the train let's say, I'll find a quite spot and either read of play my gameboy. I'll focus on the game and largely be dissociated from everything else, though I am still aware of movement around me (something I do for security reasons). Some of my friends marvel that I can do this. They say they would go nuts waiting for hours like that. I just tell them I am sort of aware of time passing, but once the train, or whatever comes, the waiting time seems not to have happened. There is little memory of it, except for details that caught my attention, like people moving close to me, a bird or lizard that came close, things like that.

It doesn't always work though. Sometimes that ADD gets in the way by pouring energy into my system making it next to impossible to sit still, or there are loud talkers or a screaming kid or something that prevents to necessary concentration.

[Guest guest]

Tom wrote:

>Lida,>Somehow, I have gotten the impression from non-Aspies that the PROCESS of valiaintly struggling against the odds whilst suffering terribly and then recovering is of more importance than simply working hard to overcome the odds and succeeding.>This must be some sort of social thing. If you "play the tragic hero" then you are "more the man" if you are male or "more the woman" if you are female. But if you simply do what needs to be done in the most simple and straightforward manner, you are ridiculed.

It might be some social thing, but I think Inger is right as well about how religious ways inflluence on how people respond to daily life.

Lida

[Guest guest]

Tom and Inger wrote:

Inger:"Christianity which implies that your reward will be all the greater inheaven if you only endure some hardships in this life."

Tom:That is incorrect. It is said in the Bible that God will give you all that you need provided you follow His laws and do what He says. The more you serve God and help your fellow man, the easier your life will be on earth. But the more you work against man, or the more you sin, the more hardships you will endure. These hardships are not so much punishments as lessons to keep people in line and remind them what they stand to sacrifice in the afterlife if they persist with disobeying God and living in sin.Tom.. what Inger wrote might be incorrect in your opinion, but not all religious people have the same opinion as you. Not all churches will interpret the bible in the same way.

Lida

[Guest guest]

Yes, same here. Earliest memory when I was about three months. Verified it with several members of my family. Even details about the room were correct and couldn't have known that from photographs or something like that.

Lida

Tom and wrote:

,I still have memories of being in my crib.Many Aspies seem to have memories from when they were babies or young children. A conversation about this subject took place many months ago, but perhaps we should revisit it.How many of you folks remember things from your early childhoods, or from when you were babies?TomBy the way, how did you remember that experience, being only fiveyears old?! (Maybe Aspie children could be recruited as child spies,since many NTs don't realize how well they can understand adultconversations!)