Re: Socially appropriate behavior

April 24, 2006

My daughter (12.5) did this a lot when she

was younger, she has grown out of it(most of the time!). We just kept

stressing that it wasn’t appropriate. Would a social story regarding the

usual pleasantries help him? You might want to give it a try. Gretchen

From: Autism and Aspergers Treatment [mailto:Autism and Aspergers Treatment ] On Behalf Of ptr42

Sent: Monday, April 24, 2006 3:10

PM

Autism and Aspergers Treatment

Subject:

Socially appropriate behavior

Hello,

My son is 7 years old, a second grader. Lately, he was taken

to " growling " at people if they try to talk to him or ruffle his hair

or anything. These are people he knows, and recognizes... could be

parents of his friends etc. I have told him several times it is not

appropriate, but he continues to do it. I understand it is stressful

for him to answer the usual pleasantries like " how are you? " ,

" you're

looking do handsome " etc., but this seems to be a regression. Any

ideas?

Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger at

people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he doesn't

know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on

redirecting this behavior?

- Deep.

April 24, 2006

Hi:

My son did the same thing at about the same age. We set up a script

for him and practised it many times with rewards for following the

script. In real life, he needed cueing the first 5 or 6 times, but

after that he remembered himself. It was as if he growled because he

didn't know what else to do. As soon as we taught him what to do and

he made it a part of his repertoire, he was able to handle situations

like this reasonably well.

Having said that, all kids are different and what worked with mine

might not work for yours, but on the off chance that it might work, I

wanted to respond.

Regards,

Trish

>

> Hello,

>

> My son is 7 years old, a second grader. Lately, he was taken

> to " growling " at people if they try to talk to him or ruffle his

hair

> or anything. These are people he knows, and recognizes... could be

> parents of his friends etc. I have told him several times it is not

> appropriate, but he continues to do it. I understand it is

stressful

> for him to answer the usual pleasantries like " how are

you? " , " you're

> looking do handsome " etc., but this seems to be a regression. Any

> ideas?

>

> Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger at

> people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he doesn't

> know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on

> redirecting this behavior?

>

> - Deep.

>

April 25, 2006

Ah yes, I remember the growl, we had a hiss too. It was bizarre looking and

a tad embarrassing. No matter how many times I explained how inappropriate

it was he kept doing it. I wish I could tell you how to make it stop but I

did not have any success at that but he did our grow it.

He tends to pick things up from TV and repeat them, he was (at 12) allowed

to watch his first episode of the Simpson's (which I hate) and it appears

that Homer does this annoying " ha ha " sound at people and so my son does it

to everyone, it is SO irritating and I keep trying to tell him people don't

like it.

Just wanted to let you know you are not alone, and that certain things do

get better as they get older.

-Charlotte in NH

Mom to 12 AS/ADHD

Socially appropriate behavior

Hello,

My son is 7 years old, a second grader. Lately, he was taken

to " growling " at people if they try to talk to him or ruffle his hair

or anything. These are people he knows, and recognizes... could be

parents of his friends etc. I have told him several times it is not

appropriate, but he continues to do it. I understand it is stressful

for him to answer the usual pleasantries like " how are you? " , " you're

looking do handsome " etc., but this seems to be a regression. Any

ideas?

Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger at

people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he doesn't

know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on

redirecting this behavior?

- Deep.

April 25, 2006

Hi there,

I take it your son is ASD? It seems to me that you are expecting an awful

lot of a 7 year old - ASD is a social and communication difference which

means that they do things which we would consider " socially inappropriate " .

Different is not wrong. I think you need to be more aware of his social

environment and more accomodating to his needs.

He may be communicating to you that he finds these things overwhelming or

even painful - have you considered that he has sensory issues which mean

that someone ruffling his hair hurts him?

With ASD children it is not helpful to tell them " don't do that " , you must

tell them what they can do instead. Try social stories for ways to respond

when someone speaks to you.

>

> Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger at

> people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he doesn't

> know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on

> redirecting this behavior?

NT children do not develop the ability to recognise and express pride until

about age 7-9, so your son is likely not going to be able to for some/many

years. Until that time he will not understand what the funny feelings he has

are and certainly will not know how to express them in a way others can

recognise. It is not unusual for an ASD person to dislike intensely anyone

praising or congratulating them.

You could try an 'emotions book', where you make a scrapbook of different

emotions (cut out pictures from magazines etc). You have to concentrate on

one for a while and then move on to another. Start with happy, and show all

the 'shades' of happiness. Or you could purchase the DVD on emotions made by

Simon Baron-Cohen's team at the University of Cambridge.

in England

April 25, 2006

Trish, you are so right, they just don't know what to do. Mine is now 14, and although we still have many quirks, consistency was the key for us. You just need to find your child's special reward for appropriate behavior, our therapist came up with Reeces peanut butter cups.........who knew? We pulled our hair out forever trying to break those habits! ~

Re: Socially appropriate behavior

Hi:My son did the same thing at about the same age. We set up a script for him and practised it many times with rewards for following the script. In real life, he needed cueing the first 5 or 6 times, but after that he remembered himself. It was as if he growled because he didn't know what else to do. As soon as we taught him what to do and he made it a part of his repertoire, he was able to handle situations like this reasonably well.Having said that, all kids are different and what worked with mine might not work for yours, but on the off chance that it might work, I wanted to respond.Regards,Trish>> Hello,> > My son is 7 years old, a second grader. Lately, he was taken > to "growling" at people if they try to talk to him or ruffle his hair > or anything. These are people he knows, and recognizes... could be > parents of his friends etc. I have told him several times it is not > appropriate, but he continues to do it. I understand it is stressful > for him to answer the usual pleasantries like "how are you?", "you're > looking do handsome" etc., but this seems to be a regression. Any > ideas?> > Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger at > people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he doesn't > know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on > redirecting this behavior?> > - Deep.>

April 25, 2006

And a great book for that is: Asperger Syndrome & Sensory Issues; Practical solutions for making sense of the world by Myles.

This book is not necessarily just for Aspies, I have read it and it applies to many dx's. I found mine on eBay.

~

Re: Socially appropriate behavior

Hi there,I take it your son is ASD? It seems to me that you are expecting an awful lot of a 7 year old - ASD is a social and communication difference which means that they do things which we would consider "socially inappropriate". Different is not wrong. I think you need to be more aware of his social environment and more accomodating to his needs.He may be communicating to you that he finds these things overwhelming or even painful - have you considered that he has sensory issues which mean that someone ruffling his hair hurts him?With ASD children it is not helpful to tell them "don't do that", you must tell them what they can do instead. Try social stories for ways to respond when someone speaks to you.>> Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger at> people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he doesn't> know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on> redirecting this behavior?NT children do not develop the ability to recognise and express pride until about age 7-9, so your son is likely not going to be able to for some/many years. Until that time he will not understand what the funny feelings he has are and certainly will not know how to express them in a way others can recognise. It is not unusual for an ASD person to dislike intensely anyone praising or congratulating them.You could try an 'emotions book', where you make a scrapbook of different emotions (cut out pictures from magazines etc). You have to concentrate on one for a while and then move on to another. Start with happy, and show all the 'shades' of happiness. Or you could purchase the DVD on emotions made by Simon Baron-Cohen's team at the University of Cambridge. in England

April 25, 2006

Wow ! I thought our 10 yo HFA son was the only one who did this. His autistic passion is lions. He has made acting like a lion his "safe place", and when he feels uncomfortable socially, he growls like a lion. He is adopted, and when he first came to us, he not only growled, he would get down on all fours and act like a lion as well. The foster parents who had him before he came to us didn't recognize the lion passion and were always reporting to his workers and therapist that he acted like a dog ! They thought he was mentally ill, and he was on several psychiatric meds to control his behavior.

Our sons growling is still a bit of an embarrassment, but now we see it as part of his uniqueness.

BTW, we learned that we should indulge the lion passion rather than fight it, and soon, the lion passion spread to an interest in Africa, where lions come from, then to Egypt which is in Africa, so his interests have expanded greatly.

Hello,My son is 7 years old, a second grader. Lately, he was taken to "growling" at people if they try to talk to him or ruffle his hair or anything. These are people he knows, and recognizes... could be parents of his friends etc. I have told him several times it is not appropriate, but he continues to do it. I understand it is stressful for him to answer the usual pleasantries like "how are you?", "you're looking do handsome" etc., but this seems to be a regression. Any ideas?Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger at people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he doesn't know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on redirecting this behavior?- Deep.

April 25, 2006

Thought I would just let u know that i too am dealing with this same "problem". My son also is 7 and doin exactly the same thing LOL. I have read the response fromseveral of the others here and so far have not found any to have been of use or work for correcting this with him. I sure do hope that the "will outgrow it" holds true. It's been rather stressing hearing it so much of the time over so many things. Good luck to us both getting through this "stage" LOL---Willowptr42 <ptr42@...> wrote: Hello,My son is 7 years old, a second grader. Lately, he was taken to "growling" at people if they try to talk to him or ruffle his hair or anything. These are people he knows, and recognizes... could be parents of his friends etc. I have told him several times it is not appropriate, but he continues to do it. I understand it is

stressful for him to answer the usual pleasantries like "how are you?", "you're looking do handsome" etc., but this seems to be a regression. Any ideas?Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger at people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he doesn't know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on redirecting this behavior?- Deep.

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April 25, 2006

Hi;

Growling is a common response that children with Asperger's have to social pressure and it means exactly what it sounds like: " Stay away...I've had enough. " Try and use cognitive behavioral techniques. Reason with your son explaining that others do not know what he means. Ask him to use his words and reinforce this behavior.

God luck.

Regards,

On 4/25/06, D Mackey <weepingwillow1952@...> wrote:

Thought I would just let u know that i too am dealing with this same " problem " . My son also is 7 and doin exactly the same thing LOL. I have read the response fromseveral of the others here and so far have not found any to have been of use or work for correcting this with him. I sure do hope that the " will outgrow it " holds true. It's been rather stressing hearing it so much of the time over so many things. Good luck to us both getting through this " stage " LOL---Willow

ptr42 <ptr42@...> wrote: Hello,My son is 7 years old, a second grader. Lately, he was taken to " growling " at people if they try to talk to him or ruffle his hair or anything. These are people he knows, and recognizes... could be parents of his friends etc. I have told him several times it is not appropriate, but he continues to do it. I understand it is stressful for him to answer the usual pleasantries like " how are you? " , " you're looking do handsome " etc., but this seems to be a regression. Any ideas?Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger at people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he doesn't know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on redirecting this behavior?- Deep.

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April 25, 2006

Thanks to everyone who responded: Charlotte, Gretchen, , Trish,

and Willow.

I will try social stories with my son. I do tell him all the time

that people do not like it, but I suppose a social story would work

better. That would give a better perspective about what people

expect and how they respond. It's good to know he will outgrow it at

some point :-)

, I understand the ruffling of the hair would be very annoying

to him. It was very annoying to me also, while growing-up. I just

joke about it and tell people they spoiled his hair-style... but

usually that comes after the growling, when they are trying to tell

him they are just being friendly. Of ocurse, by the time I correct

them, its already too late.

I'm hoping there are some story books out there about social

pleasanteries... any ideas?

- Deep.

>

> Hello,

>

> My son is 7 years old, a second grader. Lately, he was taken

> to " growling " at people if they try to talk to him or ruffle his

hair

> or anything. These are people he knows, and recognizes... could be

> parents of his friends etc. I have told him several times it is

not

> appropriate, but he continues to do it. I understand it is

stressful

> for him to answer the usual pleasantries like " how are

you? " , " you're

> looking do handsome " etc., but this seems to be a regression. Any

> ideas?

>

> Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger

at

> people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he doesn't

> know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on

> redirecting this behavior?

>

> - Deep.

>

April 26, 2006

--- In Autism and Aspergers Treatment , " Jim Roan " <roanpsych@...>

wrote in part:

>Try and use cognitive behavioral techniques. Reason with your son

>explaining that others do not know what he means. Ask him to use

>his words and reinforce this behavior.

I'm sorry, Jim, I had to laugh when I first read this.

I do agree, its worth a try.

For some of our children, the reasoning technique is a bit too

general. Do you have any ideas on how to break it down into

smaller, more specific steps, to achieve the same goal?

Thanks,

Thian's Dad

-Tim

Detroit

April 26, 2006

My son is 10 and growls as well when he is angry at something...... Occasionally we get a hiss. but that may be due to our recent adoption of a cat which he loves.... I think the growling just goes with the AS..... I am hoping he will outgrow this as well.. It becomes less and less as he gets older.... Thank God....LOL in Lancaster, Ca <jayjaycub@...> wrote: Wow ! I thought our 10 yo HFA son was the only one who did this. His autistic passion is lions. He has made acting like a lion his "safe place", and when he feels uncomfortable socially, he growls like a lion. He is adopted, and when he

first came to us, he not only growled, he would get down on all fours and act like a lion as well. The foster parents who had him before he came to us didn't recognize the lion passion and were always reporting to his workers and therapist that he acted like a dog ! They thought he was mentally ill, and he was on several psychiatric meds to control his behavior. Our sons growling is still a bit of an embarrassment, but now we see it as part of his uniqueness. BTW, we learned that we should indulge the lion passion rather than fight it, and soon, the lion passion spread to an interest in Africa, where lions come from, then to Egypt which is in Africa, so his interests have expanded greatly. Hello,My son is 7 years old, a second grader. Lately, he was

taken to "growling" at people if they try to talk to him or ruffle his hair or anything. These are people he knows, and recognizes... could be parents of his friends etc. I have told him several times it is not appropriate, but he continues to do it. I understand it is stressful for him to answer the usual pleasantries like "how are you?", "you're looking do handsome" etc., but this seems to be a regression. Any ideas?Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger at people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he doesn't know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on redirecting this behavior?- Deep.

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April 26, 2006

Thanks ,

I will try talking to him about this when we are in a " happy " mood :-

) For some reason, he has decided he does not like Daylight Savings

Time, and we have a tantrum every evening because it is dinner time,

and it is still light outside. Sigh!

- Deep.

> >

> > Hello,

> >

> > My son is 7 years old, a second grader. Lately, he was taken

> > to " growling " at people if they try to talk to him or ruffle his

hair

> > or anything. These are people he knows, and recognizes... could

be

> > parents of his friends etc. I have told him several times it is

not

> > appropriate, but he continues to do it. I understand it is

stressful

> > for him to answer the usual pleasantries like " how are

you? " , " you're

> > looking do handsome " etc., but this seems to be a regression. Any

> > ideas?

> >

> > Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger

at

> > people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he

doesn't

> > know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on

> > redirecting this behavior?

> >

> > - Deep.

> >

> > ------------------------------

> > Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+

countries<http://us.rd./mail_us/taglines/postman9/*http://us

..rd./evt=39666/*http://beta.messenger./>for just

2¢/min with Messenger with Voice.

> >

April 26, 2006

I remember when my son was that age he was in before and after care at

school because I worked full time. It was the Fall and the totally FREAKED

at school one day when I had not come to get him yet and is was almost dark!

Honestly, my typical 5 year old daughter is having issues (and tantrums)

with eating dinner in the daylight too. I even had to bump bedtime up a

little so that it was dark for bed!!

-Charlotte

Re: Socially appropriate behavior

Thanks ,

I will try talking to him about this when we are in a " happy " mood :-

) For some reason, he has decided he does not like Daylight Savings

Time, and we have a tantrum every evening because it is dinner time,

and it is still light outside. Sigh!

- Deep.

> >

> > Hello,

> >

> > My son is 7 years old, a second grader. Lately, he was taken

> > to " growling " at people if they try to talk to him or ruffle his

hair

> > or anything. These are people he knows, and recognizes... could

be

> > parents of his friends etc. I have told him several times it is

not

> > appropriate, but he continues to do it. I understand it is

stressful

> > for him to answer the usual pleasantries like " how are

you? " , " you're

> > looking do handsome " etc., but this seems to be a regression. Any

> > ideas?

> >

> > Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger

at

> > people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he

doesn't

> > know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on

> > redirecting this behavior?

> >

> > - Deep.

> >

> > ------------------------------

> > Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+

countries<http://us.rd./mail_us/taglines/postman9/*http://us

..rd./evt=39666/*http://beta.messenger./>for just

2¢/min with Messenger with Voice.

> >

April 27, 2006

Are you familar with social stories? Now there are social movies

coming that explains our social culture.

www.specialminds.org and click on Carol Gray Project they have demos

you can download. Many times the kids need to know why the behavior

is inappriopate and what they can do instead. Doesn't always change

the behavior but worth a try. Carol Gray also has a guide to

compliments that is really good! You can search The Gray Center and

find her website(sorry don't remember what it is at the moment.)

I have a now 13 year old Aspergers son. The problem is as our kids

age the behaviors can be more and more inappropiate. What we will

except from a grade schooler is different then we expect from a

middle schooler. So its a constantly changing issue that once you

find the way that makes sense to them it will be easier to address.

We sometimes tell Ben " Ben your autism is showing " and that is a cue

that socially he is missing something. We have also designed

a " code " word for in certain situations so as to not embarass him(we

are at the teen years now).

Good luck and hope these resources help!

in Minnesota

> Wow ! I thought our 10 yo HFA son was the only one who

did this. His autistic passion is lions. He has made acting like a

lion his " safe place " , and when he feels uncomfortable socially, he

growls like a lion. He is adopted, and when he first came to us, he

not only growled, he would get down on all fours and act like a lion

as well. The foster parents who had him before he came to us didn't

recognize the lion passion and were always reporting to his workers

and therapist that he acted like a dog ! They thought he was

mentally ill, and he was on several psychiatric meds to control his

behavior.

>

> Our sons growling is still a bit of an embarrassment, but now we

see it as part of his uniqueness.

> BTW, we learned that we should indulge the lion passion rather

than fight it, and soon, the lion passion spread to an interest in

Africa, where lions come from, then to Egypt which is in Africa, so

his interests have expanded greatly.

>

> Hello,

>

> My son is 7 years old, a second grader. Lately, he was taken

> to " growling " at people if they try to talk to him or ruffle his

hair

> or anything. These are people he knows, and recognizes... could be

> parents of his friends etc. I have told him several times it is

not

> appropriate, but he continues to do it. I understand it is

stressful

> for him to answer the usual pleasantries like " how are

you? " , " you're

> looking do handsome " etc., but this seems to be a regression. Any

> ideas?

>

> Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger

at

> people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he doesn't

> know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on

> redirecting this behavior?

>

> - Deep.

>

April 27, 2006

We have had issues with Daylight Savings time as well. Warren got upset the other dy because dad got home too early......... It was difficult for him to understand that it was the same time only daylight savings was in effect. It took awhile to explain it to him but I think he finally got it. I was thinking of maybe making a mini-holiday of it to kind of ease him into it next time.... special dinner, dessert, movie..... that kind of thing to ring in daylight savings....LOL.... worth a try I guess..... in Lancaster, CaCharlotte <scottdesigns@...> wrote: I remember when my son was that age he was in before and after care atschool because I worked full time. It was the Fall and the totally FREAKEDat school one day when I had not come to get him yet and is was almost

dark!Honestly, my typical 5 year old daughter is having issues (and tantrums)with eating dinner in the daylight too. I even had to bump bedtime up alittle so that it was dark for bed!!-Charlotte-----Original Message-----From: Autism and Aspergers Treatment [mailto:Autism and Aspergers Treatment ] On Behalf Of ptr42Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2006 2:47 PMAutism and Aspergers Treatment Subject: Re: Socially appropriate behaviorThanks ,I will try talking to him about this when we are in a "happy" mood :-) For some reason, he has decided he does not like Daylight Savings Time, and we have a tantrum every evening because it is dinner time, and it is still light outside. Sigh! - Deep.> >> > Hello,> >> > My son is 7 years old, a second grader. Lately, he was taken> > to "growling" at people if they try to talk to him or ruffle his hair> > or anything. These are people he knows, and recognizes... could be> > parents of his friends etc. I have told him several times it is not> > appropriate, but he continues to do it. I understand it is stressful> > for him to answer the usual pleasantries like "how are you?", "you're> > looking do handsome" etc., but this seems to be a regression. Any> > ideas?> >> > Along the same lines, he makes similar sounds or points a finger at> > people when someone praises him... me included. I guess he

doesn't> > know how to express his pride mixed with shyness. Any ideas on> > redirecting this behavior?> >> > - Deep.> >> >> >> >> > ------------------------------> > Love cheap thrills? Enjoy PC-to-Phone calls to 30+ countries<http://us.rd./mail_us/taglines/postman9/*http://us.rd./evt=39666/*http://beta.messenger./>for just 2¢/min with Messenger with Voice.> >> >

April 28, 2006

Hello,

It has helped my dd immensely to give the growling a name. I will

say, " Oh, Autumn is a tiger today! " or " You're feeling like a

tiger! " We also started giving her a coat with a hood or a hat to

wear in public to give her a feeling of safety so she is less likely

togrowl. After doing those two things the growling was gone in a

few weeks time! hth

Warmly,

Jodi

http://www.naturekiddos.com