Re: Re: New Member - SF Bay Area - Thanks!

[Guest guest]

Thanks for all the suggestions. Thank you for the definitions and the

links. I will have to find out more about Asperger's. I had considered that

before (I'm only just learning about all the differences). Our pediatrician,

however, is more convinced it is OCD like behavior. There may be some crossover

traits. He doesn't have any vocal tics (yet!) but the eye blinking is getting

pretty bad and he also chews on his sleeves or the collars of his shirts like

crazy. Looks like I will need an specialist evaluation. Do any of you see

therapists just on your own, to help better understand and respond to your

children, in lieu of having the child go (at least for the time being)? I guess

maybe I am also in a bit of denial and hoping I can handle all of this on my own

without causing my son any additional stress. Maybe I need a kick in the pants!

Just tonight he was talking about doorknobs again at bedtime and asking about

different types of locks and why some locks are

considered stronger than others, etc. He notices the locks or lack thereof

everywhere. I asked him what he found so interesting about them and he said he

just likes to think about how they work. He also said that he had to go to the

bathroom at school today and it was locked and he liked it. I asked why and he

said he liked the sound it made when he tried to open it and couldn't (?!).

Ben is a really, really bright kid: reading and comprehending at a third or

fourth grade level (he's in first grade); does full reports on insects or

animals he finds interesting(complete with research, cover pages and

illustrations) just for fun; creates his own additional homework (as mentioned

before) and also insists that the family completes it: you get the picture.

He's also a devout vegetarian since 4yo (for ethical reasons), even though the

rest of us are not. He worries about the destruction of the rain forest, the

world's dependence on oil, etc. But he is also a painfully shy kid when out in

public and eats lunch alone at school. Although many kids do seem to like him,

I'm worried about him becoming more isolated as he gets older since his

interests are not typical compared to his peers.

Thanks for letting me vent and Thank You

<@...> wrote:

I am confused at times by some of the

abbreviations

Our list archives, bookmarks, files, and chat feature may be accessed at:

/ .

Our list advisors are Gail B. , Ed.D., Tamar Chansky, Ph.D.(

http://www.worrywisekids.org ), Dan Geller, M.D.,Aureen Pinto Wagner, Ph.D., (

http://www.lighthouse-press.com ). Our list moderators are Birkhan,

Castle, Fowler, Kathy Hammes, Joye, Kathy Mac, Gail

Pesses, and Kathy . Subscription issues or suggestions may be

addressed to Louis Harkins, list owner, at louisharkins@... ,

louisharkins@... , louisharkins@... .

[Guest guest]

Thanks for all the suggestions. Thank you for the definitions and the

links. I will have to find out more about Asperger's. I had considered that

before (I'm only just learning about all the differences). Our pediatrician,

however, is more convinced it is OCD like behavior. There may be some crossover

traits. He doesn't have any vocal tics (yet!) but the eye blinking is getting

pretty bad and he also chews on his sleeves or the collars of his shirts like

crazy. Looks like I will need an specialist evaluation. Do any of you see

therapists just on your own, to help better understand and respond to your

children, in lieu of having the child go (at least for the time being)? I guess

maybe I am also in a bit of denial and hoping I can handle all of this on my own

without causing my son any additional stress. Maybe I need a kick in the pants!

Just tonight he was talking about doorknobs again at bedtime and asking about

different types of locks and why some locks are

considered stronger than others, etc. He notices the locks or lack thereof

everywhere. I asked him what he found so interesting about them and he said he

just likes to think about how they work. He also said that he had to go to the

bathroom at school today and it was locked and he liked it. I asked why and he

said he liked the sound it made when he tried to open it and couldn't (?!).

Ben is a really, really bright kid: reading and comprehending at a third or

fourth grade level (he's in first grade); does full reports on insects or

animals he finds interesting(complete with research, cover pages and

illustrations) just for fun; creates his own additional homework (as mentioned

before) and also insists that the family completes it: you get the picture.

He's also a devout vegetarian since 4yo (for ethical reasons), even though the

rest of us are not. He worries about the destruction of the rain forest, the

world's dependence on oil, etc. But he is also a painfully shy kid when out in

public and eats lunch alone at school. Although many kids do seem to like him,

I'm worried about him becoming more isolated as he gets older since his

interests are not typical compared to his peers.

Thanks for letting me vent and Thank You

<@...> wrote:

I am confused at times by some of the

abbreviations

Our list archives, bookmarks, files, and chat feature may be accessed at:

/ .

Our list advisors are Gail B. , Ed.D., Tamar Chansky, Ph.D.(

http://www.worrywisekids.org ), Dan Geller, M.D.,Aureen Pinto Wagner, Ph.D., (

http://www.lighthouse-press.com ). Our list moderators are Birkhan,

Castle, Fowler, Kathy Hammes, Joye, Kathy Mac, Gail

Pesses, and Kathy . Subscription issues or suggestions may be

addressed to Louis Harkins, list owner, at louisharkins@... ,

louisharkins@... , louisharkins@... .

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 4/5/2006 12:33:56 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,

carrie.schwettman@... writes:

Ben is a really, really bright kid: reading and comprehending at a third or

fourth grade level (he's in first grade); does full reports on insects or

animals he finds interesting(complete with research, cover pages and

illustrations) just for fun; creates his own additional homework (as mentioned

before)

and also insists that the family completes it: you get the picture. He's

also a devout vegetarian since 4yo (for ethical reasons), even though the rest

of us are not. He worries about the destruction of the rain forest, the

world's dependence on oil, etc.

-

Have you ever had his IQ tested - I mean, beyond what they do in schools?

LT

[Guest guest]

I'd second the opinion about possible AS and TS. (especially what you said

about locks - very aspergish). My son has both, along with ocd. It seems there

are a lot of kids with this alphabet mixture. While you wait to have him looked

at by someone with more expertise, you might want to do what you can to provide

your own social 'coaching' if you're worried about that. The earlier you start

to give him feedback and guidance, the better. (Lots of playdates where you

hover and subtly direct, show him how to smooth over difficulties, discuss

afterwards what he did right and what he could improve upon.) It's good that the

kids still seem to like him.

kimz

Re: Re: New Member - SF Bay Area - Thanks!

Thanks for all the suggestions. Thank you for the definitions and the

links. I will have to find out more about Asperger's. I had considered that

before (I'm only just learning about all the differences). Our pediatrician,

however, is more convinced it is OCD like behavior. There may be some crossover

traits. He doesn't have any vocal tics (yet!) but the eye blinking is getting

pretty bad and he also chews on his sleeves or the collars of his shirts like

crazy. Looks like I will need an specialist evaluation. Do any of you see

therapists just on your own, to help better understand and respond to your

children, in lieu of having the child go (at least for the time being)? I guess

maybe I am also in a bit of denial and hoping I can handle all of this on my own

without causing my son any additional stress. Maybe I need a kick in the pants!

Just tonight he was talking about doorknobs again at bedtime and asking about

different types of locks and why some locks are

considered stronger than others, etc. He notices the locks or lack thereof

everywhere. I asked him what he found so interesting about them and he said he

just likes to think about how they work. He also said that he had to go to the

bathroom at school today and it was locked and he liked it. I asked why and he

said he liked the sound it made when he tried to open it and couldn't (?!).

Ben is a really, really bright kid: reading and comprehending at a third or

fourth grade level (he's in first grade); does full reports on insects or

animals he finds interesting(complete with research, cover pages and

illustrations) just for fun; creates his own additional homework (as mentioned

before) and also insists that the family completes it: you get the picture.

He's also a devout vegetarian since 4yo (for ethical reasons), even though the

rest of us are not. He worries about the destruction of the rain forest, the

world's dependence on oil, etc. But he is also a painfully shy kid when out in

public and eats lunch alone at school. Although many kids do seem to like him,

I'm worried about him becoming more isolated as he gets older since his

interests are not typical compared to his peers.

Thanks for letting me vent and Thank You

<@...> wrote:

I am confused at times by some of the

abbreviations

Our list archives, bookmarks, files, and chat feature may be accessed at:

/ .

Our list advisors are Gail B. , Ed.D., Tamar Chansky, Ph.D.(

http://www.worrywisekids.org ), Dan Geller, M.D.,Aureen Pinto Wagner, Ph.D., (

http://www.lighthouse-press.com ). Our list moderators are Birkhan,

Castle, Fowler, Kathy Hammes, Joye, Kathy Mac, Gail

Pesses, and Kathy . Subscription issues or suggestions may be

addressed to Louis Harkins, list owner, at louisharkins@... ,

louisharkins@... , louisharkins@... .

[Guest guest]

No, his IQ has never been tested, not even at school (as far as I know). Is

that something that is done with a therapist? I'm embarrassed to be so naive

about all this stuff!

jtlt@... wrote:

In a message dated 4/5/2006 12:33:56 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,

carrie.schwettman@... writes:

Ben is a really, really bright kid: reading and comprehending at a third or

fourth grade level (he's in first grade); does full reports on insects or

animals he finds interesting(complete with research, cover pages and

illustrations) just for fun; creates his own additional homework (as mentioned

before)

and also insists that the family completes it: you get the picture. He's

also a devout vegetarian since 4yo (for ethical reasons), even though the rest

of us are not. He worries about the destruction of the rain forest, the

world's dependence on oil, etc.

-

Have you ever had his IQ tested - I mean, beyond what they do in schools?

LT

[Guest guest]

No, his IQ has never been tested, not even at school (as far as I know). Is

that something that is done with a therapist? I'm embarrassed to be so naive

about all this stuff!

jtlt@... wrote:

In a message dated 4/5/2006 12:33:56 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,

carrie.schwettman@... writes:

Ben is a really, really bright kid: reading and comprehending at a third or

fourth grade level (he's in first grade); does full reports on insects or

animals he finds interesting(complete with research, cover pages and

illustrations) just for fun; creates his own additional homework (as mentioned

before)

and also insists that the family completes it: you get the picture. He's

also a devout vegetarian since 4yo (for ethical reasons), even though the rest

of us are not. He worries about the destruction of the rain forest, the

world's dependence on oil, etc.

-

Have you ever had his IQ tested - I mean, beyond what they do in schools?

LT

[Guest guest]

Thanks Chris. Our sons do sound like similar " types. " Was your son's school

able to identify him as " gifted " as well as having another label, eg: OCD,

emotionally disturbed, Asperger's, ? Are they equipped to deal with both issues

simultaneously?

My husband also believes that our boy is just more mature/aware/intelligent,

but I always had a gut feeling since he was very small that there was more going

on. . .

<@...> wrote:

, I have to say his fascination with locks and other really

seem to go with the Aspie side/possibility.

My OCD/Aspied/gifted son - your description about the interests not

typical and peers, reminds me of my son. I thought, well, he's just

more intellectual or mature or whatever. Even if the topic/interest

was the same as peers...well I guess that helped some but then

could go on and on and on...about subjects. He liked to

correct people too, with all his knowledge/smartness, and that

included teachers. He also has others that are nice to him but no

real friends. I've always been glad for short lunch times!

Giftedness can present its own problems with education, but I have

found that the schools seem to accommodate easier for with

regard to his schoolwork since they know he's capable and identified

as " gifted/LD " . When OCD was a problem for him at school, we got

accommodations. And with the Aspergers diagnosis, I just have

occasionally brought up that something is part of his Aspergers;

like his perception on some things, anything that might have been

taken a bit literally, his asking LOTS of questions, too many

instructions/steps...but no accommodations for it.

Well - keep reading and go with your gut feelings as you are the one

with your son about 24/7. But keep us updated!

>

> Thanks for all the suggestions. Thank you for the

definitions and the links. I will have to find out more about

Asperger's. I had considered that before (I'm only just learning

about all the differences). Our pediatrician, however, is more

convinced it is OCD like behavior. There may be some crossover

Our list archives, bookmarks, files, and chat feature may be accessed at:

/ .

Our list advisors are Gail B. , Ed.D., Tamar Chansky, Ph.D.(

http://www.worrywisekids.org ), Dan Geller, M.D.,Aureen Pinto Wagner, Ph.D., (

http://www.lighthouse-press.com ). Our list moderators are Birkhan,

Castle, Fowler, Kathy Hammes, Joye, Kathy Mac, Gail

Pesses, and Kathy . Subscription issues or suggestions may be

addressed to Louis Harkins, list owner, at louisharkins@... ,

louisharkins@... , louisharkins@... .

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 4/5/2006 12:57:01 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

carrie.schwettman@... writes:

No, his IQ has never been tested, not even at school (as far as I know).

Is that something that is done with a therapist? I'm embarrassed to be so

naive about all this stuff!

I don't know - I would check with the school about where you could go to

have him tested. It just seemed, from your description of his reading level &

the interest in writing reports & investigating, he could just be a very, very

bright child. Just a thought.

LT

[Guest guest]

Hi :

Most school psychologists do IQ testing. Most OCD Therapists do not. My son

was tested several years ago, not just for intelligence, but for many other

things as well. THe results were invaluable as they paved the way for my son to

get more accommodations and a private school placement that was desperately

needed.

Hope this helps some,

CIndy in Southeastern PA

Schwettman <carrie.schwettman@...> wrote:

No, his IQ has never been tested, not even at school (as far as I know). Is

that something that is done with a therapist? I'm embarrassed to be so naive

about all this stuff!

jtlt@... wrote:

In a message dated 4/5/2006 12:33:56 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,

carrie.schwettman@... writes:

Ben is a really, really bright kid: reading and comprehending at a third or

fourth grade level (he's in first grade); does full reports on insects or

animals he finds interesting(complete with research, cover pages and

illustrations) just for fun; creates his own additional homework (as mentioned

before)

and also insists that the family completes it: you get the picture. He's

also a devout vegetarian since 4yo (for ethical reasons), even though the rest

of us are not. He worries about the destruction of the rain forest, the

world's dependence on oil, etc.

-

Have you ever had his IQ tested - I mean, beyond what they do in schools?

LT

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 4/6/2006 9:21:41 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,

k.zarzour@... writes:

The school testing, we found out later, is done cheap and quick and misses

many - especially those kids like ours who have other issues.

Kim -

Exactly - I don't have much faith in school tests. Personal opinion - but I

think they screw them up too much. They try to concentrate too much on

what's important just in their school/district/state and don't focus on an

overall knowledge base or reasoning based test. Like I mentioned before, I

would

suggest parents check into something outside the school district for this.

LT

[Guest guest]

If you can afford it I would highly recommend private testing with a

psychologist or psychiatrist (or neuropsychologist, even better) rather than

just going with what the school provides. We always knew my son was very

bright, high maintenance and a little different but that was all. In Grade 3

(Canada) the schools test for giftedness. They said my son did not get

identified. We were puzzled by that, but accepted it. As he got older his

difficulties increased until Gr. 8 when we paid to have him tested privately.

Turns out he is extremely gifted in some areas, learning disabled in others. The

school testing, we found out later, is done cheap and quick and misses many -

especially those kids like ours who have other issues. When we learned about his

aspergers and giftedness we switched schools - though some damage to his self

esteem had already been done - and it made a huge difference. Now the school

listens to us about his difficulties, we have an IEP and much more support.

Make sure to ask around to find a pdoc whom the school respects.

kimz

Re: New Member - SF Bay Area - Thanks!

, with (now age 17) I think it was around 3rd grade

when they did the state testing (that all the grade took) and

identified him as gifted. High scores on the tests is what it was,

and so all those students were for the advanced/gifted type classes

after that. And he's continued to do well on all the tests, except

the writing one, so he's remained " gifted " so far as school

classes/placement. (except now in high school, you just pick what

level classes you want mostly) And he's pretty much made A's and

B's, except back when his OCD was so bad and I was helping him!

I would check with your son's school and ask what all they will test

for. They wouldn't test for OCD. They may have some tests that

point to Aspergers. We're a " small " type area, I think our testing

might be less than in larger areas/cities. (probably depends on who

they can hire, LOL) I will say the school psychologist at my son's

high school knew more about Aspergers than the middle school psych,

who had never met anyone with autism! Can you hear my frustration

with THAT??! Anyway, I know from reading the state education website

that lots of training has been offered in autism, so I'm not sure how

things are these days. So - I'd just ask your school. If nothing

else, they might point you to someone/someplace who can evaluate.

What I found for school here, was that I had to educate about OCD.

Now, in high school the school psychologist actually KNEW about

Aspergers & autism and supports usually needed! So things vary with

school personnel too.

You would have to have reasons that relate to any problems with his

education - *something* is affecting it in an adverse way - to get

him tested at school.

Again, I would ask the school, you can just say it's curiousity if

they ask why you're asking, you just have some concerns, you'll get

back to them if you ever want to request any....

Sorry if I rambled, been a bit distracted by coming in/out

while typing this!

>

> Thanks Chris. Our sons do sound like similar " types. " Was your

son's school able to identify him as " gifted " as well as having

another label, eg: OCD, emotionally disturbed, Asperger's, ? Are

they equipped to deal with both issues simultaneously?

Our list archives, bookmarks, files, and chat feature may be accessed at:

/ .

Our list advisors are Gail B. , Ed.D., Tamar Chansky, Ph.D.(

http://www.worrywisekids.org ), Dan Geller, M.D.,Aureen Pinto Wagner, Ph.D., (

http://www.lighthouse-press.com ). Our list moderators are Birkhan,

Castle, Fowler, Kathy Hammes, Joye, Kathy Mac, Gail

Pesses, and Kathy . Subscription issues or suggestions may be

addressed to Louis Harkins, list owner, at louisharkins@... ,

louisharkins@... , louisharkins@... .

[Guest guest]

Hi all:

As with everything else in life, deciding whether or not to have your child

tested by the attending school psychologist is something that needs to be

weighed. I live in a district where I know the psychologist very well, I know

that she has clinical experience, that she knows my son's therapist because they

went through the same doctoral program together and she is wonderful. There are

others in our district that I would not allow to test our Beta fish.

Also, by Federal Law, the school district DOES NOT have to accept testing

results from a private psychologist. I have been fortunate to have our results

always accepted over the years, but I have know others who have not. My OCD

child has several other issues along with his OCD. Over the years much was

attempted by both me and the school district to keep Tommy in a public school

setting, but his needs require a private school for kids who have

neurobiological disorders. Fortunately the home school district is paying for

this along with his transportation (he travels 4 hours a day to and from

school)- something that is very often denied to many, many parents. I often

hear not only on this list, but from the AD/HD parents I know just how difficult

it is to get needed services. I consider myself to be fortunate.

My suggestions, as a parent moderator on this list, is to ask other parents in

your school district what their experiences have been. Also, keep in mind that

there are certain tests that cannot be repeated for a period of time, so if you

are considering having the school do testing, make certain duplicate tests are

not repeated if you later decide to go to a private psychologist.

in Southeastern PA

.

jtlt@... wrote:

In a message dated 4/6/2006 9:21:41 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,

k.zarzour@... writes:

The school testing, we found out later, is done cheap and quick and misses

many - especially those kids like ours who have other issues.

Kim -

Exactly - I don't have much faith in school tests. Personal opinion - but I

think they screw them up too much. They try to concentrate too much on

what's important just in their school/district/state and don't focus on an

overall knowledge base or reasoning based test. Like I mentioned before, I

would

suggest parents check into something outside the school district for this.

LT

[Guest guest]

,

My son decided one day to become a vegetarian too. The funny thing is I told

him that some meats were " processed " meats and he took that to mean that it

wasn't " REAL " meat and would eat it. He really wanted to eat it but his mind

wouldn't let him do it. When I couldn't get him to eat the meat I would tell

him it was " processed " and then he would eat it. It worked for a long time. He

deep down new it wasn't. Ha Now he still has trouble eating certain meats,

such as chicken, but every once in a while will give in because he wants to

eat it.

My son is like your son and has gotten stuck on various topics and he

constantly is worrying about us having a tornado. His doctor told me that I

needed

to block the weather channel so he couldn't watch it. He thinks he has to

have a job and has pretended to be a policeman, a grocery store clerk, fireman,

etc since he was three years old. He is 11 now and still feels he needs to

have a job. He sent out flyers all over the neighborhood advertising that he is

a dog walker. When he was two he got stuck on automatic doors. He would

practice with his hands... DOOR OPEN, DOOR CLOSED. As he grew older he loved to

make up his own mazes and they were incredible. My son has a GREAT since of

humor and VERY LOVING!

He has at some point met, or went to, 4 different psychiatrist who feel he

doesn't have aspergers but only OCD. They felt he has some " SHADOWING "

disorders such as some Asperger like qualities, but didn't quit fit into the

Aspe

rger spectrum. I noticed there was a web site chat group for children who have

various Shadowing disorders . I guess there must be a lot of kids out there

that fit in this category. So this might be an option for your son as well.

GOOD LUCK!

Sheree