Re: OT: Questions Re Working at/with a place that participates in IVF et al

[Guest guest]

,This is an interesting opportunity, and one in which you could potentially have a very positive impact on future physicians. Since you have been clear about your position on contraception, could you also be upfront about the fact that you cannot refer patients for IVF? Or if you think the situation is very unlikely to come up, is it even necessary?I think the opportunity to work with residents and students could present the perfect opening to introduce them to fertility awareness based methods, including Creighton which can be used to treat infertility. From the sounds of it, they are clearly not going to hear about it from the MFM doc. Residents and students tend to spend the most amount of time in the hospital managing patients, especially in OB so you could really build relationships with them and over time introduce them to NFP. At that stage they are also more likely to listen, and some may want to learn more, so who knows how much you can influence future OBs and FPs. Again for me personally, it took just one senior resident telling me that there were better options for family planning than just OCPs to open up eyes to the world of NFP. I always offer a prayer of thanks for her because if not for her, I might still be ignorant about NFP.While this position may be challenging at times, it also seems line you could have a real impact, so I hope you seriously consider it. Best of luck with your decision.Sincerely,Marguerite Duane Sent from my iPhoneEOn May 20, 2012, at 6:32 PM, Sandrock <cnmnancy@...> wrote:

I hope you don't mind me bugging list members, but it seems to me you all are of one mind with church teaching when it comes to things like this, so....I have been looking for a job for a while now. I've turned down a few for various reasons, and have been refused for others because of the NFP only stance I am upfront about. So now I have another offer I am sure I will get. I am uneasy about it for many reasons, but seem to be pointed in that direction...This position is with UT Health Science Center of San . They have a med school and residency program. The Faculty CNM position is a state position, but actually working at the University Hospital which is county. They are promoting a new IVF program, and of course the residents do tubals, et al. The

CNM position's are to help with the residents/med students, and to cover clinics and triage(s) because the lack of residents due to new guidelines which reduce the number of hours they can work. The goal of course is to let the residents et al get as much direct experience as possible, so the CNM's are there for oversight, and filling in the gaps - so patients don't fall through them. They know I will not Rx contraception and I am pretty sure by working certain clinics, and covering L/D, GYN triage and OB Triage, I can avoid referrals to the IVF program... I am not sure how advanced they are into that and of they do "fetal reductions" or not. I mentioned the Creighton Model and NaProtechnology, and the MFM program director was unimpressed and of course didn't know a thing about it). She was pretty vocal about them needed to get the basic's with no sidetracking (following the Dublin

protocol, active labor management, checking every hour) Getting used to doing the same thing all the time so they learn it. I can understand the need for that.What do you think? Sandrock, CNM

=

[Guest guest]

I want to strongly agree with Dr. Duane’s advice to   Sandrock.  Don’t be defensive, just offer additional options as Marguerite indicates – I’ll put in a plea for all methods of NFP –and cheerfully trust the Lord. Hanna Klaus From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of MargueriteSent: Sunday, May 20, 2012 11:05 PM Subject: Re: OT: Questions Re Working at/with a place that participates in IVF et al , This is an interesting opportunity, and one in which you could potentially have a very positive impact on future physicians. Since you have been clear about your position on contraception, could you also be upfront about the fact that you cannot refer patients for IVF? Or if you think the situation is very unlikely to come up, is it even necessary? I think the opportunity to work with residents and students could present the perfect opening to introduce them to fertility awareness based methods, including Creighton which can be used to treat infertility. From the sounds of it, they are clearly not going to hear about it from the MFM doc. Residents and students tend to spend the most amount of time in the hospital managing patients, especially in OB so you could really build relationships with them and over time introduce them to NFP. At that stage they are also more likely to listen, and some may want to learn more, so who knows how much you can influence future OBs and FPs. Again for me personally, it took just one senior resident telling me that there were better options for family planning than just OCPs to open up eyes to the world of NFP. I always offer a prayer of thanks for her because if not for her, I might still be ignorant about NFP. While this position may be challenging at times, it also seems line you could have a real impact, so I hope you seriously consider it. Best of luck with your decision. Sincerely,Marguerite Duane Sent from my iPhoneEOn May 20, 2012, at 6:32 PM, Sandrock <cnmnancy@...> wrote: I hope you don't mind me bugging list members, but it seems to me you all are of one mind with church teaching when it comes to things like this, so.... I have been looking for a job for a while now. I've turned down a few for various reasons, and have been refused for others because of the NFP only stance I am upfront about. So now I have another offer I am sure I will get. I am uneasy about it for many reasons, but seem to be pointed in that direction... This position is with UT Health Science Center of San . They have a med school and residency program. The Faculty CNM position is a state position, but actually working at the University Hospital which is county. They are promoting a new IVF program, and of course the residents do tubals, et al. The CNM position's are to help with the residents/med students, and to cover clinics and triage(s) because the lack of residents due to new guidelines which reduce the number of hours they can work. The goal of course is to let the residents et al get as much direct experience as possible, so the CNM's are there for oversight, and filling in the gaps - so patients don't fall through them. They know I will not Rx contraception and I am pretty sure by working certain clinics, and covering L/D, GYN triage and OB Triage, I can avoid referrals to the IVF program... I am not sure how advanced they are into that and of they do " fetal reductions " or not. I mentioned the Creighton Model and NaProtechnology, and the MFM program director was unimpressed and of course didn't know a thing about it). She was pretty vocal about them needed to get the basic's with no sidetracking (following the Dublin protocol, active labor management, checking every hour) Getting used to doing the same thing all the time so they learn it. I can understand the need for that. What do you think? Sandrock, CNM=

[Guest guest]

How much would the job require you to do when it comes to cooperating with tubals, IVF, contraceptives, or any other illicit procedures, or referrals for them? Any referrals for abortions or tubals expected as part of the job?

Usually, by "full spectrum of care" they mean the poisons along with the cures. Poisons meaning the illicit things we know harm women while they believe they are not only beneficial but also a health care right -- a peculiar form of insanity. Besides the question of morality or liceity there is also the issue of your having to deal with this very special and today-unfortunately-widespread insanity on a daily basis. It can wear a person down and would only seem in many cases doable if there is the offsetting satisfaction of being actually able to reach some women with the truth. Does that sound possible?

Sincerely yours,

Dominic M. Pedulla MD, FACC, CNFPMC, ABVM, ACPh

Interventional Cardiologist, Endovascular Diplomate, Varicose Vein Specialist, Noncontraceptive Family Planning Consultant, Family Planning Researcher

Medical Director, The Oklahoma Vein and Endovascular Center (www.noveinok.com, veininfo@...)

Executive Director, The Edith Stein Foundation (www.theedithsteinfoundation.com)

405-947-2228 (office)

405-834-7506 (cell)

405-947-2307 (FAX)

pedullad@...

"...the priestly ministry is not just a pastoral service; it ensures the continuity of the functions entrusted by Christ to the Apostles and the continuity of the powers related to those functions. Adaptation to civilizations and times therefore cannot abolish, on essential points, the sacramental reference to constitutive events of Christianity and to Christ himself." (Inter Insignores)

OT: Questions Re Working at/with a place that participates in IVF et al

I hope you don't mind me bugging list members, but it seems to me you all are of one mind with church teaching when it comes to things like this, so....

I have been looking for a job for a while now. I've turned down a few for various reasons, and have been refused for others because of the NFP only stance I am upfront about. So now I have another offer I am sure I will get. I am uneasy about it for many reasons, but seem to be pointed in that direction...

This position is with UT Health Science Center of San . They have a med school and residency program. The Faculty CNM position is a state position, but actually working at the University Hospital which is county. They are promoting a new IVF program, and of course the residents do tubals, et al. The

CNM position's are to help with the residents/med students, and to cover clinics and triage(s) because the lack of residents due to new guidelines which reduce the number of hours they can work. The goal of course is to let the residents et al get as much direct experience as possible, so the CNM's are there for oversight, and filling in the gaps - so patients don't fall through them.

They know I will not Rx contraception and I am pretty sure by working certain clinics, and covering L/D, GYN triage and OB Triage, I can avoid referrals to the IVF program... I am not sure how advanced they are into that and of they do "fetal reductions" or not.

I mentioned the Creighton Model and NaProtechnology, and the MFM program director was unimpressed and of course didn't know a thing about it). She was pretty vocal about them needed to get the basic's with no sidetracking (following the Dublin

protocol, active labor management, checking every hour) Getting used to doing the same thing all the time so they learn it. I can understand the need for that.

What do you think?

Sandrock, CNM