Re: Asperger's & Co-Dependency?

[Guest guest]

Carissa,

I think there is always a danger of becoming co-dependant, whether or not

you are an Aspie! Yet, Aspies often want to be accepted and loved so much by

adulthood that, if they find someone who accepts them for exactly who they

are, they often latch on to that tighter than an " NT " , which can lead to

co-dependency. You may begin relying on the other to smooth your edges or to

compensate for your weaker social skills. Yet, if you can find a group that

accepts you unconditionally, where you do not need someone else to

compensate so much, you are much less likely to become co-dependant in my

opinion (and experience). For years, I was very dependant upon my husband to

navigate through the social scene and to deal with certain issues that were

overwhelming to me. I found that slowly, as I was able to build up real

friendships and supports outside of our marriage, it helped strengthen our

marriage, my independence, and really made both of our lives much better.

Though I still have trouble " reading " those I don't know, most that accept

me for who I am do not play mental games or beat around the bush. They know

that for me to get it, they have to tell it like it is and be direct with

their emotions. For me, that is a real stress reliever, because I no longer

have to guess what people are thinking/feeling/needing. They know that I am

more than willing to bend over backwards as long as I know what they want,

and I know they will be open enough to tell me!!!

Anyway, some psycs aren't worth their weight in garbage. No matter what,

they won't " get it " . You need to find one who respects you, who understands

Aspies, who is willing to listen. Remember that half of all psycs graduated

in the bottom half of their class, so just because they have a degree

doesn't make them good!!! I wasted too much time of my life trying to make

doctors, psycs, professionals understand what was going on and needed. What

I finally figured out was that I was beating my head against the wall. When

I finally gave up and went somewhere else (facilitated by a change in

insurance) what a relief to find that it wasn't me or my communication

skills... it had been who I had been trying to work with!!! My new docs were

great! I also started doing foster care around the same time and the kiddos

coming in had a variety of doctors, which let me see the differences and I

was able to choose the best of the best of them for the care of my own

kiddos as well as the other foster kids I took in. That included counselors,

psycs, medical docs, etc. It really opened my eyes!!! One doctor told me

when we were just chatting that he couldn't believe the team I had been

trying to work with previously or how long I chose to stick with them. He

wondered aloud how I could do so well with his practice when it was so

different than the other... I do well BECAUSE it is so different from the

other!!! I can't tell you how many I have referred his direction or how many

have found comfort/relief in having a doctor who truly cares and

understands!!!

Anyway, enough of a book here!!!

Happy Thanksgiving!

~hugs~

Rabecca

PS... I loved the link you list below... It hit right on the mark!!! ~grins~

<<My therapist says that I show signs of being a co-dependent. Is this

something that happens to an Aspie as they grow to an adult? He says I

shouldn't self-diagnose, but I didn't really, go figure. My son's psych. is

the one that informed me that I have the Aspie traits and my mother sees

them too. How do I get him to understand where I am coming from?

Carissa

http://psychcentral.com/personquiz.htm>>

[Guest guest]

Hi Carolyn,

I just wanted to say that I admire you very much for

coming through all that.

It must have been a terrible time, and I am so glad

that your faith was there for you to help you through

it. If only more people were able to see what you

learned. Sometimes we make things bad for ourselves,

through no fault of our own, by trying to be good

people and hurting ourselves in the process. When I

was having a bad time with my alcoholic Mum I stopped

seeing her for a while. I had to to preserve my

sanity! Then one day I bumped into one of her

neighbours (who was not aware of what was going on)

and she really laid into me about not visiting my Mum,

and how my Mum needed me etc. Well, I knew that my Mum

was OK and was trying to manipulate everyone as usual.

But it really really hurt to stand there and take all

this abuse form this person who did not know the whole

story. And I could not defend myself as that would not

help anyone. So I had to stand there and take it and

all the time I was thinking " I am not really a bad

person, if only you knew all the truth " but had to

hold it in. That was a profound moment for me too, as

it taught me to NEVER judge anyone. And then a few

weeks later an older member of my family was

criticising her neighbours daughter for not visiting

her mother often enough. And then I told her what had

happened to me and she saw too that it is not right to

judge people as you don't know what is going on.

Sometimes you see a person as being so sweet and nice,

but maybe they have done something really bad to hurt

another person and you don't know about it.

Anyway I am going off track a bit! Sorry.

Yes it is really strange for me to to be sat here in

Hong Kong, in China, just 4 weeks from Christmas and

it is warm and sunny and I am still in t-shirts etc. I

have only been here since January from the UK so it

really does not feel very Christmasy yet! My husband

has just lef to fly to Conneticut on business so he

will get some really seasonal cold weather. We had to

dig out sweaters he had not worn for many months!

Anyway I am glad you had a nice Thanksgiving. There

are lots of Americans here who have been celebrating

too. The world really is shrinking and it is nice to

know that there are others around the world with

similar problems, joys and experiences. We are all

part of a global family, and groups like this help us

realise we have friends all over the world.

Love and best wishes

Lesley

Hong Kong

p.s. It would be really nice if we could just see

where everyone else is from?

--- Carolyn <charper777@...> wrote:

> Hi Lesley,

>

> It is pretty amazing to me to be sitting here

> writing a

> letter to you in Hong Kong, that is in China isn't

> it?

> Anyway I wanted to thank you for your kind words. It

> is

> really an awful thing to be stuck in co-dependency,

> you

> don't even realize what is wrong with you, in fact

> think

> NOTHING is wrong with you, but something is only

> wrong with

> the other guy!

>

> The day it hit me that it was ME and not the

> other

> person was one day I was screaming at my husband,

> trying my

> very best to control him so he wouldn't go out

> drinking, and

> leave me home alone to be sad and lonely, and was

> just

> having a meltdown because he wasn't paying any

> attention to

> me, and just walked out the door. I cried for some

> time

> there sitting on the sofa, crying, and thinking I

> was going

> to die, like the breath had left out of me when he

> left. I

> know I am being dramatic, but it was a very dramatic

> moment

> for me.

>

> And then I cried out to God, and asked Him what

> I should

> do, and that is when I GOT IT. For the first time in

> my life

> I got it! I knew right then that I had to stop

> trying to

> control my husband any longer, and get to work on my

> own

> self, and realized that my happiness in life was not

> dependant on him. It was the most amazing break

> through. I

> just at that moment knew the TRUTH. He was not my

> problem,

> but I WAS MY PROBLEM.

>

> So I enrolled in college, and when I went to

> college

> over the next six years I discovered myself, for the

> first

> time in my life I really got to know me. My husband

> and I

> drifted apart, and after awhile he even got mad at

> me for

> neglecting him I guess. But I was just so busy going

> to

> class and doing my work that I had no time to think

> about

> him that much. And this was when I still had to take

> care of

> my brain damaged autistic son, and two of my other

> children

> were still at home, but I found a way. Eventually I

> filed

> for a divorce once it looked like he was not

> planning on

> turning away from his alcoholism, and about ten

> years after

> it was final he died of cirrhosis and cancer.

>

> What I basically did was I saved myself. I had

> to learn

> that I was responsible for my life, and that he was

> responsible for his. I did not have to save him,

> which was

> part of my torment because I saw which way he was

> going, and

> also that he did not have to save me. So I just let

> him go,

> and took responsibility for my own life.

>

> Well I kind of got on a roll there I guess! We

> had a

> nice day here today. I cooked a turkey dinner and my

> daughter and her three kids, and my oldest son Tom

> came

> over. Her husband didn't make it, nor his

> girlfriend, but

> that's o.k., and my mom came also, and my disabled

> son Marty

> was here, and we had a nice day.

>

> And now I am going to go and watch " Survivor, "

> talk to

> you all soon.

> Carolyn in Oregon U.S.A.

>

>

>

>

> Re: Asperger's &

> Co-Dependency?

>

>

> Carolyn - I found this post TRULY inspiring. How

> wonderful that you were able to find your way out of

> the fog of codependency. GOOD FOR YOU!!!

>

>

> HAPPY THANKSGIVING to all my new American friends!

>

> Lesley

> Hong Kong

>

> --- Carolyn <charper777@...> wrote:

> > Hi Carissa,

> >

> > I didn't know you had a therapist, that's

> good.

> > Anyway

> > about being co-dependent, I don't think you have

> to

> > be Aspie

> > or anything else really, just human. I have had a

> > terrible

> > time with it myself. And what I have come to

> > understand what

> > it is, it is when you believe that you must help

> > others to

> > the extent that you are very dependant on them. If

> > they do

> > not get better, then you believe, really believe,

> > that you

> > can never be happy yourself! If they are a mess

> then

> > you are

> > a mess! It is a problem of being unable to

> separate

> > from

> > another person, and their own personal problems,

> > unhappiness, whatever, and being unable to take

> > responsibility for your own happiness in life.

> >

> > With me, I was raised that way. My mom is

> quite

> > co-dependant, and from listening to her growing up

> I

> > became

> > like her. All of her happiness, or unhappiness

> > seemed to

> > rest squarely upon my dad and what he was doing,

> and

> > whether

> > he made her happy or not happy. If he had his own

> > personal

> > problem, in his case it was getting drunk when she

> > did not

> > want him to, then she was very unhappy. But, he

> was

> > happy!

> > He was doing what he wanted to be doing, and she

> > could not

> > imagine that, as she believed all of his efforts

> > were

> > supposed to be geared to MAKING HER HAPPY!

> >

> > So my dad died when he was only 56, from a

> > logging

> > accident, and my mom is 86 now, over thirty years

> > since he

> > died, and she is STILL unhappy. Why? Because he

> > died! And

> > her oldest son has died, and her second oldest son

> > has died,

> > and she only has me and one son younger than me.

> And

> > she is

> > always whining and complaining about how unhappy

> she

> > is!

> >

> > People who are co-dependant have a very hard

> > time

> > separating themselves from others. They are

> victims

> > really,

> > to the circumstances in their lives. And too, they

> > cannot

> > imagine that there is another way to look at

> thing.

> > Rather,

> > that THEY are responsible for their own happiness,

>

=== message truncated ===

___________________________________________________________

Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Messenger

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[Guest guest]

Hi Lesley,

Wow, I know what you are talking about where you said you had to avoid seeing your Mum on account of the way she treated you. I have had to do that too, and yet she is so sweet to other people, just not to me. haha Once I had a wonderful insight though. My brother had called me to bawl me out one night. He was a serious alcoholic for at least forty years before his death last year of cirrhosis, and mom evidentially had been telling him how "bad" I was and so he called me, and he started laying it on me, and I said these words,

"Well Dick, this is as nice as I am ever going to get!"

It left him speechless! I am sure the Lord gave me these words, I had never thought of them before. Well gosh here I was a mom, at the time near 60 years old, had raised my own family, three regular kids and one severely disabled, had been made widow also by my husband's cirrhosis from alcoholism, and had managed to survive and take care of everybody, and never hesitated to help mom whenever she called on me.

After that, I have always held onto those words, and they make me feel really GOOD. You should try it! Well I have to run, my daughter is here to get her kids, and I need to talk to her. She said her husband just called from the woods, and is lost deer hunting! And his phone was going dead, good grief, what next around here!

Talk to you soon,

Carolyn in Springfield, Oregon, U.S.A.

Re: Asperger's & > Co-Dependency?> > > Carolyn - I found this post TRULY inspiring. How> wonderful that you were able to find your way out of> the fog of codependency. GOOD FOR YOU!!!> > > HAPPY THANKSGIVING to all my new American friends!> > Lesley> Hong Kong> > --- Carolyn <charper777@...> wrote:> > Hi Carissa,> >> > I didn't know you had a therapist, that's> good.> > Anyway> > about being co-dependent, I don't think you have> to> > be Aspie> > or anything else really, just human. I have had a> > terrible> > time with it myself. And what I have come to> > understand what> > it is, it is when you believe that you must help> > others to> > the extent that you are very dependant on them. If> > they do> > not get better, then you believe, really believe,> > that you> > can never be happy yourself! If they are a mess> then> > you are> > a mess! It is a problem of being unable to> separate> > from> > another person, and their own personal problems,> > unhappiness, whatever, and being unable to take> > responsibility for your own happiness in life.> >> > With me, I was raised that way. My mom is> quite> > co-dependant, and from listening to her growing up> I> > became> > like her. All of her happiness, or unhappiness> > seemed to> > rest squarely upon my dad and what he was doing,> and> > whether> > he made her happy or not happy. If he had his own> > personal> > problem, in his case it was getting drunk when she> > did not> > want him to, then she was very unhappy. But, he> was> > happy!> > He was doing what he wanted to be doing, and she> > could not> > imagine that, as she believed all of his efforts> > were> > supposed to be geared to MAKING HER HAPPY!> >> > So my dad died when he was only 56, from a> > logging> > accident, and my mom is 86 now, over thirty years> > since he> > died, and she is STILL unhappy. Why? Because he> > died! And> > her oldest son has died, and her second oldest son> > has died,> > and she only has me and one son younger than me.> And> > she is> > always whining and complaining about how unhappy> she> > is!> >> > People who are co-dependant have a very hard> > time> > separating themselves from others. They are> victims> > really,> > to the circumstances in their lives. And too, they> > cannot> > imagine that there is another way to look at> thing.> > Rather,> > that THEY are responsible for their own happiness,> === message truncated === ___________________________________________________________ Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Messenger http://uk.messenger.

[Guest guest]

Brilliant! Thank you. yes, they can only hurt our

emotions if we give them our permission!

Lesley

Hong Kong

--- Carolyn <charper777@...> wrote:

> Hi Lesley,

>

> Wow, I know what you are talking about where you

> said

> you had to avoid seeing your Mum on account of the

> way she

> treated you. I have had to do that too, and yet she

> is so

> sweet to other people, just not to me. haha Once I

> had a

> wonderful insight though. My brother had called me

> to bawl

> me out one night. He was a serious alcoholic for at

> least

> forty years before his death last year of cirrhosis,

> and mom

> evidentially had been telling him how " bad " I was

> and so he

> called me, and he started laying it on me, and I

> said these

> words,

>

> " Well Dick, this is as nice as I am ever going

> to get! "

>

> It left him speechless! I am sure the Lord gave

> me these

> words, I had never thought of them before. Well gosh

> here I

> was a mom, at the time near 60 years old, had raised

> my own

> family, three regular kids and one severely

> disabled, had

> been made widow also by my husband's cirrhosis from

> alcoholism, and had managed to survive and take care

> of

> everybody, and never hesitated to help mom whenever

> she

> called on me.

>

> After that, I have always held onto those words,

> and

> they make me feel really GOOD. You should try it!

> Well I

> have to run, my daughter is here to get her kids,

> and I need

> to talk to her. She said her husband just called

> from the

> woods, and is lost deer hunting! And his phone was

> going

> dead, good grief, what next around here!

>

> Talk to you soon,

> Carolyn in Springfield, Oregon, U.S.A.

>

> Re: Asperger's &

> Co-Dependency?

>

>

> Hi Carolyn,

>

> I just wanted to say that I admire you very much for

> coming through all that.

>

> It must have been a terrible time, and I am so glad

> that your faith was there for you to help you

> through

> it. If only more people were able to see what you

> learned. Sometimes we make things bad for ourselves,

> through no fault of our own, by trying to be good

> people and hurting ourselves in the process. When I

> was having a bad time with my alcoholic Mum I

> stopped

> seeing her for a while. I had to to preserve my

> sanity! Then one day I bumped into one of her

> neighbours (who was not aware of what was going on)

> and she really laid into me about not visiting my

> Mum,

> and how my Mum needed me etc. Well, I knew that my

> Mum

> was OK and was trying to manipulate everyone as

> usual.

> But it really really hurt to stand there and take

> all

> this abuse form this person who did not know the

> whole

> story. And I could not defend myself as that would

> not

> help anyone. So I had to stand there and take it and

> all the time I was thinking " I am not really a bad

> person, if only you knew all the truth " but had to

> hold it in. That was a profound moment for me too,

> as

> it taught me to NEVER judge anyone. And then a few

> weeks later an older member of my family was

> criticising her neighbours daughter for not visiting

> her mother often enough. And then I told her what

> had

> happened to me and she saw too that it is not right

> to

> judge people as you don't know what is going on.

> Sometimes you see a person as being so sweet and

> nice,

> but maybe they have done something really bad to

> hurt

> another person and you don't know about it.

>

> Anyway I am going off track a bit! Sorry.

>

> Yes it is really strange for me to to be sat here in

> Hong Kong, in China, just 4 weeks from Christmas and

> it is warm and sunny and I am still in t-shirts etc.

> I

> have only been here since January from the UK so it

> really does not feel very Christmasy yet! My husband

> has just lef to fly to Conneticut on business so he

> will get some really seasonal cold weather. We had

> to

> dig out sweaters he had not worn for many months!

> Anyway I am glad you had a nice Thanksgiving. There

> are lots of Americans here who have been celebrating

> too. The world really is shrinking and it is nice to

> know that there are others around the world with

> similar problems, joys and experiences. We are all

> part of a global family, and groups like this help

> us

> realise we have friends all over the world.

>

> Love and best wishes

> Lesley

> Hong Kong

>

> p.s. It would be really nice if we could just see

> where everyone else is from?

>

> --- Carolyn <charper777@...> wrote:

> > Hi Lesley,

> >

> > It is pretty amazing to me to be sitting here

> > writing a

> > letter to you in Hong Kong, that is in China isn't

> > it?

> > Anyway I wanted to thank you for your kind words.

> It

> > is

> > really an awful thing to be stuck in

> co-dependency,

> > you

> > don't even realize what is wrong with you, in fact

> > think

> > NOTHING is wrong with you, but something is only

> > wrong with

> > the other guy!

> >

> > The day it hit me that it was ME and not the

> > other

> > person was one day I was screaming at my husband,

> > trying my

> > very best to control him so he wouldn't go out

> > drinking, and

> > leave me home alone to be sad and lonely, and was

> > just

> > having a meltdown because he wasn't paying any

> > attention to

> > me, and just walked out the door. I cried for some

> > time

> > there sitting on the sofa, crying, and thinking I

> > was going

> > to die, like the breath had left out of me when he

> > left. I

> > know I am being dramatic, but it was a very

> dramatic

> > moment

> > for me.

> >

> > And then I cried out to God, and asked Him

> what

> > I should

> > do, and that is when I GOT IT. For the first time

> in

> > my life

> > I got it! I knew right then that I had to stop

> > trying to

> > control my husband any longer, and get to work on

> my

> > own

> > self, and realized that my happiness in life was

> not

> > dependant on him. It was the most amazing break

> > through. I

> > just at that moment knew the TRUTH. He was not my

> > problem,

> > but I WAS MY PROBLEM.

> >

> > So I enrolled in college, and when I went to

> > college

> > over the next six years I discovered myself, for

> the

>

=== message truncated ===

___________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

Brilliant! Thank you. yes, they can only hurt our

emotions if we give them our permission!

Lesley

Hong Kong

--- Carolyn <charper777@...> wrote:

> Hi Lesley,

>

> Wow, I know what you are talking about where you

> said

> you had to avoid seeing your Mum on account of the

> way she

> treated you. I have had to do that too, and yet she

> is so

> sweet to other people, just not to me. haha Once I

> had a

> wonderful insight though. My brother had called me

> to bawl

> me out one night. He was a serious alcoholic for at

> least

> forty years before his death last year of cirrhosis,

> and mom

> evidentially had been telling him how " bad " I was

> and so he

> called me, and he started laying it on me, and I

> said these

> words,

>

> " Well Dick, this is as nice as I am ever going

> to get! "

>

> It left him speechless! I am sure the Lord gave

> me these

> words, I had never thought of them before. Well gosh

> here I

> was a mom, at the time near 60 years old, had raised

> my own

> family, three regular kids and one severely

> disabled, had

> been made widow also by my husband's cirrhosis from

> alcoholism, and had managed to survive and take care

> of

> everybody, and never hesitated to help mom whenever

> she

> called on me.

>

> After that, I have always held onto those words,

> and

> they make me feel really GOOD. You should try it!

> Well I

> have to run, my daughter is here to get her kids,

> and I need

> to talk to her. She said her husband just called

> from the

> woods, and is lost deer hunting! And his phone was

> going

> dead, good grief, what next around here!

>

> Talk to you soon,

> Carolyn in Springfield, Oregon, U.S.A.

>

> Re: Asperger's &

> Co-Dependency?

>

>

> Hi Carolyn,

>

> I just wanted to say that I admire you very much for

> coming through all that.

>

> It must have been a terrible time, and I am so glad

> that your faith was there for you to help you

> through

> it. If only more people were able to see what you

> learned. Sometimes we make things bad for ourselves,

> through no fault of our own, by trying to be good

> people and hurting ourselves in the process. When I

> was having a bad time with my alcoholic Mum I

> stopped

> seeing her for a while. I had to to preserve my

> sanity! Then one day I bumped into one of her

> neighbours (who was not aware of what was going on)

> and she really laid into me about not visiting my

> Mum,

> and how my Mum needed me etc. Well, I knew that my

> Mum

> was OK and was trying to manipulate everyone as

> usual.

> But it really really hurt to stand there and take

> all

> this abuse form this person who did not know the

> whole

> story. And I could not defend myself as that would

> not

> help anyone. So I had to stand there and take it and

> all the time I was thinking " I am not really a bad

> person, if only you knew all the truth " but had to

> hold it in. That was a profound moment for me too,

> as

> it taught me to NEVER judge anyone. And then a few

> weeks later an older member of my family was

> criticising her neighbours daughter for not visiting

> her mother often enough. And then I told her what

> had

> happened to me and she saw too that it is not right

> to

> judge people as you don't know what is going on.

> Sometimes you see a person as being so sweet and

> nice,

> but maybe they have done something really bad to

> hurt

> another person and you don't know about it.

>

> Anyway I am going off track a bit! Sorry.

>

> Yes it is really strange for me to to be sat here in

> Hong Kong, in China, just 4 weeks from Christmas and

> it is warm and sunny and I am still in t-shirts etc.

> I

> have only been here since January from the UK so it

> really does not feel very Christmasy yet! My husband

> has just lef to fly to Conneticut on business so he

> will get some really seasonal cold weather. We had

> to

> dig out sweaters he had not worn for many months!

> Anyway I am glad you had a nice Thanksgiving. There

> are lots of Americans here who have been celebrating

> too. The world really is shrinking and it is nice to

> know that there are others around the world with

> similar problems, joys and experiences. We are all

> part of a global family, and groups like this help

> us

> realise we have friends all over the world.

>

> Love and best wishes

> Lesley

> Hong Kong

>

> p.s. It would be really nice if we could just see

> where everyone else is from?

>

> --- Carolyn <charper777@...> wrote:

> > Hi Lesley,

> >

> > It is pretty amazing to me to be sitting here

> > writing a

> > letter to you in Hong Kong, that is in China isn't

> > it?

> > Anyway I wanted to thank you for your kind words.

> It

> > is

> > really an awful thing to be stuck in

> co-dependency,

> > you

> > don't even realize what is wrong with you, in fact

> > think

> > NOTHING is wrong with you, but something is only

> > wrong with

> > the other guy!

> >

> > The day it hit me that it was ME and not the

> > other

> > person was one day I was screaming at my husband,

> > trying my

> > very best to control him so he wouldn't go out

> > drinking, and

> > leave me home alone to be sad and lonely, and was

> > just

> > having a meltdown because he wasn't paying any

> > attention to

> > me, and just walked out the door. I cried for some

> > time

> > there sitting on the sofa, crying, and thinking I

> > was going

> > to die, like the breath had left out of me when he

> > left. I

> > know I am being dramatic, but it was a very

> dramatic

> > moment

> > for me.

> >

> > And then I cried out to God, and asked Him

> what

> > I should

> > do, and that is when I GOT IT. For the first time

> in

> > my life

> > I got it! I knew right then that I had to stop

> > trying to

> > control my husband any longer, and get to work on

> my

> > own

> > self, and realized that my happiness in life was

> not

> > dependant on him. It was the most amazing break

> > through. I

> > just at that moment knew the TRUTH. He was not my

> > problem,

> > but I WAS MY PROBLEM.

> >

> > So I enrolled in college, and when I went to

> > college

> > over the next six years I discovered myself, for

> the

>

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