Re:Leo Kanner, reactionary against eugenics?

[Guest guest]

Two small points...

I do not know that Kanner bought into the refrigerator

mother theory, which was conceive by Bettleheim. He

may not have been vocal in his misgivings or

opposition (I recall reading several times that

Rimland was the first vocal critic of Bettleheim's

theorm).

As to " mercy eugenics " being a thing of the past...

As late as 2000, Dr. Singer, who held the

dubious position of Bio-ethics Chair at Princeton was

advocating that parents should have the right to

" abort " disabled children as old as age 3, to spare

the children, their families and ultimately society

the burden of caring for their extraordinary needs.

Never for one minutte think that ONLY the Nazis would

advocate crimes against humanity such as forced

euthanasia.

To paraphrase Ghandi, " a society is best judged by the

manner in which they treat those members least able to

defend themselves. "

________________________________________________________________________________\

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[Guest guest]

That is disgusting!!! 3 years old?

Obviously he has some severe mental impairments himself to ever suggest such a

thing. Do you have any references to this?

-

From: EOHarm [mailto:EOHarm ] On Behalf Of Dad Fourkids

Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007

2:43 PM

EOHarm

Subject: Re:Leo Kanner,

reactionary against eugenics?

Two small

points...

I do not know that Kanner bought into the refrigerator

mother theory, which was conceive by Bettleheim. He

may not have been vocal in his misgivings or

opposition (I recall reading several times that

Rimland was the first vocal critic of Bettleheim's

theorm).

As to " mercy eugenics " being a thing of the past...

As late as 2000, Dr. Singer, who held the

dubious position of Bio-ethics Chair at Princeton

was

advocating that parents should have the right to

" abort " disabled children as old as age 3, to spare

the children, their families and ultimately society

the burden of caring for their extraordinary needs.

Never for one minutte think that ONLY the Nazis would

advocate crimes against humanity such as forced

euthanasia.

To paraphrase Ghandi, " a society is best judged by the

manner in which they treat those members least able to

defend themselves. "

__________________________________________________________

Looking for last minute shopping deals?

Find them fast with Search. http://tools.search./newsearch/category.php?category=shopping

[Guest guest]

well... this is not the only time in history about getting rid of kids with disabilities.. the chinese would throw them off cliffs as well as the greeks... disgusting.. but true...LiaCheck out AOL Money Finance's list of the hottest products and top money wasters of 2007.

[Guest guest]

Yikes. Singer, huh? I think I'll sleuth out more about that

character. I'll bet he was involved in some government

psychiatric " violence treatment " programs.

I hadn't heard of Singer but I believe that modern eugenics is alive

and well, even if going by different, more euphemized names. The

book I'm reading (which I keep compulsively posting about each time

I come accross more historical shockers), " The War Against Children

of Color " , about psychiatric abuse and modern eugenics, points out

that eugenics in the United States and Germany PRECEEDED naziism.

Eugenical psychiatry was not influenced by naziism but vice-versa.

I wrote earlier that eugenical psychiatry- as a philosophy- escaped

prosecution at Nuremberg. Untold numbers of psychiatrists who not

only implemented the Final Solution but *started it*, were never

brought to justice or public scrutiny because the chief psychiatric

examiner at Nuremberg, Leo , was a eugenicist himself.

Furthermore, the U.S. was practicing eugenical sterilization in

mental institutions and prison and the Tuskegee experiment was well

underway at that time. may have been charged with the task

of glossing over the " overlaps " between American and German

psychiatric abuses. He let the psychiatric criminals off and

allowed, therefore, their ideas to spread and " breed " , which is one

way to explain the horrors and corruption of modern genetic theory,

pharmaceutical practices and biopsychiatry in general.

Thanks for the heads up about Kanner and Beitelheim. I get a bit

confused! (blond genes) Someone sent me a quote from Kanner in which

he remarks that the diagnosis of autism was muddled and that science

attempts to shut the book on the diagnosis when so much more needed

to be learned.

>

> Two small points...

>

> I do not know that Kanner bought into the refrigerator

> mother theory, which was conceive by Bettleheim. He

> may not have been vocal in his misgivings or

> opposition (I recall reading several times that

> Rimland was the first vocal critic of Bettleheim's

> theorm).

>

> As to " mercy eugenics " being a thing of the past...

> As late as 2000, Dr. Singer, who held the

> dubious position of Bio-ethics Chair at Princeton was

> advocating that parents should have the right to

> " abort " disabled children as old as age 3, to spare

> the children, their families and ultimately society

> the burden of caring for their extraordinary needs.

> Never for one minutte think that ONLY the Nazis would

> advocate crimes against humanity such as forced

> euthanasia.

>

> To paraphrase Ghandi, " a society is best judged by the

> manner in which they treat those members least able to

> defend themselves. "

>

>

>

_____________________________________________________________________

_______________

> Looking for last minute shopping deals?

> Find them fast with Search.

http://tools.search./newsearch/category.php?

category=shopping

>

[Guest guest]

When we were in the NICU with my preemies the nurses told me that

only a few years ago if kids were doing bad the doctors would turn

off the machines and just tell the parents the kids died overnight -

no one questioned it ...

Diane

>

> That is disgusting!!! 3 years old? Obviously he has some severe

mental

> impairments himself to ever suggest such a thing. Do you have any

> references to this?

>

> -

>

>

>

> _____

>

> From: EOHarm [mailto:EOHarm ] On

Behalf Of

> Dad Fourkids

> Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 2:43 PM

> EOHarm

> Subject: Re:Leo Kanner, reactionary against eugenics?

>

>

>

> Two small points...

>

> I do not know that Kanner bought into the refrigerator

> mother theory, which was conceive by Bettleheim. He

> may not have been vocal in his misgivings or

> opposition (I recall reading several times that

> Rimland was the first vocal critic of Bettleheim's

> theorm).

>

> As to " mercy eugenics " being a thing of the past...

> As late as 2000, Dr. Singer, who held the

> dubious position of Bio-ethics Chair at Princeton was

> advocating that parents should have the right to

> " abort " disabled children as old as age 3, to spare

> the children, their families and ultimately society

> the burden of caring for their extraordinary needs.

> Never for one minutte think that ONLY the Nazis would

> advocate crimes against humanity such as forced

> euthanasia.

>

> To paraphrase Ghandi, " a society is best judged by the

> manner in which they treat those members least able to

> defend themselves. "

>

> __________________________________________________________

> Looking for last minute shopping deals?

> Find them fast with Search. http://tools.

> <http://tools.search./newsearch/category.php?

category=shopping>

> search./newsearch/category.php?category=shopping

>

[Guest guest]

Now that's just nausiating. I guess they didn't want NICU crowded up

with what they subjectively deemed " hopeless cases " , because they

certainly weren't acting in the best interests of the child, the

parents or society.

> >

> > That is disgusting!!! 3 years old? Obviously he has some severe

> mental

> > impairments himself to ever suggest such a thing. Do you have

any

> > references to this?

> >

> > -

> >

> >

> >

> > _____

> >

> > From: EOHarm [mailto:EOHarm ] On

> Behalf Of

> > Dad Fourkids

> > Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 2:43 PM

> > EOHarm

> > Subject: Re:Leo Kanner, reactionary against eugenics?

> >

> >

> >

> > Two small points...

> >

> > I do not know that Kanner bought into the refrigerator

> > mother theory, which was conceive by Bettleheim. He

> > may not have been vocal in his misgivings or

> > opposition (I recall reading several times that

> > Rimland was the first vocal critic of Bettleheim's

> > theorm).

> >

> > As to " mercy eugenics " being a thing of the past...

> > As late as 2000, Dr. Singer, who held the

> > dubious position of Bio-ethics Chair at Princeton was

> > advocating that parents should have the right to

> > " abort " disabled children as old as age 3, to spare

> > the children, their families and ultimately society

> > the burden of caring for their extraordinary needs.

> > Never for one minutte think that ONLY the Nazis would

> > advocate crimes against humanity such as forced

> > euthanasia.

> >

> > To paraphrase Ghandi, " a society is best judged by the

> > manner in which they treat those members least able to

> > defend themselves. "

> >

> > __________________________________________________________

> > Looking for last minute shopping deals?

> > Find them fast with Search. http://tools.

> > <http://tools.search./newsearch/category.php?

> category=shopping>

> > search./newsearch/category.php?category=shopping

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Endlessly keeping anyone alive with machinery can be pretty awful.

But it would be a lot better to talk it over with the parents and

come to a decision that there was no hope of improvement or

survival, rather than acting like god behind the scenes.

Would you want your death endlessly prolonged just because the

machinery was there to do it?

I'm not in favor of physician assisted suicide. I'm very glad that

my aunt, who had a severe stroke (with no hope of recovery), had

signed documents requesting that she not be kept alive with

machinery. She was able to spend her last weeks in hospice, gently

departing, rather than in an ICU or nursing home, suffering through

an indefinite period of pointless life prolongation.

Those doctors sound like skunks, though!

Deborah

> > >

> > > That is disgusting!!! 3 years old? Obviously he has some

severe

> > mental

> > > impairments himself to ever suggest such a thing. Do you have

> any

> > > references to this?

> > >

> > > -

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > _____

> > >

> > > From: EOHarm [mailto:EOHarm ]

On

> > Behalf Of

> > > Dad Fourkids

> > > Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 2:43 PM

> > > EOHarm

> > > Subject: Re:Leo Kanner, reactionary against eugenics?

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Two small points...

> > >

> > > I do not know that Kanner bought into the refrigerator

> > > mother theory, which was conceive by Bettleheim. He

> > > may not have been vocal in his misgivings or

> > > opposition (I recall reading several times that

> > > Rimland was the first vocal critic of Bettleheim's

> > > theorm).

> > >

> > > As to " mercy eugenics " being a thing of the past...

> > > As late as 2000, Dr. Singer, who held the

> > > dubious position of Bio-ethics Chair at Princeton was

> > > advocating that parents should have the right to

> > > " abort " disabled children as old as age 3, to spare

> > > the children, their families and ultimately society

> > > the burden of caring for their extraordinary needs.

> > > Never for one minutte think that ONLY the Nazis would

> > > advocate crimes against humanity such as forced

> > > euthanasia.

> > >

> > > To paraphrase Ghandi, " a society is best judged by the

> > > manner in which they treat those members least able to

> > > defend themselves. "

> > >

> > > __________________________________________________________

> > > Looking for last minute shopping deals?

> > > Find them fast with Search. http://tools.

> > > <http://tools.search./newsearch/category.php?

> > category=shopping>

> > > search./newsearch/category.php?category=shopping

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

It seems that this strand has diverted from the subject line. Until I read some of the earlier postings here, I never realized that Kanner may have been a reactionary against eugenics. However, years ago, I had already heard that Hans Asperger, Kanner's "counterpart" in Europe, perhaps unbeknownst to him , was also trying to save kids from the Nazi's drive to get rid of anyone with certain differences. Hans Asperger, in his own way, also tried to save kids who would have otherwise been deemed unacceptable. Aasadoybia <doybia@...> wrote: Endlessly keeping anyone alive with machinery can be pretty awful. But it would be a lot better to talk it over with the parents and come to a decision that there was no hope of improvement or survival, rather than acting like god behind the scenes.Would you want your death endlessly prolonged just because the machinery was there to do it?I'm not in favor of physician assisted suicide. I'm very glad that my aunt, who had a severe stroke (with no hope of recovery), had signed documents requesting that she not be kept alive with machinery. She was able to spend her last weeks in hospice, gently departing, rather than in an ICU or nursing home, suffering through an indefinite period of pointless life prolongation.Those doctors sound like skunks, though!Deborah> > >>

> > That is disgusting!!! 3 years old? Obviously he has some severe > > mental> > > impairments himself to ever suggest such a thing. Do you have > any> > > references to this? > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > From: EOHarm [mailto:EOHarm ] On > > Behalf Of> > > Dad Fourkids> > > Sent: Monday, December 03, 2007 2:43 PM> > > EOHarm > > > Subject: Re:Leo Kanner, reactionary against eugenics?> > > > > > > > > > > > Two small points...> > > >

> > I do not know that Kanner bought into the refrigerator> > > mother theory, which was conceive by Bettleheim. He> > > may not have been vocal in his misgivings or> > > opposition (I recall reading several times that> > > Rimland was the first vocal critic of Bettleheim's> > > theorm).> > > > > > As to "mercy eugenics" being a thing of the past... > > > As late as 2000, Dr. Singer, who held the> > > dubious position of Bio-ethics Chair at Princeton was> > > advocating that parents should have the right to> > > "abort" disabled children as old as age 3, to spare> > > the children, their families and ultimately society> > > the burden of caring for their extraordinary needs. > > > Never for one minutte think that ONLY the Nazis would> > > advocate crimes against

humanity such as forced> > > euthanasia.> > > > > > To paraphrase Ghandi, "a society is best judged by the> > > manner in which they treat those members least able to> > > defend themselves."> > > > > > __________________________________________________________> > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? > > > Find them fast with Search. http://tools.> > > <http://tools.search./newsearch/category.php?> > category=shopping>> > > search./newsearch/category.php?category=shopping> > >> >>