Re: combatautism.org/MAM, No HG,achamp logo gone

[Guest guest]



One approach may be to use the private funding to point out the corruption of our medical institutions. But that will only go to causation. If Maloney-Olmsted can't get done, maybe Generation Rescue efforts and a few others will be enough.

For new therapies, especially from, for example, the NIH, the fact that the medical authorities refuse to look into the common sense answer to this epidemic and congress rubberstamps the corruption, will mean that no meaningful research will be done in this area, unless it comes from private research funds.

It's absolutely absurd that one has to go the private route to end-run a corruptive process in the federal government because the federal government is actively working against any therapies which will implicate the common sense answer to this scandal.

What a mess!!

It shows how far we've fallen.

Re: Re: combatautism.org/MAM, No HG,achamp logo gonePutting aside for the moment the debate about CAA, since the last poster asked about Holly, I would like to point out that Holly has worked with a number of groups that have "successfully passed a bill." As I'm sure you know, passing a bill is a political process that requires the collective work of many individuals and groups. Building a movement and an effective coalition is what it takes. In a very short time, in NY and other states, in cooperation with other organizations, A-CHAMP or its members and coalition partners (including NoMercury) have led or participated in the passage of many pieces of legislation - legislation that directly helps our kids. Holly has participated in and supported a number of those efforts. She is a veteran.We are all trying to make a difference. Sometimes criticism - not addressing the criticism here - is productive. Without criticism we will get what those in power - those who dominate the power structure in D.C. - shove down our throats. I credit the efforts of many parents to get something done for our kids. Surely, you would not want to stifle healthy debate by saying that it is inappropriate to criticize a position that may not be helpful for our kids, even though it appears helpful. Simply to say that someone or some organization is "trying to make a difference" does not automatically validate the position those people or organizations take. Sometimes it is very important to respectfully disagree with "brethren" when they are misguided or misdirected. I would submit that doing so is the essence of doing "something productive" and is the only responsible conduct in which to engage.And while this may violate the list moderator's edict on commenting on an individual's activities, I know that right now Holly is doing something highly productive for all our kids.As for the reasons why CAA may not be the panacea - may even be a setback - we can get into that when the dust settles. See my earlier post on the colloquy language's reference to the IOM report for one reason why CAA may not be what we want. I am sure right now some groups are debating the merits of the CAA passed by the Senate. Whether or not it becomes law many parents will be right there, shining a light on the NIH and CDC, making sure that the bureaucratic machinations of the past, and the industry/government collusion directing [suppressing] research, does not continue without criticism and counter political pressure. This will include groups on differing sides of the CAA question, the advocacy for which unfortunately became a tool for dividing us, rather than building a strong parents' movement.On Aug 5, 2006, at 12:37 AM, mercerdad13 wrote:

What's the basis for your comments, Holly? If you could articulate yourself without using vulgar language, maybe someone would listen to you. Have you ever successfully passed a bill? Probably not. Stop throwing stones at the very people who trying to make a difference for every child with autism. Put your energies into something productive...criticizing your brethren is not becoming. > > > > > > > http://www.combatau <http://www.combatautism.org/> tism.org/> > > >> > > > Don't know when this site went live. KB> > > >> > > > > > > J. Krakow> > > Attorney At Law> > > 2001 Marcus Avenue, Suite N125> > > Lake Success, New York 11042> > > (516) 354-3300> > > (646) 349-1771 (fax)> > > (212) 227-0600 (NYC telephone)> > >> >> J. KrakowAttorney At Law2001 Marcus Avenue, Suite N125Lake Success, New York 11042(516) 354-3300 (646) 349-1771 (fax)(212) 227-0600 (NYC telephone) J. KrakowAttorney At Law2001 Marcus Avenue, Suite N125Lake Success, New York 11042(516) 354-3300 (646) 349-1771 (fax)(212) 227-0600 (NYC telephone)

[Guest guest]

HollyThank you for being there for all of us, watching our backs, for so long.  You have been fighting this longer than my baby has been alive (he is only 5).  I learn every day from veterans like you and take the info I get to our local ASD community.  I work on informing one person (including my doctor friends) at a time.  So many people are still in the dark; but not as many as yesterday, a month ago, six months ago, a year ago.  This is due to you and other like you.:)On Aug 5, 2006, at 9:55 AM, Holly Bortfeld wrote:Mercerdad, as you have seen from the volley of supportive emails (thanks to all) in response to yours, I am not the only one unhappy with this legislation.  It’s a bad bill, period.  If you read and analyze the bill, you will see for yourself what is so bad and how, as it’s currently written, it will never help the children who already have autism.  It’s a shame that it got diluted so much, but compromise for the sake of getting your name on something isn’t good enough.  You can say, “wow, we got $1 billion to spend just on autism” but the reality is if most of it is wasted in silly programs like teaching doctors to recognize autism (and at the same time saying the increase is due to doctors better recognizing it – not to mention the fact that they already have a perfectly good program for dirt cheap in place) or it’s all given to the CDC to continue to squander it on anything but environmental research – I can see 87 new studies to show that ASD kids have social and language impairments, are most often left-handed, were born in august and had fathers with technical jobs – would you be happy knowing that they spent $1Billion on that?  How will any of that help your child?  My energies are firmly planted in support of our kids and I work towards helping today’s children, as well as tomorrow’s children every single day.  I have done so for more than 8 years.  I will still work with the legislators in the house to revive this bill if at all possible but I fear it’s truly too late.  The bill had a bad beginning and didn’t stand much of a chance to begin with in regards to actually helping our kids.  If this bill does pass as written, we will spend more time fighting it than gaining anything useful from it.  I think it will be better for us long term to kill it and come back stronger, having learned our lessons from this run.  If you don’t agree, that’s fine.  But I expect to see you, and everyone else, do their part, show up in DC, contact all your legislators and work like hell to pass the bill that you think will actually benefit your kid.  I am happier to deal with people who do the work, even if I don’t agree with it than those who complain one way or another, but I never see in DC backing up their stance.  I may bitch and complain, and YES, criticize, but I always show up and do my part.  Holly From: EOHarm [mailto:EOHarm ] On Behalf Of mercerdad13Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 12:38 AMEOHarm Subject: Re: combatautism.org/MAM, No HG,achamp logo gone What's the basis for your comments, Holly? If you could articulate yourself without using vulgar language, maybe someone would listen to you. Have you ever successfully passed a bill? Probably not. Stop throwing stones at the very people who trying to make a difference for every child with autism. Put your energies into something productive...criticizing your brethren is not becoming. > > > > > > > http://www.combatau <http://www.combatautism.org/> tism.org/> > > >> > > > Don't know when this site went live. KB> > > >> > > > > > > J. Krakow> > > Attorney At Law> > > 2001 Marcus Avenue, Suite N125> > > Lake Success, New York 11042> > > (516) 354-3300> > > (646) 349-1771 (fax)> > > (212) 227-0600 (NYC telephone)> > >> >>

[Guest guest]

But if the majority of the large autism groups e.g. SafeMinds, etc,

give this bill a thumbs up wont it be difficult to toss this bill in

the trash??

> > >

> > > > http://www.combatau <http://www.combatautism.org/> tism.org/

> > > >

> > > > Don't know when this site went live. KB

> > > >

> > > >

> > > J. Krakow

> > > Attorney At Law

> > > 2001 Marcus Avenue, Suite N125

> > > Lake Success, New York 11042

> > > (516) 354-3300

> > > (646) 349-1771 (fax)

> > > (212) 227-0600 (NYC telephone)

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, but difficult is not impossible.

Parents have the power. J

From: EOHarm [mailto:EOHarm ] On Behalf Of markautismcharge

Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2006

3:32 PM

EOHarm

Subject: Re:

combatautism.org/MAM, No HG,achamp logo gone

But if the majority of the large autism groups e.g.

SafeMinds, etc,

give this bill a thumbs up wont it be difficult to toss this bill in

the trash??

> > >

> > > > http://www.combatau <http://www.combatautism.org/>

tism.org/

> > > >

> > > > Don't know when this site went live. KB

> > > >

> > > >

> > > J. Krakow

> > > Attorney At Law

> > > 2001 Marcus Avenue,

Suite N125

> > > Lake Success,

New York 11042

> > > (516) 354-3300

> > > (646) 349-1771 (fax)

> > > (212) 227-0600 (NYC telephone)

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Absolutely.

It just seems to me that it would behoove all of us to dig deeper

into the situation, know all of the facts and angles to this very

complex bill. Holly has done just that. Just because close to $1

billion is going towards autism certainly doesn't mean it is a good

bill. Afterall, we all believed the " vaccines are good " mantra at

the expense of our kids. I dont take anything at face value anymore,

and I do not accept the status quo. At some point we all need to

realize that this problem is much bigger than the amount of

thimerosal in our kids' vaccines. It is about corporations,

stockholders, the health agencies and politicians all looking out

for their own best interests. Narcissism on an enormous scale. The

CAA is NOT about treating our kids. Because first they would have

to admit the cause.

I am completely disgusted with one of my Senators, who I personally

asked to support the CAA when it contained the environmental

research language. He would not. Now, however he has released a

statement applauding the passage of CAA in the SEnate. He did an

about-face, to keep Pharma happy and make himself look good. I am

very tempted to send him copies of my son's Doctor's Data lab

reports showing how much mercury is coming out of his body.

>

>

> Dear new member,

>

> Why in the world, if you are new and don't know Holly or the rest

of the list

> members, would you start out picking on her??? Actuallly what she

wrote was

> pretty mild.

>

> You may have a different view of the bill and/or a different way

of

> expressing yourself but your attack was out of line.

>

> Holly is extremely capable of responding to you herself, if she

chooses, so

> I'll leave that to her.

>

> However, I would like to comment on something she said that I

don't think has

> been discussed enough concerning the bill... Holly was absolutely

correct

> when she said...

>

> <<< our kids deserve real research, real funding, a real bill.

>

> Soggy potato chips are not better than no potato chips. >>>

>

> Some of you parents have not been around long enough to realize

that while $1

> million that 'might possibly' make it to some

vaccine/environmental toxin

> investigations, and the many other biomedical research studies

that relate to the

> immune problems so many of our children have, sounds good, the

reality is th

> at all the rest of the money in that bill is not going there nor

will it be

> spent on either prevention of or treatments for autism, BASED ON

THE RESULTS of

> that badly needed research.

>

> The very individuals and groups who are interested in the money,

NOT in

> preventing autism nor in helping our kids immune system problems,

will be able to

> do EVEN MORE DAMAGE than they have in the past simply because

they've never had

> that kind of funding either. They will continue to keep their own

selfish

> agendas afloat. That is their record. They are NOT innocents.

>

> Our children are the innocent victims as are all of us, young and

old, who

> are being continually subjected to the damage of all the

contamination/

> pollution issues bombarding our bodies and our brains daily.

>

> Soggy potato chips " are indeed what has been offered.

>

> Dona

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, the power lies within all the parents not these organizations....including MAM.

We need you guys desperately.....we are here to serve/represent not only our children, but your children.

However we are nothing, nada, big fat 0 without all of you. Medlin

-----Original Message-----From: EOHarm [mailto:EOHarm ]On Behalf Of Holly BortfeldSent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 3:34 PMEOHarm Subject: RE: Re: combatautism.org/MAM, No HG,achamp logo gone

Yes, but difficult is not impossible. Parents have the power. J

From: EOHarm [mailto:EOHarm ] On Behalf Of markautismchargeSent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 3:32 PMEOHarm Subject: Re: combatautism.org/MAM, No HG,achamp logo gone

But if the majority of the large autism groups e.g. SafeMinds, etc, give this bill a thumbs up wont it be difficult to toss this bill in the trash??> > > > > > > http://www.combatau <http://www.combatautism.org/> tism.org/> > > >> > > > Don't know when this site went live. KB> > > >> > > > > > > J. Krakow> > > Attorney At Law> > > 2001 Marcus Avenue, Suite N125> > > Lake Success, New York 11042> > > (516) 354-3300> > > (646) 349-1771 (fax)> > > (212) 227-0600 (NYC telephone)> > >> >>

[Guest guest]

>

> Sorry, the message (Lujene's) did come through on EOH. Sorry, Lenny.

>

>

That's OK Bob. But you should know that we do not censor messages

here. Rarely, we will put someone on moderation if there is a flame

war going on or if there is high risk a member might flame the list --

as a time out. If things ever do come down to the level of rude

behavior, we just ask the offending poster to stop or leave the list,

but we do not censor messages.

Lenny

EOHarm Co-Host.

[Guest guest]

It's RUDE comments about other list members that's a no-no. We

usually don't get involved unless someone complains.

This list is hosted, not moderated.

Lenny

EOHarm Co-Host

>

> -Hi,

>

> Just a reminder that Lenny (our Den mother) does not tolerate

> comments about other people behaviors, writing styles etc.. He just

> reminded us of this about two weeks ago when some people became

> upset about one posters comments.

>

> Being new to the list you probably wouldn't know that.

>

> Just a heads up on what might get you tossed from this group.

>

[Guest guest]

It's always helpful to know which skunk.

Which skunk?

Re: combatautism.org/MAM, No HG,achamp logo gone

Absolutely.It just seems to me that it would behoove all of us to dig deeper into the situation, know all of the facts and angles to this very complex bill. Holly has done just that. Just because close to $1 billion is going towards autism certainly doesn't mean it is a good bill. Afterall, we all believed the "vaccines are good" mantra at the expense of our kids. I dont take anything at face value anymore, and I do not accept the status quo. At some point we all need to realize that this problem is much bigger than the amount of thimerosal in our kids' vaccines. It is about corporations, stockholders, the health agencies and politicians all looking out for their own best interests. Narcissism on an enormous scale. The CAA is NOT about treating our kids. Because first they would have to admit the cause. I am completely disgusted with one of my Senators, who I personally asked to support the CAA when it contained the environmental research language. He would not. Now, however he has released a statement applauding the passage of CAA in the SEnate. He did an about-face, to keep Pharma happy and make himself look good. I am very tempted to send him copies of my son's Doctor's Data lab reports showing how much mercury is coming out of his body.>> > Dear new member,> > Why in the world, if you are new and don't know Holly or the rest of the list > members, would you start out picking on her??? Actuallly what she wrote was > pretty mild.> > You may have a different view of the bill and/or a different way of > expressing yourself but your attack was out of line.> > Holly is extremely capable of responding to you herself, if she chooses, so > I'll leave that to her. > > However, I would like to comment on something she said that I don't think has > been discussed enough concerning the bill... Holly was absolutely correct > when she said...> > <<< our kids deserve real research, real funding, a real bill. > > Soggy potato chips are not better than no potato chips. >>>> > Some of you parents have not been around long enough to realize that while $1 > million that 'might possibly' make it to some vaccine/environmental toxin > investigations, and the many other biomedical research studies that relate to the > immune problems so many of our children have, sounds good, the reality is th> at all the rest of the money in that bill is not going there nor will it be > spent on either prevention of or treatments for autism, BASED ON THE RESULTS of > that badly needed research. > > The very individuals and groups who are interested in the money, NOT in > preventing autism nor in helping our kids immune system problems, will be able to > do EVEN MORE DAMAGE than they have in the past simply because they've never had > that kind of funding either. They will continue to keep their own selfish > agendas afloat. That is their record. They are NOT innocents. > > Our children are the innocent victims as are all of us, young and old, who > are being continually subjected to the damage of all the contamination/ > pollution issues bombarding our bodies and our brains daily. > > Soggy potato chips" are indeed what has been offered. > > Dona>

[Guest guest]

Senator Dick Durbin, whose health staffer was a lobbyist for the ASA.

> >

> >

> > Dear new member,

> >

> > Why in the world, if you are new and don't know Holly or the

rest

> of the list

> > members, would you start out picking on her??? Actuallly what

she

> wrote was

> > pretty mild.

> >

> > You may have a different view of the bill and/or a different

way

> of

> > expressing yourself but your attack was out of line.

> >

> > Holly is extremely capable of responding to you herself, if

she

> chooses, so

> > I'll leave that to her.

> >

> > However, I would like to comment on something she said that I

> don't think has

> > been discussed enough concerning the bill... Holly was

absolutely

> correct

> > when she said...

> >

> > <<< our kids deserve real research, real funding, a real bill.

> >

> > Soggy potato chips are not better than no potato chips. >>>

> >

> > Some of you parents have not been around long enough to

realize

> that while $1

> > million that 'might possibly' make it to some

> vaccine/environmental toxin

> > investigations, and the many other biomedical research studies

> that relate to the

> > immune problems so many of our children have, sounds good, the

> reality is th

> > at all the rest of the money in that bill is not going there

nor

> will it be

> > spent on either prevention of or treatments for autism, BASED

ON

> THE RESULTS of

> > that badly needed research.

> >

> > The very individuals and groups who are interested in the

money,

> NOT in

> > preventing autism nor in helping our kids immune system

problems,

> will be able to

> > do EVEN MORE DAMAGE than they have in the past simply because

> they've never had

> > that kind of funding either. They will continue to keep their

own

> selfish

> > agendas afloat. That is their record. They are NOT innocents.

> >

> > Our children are the innocent victims as are all of us, young

and

> old, who

> > are being continually subjected to the damage of all the

> contamination/

> > pollution issues bombarding our bodies and our brains daily.

> >

> > Soggy potato chips " are indeed what has been offered.

> >

> > Dona

> >

>

[Guest guest]

> Senator Dick Durbin, whose health staffer was a lobbyist for the ASA.

>

A current staffar is a former lobbist for ASA, or a former Durbin

staffer is now a lobbyist for ASA.

Either way, would explain a lot about Durbin and ASA.

On Aug 6, 2006, at 12:06 PM, McDonough wrote:

> Senator Dick Durbin, whose health staffer was a lobbyist for the ASA.

>

>

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear new member,

> > >

> > > Why in the world, if you are new and don't know Holly or the

> rest

> > of the list

> > > members, would you start out picking on her??? Actuallly what

> she

> > wrote was

> > > pretty mild.

> > >

> > > You may have a different view of the bill and/or a different

> way

> > of

> > > expressing yourself but your attack was out of line.

> > >

> > > Holly is extremely capable of responding to you herself, if

> she

> > chooses, so

> > > I'll leave that to her.

> > >

> > > However, I would like to comment on something she said that I

> > don't think has

> > > been discussed enough concerning the bill... Holly was

> absolutely

> > correct

> > > when she said...

> > >

> > > <<< our kids deserve real research, real funding, a real bill.

> > >

> > > Soggy potato chips are not better than no potato chips. >>>

> > >

> > > Some of you parents have not been around long enough to

> realize

> > that while $1

> > > million that 'might possibly' make it to some

> > vaccine/environmental toxin

> > > investigations, and the many other biomedical research studies

> > that relate to the

> > > immune problems so many of our children have, sounds good, the

> > reality is th

> > > at all the rest of the money in that bill is not going there

> nor

> > will it be

> > > spent on either prevention of or treatments for autism, BASED

> ON

> > THE RESULTS of

> > > that badly needed research.

> > >

> > > The very individuals and groups who are interested in the

> money,

> > NOT in

> > > preventing autism nor in helping our kids immune system

> problems,

> > will be able to

> > > do EVEN MORE DAMAGE than they have in the past simply because

> > they've never had

> > > that kind of funding either. They will continue to keep their

> own

> > selfish

> > > agendas afloat. That is their record. They are NOT innocents.

> > >

> > > Our children are the innocent victims as are all of us, young

> and

> > old, who

> > > are being continually subjected to the damage of all the

> > contamination/

> > > pollution issues bombarding our bodies and our brains daily.

> > >

> > > Soggy potato chips " are indeed what has been offered.

> > >

> > > Dona

> > >

> >

>

>

J. Krakow

Attorney At Law

2001 Marcus Avenue, Suite N125

Lake Success, New York 11042

(516) 354-3300

(646) 349-1771 (fax)

(212) 227-0600 (NYC telephone)