[EOHarm Publish or be damned-KrigsmanSTOP THIS MADNESS

[Guest guest]

You know this debate will rage on and on until everyone involved...boths sides of the issues really gets down and openly, honestly examines all the viewpoints nuts and bolts, uncle Tom Cobley and all. My personal position is .yes I am of the form conviction that there is definitely some sort of link between vaccine, safety, administration schedule, protocol and ingredients. There is sort of something to be said for the concept of 'tickling" the immune system in order to stimulate anti-body production thereby decreasing susceptibility to full blown onset of a particular disease. There is also something to be said for honestly examining efficacy, safety, individual sensitivity to all the ingredients, whether they be, active, fillers or preservatives. and checking titers to ascertain immunity levels before blanket policy of administration accross the board to

every single child. There is no doubt that something is array with current policy and safety. There are too many cases worldwide where the seemingly only nexus of Autism onset is somehow temporally tied to vaccine administration and constituents of the vaccines. There is additionally the fear factor of culpability because the backlash against the true identity of the wrongdoers will make the tobacco issue seem like a nickle and dime issue. Here the guilty party/ies will have irreparably harmed 100's of thousands of innocent children who had no say in the administration of their vaccines unlike smokers who were conscious enough to make personal choice/s whether or not they wished to light up. Dealing with the moral and ethical culpability of poisoning these 1000's of children is so far reaching that no punishment could come close to assuaging the harm done. BUT...this factor doesn't for one second detract from the necessity of those trying to SCIENTIFICALLY prove nexus between vaccines and autism onset from conducting ACCURATE, UNBIASED, OPEN to RIGID CLEAR OBJECTIVE SCRUTINY by all interested parties seeking the truth. I want the Wakefields, Krigsmans, Wake Forest University Medical Schools etc.and anyone else who's done research to come out and clearly defend their findings. and I want their detractors to conduct free and unfettered investigations thereof, pose delving type questions to them and receive clearcut unambiguous answeras that clearly and unequivocally support their research hypotheses and findings. What has been happening thus far is that the immediate focus upon any research done by either side.........has been to nitpick at flaws and avoid targeting the meat of

the research. Continually seeking to denigrate efforts has only led to the current state of utter discombobulation. It will never recede as long as unethical, dishonest agendas both political and percuniary are not set aside and research is only conducted with sole purpose of establishing the truth regardless of where the chips may fall. Those with specific interests on maintaining the current state of confusion must be removed from the debate unless they agree to adhere to free and open research and debate. This calamity must be addressed now. It can't continue to fester like a boil with a bandaid over it which doesn't address the aetiology of the vaccine issue. It would be very prudent for those who do believe the nexus between vaccines and autism to do EVERYTHING above board, openly and honestly. If they do so, their detractors will have no

where to go other than confront the truth which hopefully will be irrefutable. Every criticism thus far levelled by the detractors, must be logically deated and exposed with presentation of concrete evidence highlighting it's fallacies. Every potential criticism must attempt to be addressed so that when critical articles are written or deliberate misleading statements uttered, they can immediately be exposed as being unfounded. At this juncture we as a collective parent body have been broadly painted with the same brush as being emotionally hysterical ranters and ravers. This picture has seeded in the minds of mainstream because it isn't unreasonable for every day "Joe Ruminator" to consider the rationale.."hey if my kid was "@#$%^^%## up" in a serious way, I'd also want to find the cause and blame somebody. This is reasonable when coupled with ,

"hey my kids were vaccinated with the same stuff and they're fine" so..while I fell some degree of compassion for those kids, we can't risk a disease pandemic breaking out by ceasing vaccinations. Many of these diseases have decreased significantly amonst populations since inception and implementation of broad vaccine administration to millions, and we're told that they will increase if we accept this constant hysterical baying of all these parents of children with Autism etc....? I call upon all involved here to really focus on insisting that only TRUTHFUL ETHICAL STUDIES be conducted and results be openly examined by all and then accurate publication will set this debate to rest. This doesn't mean that it's a black and white issue. Science is never absolute, it is temporal and can always be reviewed as new studies and information come to loght..........Consider the gastric ulcer debate and how long it took to

establish the validity of "heliobacter pylori" as the aetiology. All the different research organizations need to allocate funds towards this single minded goal, because if a nexus is established, the support from mainstream will be so great that the authorities will have no chopice other than to pour billions into researching every aspect of the perniciously internecine juggernaut that is slowly, insidiously creeping up on so many kids at the current rate of TWO PER HOUR !! I beg you all stop this madness with clear headed logic not emotional ranting Take care,Best nKerbob <robertbloch@...> wrote: Dear

Ben, You are a Deer jock-strap sniffing loser. Even my monkey pox carrying prairie dog says to split the MMR up and space it out over several months. What's the big deal? We all know the MMR sux. Thanks, RB Publish or be damned-Krigsman The British Quackwatch? Publish or be damned Ben GoldacreSaturday June 3, 2006The Guardian MMR is back. "US scientists back autism link to MMR," squealed the Telegraph. "Scientists fear MMR link to autism," roared the Mail. "US study supports claims of MMR link to autism," croaked the Times, a day later. Strap me to the rocket and print my home address in the paper, I'm going after them again. So what was this frightening new data? Well it's hard to tell, since it hasn't been properly published anywhere yet. This is now standard operating procedure for all scare stories, because journalists have learnt that informed and informative

public debate on unpublished research is basically impossible. So it turns out that these three stories were all about a poster presentation at a conference that had yet to occur on research not yet completed by a man with a track record of announcing research that then does not appear in academic journals. www.badscience.netBe in the knowSign up for our email bulletinsRelated articles10.10.2004: MMR report 'not denial of autism link'24.09.2004: MMR vaccinations fall to new low08.07.2004: Researchers to study link between autism and MMR12.05.2004: Drug firm threatened us, say MMR families02.03.2004: Autism research 'overshadowed by MMR'22.02.2004: Maverick view that sparked panic over the

triple vaccineQ & A31.10.2003: Measles and MMRBig issuePublic healthUseful sitesThe LancetDepartment of Health - MMRSense: Remember Rubella (pdf)UK Public Health AssociationBritish Medical JournalWorld Health OrganisationBritish Medical AssociationBMJ paper: Mumps, measles, and rubella vaccine and the incidence of autismGeneral Medical Council __________________________________________________