Guest guest Posted June 6, 2006 Report Share Posted June 6, 2006 Hi and thanks for sharing this positive news! > > Hello all.. I have been a member here for about a year but I usually > just lurk. I noticed some questions about the DMSA study, and I > thought I would offer to share what we know. > > We just finished the study, with fantastic results. (our boy was also > in the dateline piece... footage of him before the DMSA, he was > wearing a grey t-shirt and vocally and physically stimming like mad) > > I had a TON of questions regarding how the whole study was set up (i > had the same concerns as some of you regarding the glutathione, and > also regarding yeast flare ups and the reasoning behind using oral > DMSA etc) and I would be happy to share the answers I recieved from > the doctors and nurses involved in the study. > > From my perspective they covered their bases pretty well, I can't > think of much they could have done to format it better short of having > it be a longer trial of chelation. > > > A few notes: > > Only the kids who excreeted toxic levels of metals on the challenge > moved to phase two, the six round trial > > In phase two, the kids who get the placebo DMSA also get the placebo > glutathione > > A qualified professional evaluates each child before and after phase > two (using ADOS, I believe) > > The parent fills out a VERY lengthy evaluation of behaviours, social > interaction, language skills etc before and after phase two > > A non-study relation professional (child's psychologist, speech > therapist, teacher) fills out a behavioral/language/social evaluation > before and after phase two > > Nystatin is avaliable for chldren who exhibit symptoms of yeast (don't > want those yeasty beasties overshadowing any positive effects!) > > Urine is collected and sent to Dr. Data for heavy metal testing every > other round. > > Blood is drawn every three rounds to evaluate kidney and liver function. > > Participants are contacted weekly and asked a series of questions > regarding their childs general well-being, level of energy, eating > habits, toilet habits and any changes in behavior/language/social > interaction etc. > > It all seems pretty well thought out to me. Hope this answers some of > your questions. I know that Dr. has already released > preliminary results on two occasions, most recently the Autism One > conference in Chicago. He will be talking about the study again at a > conference in Phoenix in June. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2006 Report Share Posted June 7, 2006 Problems that I see-- Many kids don't excrete metals on challenges but the mercury comes out much later. They would have been eliminated from the study. Not all kids respond to the glutathione. Some react badly to it. Nystatin is bad news for some kids with yeast. Every eight hours on DMSA causes redistribution--it should be four. No ALA is being added to get into the brain. Barb AZ DMSA study Hello all.. I have been a member here for about a year but I usuallyjust lurk. I noticed some questions about the DMSA study, and Ithought I would offer to share what we know. We just finished the study, with fantastic results. (our boy was alsoin the dateline piece... footage of him before the DMSA, he waswearing a grey t-shirt and vocally and physically stimming like mad) I had a TON of questions regarding how the whole study was set up (ihad the same concerns as some of you regarding the glutathione, andalso regarding yeast flare ups and the reasoning behind using oralDMSA etc) and I would be happy to share the answers I recieved fromthe doctors and nurses involved in the study. From my perspective they covered their bases pretty well, I can'tthink of much they could have done to format it better short of havingit be a longer trial of chelation. A few notes:Only the kids who excreeted toxic levels of metals on the challengemoved to phase two, the six round trialIn phase two, the kids who get the placebo DMSA also get the placeboglutathioneA qualified professional evaluates each child before and after phasetwo (using ADOS, I believe)The parent fills out a VERY lengthy evaluation of behaviours, socialinteraction, language skills etc before and after phase twoA non-study relation professional (child's psychologist, speechtherapist, teacher) fills out a behavioral/language/social evaluationbefore and after phase twoNystatin is avaliable for chldren who exhibit symptoms of yeast (don'twant those yeasty beasties overshadowing any positive effects!)Urine is collected and sent to Dr. Data for heavy metal testing everyother round. Blood is drawn every three rounds to evaluate kidney and liver function. Participants are contacted weekly and asked a series of questionsregarding their childs general well-being, level of energy, eatinghabits, toilet habits and any changes in behavior/language/socialinteraction etc. It all seems pretty well thought out to me. Hope this answers some ofyour questions. I know that Dr. has already releasedpreliminary results on two occasions, most recently the Autism Oneconference in Chicago. He will be talking about the study again at aconference in Phoenix in June. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2006 Report Share Posted June 7, 2006 FOR Debi HEAVY METAL Eradricator Is Much BETTER Hey Hera AZ DMSA study Hello all.. I have been a member here for about a year but I usuallyjust lurk. I noticed some questions about the DMSA study, and Ithought I would offer to share what we know. We just finished the study, with fantastic results. (our boy was alsoin the dateline piece... footage of him before the DMSA, he waswearing a grey t-shirt and vocally and physically stimming like mad) I had a TON of questions regarding how the whole study was set up (ihad the same concerns as some of you regarding the glutathione, andalso regarding yeast flare ups and the reasoning behind using oralDMSA etc) and I would be happy to share the answers I recieved fromthe doctors and nurses involved in the study. From my perspective they covered their bases pretty well, I can'tthink of much they could have done to format it better short of havingit be a longer trial of chelation. A few notes:Only the kids who excreeted toxic levels of metals on the challengemoved to phase two, the six round trialIn phase two, the kids who get the placebo DMSA also get the placeboglutathioneA qualified professional evaluates each child before and after phasetwo (using ADOS, I believe)The parent fills out a VERY lengthy evaluation of behaviours, socialinteraction, language skills etc before and after phase twoA non-study relation professional (child's psychologist, speechtherapist, teacher) fills out a behavioral/language/social evaluationbefore and after phase twoNystatin is avaliable for chldren who exhibit symptoms of yeast (don'twant those yeasty beasties overshadowing any positive effects!)Urine is collected and sent to Dr. Data for heavy metal testing everyother round. Blood is drawn every three rounds to evaluate kidney and liver function. Participants are contacted weekly and asked a series of questionsregarding their childs general well-being, level of energy, eatinghabits, toilet habits and any changes in behavior/language/socialinteraction etc. It all seems pretty well thought out to me. Hope this answers some ofyour questions. I know that Dr. has already releasedpreliminary results on two occasions, most recently the Autism Oneconference in Chicago. He will be talking about the study again at aconference in Phoenix in June. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2006 Report Share Posted June 7, 2006 I'm no expert, but isn't metals excreted mostly in stool? >>Urine is collected and sent to Dr. Data for heavy metal testing every other round Diane > > Hello all.. I have been a member here for about a year but I usually > just lurk. I noticed some questions about the DMSA study, and I > thought I would offer to share what we know. > > We just finished the study, with fantastic results. (our boy was also > in the dateline piece... footage of him before the DMSA, he was > wearing a grey t-shirt and vocally and physically stimming like mad) > > I had a TON of questions regarding how the whole study was set up (i > had the same concerns as some of you regarding the glutathione, and > also regarding yeast flare ups and the reasoning behind using oral > DMSA etc) and I would be happy to share the answers I recieved from > the doctors and nurses involved in the study. > > From my perspective they covered their bases pretty well, I can't > think of much they could have done to format it better short of having > it be a longer trial of chelation. > > > A few notes: > > Only the kids who excreeted toxic levels of metals on the challenge > moved to phase two, the six round trial > > In phase two, the kids who get the placebo DMSA also get the placebo > glutathione > > A qualified professional evaluates each child before and after phase > two (using ADOS, I believe) > > The parent fills out a VERY lengthy evaluation of behaviours, social > interaction, language skills etc before and after phase two > > A non-study relation professional (child's psychologist, speech > therapist, teacher) fills out a behavioral/language/social evaluation > before and after phase two > > Nystatin is avaliable for chldren who exhibit symptoms of yeast (don't > want those yeasty beasties overshadowing any positive effects!) > > Urine is collected and sent to Dr. Data for heavy metal testing every > other round. > > Blood is drawn every three rounds to evaluate kidney and liver function. > > Participants are contacted weekly and asked a series of questions > regarding their childs general well-being, level of energy, eating > habits, toilet habits and any changes in behavior/language/social > interaction etc. > > It all seems pretty well thought out to me. Hope this answers some of > your questions. I know that Dr. has already released > preliminary results on two occasions, most recently the Autism One > conference in Chicago. He will be talking about the study again at a > conference in Phoenix in June. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2006 Report Share Posted June 7, 2006 The title of the study is " DMSA Treatment of Children with Autism and Heavy Metal Toxicity " so their challenge must show heavy metal toxicity for them to be part of the study. I would think, also, that having kids who excrete on the challenge would be a good thing, since the study is only six rounds. If you have kids in the study that take much longer to excrete, then you would get a negative spin on the study from their results if they never throw toxic metals (or throw very little) during the study. I would guess the eight hour dosing was used becuase more parents are likely to follow it. I know I have no problem interrupting my sleep to dose every four hours, but some people might be less likely to follow this protocol and it could affect the results of the study. Remember, many of these families know nothing of bio-med. I know one mom personally who had (and still pretty much has) no idea at all what a chelator is, what glutathione does besides what the researchers and I have told her. She has not taken the initiative to research any of this at all herself... I have offered her books and she sais she doesn't have time to read. I seriously doubt she would have stuck with an every four hour dosing schedule, it may have been " inconvenient. " ALA, if my research serves me correctly, should not be used until the body burden of metals is way down so as not to cause metals in the body to cross the blood-brain barrier and settle in the brain, causing more damage. I am not speaking for the researchers doing the study, this is all my opinion completely. I will say that THANK GOD someone is actually doing this study!! And that of course, there will always be people who think it should be done differently no matter which way you do it. That is true with all things in life! Respect~ > > Problems that I see-- > > Many kids don't excrete metals on challenges but the mercury comes out much later. They would have been eliminated from the study. > > Not all kids respond to the glutathione. Some react badly to it. > > Nystatin is bad news for some kids with yeast. > > Every eight hours on DMSA causes redistribution--it should be four. > > No ALA is being added to get into the brain. > > Barb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2006 Report Share Posted June 7, 2006 We Are FINDING ANTIBODIES TO MERCURY IN PEOPLE WHO FORMERLY HAD HIGH RED BLOOD CELL MERCURY THAT NORMALIZED ON ONE OR ANOTHER tOXIC hEAVY mETAL sINCE ANTIBODIES PERSIST FOR UP TO 20 YEARS, THAT IS NOT SURPRISING. bUT PERHAPS THE MERCURY PERSISTS IN THE BRAIN AFTER URINE and feces are normal. H. H.Fudenberg, M.D.,DDG.IOM Inman, SC 29349 (864) 592 8076 Website nitrf.org From: "samsaraarasmas" <samsaraarasmas@...>Reply-EOHarm To: EOHarm Subject: Re: AZ DMSA studyDate: Wed, 07 Jun 2006 16:10:25 -0000>>The title of the study is "DMSA Treatment of Children with Autism and>Heavy Metal Toxicity" so their challenge must show heavy metal>toxicity for them to be part of the study.>>I would think, also, that having kids who excrete on the challenge>would be a good thing, since the study is only six rounds. If you>have kids in the study that take much longer to excrete, then you>would get a negative spin on the study from their results if they>never throw toxic metals (or throw very little) during the study.>>I would guess the eight hour dosing was used becuase more parents are>likely to follow it. I know I have no problem interrupting my sleep>to dose every four hours, but some people might be less likely to>follow this protocol and it could affect the results of the study.>Remember, many of these families know nothing of bio-med. I know one>mom personally who had (and still pretty much has) no idea at all what>a chelator is, what glutathione does besides what the researchers and>I have told her. She has not taken the initiative to research any of>this at all herself... I have offered her books and she sais she>doesn't have time to read. I seriously doubt she would have stuck>with an every four hour dosing schedule, it may have been "inconvenient.">>ALA, if my research serves me correctly, should not be used until the>body burden of metals is way down so as not to cause metals in the>body to cross the blood-brain barrier and settle in the brain, causing>more damage.>>I am not speaking for the researchers doing the study, this is all my>opinion completely.>>I will say that THANK GOD someone is actually doing this study!! And>that of course, there will always be people who think it should be>done differently no matter which way you do it. That is true with>all things in life!>>Respect~>>>> >> > Problems that I see--> >> > Many kids don't excrete metals on challenges but the mercury comes>out much later. They would have been eliminated from the study.> >> > Not all kids respond to the glutathione. Some react badly to it.> >> > Nystatin is bad news for some kids with yeast.> >> > Every eight hours on DMSA causes redistribution--it should be four.> >> > No ALA is being added to get into the brain.> >> > Barb>>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2006 Report Share Posted June 7, 2006 for samssara? Measurment of red blood cell level of mercury and 11 other heavy toxic metals abd has no adverse side effects ALSO GET ANTIBODY LEVELS to mercury and whichever toxic metals are elevated. There is good therapy, H.H. Fudenbrrg, M.D., DDG, IOM nitrf.org Re: AZ DMSA study The title of the study is "DMSA Treatment of Children with Autism andHeavy Metal Toxicity" so their challenge must show heavy metaltoxicity for them to be part of the study. I would think, also, that having kids who excrete on the challengewould be a good thing, since the study is only six rounds. If youhave kids in the study that take much longer to excrete, then youwould get a negative spin on the study from their results if theynever throw toxic metals (or throw very little) during the study. I would guess the eight hour dosing was used becuase more parents arelikely to follow it. I know I have no problem interrupting my sleepto dose every four hours, but some people might be less likely tofollow this protocol and it could affect the results of the study. Remember, many of these families know nothing of bio-med. I know onemom personally who had (and still pretty much has) no idea at all whata chelator is, what glutathione does besides what the researchers andI have told her. She has not taken the initiative to research any ofthis at all herself... I have offered her books and she sais shedoesn't have time to read. I seriously doubt she would have stuckwith an every four hour dosing schedule, it may have been "inconvenient."ALA, if my research serves me correctly, should not be used until thebody burden of metals is way down so as not to cause metals in thebody to cross the blood-brain barrier and settle in the brain, causingmore damage. I am not speaking for the researchers doing the study, this is all myopinion completely. I will say that THANK GOD someone is actually doing this study!! Andthat of course, there will always be people who think it should bedone differently no matter which way you do it. That is true withall things in life! Respect~>> Problems that I see--> > Many kids don't excrete metals on challenges but the mercury comesout much later. They would have been eliminated from the study.> > Not all kids respond to the glutathione. Some react badly to it. > > Nystatin is bad news for some kids with yeast. > > Every eight hours on DMSA causes redistribution--it should be four.> > No ALA is being added to get into the brain.> > Barb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 For Herman: Any good way to get mercury out of CNS without use of lipoic acid? Henry RE: Re: AZ DMSA study We Are FINDING ANTIBODIES TO MERCURY IN PEOPLE WHO FORMERLY HAD HIGH RED BLOOD CELL MERCURY THAT NORMALIZED ON ONE OR ANOTHER tOXIC hEAVY mETAL sINCE ANTIBODIES PERSIST FOR UP TO 20 YEARS, THAT IS NOT SURPRISING. bUT PERHAPS THE MERCURY PERSISTS IN THE BRAIN AFTER URINE and feces are normal. H. H.Fudenberg, M.D.,DDG.IOM Inman, SC 29349 (864) 592 8076 Website nitrf.org From: "samsaraarasmas" <samsaraarasmas@...>Reply-EOHarm To: EOHarm Subject: Re: AZ DMSA studyDate: Wed, 07 Jun 2006 16:10:25 -0000>>The title of the study is "DMSA Treatment of Children with Autism and>Heavy Metal Toxicity" so their challenge must show heavy metal>toxicity for them to be part of the study.>>I would think, also, that having kids who excrete on the challenge>would be a good thing, since the study is only six rounds. If you>have kids in the study that take much longer to excrete, then you>would get a negative spin on the study from their results if they>never throw toxic metals (or throw very little) during the study.>>I would guess the eight hour dosing was used becuase more parents are>likely to follow it. I know I have no problem interrupting my sleep>to dose every four hours, but some people might be less likely to>follow this protocol and it could affect the results of the study.>Remember, many of these families know nothing of bio-med. I know one>mom personally who had (and still pretty much has) no idea at all what>a chelator is, what glutathione does besides what the researchers and>I have told her. She has not taken the initiative to research any of>this at all herself... I have offered her books and she sais she>doesn't have time to read. I seriously doubt she would have stuck>with an every four hour dosing schedule, it may have been "inconvenient.">>ALA, if my research serves me correctly, should not be used until the>body burden of metals is way down so as not to cause metals in the>body to cross the blood-brain barrier and settle in the brain, causing>more damage.>>I am not speaking for the researchers doing the study, this is all my>opinion completely.>>I will say that THANK GOD someone is actually doing this study!! And>that of course, there will always be people who think it should be>done differently no matter which way you do it. That is true with>all things in life!>>Respect~>>>> >> > Problems that I see--> >> > Many kids don't excrete metals on challenges but the mercury comes>out much later. They would have been eliminated from the study.> >> > Not all kids respond to the glutathione. Some react badly to it.> >> > Nystatin is bad news for some kids with yeast.> >> > Every eight hours on DMSA causes redistribution--it should be four.> >> > No ALA is being added to get into the brain.> >> > Barb>>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 Just remember that out of the blood is not to say out of the body. Mercury is quickly taken up and sequestered into soft tissue. There is extensive clinic study and basic textbook chemistry that concludes blood testing is not valid in determining mercury toxicity. Re: AZ DMSA study The title of the study is "DMSA Treatment of Children with Autism andHeavy Metal Toxicity" so their challenge must show heavy metaltoxicity for them to be part of the study. I would think, also, that having kids who excrete on the challengewould be a good thing, since the study is only six rounds. If youhave kids in the study that take much longer to excrete, then youwould get a negative spin on the study from their results if theynever throw toxic metals (or throw very little) during the study. I would guess the eight hour dosing was used becuase more parents arelikely to follow it. I know I have no problem interrupting my sleepto dose every four hours, but some people might be less likely tofollow this protocol and it could affect the results of the study. Remember, many of these families know nothing of bio-med. I know onemom personally who had (and still pretty much has) no idea at all whata chelator is, what glutathione does besides what the researchers andI have told her. She has not taken the initiative to research any ofthis at all herself... I have offered her books and she sais shedoesn't have time to read. I seriously doubt she would have stuckwith an every four hour dosing schedule, it may have been "inconvenient."ALA, if my research serves me correctly, should not be used until thebody burden of metals is way down so as not to cause metals in thebody to cross the blood-brain barrier and settle in the brain, causingmore damage. I am not speaking for the researchers doing the study, this is all myopinion completely. I will say that THANK GOD someone is actually doing this study!! Andthat of course, there will always be people who think it should bedone differently no matter which way you do it. That is true withall things in life! Respect~>> Problems that I see--> > Many kids don't excrete metals on challenges but the mercury comesout much later. They would have been eliminated from the study.> > Not all kids respond to the glutathione. Some react badly to it. > > Nystatin is bad news for some kids with yeast. > > Every eight hours on DMSA causes redistribution--it should be four.> > No ALA is being added to get into the brain.> > Barb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 9, 2006 Report Share Posted June 9, 2006 RE: Re: AZ DMSA studyWe Are FINDING ANTIBODIES TO MERCURY IN PEOPLE WHO FORMERLY HAD HIGH RED BLOOD CELL MERCURY THAT NORMALIZED ON ONE OR ANOTHERtOXIC hEAVY mETAL sINCE ANTIBODIES PERSIST FOR UP TO 20 YEARS, THAT IS NOT SURPRISING. bUT PERHAPS THE MERCURY PERSISTS IN THE BRAIN AFTERURINE and feces are normal. H. H.Fudenberg, M.D.,DDG.IOMInman, SC 29349(864) 592 8076Website nitrf.orgFrom: "samsaraarasmas" <samsaraarasmas@...>Reply-EOHarm To: EOHarm Subject: Re: AZ DMSA studyDate: Wed, 07 Jun 2006 16:10:25 -0000>>The title of the study is "DMSA Treatment of Children with Autism and>Heavy Metal Toxicity" so their challenge must show heavy metal>toxicity for them to be part of the study.>>I would think, also, that having kids who excrete on the challenge>would be a good thing, since the study is only six rounds. If you>have kids in the study that take much longer to excrete, then you>would get a negative spin on the study from their results if they>never throw toxic metals (or throw very little) during the study.>>I would guess the eight hour dosing was used becuase more parents are>likely to follow it. I know I have no problem interrupting my sleep>to dose every four hours, but some people might be less likely to>follow this protocol and it could affect the results of the study.>Remember, many of these families know nothing of bio-med. I know one>mom personally who had (and still pretty much has) no idea at all what>a chelator is, what glutathione does besides what the researchers and>I have told her. She has not taken the initiative to research any of>this at all herself... I have offered her books and she sais she>doesn't have time to read. I seriously doubt she would have stuck>with an every four hour dosing schedule, it may have been "inconvenient.">>ALA, if my research serves me correctly, should not be used until the>body burden of metals is way down so as not to cause metals in the>body to cross the blood-brain barrier and settle in the brain, causing>more damage.>>I am not speaking for the researchers doing the study, this is all my>opinion completely.>>I will say that THANK GOD someone is actually doing this study!! And>that of course, there will always be people who think it should be>done differently no matter which way you do it. That is true with>all things in life!>>Respect~>>>> >> > Problems that I see--> >> > Many kids don't excrete metals on challenges but the mercury comes>out much later. They would have been eliminated from the study.> >> > Not all kids respond to the glutathione. Some react badly to it.> >> > Nystatin is bad news for some kids with yeast.> >> > Every eight hours on DMSA causes redistribution--it should be four.> >> > No ALA is being added to get into the brain.> >> > Barb>>>>>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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