Re: EOHarm] Thoughtful House; ready to move on

[Guest guest]

Hi I promise my last post on the matter (and it is only my second). Do DAN doctors make mistakes? Of course, they are human and fallible. But to even suggest that they make more money than the pediatricians who see 40 babies per day and spend 5 minutes with each one before injecting them with 5 or 6 vaccinations is ludicrous. It is far easier to deal with the average pediatrics practice (aka vaccination mill) than to deal with a handful of kids, each with a more complicated medical issue than the last. The average vaccination mill pediatrician can do 5 well visits an hour. They get reimbursed about $100 for each 5 minute visit. Then tack on their share of the vaccination profit, and it easily surpasses the $400 that the average DAN charges in an hour -- and yes some do charge

less. While it is easy to just blame the DANs and the insurance companies, they are not the ones who created the problem. Of course insurance companies are where we need to start, but if insurance companies started covering biomed, the costs would be immediately passed on to employers who would then pass it back on to the employees. We do not have a choice but to push for coverage -- but it is Pharma and the government who are responsible -- not Blue Cross. (I totally digressed). The crime is that many children from lower income families are losing out and -- and it does not help that CAN and NAAR are hogging all of the dollars on the future hope that someday all ASD children can be aborted before birth. Also, for the record, I do not put "blind faith" in anyone. When my son was 3, he would scream bloody murder if we tried to get him to walk down

stairs. At the age of 3.5, he was discharged from physical therapy at Children's Hospital of Orange County because they said that he would never walk down stairs due to "psychiatric limiations." Several weeks later, we started the DAN protocol. The first intervention was 1 teaspoon of cod liver oil. Within about two weeks, he was running down stairs alternating feet. Dr. Megson discovered that the mercury had depleted many ASD kids of vitamin A which is responsible for depth perception -- and that most ASD children benefitted greatly from something as simple are pure cod liver oil. For my son, going down stairs was like jumping off a cliff. My son and thousands of others have benefitted greatly from the use of CLO. A $20 bottle of Nordic Naturals cod liver oil did more for my little boy than $25,000 in my share of co-pays from a traidtional hospital. Then there is Dr. N's MB 12 shots, Dr. Bradstreet and Dr. Greene's work with chelation, Dr. McCandless and her work with viral issues, and the list goes on forever. No other group of autism orgranizations in the country as done one tangible thing for ASD kids. If someone believes they have -- I would love to hear it. It is the DAN doctors that are making a difference. That does not mean that mistakes will not be made and people will not have a bad experience. The real crime is that the AMA's physician desk references advises against treating ASD children for any gastro, toxicological or autoimmune issues. How are we supposed to refrain from bashing US traditional medicine given that it does not support ending the torture of hundreds of thousands of children? These DANs are risking their licenses for treating our kids -- and for that I am grateful. Vera

[Guest guest]

Wow. nice.

Well said.

Nice.

>

> Hi

>

> I promise my last post on the matter (and it is only my second).

>

> Do DAN doctors make mistakes? Of course, they are human and

fallible. But to even suggest that they make more money than the

pediatricians who see 40 babies per day and spend 5 minutes with each

one before injecting them with 5 or 6 vaccinations is ludicrous.

>

> It is far easier to deal with the average pediatrics practice

(aka vaccination mill) than to deal with a handful of kids, each with

a more complicated medical issue than the last.

>

> The average vaccination mill pediatrician can do 5 well visits an

hour. They get reimbursed about $100 for each 5 minute visit. Then

tack on their share of the vaccination profit, and it easily

surpasses the $400 that the average DAN charges in an hour -- and yes

some do charge less. While it is easy to just blame the DANs and the

insurance companies, they are not the ones who created the problem.

Of course insurance companies are where we need to start, but if

insurance companies started covering biomed, the costs would be

immediately passed on to employers who would then pass it back on to

the employees. We do not have a choice but to push for coverage --

but it is Pharma and the government who are responsible -- not Blue

Cross. (I totally digressed).

>

> The crime is that many children from lower income families are

losing out and -- and it does not help that CAN and NAAR are hogging

all of the dollars on the future hope that someday all ASD children

can be aborted before birth.

>

> Also, for the record, I do not put " blind faith " in anyone.

>

> When my son was 3, he would scream bloody murder if we tried to

get him to walk down stairs. At the age of 3.5, he was discharged

from physical therapy at Children's Hospital of Orange County because

they said that he would never walk down stairs due to " psychiatric

limiations. "

>

> Several weeks later, we started the DAN protocol. The first

intervention was 1 teaspoon of cod liver oil. Within about two

weeks, he was running down stairs alternating feet. Dr. Megson

discovered that the mercury had depleted many ASD kids of vitamin A

which is responsible for depth perception -- and that most ASD

children benefitted greatly from something as simple are pure cod

liver oil. For my son, going down stairs was like jumping off a

cliff. My son and thousands of others have benefitted greatly from

the use of CLO. A $20 bottle of Nordic Naturals cod liver oil did

more for my little boy than $25,000 in my share of co-pays from a

traidtional hospital.

>

> Then there is Dr. N's MB 12 shots, Dr. Bradstreet and Dr.

Greene's work with chelation, Dr. McCandless and her work with viral

issues, and the list goes on forever.

>

> No other group of autism orgranizations in the country as done

one tangible thing for ASD kids. If someone believes they have -- I

would love to hear it. It is the DAN doctors that are making a

difference. That does not mean that mistakes will not be made and

people will not have a bad experience.

>

> The real crime is that the AMA's physician desk references

advises against treating ASD children for any gastro, toxicological

or autoimmune issues. How are we supposed to refrain from bashing US

traditional medicine given that it does not support ending the

torture of hundreds of thousands of children? These DANs are risking

their licenses for treating our kids -- and for that I am grateful.

>

> Vera

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

[Guest guest]

Wow. nice.

Well said.

Nice.

>

> Hi

>

> I promise my last post on the matter (and it is only my second).

>

> Do DAN doctors make mistakes? Of course, they are human and

fallible. But to even suggest that they make more money than the

pediatricians who see 40 babies per day and spend 5 minutes with each

one before injecting them with 5 or 6 vaccinations is ludicrous.

>

> It is far easier to deal with the average pediatrics practice

(aka vaccination mill) than to deal with a handful of kids, each with

a more complicated medical issue than the last.

>

> The average vaccination mill pediatrician can do 5 well visits an

hour. They get reimbursed about $100 for each 5 minute visit. Then

tack on their share of the vaccination profit, and it easily

surpasses the $400 that the average DAN charges in an hour -- and yes

some do charge less. While it is easy to just blame the DANs and the

insurance companies, they are not the ones who created the problem.

Of course insurance companies are where we need to start, but if

insurance companies started covering biomed, the costs would be

immediately passed on to employers who would then pass it back on to

the employees. We do not have a choice but to push for coverage --

but it is Pharma and the government who are responsible -- not Blue

Cross. (I totally digressed).

>

> The crime is that many children from lower income families are

losing out and -- and it does not help that CAN and NAAR are hogging

all of the dollars on the future hope that someday all ASD children

can be aborted before birth.

>

> Also, for the record, I do not put " blind faith " in anyone.

>

> When my son was 3, he would scream bloody murder if we tried to

get him to walk down stairs. At the age of 3.5, he was discharged

from physical therapy at Children's Hospital of Orange County because

they said that he would never walk down stairs due to " psychiatric

limiations. "

>

> Several weeks later, we started the DAN protocol. The first

intervention was 1 teaspoon of cod liver oil. Within about two

weeks, he was running down stairs alternating feet. Dr. Megson

discovered that the mercury had depleted many ASD kids of vitamin A

which is responsible for depth perception -- and that most ASD

children benefitted greatly from something as simple are pure cod

liver oil. For my son, going down stairs was like jumping off a

cliff. My son and thousands of others have benefitted greatly from

the use of CLO. A $20 bottle of Nordic Naturals cod liver oil did

more for my little boy than $25,000 in my share of co-pays from a

traidtional hospital.

>

> Then there is Dr. N's MB 12 shots, Dr. Bradstreet and Dr.

Greene's work with chelation, Dr. McCandless and her work with viral

issues, and the list goes on forever.

>

> No other group of autism orgranizations in the country as done

one tangible thing for ASD kids. If someone believes they have -- I

would love to hear it. It is the DAN doctors that are making a

difference. That does not mean that mistakes will not be made and

people will not have a bad experience.

>

> The real crime is that the AMA's physician desk references

advises against treating ASD children for any gastro, toxicological

or autoimmune issues. How are we supposed to refrain from bashing US

traditional medicine given that it does not support ending the

torture of hundreds of thousands of children? These DANs are risking

their licenses for treating our kids -- and for that I am grateful.

>

> Vera

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

[Guest guest]

VERA, You make some very valid points but I think you are wrong

about the reimbursements of mainstream physicians today. In

addition, I don't believe it is the physicians who make out so well

from the vaccines as the price gouging emanates from the

pharmaceuticals and wholesalers. Generally doctors are hampered in

many ways today by very low contracted rates set by HMO's. Their

profit margins generally are down. That being said I am not crying

for them or justifying anything they do.

For example in todays Kaiser health Report the following was

provided:

" Kaiser Daily Health Policy Report

Monday, March 27, 2006

New York Times Examines Declining Fees for Mental Health Therapists

The New York Times on Sunday examined how mental health

practitioners " are feeling an economic pinch, partly because of

insurance reimbursement schedules that they say have not kept pace

with their expenses. " The Times profiles several mental health

professionals who maintain that fees negotiated by insurance

carriers have forced them to increase their patient loads or look

for other sources of income. In addition, social workers say they

are facing reduced fees, late payments and " inappropriate assessment

of the needs of patients, " the Times reports. According to

Berman, the professional affairs officer for land's

psychological association, many psychologists in private practice

say reduced fees have forced them to nearly double their client

loads and work many more hours to maintain their incomes. He said

that when he went into private practice in 1990, his maximum

allowable hourly billing rate as a participant in insurers' provider

networks was $95, compared with today's rates of about $65 or $75.

According to , a health economist at Harvard

University, efforts by insurance companies to reduce costs, as well

as the increased use of drugs rather than psychological therapy to

treat mental health ailments, have affected the incomes of mental

health professionals. He said, " Clearly, the earnings of mental

health professionals -- medical doctors, psychologists, social

workers and counselors -- have either been flat or been declining

for the past five to eight years. " added, " It's not so much

the number of visits allowed by managed care to mental health

professionals has changed. It's that the fees paid to the mental

health professionals have not been rising " (Carr, New York Times,

3/26). "

So at the end of the day I still believe as was stated by someone in

a prior post that there is plenty of room for anyone to get into

autism to make money in the non-traditional ways. This is not a

statement of being against any form of bio-medical treatment or a

suggestion that any of the physicians discussed practice this way

but reality for parents to always consider. Rip-offs occur

everywhere, in mainstream medicine everyday and I am sure with some

alternative providers.

I always believe parents know our kids best so if it seems right go

for it, if you have a bad feeling, move on or reconsider your

options.

Finally to be fair, your statement that " The crime is that many

children from lower income families are losing out and -- and it

does not help that CAN and NAAR are hogging all of the dollars on

the future hope that someday all ASD children can be aborted before

birth. " is blatantly untrue. As a former Trustee of NAAR who had my

share of many differences with the organization I can tell you that

was never contemplated. It was never about " ASD children can be

aborted before birth. " Had it been I would have left even sooner.

I am sure I as well as many others on this list have some real

philosophical differences with NAAR and CAN, but this is best left

to a separate e-mail under a different heading.

Marty

>

> Hi

>

> I promise my last post on the matter (and it is only my second).

>

> Do DAN doctors make mistakes? Of course, they are human and

fallible. But to even suggest that they make more money than the

pediatricians who see 40 babies per day and spend 5 minutes with

each one before injecting them with 5 or 6 vaccinations is ludicrous.

>

> It is far easier to deal with the average pediatrics practice

(aka vaccination mill) than to deal with a handful of kids, each

with a more complicated medical issue than the last.

>

> The average vaccination mill pediatrician can do 5 well visits

an hour. They get reimbursed about $100 for each 5 minute visit.

Then tack on their share of the vaccination profit, and it easily

surpasses the $400 that the average DAN charges in an hour -- and

yes some do charge less. While it is easy to just blame the DANs

and the insurance companies, they are not the ones who created the

problem. Of course insurance companies are where we need to start,

but if insurance companies started covering biomed, the costs would

be immediately passed on to employers who would then pass it back on

to the employees. We do not have a choice but to push for coverage -

- but it is Pharma and the government who are responsible -- not

Blue Cross. (I totally digressed).

>

> The crime is that many children from lower income families are

losing out and -- and it does not help that CAN and NAAR are hogging

all of the dollars on the future hope that someday all ASD children

can be aborted before birth.

>

> Also, for the record, I do not put " blind faith " in anyone.

>

> When my son was 3, he would scream bloody murder if we tried to

get him to walk down stairs. At the age of 3.5, he was discharged

from physical therapy at Children's Hospital of Orange County

because they said that he would never walk down stairs due

to " psychiatric limiations. "

>

> Several weeks later, we started the DAN protocol. The first

intervention was 1 teaspoon of cod liver oil. Within about two

weeks, he was running down stairs alternating feet. Dr. Megson

discovered that the mercury had depleted many ASD kids of vitamin A

which is responsible for depth perception -- and that most ASD

children benefitted greatly from something as simple are pure cod

liver oil. For my son, going down stairs was like jumping off a

cliff. My son and thousands of others have benefitted greatly from

the use of CLO. A $20 bottle of Nordic Naturals cod liver oil did

more for my little boy than $25,000 in my share of co-pays from a

traidtional hospital.

>

> Then there is Dr. N's MB 12 shots, Dr. Bradstreet and Dr.

Greene's work with chelation, Dr. McCandless and her work with viral

issues, and the list goes on forever.

>

> No other group of autism orgranizations in the country as done

one tangible thing for ASD kids. If someone believes they have -- I

would love to hear it. It is the DAN doctors that are making a

difference. That does not mean that mistakes will not be made and

people will not have a bad experience.

>

> The real crime is that the AMA's physician desk references

advises against treating ASD children for any gastro, toxicological

or autoimmune issues. How are we supposed to refrain from bashing

US traditional medicine given that it does not support ending the

torture of hundreds of thousands of children? These DANs are

risking their licenses for treating our kids -- and for that I am

grateful.

>

> Vera

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

[Guest guest]

The average pediatrician gets 53% of his incopme from vaccinations; that is why they refuse to see children whose parents

decline vaccination.

Sincerely,

H.H. Fudenberg, M.D., D.D.G., I.O.M.

226 Edgewater Road

Inman, SC 29349

864-592-8076

nitrf@hotmailcom

From: "martinx2us" <martyx2@...>Reply-EOHarm To: EOHarm Subject: Re: EOHarm] Thoughtful House; ready to move onDate: Mon, 27 Mar 2006 17:34:19 -0000VERA, You make some very valid points but I think you are wrong about the reimbursements of mainstream physicians today. In addition, I don't believe it is the physicians who make out so well from the vaccines as the price gouging emanates from the pharmaceuticals and wholesalers. Generally doctors are hampered in many ways today by very low contracted rates set by HMO's. Their profit margins generally are down. That being said I am not crying for them or justifying anything they do. For example in todays Kaiser health Report the following was provided:"Kaiser Daily Health Policy Report Monday, March 27, 2006 New York Times Examines Declining Fees for Mental Health Therapists The New York Times on Sunday examined how mental health practitioners "are feeling an economic pinch, partly because of insurance reimbursement schedules that they say have not kept pace with their expenses." The Times profiles several mental health professionals who maintain that fees negotiated by insurance carriers have forced them to increase their patient loads or look for other sources of income. In addition, social workers say they are facing reduced fees, late payments and "inappropriate assessment of the needs of patients," the Times reports. According to Berman, the professional affairs officer for land's psychological association, many psychologists in private practice say reduced fees have forced them to nearly double their client loads and work many more hours to maintain their incomes. He said that when he went into private practice in 1990, his maximum allowable hourly billing rate as a participant in insurers' provider networks was $95, compared with today's rates of about $65 or $75. According to , a health economist at Harvard University, efforts by insurance companies to reduce costs, as well as the increased use of drugs rather than psychological therapy to treat mental health ailments, have affected the incomes of mental health professionals. He said, "Clearly, the earnings of mental health professionals -- medical doctors, psychologists, social workers and counselors -- have either been flat or been declining for the past five to eight years." added, "It's not so much the number of visits allowed by managed care to mental health professionals has changed. It's that the fees paid to the mental health professionals have not been rising" (Carr, New York Times, 3/26)." So at the end of the day I still believe as was stated by someone in a prior post that there is plenty of room for anyone to get into autism to make money in the non-traditional ways. This is not a statement of being against any form of bio-medical treatment or a suggestion that any of the physicians discussed practice this way but reality for parents to always consider. Rip-offs occur everywhere, in mainstream medicine everyday and I am sure with some alternative providers. I always believe parents know our kids best so if it seems right go for it, if you have a bad feeling, move on or reconsider your options.Finally to be fair, your statement that " The crime is that many children from lower income families are losing out and -- and it does not help that CAN and NAAR are hogging all of the dollars on the future hope that someday all ASD children can be aborted before birth." is blatantly untrue. As a former Trustee of NAAR who had my share of many differences with the organization I can tell you that was never contemplated. It was never about "ASD children can be aborted before birth." Had it been I would have left even sooner. I am sure I as well as many others on this list have some real philosophical differences with NAAR and CAN, but this is best left to a separate e-mail under a different heading.Marty >> Hi> > I promise my last post on the matter (and it is only my second).> > Do DAN doctors make mistakes? Of course, they are human and fallible. But to even suggest that they make more money than the pediatricians who see 40 babies per day and spend 5 minutes with each one before injecting them with 5 or 6 vaccinations is ludicrous.> > It is far easier to deal with the average pediatrics practice (aka vaccination mill) than to deal with a handful of kids, each with a more complicated medical issue than the last.> > The average vaccination mill pediatrician can do 5 well visits an hour. They get reimbursed about $100 for each 5 minute visit. Then tack on their share of the vaccination profit, and it easily surpasses the $400 that the average DAN charges in an hour -- and yes some do charge less. While it is easy to just blame the DANs and the insurance companies, they are not the ones who created the problem. Of course insurance companies are where we need to start, but if insurance companies started covering biomed, the costs would be immediately passed on to employers who would then pass it back on to the employees. We do not have a choice but to push for coverage -- but it is Pharma and the government who are responsible -- not Blue Cross. (I totally digressed).> > The crime is that many children from lower income families are losing out and -- and it does not help that CAN and NAAR are hogging all of the dollars on the future hope that someday all ASD children can be aborted before birth.> > Also, for the record, I do not put "blind faith" in anyone.> > When my son was 3, he would scream bloody murder if we tried to get him to walk down stairs. At the age of 3.5, he was discharged from physical therapy at Children's Hospital of Orange County because they said that he would never walk down stairs due to "psychiatric limiations." > > Several weeks later, we started the DAN protocol. The first intervention was 1 teaspoon of cod liver oil. Within about two weeks, he was running down stairs alternating feet. Dr. Megson discovered that the mercury had depleted many ASD kids of vitamin A which is responsible for depth perception -- and that most ASD children benefitted greatly from something as simple are pure cod liver oil. For my son, going down stairs was like jumping off a cliff. My son and thousands of others have benefitted greatly from the use of CLO. A $20 bottle of Nordic Naturals cod liver oil did more for my little boy than $25,000 in my share of co-pays from a traidtional hospital.> > Then there is Dr. N's MB 12 shots, Dr. Bradstreet and Dr. Greene's work with chelation, Dr. McCandless and her work with viral issues, and the list goes on forever.> > No other group of autism orgranizations in the country as done one tangible thing for ASD kids. If someone believes they have -- I would love to hear it. It is the DAN doctors that are making a difference. That does not mean that mistakes will not be made and people will not have a bad experience.> > The real crime is that the AMA's physician desk references advises against treating ASD children for any gastro, toxicological or autoimmune issues. How are we supposed to refrain from bashing US traditional medicine given that it does not support ending the torture of hundreds of thousands of children? These DANs are risking their licenses for treating our kids -- and for that I am grateful.> > Vera> > > --------------------------------->

[Guest guest]

That was for

Sincerely,

H.H. Fudenberg, M.D., D.D.G., I.O.M.

226 Edgewater Road

Inman, SC 29349

864-592-8076

nitrf@hotmailcom

From: "martinx2us" <martyx2@...>Reply-EOHarm To: EOHarm Subject: Re: EOHarm] Thoughtful House; ready to move onDate: Mon, 27 Mar 2006 17:34:19 -0000VERA, You make some very valid points but I think you are wrong about the reimbursements of mainstream physicians today. In addition, I don't believe it is the physicians who make out so well from the vaccines as the price gouging emanates from the pharmaceuticals and wholesalers. Generally doctors are hampered in many ways today by very low contracted rates set by HMO's. Their profit margins generally are down. That being said I am not crying for them or justifying anything they do. For example in todays Kaiser health Report the following was provided:"Kaiser Daily Health Policy Report Monday, March 27, 2006 New York Times Examines Declining Fees for Mental Health Therapists The New York Times on Sunday examined how mental health practitioners "are feeling an economic pinch, partly because of insurance reimbursement schedules that they say have not kept pace with their expenses." The Times profiles several mental health professionals who maintain that fees negotiated by insurance carriers have forced them to increase their patient loads or look for other sources of income. In addition, social workers say they are facing reduced fees, late payments and "inappropriate assessment of the needs of patients," the Times reports. According to Berman, the professional affairs officer for land's psychological association, many psychologists in private practice say reduced fees have forced them to nearly double their client loads and work many more hours to maintain their incomes. He said that when he went into private practice in 1990, his maximum allowable hourly billing rate as a participant in insurers' provider networks was $95, compared with today's rates of about $65 or $75. According to , a health economist at Harvard University, efforts by insurance companies to reduce costs, as well as the increased use of drugs rather than psychological therapy to treat mental health ailments, have affected the incomes of mental health professionals. He said, "Clearly, the earnings of mental health professionals -- medical doctors, psychologists, social workers and counselors -- have either been flat or been declining for the past five to eight years." added, "It's not so much the number of visits allowed by managed care to mental health professionals has changed. It's that the fees paid to the mental health professionals have not been rising" (Carr, New York Times, 3/26)." So at the end of the day I still believe as was stated by someone in a prior post that there is plenty of room for anyone to get into autism to make money in the non-traditional ways. This is not a statement of being against any form of bio-medical treatment or a suggestion that any of the physicians discussed practice this way but reality for parents to always consider. Rip-offs occur everywhere, in mainstream medicine everyday and I am sure with some alternative providers. I always believe parents know our kids best so if it seems right go for it, if you have a bad feeling, move on or reconsider your options.Finally to be fair, your statement that " The crime is that many children from lower income families are losing out and -- and it does not help that CAN and NAAR are hogging all of the dollars on the future hope that someday all ASD children can be aborted before birth." is blatantly untrue. As a former Trustee of NAAR who had my share of many differences with the organization I can tell you that was never contemplated. It was never about "ASD children can be aborted before birth." Had it been I would have left even sooner. I am sure I as well as many others on this list have some real philosophical differences with NAAR and CAN, but this is best left to a separate e-mail under a different heading.Marty >> Hi> > I promise my last post on the matter (and it is only my second).> > Do DAN doctors make mistakes? Of course, they are human and fallible. But to even suggest that they make more money than the pediatricians who see 40 babies per day and spend 5 minutes with each one before injecting them with 5 or 6 vaccinations is ludicrous.> > It is far easier to deal with the average pediatrics practice (aka vaccination mill) than to deal with a handful of kids, each with a more complicated medical issue than the last.> > The average vaccination mill pediatrician can do 5 well visits an hour. They get reimbursed about $100 for each 5 minute visit. Then tack on their share of the vaccination profit, and it easily surpasses the $400 that the average DAN charges in an hour -- and yes some do charge less. While it is easy to just blame the DANs and the insurance companies, they are not the ones who created the problem. Of course insurance companies are where we need to start, but if insurance companies started covering biomed, the costs would be immediately passed on to employers who would then pass it back on to the employees. We do not have a choice but to push for coverage -- but it is Pharma and the government who are responsible -- not Blue Cross. (I totally digressed).> > The crime is that many children from lower income families are losing out and -- and it does not help that CAN and NAAR are hogging all of the dollars on the future hope that someday all ASD children can be aborted before birth.> > Also, for the record, I do not put "blind faith" in anyone.> > When my son was 3, he would scream bloody murder if we tried to get him to walk down stairs. At the age of 3.5, he was discharged from physical therapy at Children's Hospital of Orange County because they said that he would never walk down stairs due to "psychiatric limiations." > > Several weeks later, we started the DAN protocol. The first intervention was 1 teaspoon of cod liver oil. Within about two weeks, he was running down stairs alternating feet. Dr. Megson discovered that the mercury had depleted many ASD kids of vitamin A which is responsible for depth perception -- and that most ASD children benefitted greatly from something as simple are pure cod liver oil. For my son, going down stairs was like jumping off a cliff. My son and thousands of others have benefitted greatly from the use of CLO. A $20 bottle of Nordic Naturals cod liver oil did more for my little boy than $25,000 in my share of co-pays from a traidtional hospital.> > Then there is Dr. N's MB 12 shots, Dr. Bradstreet and Dr. Greene's work with chelation, Dr. McCandless and her work with viral issues, and the list goes on forever.> > No other group of autism orgranizations in the country as done one tangible thing for ASD kids. If someone believes they have -- I would love to hear it. It is the DAN doctors that are making a difference. That does not mean that mistakes will not be made and people will not have a bad experience.> > The real crime is that the AMA's physician desk references advises against treating ASD children for any gastro, toxicological or autoimmune issues. How are we supposed to refrain from bashing US traditional medicine given that it does not support ending the torture of hundreds of thousands of children? These DANs are risking their licenses for treating our kids -- and for that I am grateful.> > Vera> > > --------------------------------->

[Guest guest]

I was told our DAN! doc just took out a 3rd mortgage to pay for his

son's treatments. He ain't getting rich off it, but he sure will be

rich in Heaven!

Debi

[Guest guest]

At 12:44 PM 3/27/2006, " martinx2us " <martyx2@...> wrote:

>think you are wrong about the reimbursements of mainstream physicians

>today. In addition, I don't believe it is the physicians who make out so

>well from the vaccines as the price gouging emanates from the

>pharmaceuticals and wholesalers. Generally doctors are hampered in many

>ways today by very low contracted rates set by HMO's.

Given that, how much control over the vaccine and medication in general

that is administered by physicians is actually controlled by them do you think?

Marty

--

Asperger's/High Functioning Autism Homeschooler's discussion list

as-hfa-homeschool/

[Guest guest]

Marty, I am not sure I really understand the question. Can you say

it differently so I can give you an appropriate response.

Thanks

>

> >think you are wrong about the reimbursements of mainstream

physicians

> >today. In addition, I don't believe it is the physicians who

make out so

> >well from the vaccines as the price gouging emanates from the

> >pharmaceuticals and wholesalers. Generally doctors are hampered

in many

> >ways today by very low contracted rates set by HMO's.

>

> Given that, how much control over the vaccine and medication in

general

> that is administered by physicians is actually controlled by them

do you think?

>

> Marty

>

>

> --

> Asperger's/High Functioning Autism Homeschooler's discussion list

> as-hfa-homeschool/

>

[Guest guest]

Can you share where you get that statistic from? I find that very

hard to believe.

Marty

The average pediatrician gets 53% of his incopme from vaccinations;

that is why they refuse to see children whose parents

decline vaccination.

Sincerely,

H.H. Fudenberg, M.D., D.D.G., I.O.M.

226 Edgewater Road

Inman, SC 29349

864-592-8076

nitrf@hotmailcom

[Guest guest]

At 03:23 PM 3/27/2006, " martinx2us " <martyx2@...> wrote:

>Marty, I am not sure I really understand the question. Can you say it

>differently so I can give you an appropriate response.

To what degree do the doctors that give vaccines have control over which

vaccines should be given, what is in those drugs - e.g. mercury, aluminum;

and the schedule under which they are given?

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[Guest guest]

If this percentage is accurate, it would have to be the office visit

fee included. THere's no way a ped makes that much of his income off

of a shot, they don't charge that much. I can assure you when I was

fully immunizing my kids he made way more off the office visit cost

than the vaccines.

Debi

[Guest guest]

I

agree. 15-20 years ago, this might have been true. Pediatricians were known

for having inexpensive office visits and they did make a decent return on

shots. Today it is different as a result of managed care.

Marty

From: EOHarm [mailto:EOHarm ] On Behalf Of Debi

Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 5:22

PM

EOHarm

Subject: Re: EOHarm]

Thoughtful House; ready to move on

If this percentage is accurate, it would have to be the office visit

fee included. THere's no way a ped makes that much

of his income off

of a shot, they don't charge that much. I can

assure you when I was

fully immunizing my kids he made way more off the

office visit cost

than the vaccines.

Debi

[Guest guest]

Marty

Yes it includes office visits;

at least 15 if all the shots recommended are taken.

From: "Marty" <martyx2@...>Reply-EOHarm To: <EOHarm >Subject: RE: Re: EOHarm] Thoughtful House; ready to move onDate: Mon, 27 Mar 2006 18:08:43 -0500

I agree. 15-20 years ago, this might have been true. Pediatricians were known for having inexpensive office visits and they did make a decent return on shots. Today it is different as a result of managed care.

Marty

From: EOHarm [mailto:EOHarm ] On Behalf Of DebiSent: Monday, March 27, 2006 5:22 PMEOHarm Subject: Re: EOHarm] Thoughtful House; ready to move on

If this percentage is accurate, it would have to be the office visitfee included. THere's no way a ped makes that much of his income offof a shot, they don't charge that much. I can assure you when I wasfully immunizing my kids he made way more off the office visit costthan the vaccines.Debi

[Guest guest]

Could you please let me know where this statistic came from? The one

that indicates the average peds income is 53% from vaccinations. I

would love to be able to use this. We see this happening in MI right

now and I'd love to share this information with parents.

Thank-you,

Carolyn

[Guest guest]

OK I guess they have some

control. I suspect many probably just blindly follow the CDC

recommendations. And yes I agree there is an incentive for more

$$$ via more visits. The Flu vaccine may be a good example, I

suspect some are too cheap to pay extra for mercury free so just stock or get a

better deal on the regular ones. On the other hand, we know many physicians

will put their patients first and do otherwise.

I am no expert in this area but I suspect they

have little control on ingredients but more control over schedules.

However, malpractice labiality probably trumps it all and many will play it

safe and follow the standard care of practice. How scary is that?

Now sure if that answers your question??

Marty

From: EOHarm [mailto:EOHarm ] On Behalf Of Marty Landman

Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 4:18

PM

EOHarm

Subject: Re: EOHarm]

Thoughtful House; ready to move on

At 03:23 PM 3/27/2006,

" martinx2us " <martyx2@...>

wrote:

>Marty, I am not sure I really understand the

question. Can you say it

>differently so I can give you an appropriate

response.

To what degree do the doctors that give vaccines

have control over which

vaccines should be given, what is in those drugs -

e.g. mercury, aluminum;

and the schedule under which they are given?

--

Asperger's/High Functioning Autism Homeschooler's

discussion list

as-hfa-homeschool/

[Guest guest]

>

> OK I guess they have some control. I suspect many probably just

blindly

> follow the CDC recommendations. And yes I agree there is an

incentive for

> more $$$ via more visits. The Flu vaccine may be a good example, I

> suspect some are too cheap to pay extra for mercury free so just

stock or

> get a better deal on the regular ones. On the other hand, we know many

> physicians will put their patients first and do otherwise.

Seems to me that every one of us has been told that vaccines are an

important health measure for our children. With the talk of strong

financial/employment connections between pharmaceutical companies and

CDC employees the questions of transparency and the appearance of

impropriety naturally come up.

This is most especially true when there is so much public

consciousness nowadays about the possibility of profound harm coming

from vaccines. Some make the extreme case that vaccines are poison,

unnecessary, and doctors simply do what they are told by the

government which is controlled by the industry - who only is concerned

with making money.

Others make the extreme argument that vaccines are 100% safe and

responsible for saving many lives each year. And the more vaccines the

better.

Now that there appears to be evidence accumulating that the autism

spectrum rates are dropping in line with the decline of mercury in

vaccines, the potential seems to be there for a major change in public

perception about the medical profession.

Just my two cents.

Marty

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