RE: Re: nothing to do with autism

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 27/07/2006 13:27:40 GMT Standard Time, m.easthope@... writes:

Tom’s VB consultant said toe walking is the result of unformed arches on a child’s feet – ie failure ot develop which I think is the definition of autism and not some mystery as is commonly made out – I’m wondering if Tom’s unformed arches and repetitive jumping (he jumps almost non-stop) are causing a deformity. Just a thought.

Sara,

I've heard this as well. I can ask my brother in law about the deformity being caused by toe-walking. He's a pediatric bone surgeon and he does lots of work on toes and finger bones. This is of interest to me because toe-walks a lot (and has always done so) he refuses to wear any shoes with hard soles so he can prance around like a ballerina in his soft sole shoes. If it can cause bone deformity then I guess it would be something that we might need to look into further.

I have on my *infinite list of things to do* to look into the sole inserts for the unformed arches. I have heard that this can be quite helpful as well in providing the sensory input that they need to help the problem. We do deep massage on the bottom of his feet as much as I can remember to do it and when he can tolerate it (just when playing in the house or whatever). I have no idea if this is helpful but hey, it makes me feel better, lol.

Will let you know if I find anything interesting from the ped surgeon.

All the best,

Darla

[Guest guest]

Thanks,

and everyone else who wrote about this. This is what I was hoping for –

a way to straighten his toes up (he’s only 3 ½ and probably still quite

bendy!) I’m thinking now that it might have something to do with autism

after all. Tom’s VB consultant said toe walking is the result of unformed

arches on a child’s feet – ie failure ot develop which I think is

the definition of autism and not some mystery as is commonly made out – I’m

wondering if Tom’s unformed arches and repetitive jumping (he jumps

almost non-stop) are causing a deformity. Just a thought. What’s NHA?

Sara x

Re: nothing to do with autism

Sara

My daughter had curly toes, curled underneath themselves not sure if

this is something similar. The GP referred us to an NHA chiropodist,

two in fact. One was really helpful and made some moulds to stick

under her toes straightening them out. I've noticed similar ones in

the bettaware catalogue. The other one said it was just aesthetic and

wouldn't cause her any problems in life. When the moulds broke

unfortunately we got the unhelpful chiropodist who wouldn't make new

ones. At the time my daughter was quite self conscious about the

moulds so we let it go. She is 18 now and her toes are pretty ugly

looking but don't hurt or give her a problem with shoes fitting. Still

wish we'd perservered tho

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[Guest guest]

Hi

Jane,

Thanks for your reply. ‘there’s no reason

why a child with autism should toe walk’ but they do! According to our doctors,

there’s no reason why a child with autism should do anything and there’s no

reason for autism! I would like to hear from other people on this list actually…can

everyone with a child who toe walks look at them standing with their weight on

their feet, I just want to know if my VB consultant is right and whether it’s

caused by undeveloped arches. Tom certainly hasn’t got any ! (arches)

Interesting methinks…

Sara x

Re:

Re: nothing to do with autism



 

We were referred to Orthopaedic

Surgeon at Alder Hey Children's Hospital with my 11 year old a few years

ago.

He said there was no known reason

why a child with autism should toe walk. He said there was nothing

physical that should lead to this behaviour. He did say we could try

splints to stretch the tendons. The tendons on one of his legs had

shortened because he has toe walked for so long. However, the surgeon

told us that the likelihood was that my son would toe walk once again when the

splints were removed. He did say we could consider surgery at a later

date, but again this may not alter the toe walking in the long term. We

certainly would not go down that route unless toe walking caused him discomfort

or limited his mobility - which it does not at the moment.

We have tried physio, OT, you name

it and nothing has worked. We are now trying out prism glasses to see if

they help. It is early days but we have seem some improvement when he is

wearing them and immediately after he removes them. these alter lower the

line of vision which some research has shown can help with toe walking.

Jane

Re:

Re: nothing to do with autism

In a

message dated 27/07/2006 13:27:40 GMT Standard Time, m.easthope writes:

Tom’s VB

consultant said toe walking is the result of unformed arches on a child’s feet

– ie failure ot develop which I think is the definition of autism and not some

mystery as is commonly made out – I’m wondering if Tom’s unformed arches and

repetitive jumping (he jumps almost non-stop) are causing a deformity. Just a

thought.

Sara,

I've

heard this as well. I can ask my brother in law about the deformity being

caused by toe-walking. He's a pediatric bone surgeon and he does lots of

work on toes and finger bones. This is of interest to me because

toe-walks a lot (and has always done so) he refuses to wear any shoes with hard

soles so he can prance around like a ballerina in his soft sole shoes. If

it can cause bone deformity then I guess it would be something that we might

need to look into further.

I have

on my *infinite list of things to do* to look into the sole inserts for the

unformed arches. I have heard that this can be quite helpful as well in

providing the sensory input that they need to help the problem. We do deep

massage on the bottom of his feet as much as I can remember to do it and when

he can tolerate it (just when playing in the house or whatever). I have

no idea if this is helpful but hey, it makes me feel better, lol.

Will

let you know if I find anything interesting from the ped surgeon.

All the

best,

Darla

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[Guest guest]

Hi

I was told by an SI therapist that the toe walking is to do with

tension in the body caused by stress, something to do with muscle

contraction i think, - it is true that my son toe walks when he is

either very excited or stressed, but equally he has a lot of pain in

his feet i think due to problems with his foot arches. I have recently

asked him why he does it and he said because it feels nice and he wants

to !

On Thursday, July 27, 2006, at 07:05 pm, Sass and Rem wrote:

> Hi Jane,

>

> Thanks for your reply. therežs no reason why a child with autism

> should toe walkž but they do! According to our doctors, therežs no

> reason why a child with autism should do anything and therežs no

> reason for autism! I would like to hear from other people on this list

> actually‚can everyone with a child who toe walks look at them standing

> with their weight on their feet, I just want to know if my VB

> consultant is right and whether itžs caused by undeveloped arches. Tom

> certainly hasnžt got any ! (arches)

>

> Interesting methinks‚

>

> Sara x

>

>  

>

> Re: Re: nothing to do with autism

>

>  

>

> Û  

>

> We were referred to Orthopaedic Surgeon at Alder Hey Children's

> Hospital with my 11 year old a few years ago. 

>

> He said there was no known reason why a child with autism should toe

> walk.  He said there was nothing physical that should lead to this

> behaviour.  He did say we could try splints to stretch the tendons. 

> The tendons on one of his legs had shortened because he has toe walked

> for so long.  However, the surgeon told us that the likelihood was

> that my son would toe walk once again when the splints were removed. 

> He did say we could consider surgery at a later date, but again this

> may not alter the toe walking in the long term.  We certainly would

> not go down that route unless toe walking caused him discomfort or

> limited his mobility - which it does not at the moment.

>

>  

>

> We have tried physio, OT, you name it and nothing has worked.  We are

> now trying out prism glasses to see if they help.  It is early days

> but we have seem some improvement when he is wearing them and

> immediately after he removes them.  these alter lower the line of

> vision which some research has shown can help with toe walking.

>

>  

>

> Jane

>

> Re: Re: nothing to do with autism

>

>  

>

>  

>

> In a message dated 27/07/2006 13:27:40 GMT Standard Time,

> m.easthope@... writes:

>

> Tomžs VB consultant said toe walking is the result of unformed arches

> on a childžs feet Ý ie failure ot develop which I think is the

> definition of autism and not some mystery as is commonly made out Ý

> Ižm wondering if Tomžs unformed arches and repetitive jumping (he

> jumps almost non-stop) are causing a deformity. Just a thought.

>

> Sara,

>

> I've heard this as well.  I can ask my brother in law about the

> deformity being caused by toe-walking.  He's a pediatric bone surgeon

> and he does lots of work on toes and finger bones.  This is of

> interest to me because toe-walks a lot (and has always done so)

> he refuses to wear any shoes with hard soles so he can prance around

> like a ballerina in his soft sole shoes. If it can cause bone

> deformity then I guess it would be something that we might need to

> look into further.

>

>  

>

> I have on my *infinite list of things to do* to look into the sole

> inserts for the unformed arches.  I have heard that this can be quite

> helpful as well in providing the sensory input that they need to help

> the problem. We do deep massage on the bottom of his feet as much as I

> can remember to do it and when he can tolerate it (just when playing

> in the house or whatever).  I have no idea if this is helpful but hey,

> it makes me feel better, lol.

>

>  

>

> Will let you know if I find anything interesting from the ped surgeon.

>

>  

>

> All the best,

>

> Darla

>

>  

>

>  

>

>

>

>

> --

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> Checked by AVG Free Edition.

> Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.3/395 - Release Date:

> 21/07/2006

>

>

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> Checked by AVG Free Edition.

> Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.4/401 - Release Date:

> 26/07/2006

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Sara.

Ralph walks on his toes 100% of the time. I didn't quite understand your

question, can you re-phrase it for me and I will try to answer from my

perspective.

Miles.

Sass and Rem wrote:

>

> Hi Jane,

>

> Thanks for your reply. ‘there’s no reason why a child with autism

> should toe walk’ but they do! According to our doctors, there’s no

> reason why a child with autism should do anything and there’s no

> reason for autism! I would like to hear from other people on this list

> actually…can everyone with a child who toe walks look at them standing

> with their weight on their feet, I just want to know if my VB

> consultant is right and whether it’s caused by undeveloped arches. Tom

> certainly hasn’t got any ! (arches)

>

> Interesting methinks…

>

> Sara x

>

>

>

> * Re: Re: nothing to do with autism

>

>

>

> 

>

> We were referred to Orthopaedic Surgeon at Alder Hey Children's

> Hospital with my 11 year old a few years ago.

>

> He said there was no known reason why a child with autism should toe

> walk. He said there was nothing physical that should lead to this

> behaviour. He did say we could try splints to stretch the tendons.

> The tendons on one of his legs had shortened because he has toe walked

> for so long. However, the surgeon told us that the likelihood was

> that my son would toe walk once again when the splints were removed.

> He did say we could consider surgery at a later date, but again this

> may not alter the toe walking in the long term. We certainly would

> not go down that route unless toe walking caused him discomfort or

> limited his mobility - which it does not at the moment.

>

>

>

> We have tried physio, OT, you name it and nothing has worked. We are

> now trying out prism glasses to see if they help. It is early days

> but we have seem some improvement when he is wearing them and

> immediately after he removes them. these alter lower the line of

> vision which some research has shown can help with toe walking.

>

>

>

> Jane

>

> * Re: Re: nothing to do with

> autism

>

>

>

>

>

> In a message dated 27/07/2006 13:27:40 GMT Standard Time,

> m.easthope@... <mailto:m.easthope@...> writes:

>

> Tom’s VB consultant said toe walking is the result of unformed

> arches on a child’s feet – ie failure ot develop which I think

> is the definition of autism and not some mystery as is

> commonly made out – I’m wondering if Tom’s unformed arches and

> repetitive jumping (he jumps almost non-stop) are causing a

> deformity. Just a thought.

>

> Sara,

>

> I've heard this as well. I can ask my brother in law about the

> deformity being caused by toe-walking. He's a pediatric bone

> surgeon and he does lots of work on toes and finger bones. This

> is of interest to me because toe-walks a lot (and has always

> done so) he refuses to wear any shoes with hard soles so he can

> prance around like a ballerina in his soft sole shoes. If it can

> cause bone deformity then I guess it would be something that we

> might need to look into further.

>

>

>

> I have on my *infinite list of things to do* to look into the sole

> inserts for the unformed arches. I have heard that this can be

> quite helpful as well in providing the sensory input that they

> need to help the problem. We do deep massage on the bottom of his

> feet as much as I can remember to do it and when he can tolerate

> it (just when playing in the house or whatever). I have no idea

> if this is helpful but hey, it makes me feel better, lol.

>

>

>

> Will let you know if I find anything interesting from the ped surgeon.

>

>

>

> All the best,

>

> Darla

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> --

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>

>

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>

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>

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[Guest guest]

Hi .

What is a " sacrum " ?

Miles

Charman wrote:

> My Joe used to toe walk, due to his sacrum being distended

> (apparently). Our chiropractor treated this and he hasn't toe walked

> in over a year now

>

>

>

>

>

>

> DISCLAIMER

> No information contained in this post is to be construed as medical advice. If

you need medical advice, please seek it from a suitably qualified practitioner.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Peta,

Yes, I have read that it is a sign of toxicity too. But then again, I have also heard it is caused by constipation, yeast, sensory problems, visual problems etc., All I know is we have tried virtually everything possible and so far the only real improvement has come from wearing prism glasses. But, we have been chelating for about the same time as the glasses were introduced (approx 2 months).

I have mentioned prism glasses to my son's Consultant. He just said he had never heard of them being used for toe walking. There is some research on the ARI site relating to this.

Jane

Re: Re: nothing to do with autism> > > > > In a message dated 27/07/2006 13:27:40 GMT Standard Time, m.easthope@... writes:> Tom’s VB consultant said toe walking is the result of unformed arches on a child’s feet â€" ie failure ot develop which I think is the definition of autism and not some mystery as is commonly made out â€" I’m wondering if Tom’s unformed arches and repetitive jumping (he jumps almost non-stop) are causing a deformity. Just a thought. > Sara,> I've heard this as well. I can ask my brother in law about the deformity being caused by toe-walking. He's a pediatric bone surgeon and he does lots of work on toes and finger bones. This is of interest to me because toe-walks a lot (and has always done so) he refuses to wear any shoes with hard soles so he can prance around like a ballerina in his soft sole shoes. If it can cause bone deformity then I guess it would be something that we might need to look into further.> > I have on my *infinite list of things to do* to look into the sole inserts for the unformed arches. I have heard that this can be quite helpful as well in providing the sensory input that they need to help the problem. We do deep massage on the bottom of his feet as much as I can remember to do it and when he can tolerate it (just when playing in the house or whatever). I have no idea if this is helpful but hey, it makes me feel better, lol.> > Will let you know if I find anything interesting from the ped surgeon.> > All the best,> Darla>

[Guest guest]

Toe-walking can also be due to clostridia. It interferes with acetylcholine which is the neurotransmitter responsible for generating muscle impulse. Bill Shaw, I think it is also has written up on this but you should be able to find something on www.pubmed.com

Best,

Re: Re: nothing to do with autism In a message dated 27/07/2006 13:27:40 GMT Standard Time, m.easthope@... writes:Tomžs VB consultant said toe walking is the result of unformed arches on a childžs feet Ý ie failure ot develop which I think is the definition of autism and not some mystery as is commonly made out Ý Ižm wondering if Tomžs unformed arches and repetitive jumping (he jumps almost non-stop) are causing a deformity. Just a thought.Sara,I've heard this as well. I can ask my brother in law about the deformity being caused by toe-walking. He's a pediatric bone surgeon and he does lots of work on toes and finger bones. This is of interest to me because toe-walks a lot (and has always done so) he refuses to wear any shoes with hard soles so he can prance around like a ballerina in his soft sole shoes. If it can cause bone deformity then I guess it would be something that we might need to look into further. I have on my *infinite list of things to do* to look into the sole inserts for the unformed arches. I have heard that this can be quite helpful as well in providing the sensory input that they need to help the problem. We do deep massage on the bottom of his feet as much as I can remember to do it and when he can tolerate it (just when playing in the house or whatever). I have no idea if this is helpful but hey, it makes me feel better, lol. Will let you know if I find anything interesting from the ped surgeon. All the best,Darla --No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.3/395 - Release Date: 21/07/2006--No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.4/401 - Release Date: 26/07/2006

[Guest guest]

Hi Sara,

I'll put an email in to him tonight. I keep forgetting to do it. I don't see how the toewalking could affect bone formation but maybe it can (not that I'd know!). I only read a brief reference to the fact that sole inserts could help with toe-walking but for the life of me I can't remember where. It wasn't anything particularly interesting though, just a mention. BUT another mother IRL said told me that the inserts had ceased her son's toewalking. I guess it's just a matter of finding the right cause - deformity, sensory, mercury, etc. Right now isn't doing it at all. I've never correlated any cause/effect to his toewalking....

Will let you know what Brother In Law says.

Darla

In a message dated 01/08/2006 16:14:16 GMT Standard Time, Moroza-@... writes:

Hi Darla,

Haven’t been through my emails for a while. I would be VERY grateful if you could ask your brother in law - that would be brilliant! Where did you read about the inserts for unformed arches? I’d love to read up on it! And thanks to anyone else who answered my post about feet!

Sara x

[Guest guest]

Hi

Darla,

Haven’t been through my emails for a

while. I would be VERY grateful if you could ask your brother in law  - that

would be brilliant! Where did you read about the inserts for unformed arches? I’d

love to read up on it! And thanks to anyone else who answered my post about

feet!

Sara x

Re:

Re: nothing to do with autism

In a

message dated 27/07/2006 13:27:40 GMT Standard Time, m.easthope

writes:

Tom’s VB

consultant said toe walking is the result of unformed arches on a child’s feet

– ie failure ot develop which I think is the definition of autism and not some mystery

as is commonly made out – I’m wondering if Tom’s unformed arches and repetitive

jumping (he jumps almost non-stop) are causing a deformity. Just a thought.

Sara,

I've

heard this as well. I can ask my brother in law about the deformity being

caused by toe-walking. He's a pediatric bone surgeon and he does lots of

work on toes and finger bones. This is of interest to me because

toe-walks a lot (and has always done so) he refuses to wear any shoes with hard

soles so he can prance around like a ballerina in his soft sole shoes. If

it can cause bone deformity then I guess it would be something that we might

need to look into further.

I have

on my *infinite list of things to do* to look into the sole inserts for the

unformed arches. I have heard that this can be quite helpful as well in

providing the sensory input that they need to help the problem. We do deep

massage on the bottom of his feet as much as I can remember to do it and when

he can tolerate it (just when playing in the house or whatever). I have

no idea if this is helpful but hey, it makes me feel better, lol.

Will

let you know if I find anything interesting from the ped surgeon.

All the

best,

Darla

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