file

[Guest guest]

---In this post, I thank a for uploading the file of the picture

that she likes, and offer a few thoughts regarding body types and

" goal bodies. " ---

Hi a!

Congratulations on finding a picture of a " goal body " that appeals

to you personally! Also, thanks for uploading the file so that the

rest of us can see what you are talking about.

I think it's important for people, in the process of transforming

their physiques, to identify physiques that appeal to them. I think

this can really help people to visualize what they personally want

to achieve. More power to you in developing the physique that

you want!

I don't know how quickly others will be able to view the file that

you uploaded. My wife and I have a rather quick DSL connection,

and it took only a couple of moments for me to view. I'm not sure

how much more time it might take with, say, a 56 K modem.

You raise interesting issues regarding body types, " goal bodies, "

the esthetics of photographing the human body, and so on.

Some of these issues have already arisen in discussions of

whether or not women " need " a " six-pack " of defined abs.

Personally, from the moment that my wife and I set out to

transform our physiques, we knew that we wanted to change

ourselves in a *healthy* way. We knew, for example, that we

would not consider using steroids, crazy diets, or anything like

that to achieve a " certain body type. " To me, there just isn't a

" look " in the world that justifies compromising my health. In fact,

one sure way to " turn me off " to a given " look " is to inform me that

it was achieved by using unhealthy means. One of the central

reasons why my wife and I got interested in BFL, was as a

means to improving our health.

Even while upholding one's health as paramount, though, there

remains a considerable range of options within which each

person can choose an " ideal body " to seek as one's personal

goal.

There is, for example, a range of body fat percentages for men,

and another for women, within which optimal health can be

maintained. By adjusting one's training and nutrition, one can

achieve more or less definition within that range - and still be

optimally healthy.

I know my wife wants to develop a " six-pack " - but she's not

interested in developing the look of a competitive, female

bodybuilder. She doesn't like what she calls the " dried prune "

look that such bodybuilders get with their severely low bodyfat.

She also doesn't consider " ideal, " the models whose images

you criticize. She wants to look stronger than they do. She *is*

eager to add muscle and strength, and definitely wants some

noticeable definition.

Personally, I'm perfectly happy with all her goals and

preferences. :-)

I mention these things, because in these discussions,

sometimes I think the distinction between what's healthy on the

one hand, and what's a personal preference on the other,

doesn't get emphasized. I think it's worth mentioning. In this

sense, I don't think it's an issue of whether a person " needs " a

six-pack or not, but whether one wants to achieve one in a

healthy manner. If one wants one - a six-pack is certainly

achievable while being fit and healthy. If one doesn't want one -

a person can still be fit and healthy, with a slightly higher body fat

percentage, and not have that " chiseled six-pack " look.

Just some thoughts from my point of view. :-)

Energetically,

> I did upload the file, but it took forever! It's just a black and

white

> photo, but I guess my scanner likes to make things as perfect

as possible.

> Sorry about the file size, but I think its worth it. Its there!

> a

> " I want to be a free rover on the breezy common of the

universe. " - Harriet

> eau

[Guest guest]

> You raise interesting issues regarding body types, " goal bodies, "

> the esthetics of photographing the human body, and so on.

> Some of these issues have already arisen in discussions of

> whether or not women " need " a " six-pack " of defined abs.

Yes, those definitely are interesting issues. Personally, I didn't

find the woman in that goal picture at all attractive. Just no body

at all. IMO a woman needs some meat in the right places, doesn't

she? (And that doesn't negate fitness, either.) I imagine most men

will agree with me - just as most women will say they appreciate a

guy having strong shoulders and arms, etc. Not saying we can all

reach such ideals, just saying that I don't think I'm suggesting

anything radical or unusual here.

> Personally, from the moment that my wife and I set out to

> transform our physiques, we knew that we wanted to change

> ourselves in a *healthy* way. We knew, for example, that we

> would not consider using steroids, crazy diets, or anything like

> that to achieve a " certain body type. "

Amen to that, .

> Even while upholding one's health as paramount, though, there

> remains a considerable range of options within which each

> person can choose an " ideal body " to seek as one's personal

> goal.

Yeah, I guess so. If that's the physique a or another woman

wants, who am I to judge? Just not attractive by my tastes and, I

imagine, most men's.

> [My wife] also doesn't consider " ideal, " the models whose images

> you criticize.

Most men do. Question: It's understandable that either a woman or a

man would set a goal of becoming fit. But why would anyone set a

goal of developing a look that most individuals of the opposite sex

would find unattractive? I just don't get it. Sorry if I'm

offending a or anyone else; this just mystifies me. It's like

some women think they have only two choices when it comes to slimming

down: (a) get cut, or ( look like a blond bimbo. I'd think most

women would have a goal of striking a healthy balance between slim

and voluptuous. " Cut " is more a man thing, IMO.

> She wants to look stronger than they do.

Why? Why does she feel she needs to? Why does sexy = wimpy?

> Personally, I'm perfectly happy with all her goals and

> preferences. :-)

That makes you a good husband!

Best wishes,

Andy

[Guest guest]

Pursuant to this topic, I was just going back over some of the pix in

the Transformation Gallery at http://www.leanandstrong.com/ls.html,

and IMO this group's own Cheryl Cundick pretty much has the perfect

feminine physique. Just to give you an idea of the zone my tastes

lie in, and, I suspect, most men's. (Other great examples of women's

transformations on that site are KimL, Debbie of " Lee and Debbie, "

" Hot_Stuffff " (), G, Barronton.)

To a or any other woman who wants more " extreme " definition, I'm

not putting you down, just expressing my own opinion of what makes a

nice feminine physique. Women can be strong and fit without looking

like men.

Now granted, I don't meet most women's qualifications for the perfect

male physique, so I'm hardly putting anyone down. :-)

Andy

> > You raise interesting issues regarding body types, " goal bodies, "

> > the esthetics of photographing the human body, and so on.

> > Some of these issues have already arisen in discussions of

> > whether or not women " need " a " six-pack " of defined abs.

>

> Yes, those definitely are interesting issues. Personally, I didn't

> find the woman in that goal picture at all attractive. Just no

body

> at all. IMO a woman needs some meat in the right places, doesn't

> she? (And that doesn't negate fitness, either.) I imagine most

men

> will agree with me - just as most women will say they appreciate a

> guy having strong shoulders and arms, etc. Not saying we can all

> reach such ideals, just saying that I don't think I'm suggesting

> anything radical or unusual here.

>

> > Personally, from the moment that my wife and I set out to

> > transform our physiques, we knew that we wanted to change

> > ourselves in a *healthy* way. We knew, for example, that we

> > would not consider using steroids, crazy diets, or anything like

> > that to achieve a " certain body type. "

>

> Amen to that, .

>

> > Even while upholding one's health as paramount, though, there

> > remains a considerable range of options within which each

> > person can choose an " ideal body " to seek as one's personal

> > goal.

>

> Yeah, I guess so. If that's the physique a or another woman

> wants, who am I to judge? Just not attractive by my tastes and, I

> imagine, most men's.

>

> > [My wife] also doesn't consider " ideal, " the models whose images

> > you criticize.

>

> Most men do. Question: It's understandable that either a woman or

a

> man would set a goal of becoming fit. But why would anyone set a

> goal of developing a look that most individuals of the opposite sex

> would find unattractive? I just don't get it. Sorry if I'm

> offending a or anyone else; this just mystifies me. It's like

> some women think they have only two choices when it comes to

slimming

> down: (a) get cut, or ( look like a blond bimbo. I'd think most

> women would have a goal of striking a healthy balance between slim

> and voluptuous. " Cut " is more a man thing, IMO.

>

> > She wants to look stronger than they do.

>

> Why? Why does she feel she needs to? Why does sexy = wimpy?

>

> > Personally, I'm perfectly happy with all her goals and

> > preferences. :-)

>

> That makes you a good husband!

>

> Best wishes,

> Andy

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/10/01 7:45:58 PM Eastern Standard Time, "Sara Altmyer" <

sasasup@...> writes:

I can't get that picture to download right. I see her calves and that's it!

I have no idea why but I'd like to see her!

Sara

I think I'm going to amend the file, pare down the size of the picture, and see if that doesn't make it easier.

a

"Women may be the one group that grows more radical with age." - Gloria Steinem

[Guest guest]

>Most men do. Question: It's understandable that either a woman or a

>man would set a goal of becoming fit. But why would anyone set a

>goal of developing a look that most individuals of the opposite sex

>would find unattractive? I just don't get it. Sorry if I'm

Maybe because some women are mentally strong, as well as physically strong, and

don't need the approval or attraction of a man in order to justify her life.

Tina

[Guest guest]

, >and IMO this group's own Cheryl Cundick pretty much has the perfect

>feminine physique.

I'll agree with you on that, Andy! Cheryl looks fantastic!!!

Sara

[Guest guest]

I don't think we're justifying anybody's life here. :-) Why does a

man put on cologne - for other men? Why does a woman want to look

good at the beach - for other women? (I'm assuming heterosexuality

here in the normal cases.)

Wanting to be attractive to the opposite sex is normal, not " weak. "

Again, I don't think I'm suggesting anything radical here.

Andy

> >Most men do. Question: It's understandable that either a woman or

a

> >man would set a goal of becoming fit. But why would anyone set a

> >goal of developing a look that most individuals of the opposite

sex

> >would find unattractive? I just don't get it. Sorry if I'm

>

> Maybe because some women are mentally strong, as well as physically

strong, and don't need the approval or attraction of a man in order

to justify her life.

>

> Tina

[Guest guest]

Let's see. I guess I'd call that game, set and match to Tina.

<<Maybe because some women are mentally strong, as well as physically

strong, and don't need the approval or attraction of a man in order to

justify her life.>>

[Guest guest]

You need adobe acrobat reader, if you don't have it you can install it for free:

http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep2.html

In a message dated 5/24/2005 1:38:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time, coolmom418@... writes:

Hi all, I've been trying to view your behavior mod file, and have hadno sucess. I pretty computer dumb, but I've always been able to readthe files. Any suggestions would be great. Sherrie

[Guest guest]

Morning everyone,

I have uploaded a sunflower cookie recipe you will see that it's from

Sewpieceful, that's still me!

Hope you enjoy the recipe.

Kerry