Re: OCD - genetic

[Guest guest]

I had mild OCD as a child and still have hoarding and arranging issues. My

mother has the obssessive-compulsive personality type and hoards and

arranges. I believe all 3 of my kids have OCD, with my daughter's being the

instantly recognizable, classic variety. I am also a recovered substance

abuser (for many years), and I know there is some evidence to suggest that

children of substance abusers having OCD and/or bipolar tendencies.

--

>From: " " <English@...>

>Reply-

>< >

>Subject: Re: Digest Number 956

>Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 23:02:30 -0000

>

>

>Joni;

>

>There have already been some excellent answers to your post, but I wanted

>to

>take a moment to address your fourth one:

>

> >Question #4-- Is there any evidence that the OCD gene is passed by

> >the mother to her offspring or by the father? Just curious. I know

> >that *I* passed on the color-blind gene to 2 of my 3 sons. It's

> >carried by the female to her male offspring, and females are rarely

> >color-blind. Ironic that my two sons that are color-blind are also

> >the ones with the ADHD and OCD. What's the connection, if any?

>

>I'm not sure what the current research indicates about the genetic

>transmissibility of OCD, but I can offer some anecdotal evidence. Though I

>was the first in my family to be diagnosed (since I was the first to seek

>treatment), it runs through my mother's side of the family fairly strongly.

>One cousin was hospitalized for it for a time, her mother shows signs of

>mild OCD, and another aunt definitely has strong obsessions about cleaning

>and arranging. One relative on my father's side also had what I would

>classify as medium-strength OCD.

>

>I would be very interested in hearing what others have to say about this;

>since I would love to have children of my own some day, it's an issue which

>could have a definite effect on my life.

>

>-

>

_________________________________________________________________

Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

[Guest guest]

I am have been reading about this with great interest. while reading

the book called Brain Lock it briefly mentions obsessive compulsive

personality disorder and to my horror it sounds very much like my

mother and to some extent myself. Does anybody know more about this.

I would welcome any thoughts, comments or information.

Kerrie

> I had mild OCD as a child and still have hoarding and arranging

issues. My

> mother has the obssessive-compulsive personality type and hoards

and

> arranges. I believe all 3 of my kids have OCD, with my daughter's

being the

> instantly recognizable, classic variety. I am also a recovered

substance

> abuser (for many years), and I know there is some evidence to

suggest that

> children of substance abusers having OCD and/or bipolar tendencies.

> --

>

> >From: " " <English@I...>

> >Reply-@y...

> ><@y...>

> >Subject: Re: Digest Number 956

> >Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 23:02:30 -0000

> >

> >

> >Joni;

> >

> >There have already been some excellent answers to your post, but I

wanted

> >to

> >take a moment to address your fourth one:

> >

> > >Question #4-- Is there any evidence that the OCD gene is passed

by

> > >the mother to her offspring or by the father? Just curious. I

know

> > >that *I* passed on the color-blind gene to 2 of my 3 sons. It's

> > >carried by the female to her male offspring, and females are

rarely

> > >color-blind. Ironic that my two sons that are color-blind are

also

> > >the ones with the ADHD and OCD. What's the connection, if any?

> >

> >I'm not sure what the current research indicates about the genetic

> >transmissibility of OCD, but I can offer some anecdotal evidence.

Though I

> >was the first in my family to be diagnosed (since I was the first

to seek

> >treatment), it runs through my mother's side of the family fairly

strongly.

> >One cousin was hospitalized for it for a time, her mother shows

signs of

> >mild OCD, and another aunt definitely has strong obsessions about

cleaning

> >and arranging. One relative on my father's side also had what I

would

> >classify as medium-strength OCD.

> >

> >I would be very interested in hearing what others have to say

about this;

> >since I would love to have children of my own some day, it's an

issue which

> >could have a definite effect on my life.

> >

> >-

> >

>

> _________________________________________________________________

> Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

[Guest guest]

My husband has OCPD, so I am very familiar with it. Our therapist explained that the difference between OCPD and OCD is that the former is ego-syntonic, while the latter is ego-dystonic. That means that people with OCPD like the way they are and think everyone should be like that, while people with OCD are pretty miserable with their condition. There is apparently some genetic link between the two conditions, however.

Judy

Re: Digest Number 956> >Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 23:02:30 -0000> >> >> >Joni;> >> >There have already been some excellent answers to your post, but I wanted > >to> >take a moment to address your fourth one:> >> > >Question #4-- Is there any evidence that the OCD gene is passed by> > >the mother to her offspring or by the father? Just curious. I know> > >that *I* passed on the color-blind gene to 2 of my 3 sons. It's> > >carried by the female to her male offspring, and females are rarely> > >color-blind. Ironic that my two sons that are color-blind are also> > >the ones with the ADHD and OCD. What's the connection, if any?> >> >I'm not sure what the current research indicates about the genetic> >transmissibility of OCD, but I can offer some anecdotal evidence. Though I> >was the first in my family to be diagnosed (since I was the first to seek> >treatment), it runs through my mother's side of the family fairly strongly.> >One cousin was hospitalized for it for a time, her mother shows signs of> >mild OCD, and another aunt definitely has strong obsessions about cleaning> >and arranging. One relative on my father's side also had what I would> >classify as medium-strength OCD.> >> >I would be very interested in hearing what others have to say about this;> >since I would love to have children of my own some day, it's an issue which> >could have a definite effect on my life.> >> >- > >> > _________________________________________________________________> Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.comYou may subscribe to the OCD-L by emailing listserv@... . In the body of your message write: subscribe OCD-L your name. You may subscribe to the Parents of Adults with OCD List at parentsofadultswithOCD-subscribe . You may subscribe to the OCD and Homeschooling List at ocdandhomeschooling-subscribe . You may change your subscription format or access the files, bookmarks, and archives for our list at . Our list advisors are Tamar Chansky, Ph.D., Aureen Pinto Wagner, Ph.D., and Dan Geller, M.D. Our list moderators are Birkhan, Kathy Hammes, Jule Monnens, Gail Pesses, Kathy , and Jackie Stout. Subscription issues or suggestions may be addressed to Louis Harkins, list owner, at lharkins@... .

[Guest guest]

HI Kerrie:

I believe a session on OCD and OCPD is planned at the next OCF Conference.

There have also been a few articles written about this in the OCF

Newsletter, you can order back copies from the OC Foundation

(http://www.ocfoundation.org). If my memory serves me (and it often

doesn't) Dr. on has written about this on his website (there is a

link to it on the OC Foundation website I believe).

Although the names are very similar the disorders are very different.

People with OCD are very upset (Louis' ego-dystonic info fits here) about

their symptoms and recognize them as a problem (even if they don't always

admit it or sometimes deny it when asked). People with OCPD think the

problem is not theirs but that other people are a problem, they do not see

a need to change and are very comfortable with the situation.

Often OCD professionals find that their patients may seem to have OCPD but

once the OCD is treated the personality disorder disappears too. This

question comes up a lot on the OCD-L and you may want to join that list for

their discussions and information.

Take care, aloha, Kathy (h)

kathyh@...

At 12:43 AM 04/04/2001 +0000, you wrote:

>I am have been reading about this with great interest. while reading

>the book called Brain Lock it briefly mentions obsessive compulsive

>personality disorder and to my horror it sounds very much like my

>mother and to some extent myself. Does anybody know more about this.

>I would welcome any thoughts, comments or information.

>Kerrie

[Guest guest]

Dear Joni,

I hear ya. My daughter's biggest, overriding, overwhelming obsession is

throwing up. Has been now for 5 years. The meds have helped tremendously, but

any mention of sickness anywhere in the world (the Prime Minister of Japan is

ill - " is he going to throw up???? " ) still gives her at least a moment of

panic. And it is so frustrating because you can't exactly force a kid to

throw up to get them over this particular obsession. (no matter how

tempting). It drives us all insane too.

But the only helpful bit of info I have for you, other than just tons of

sympathy and empathy, is that any illness can make symptoms just explode

temporarily. We have been as good as 99% better and then my daughter gets a

cold, or the flu, and whammo - right back to where we started each time. The

good news is that the climb back up the mountain is usually quicker the next

time. Each time you conquer an attack of OCD you get better at the battle.

So take a break for yourself and remember that he will be better soon.

And if you ever have a Barf Your Brains out party, let me know. We have been

contemplating the same thing for years. (We also tell Annie that she has to

go to med school before she does anything else, just to get over all her

body/illness/vomit worries. She sees the humor in that, but sees NOTHING

humorous about the barf parties, believe me.)

Good luck,

Em

[Guest guest]

I believe all 3 of my kids have OCD, with my daughter's being the

> instantly recognizable, classic variety. I am also a recovered

substance

> abuser (for many years), and I know there is some evidence to

suggest that

> children of substance abusers having OCD and/or bipolar tendencies.

> --

Good grief ! All 3 of your kids may have OCD??? I'm going nuts

with just ONE! No matter how much I love a good laugh, there's

nothing humorous in a 10 year old obsessing that he's going to die if

he throws-up. He has a cold/allergy this week-- and mygod, you'd

think he was dying of a terminal illness. Every 5 minutes it's 'am I

going to throw-up? What if my stomach hurts? My nose is running!!

What's this slimy green stuff? <panic> OMG, I just touched the sofa

and now I'm gonna catch more germs! When I cough, it feels like I'm

going to throw up!! etc, etc, etc....' Arrrrgggghhhh!!!

Talk about going crazy! I'm losing my compassion for OCD by the

minute. It makes me want to look him square in the eyeballs and

say: " Damn right you're gonna throw up 'cause after I finish with

you, young man, you're gonna feel like HURLING.' But, if I do

such a horrible thing, I'm faced with the Temper Tantrum from Hell---

throwing things, verbal abuse, cussing, hitting, screaming, etc.

Damn! There's no way out. Honestly, I think this is WORSE on the

parents!!

Pardon this momentary flight of fantasy, but I want so badly to tell

him to 'GO AHEAD, HURL YOUR BRAINS OUT!' or 'GUT IT UP AND TAKE IT

LIKE A MAN!' Or, GET A GRIP ON YOURSELF, ALREADY!! Or, when he has

a flaming temper tantrum, I become a WWF wrestler, with major PMS

(yeah!) and say, 'IF YOU BREAK ONE MORE THING IN THIS HOUSE, I'M

GONNA OPEN UP A CAN OF WHOOP-ASS AND BREAK IT OVER YOUR HEAD.'

(ahem, sorry! It must be the hard-ass Italian/Catholic in me! If

*I* was a kid w/ OCD, my folks would've said 'WhattzzzTheMatta with

you? SNAP OUT OF IT!' and slapped me silly if I acted like that!)

Funny, but he was doing GREAT on his Luvox until this cold hit.

What's that all about? I guess a silly cold has *confirmed* all of

his fears of germs and no matter HOW effective the meds are, OCD is

prevailing THIS week. Damn. Where's PMS when I need it?

Gawd, forget HIM-- *I'm* gonna need hospitalization if this doesn't

stop soon. Thank God we have an appt. today with the shrink, even if

it's only a 15 minute med-check. Maybe my son will listen to HIM

when he tells him that if he throws-up, the world won't end! (geez)

Thanks for the vent. I think I need a vacation - by MYSELF!

Joni (who is SICK of it and may just throw a 'Let's Barf Our Brains

Out Party' if this continues)

P.S. Thanks for everyone's answers to my 'Questions' post! I was

especially interested in the genetic stuff because my mother-in-law

has OCD. And , your statement above (about the correlation

between substance abuse and OCD) was interesting too because my

father AND my father-in-law were alcoholics at one point in their

lives. I'm wondering if the genetic link SKIPS a generation? My

husband and I have *never* abused any substances (for obvious reasons-

- we won't relive THAT hell again) and neither one of us has OCD.

But, how cruel is this? OCD feels like a curse on my family - thanks

to the *grandparents'* alcoholism!!! Forgive the pity-party, but 'why

me?' - and why does it have to attack my son?? That pisses me off!!

I've always taken good care of myself! I guess the only thing that

helps me understand it is that my son's grandparents may have had

some kind of mental/anxiety disorder and they must have used alcohol

to self-medicate. *sigh* It seems very unfair, but no one ever

promised that life would be fair.....

[Guest guest]

List,

Someone asked about the connection of ocd and genetics. Three years

ago I was at a conference in LA (OCSDA) where I attended a lecuture

by Dr. Walkup from Hopkins. i thought that I'd share some

info with you all.

According to research on genetics, if both parents have ocd, the

risk of their children having ocd or another spectrum disorder is

very high, about 75%. If an extended member of the family has ocd and

a parent, then its about 50%. There is a 75% chance that someone with

ocd will also have another diagnosis (major depression, TS, an eating

disorder...).

In our case, we knew that my mother in law was bi-polar, and that

she had lots of things that didnt make sense, like hoading, carefully

speaking so that she wouldnt loose her train of thought, stuff like

that, but didnt know the connection to ocd until recently.

It was my son, who is almost 18, that was diagnosed when he was

12.5. Within 6 months we realized that the girls, then 7 and 10, also

have ocd. All three also deal with depression (which is common is 67%

of the cases). Afterwards, we figured out that dad has it too! He

usually denies it, but agrees that he can become depressed. (he

washed the floor 7 times because it wasnt clean enough - if that's

not ocd then what is it?). I have also been on anti-depressants.

Aside from that - my husband and I are 3rd cousins on our mothers

side (our great-grandmothers were sisters)!!!

So, if you are wondering about genetics, there's your answer. If you

have ocd yourself, you'll be able to recognize it early on in your

kids and begin treatment sooner and with a lot more insight than most

of us.

Enjoy life, look for humour in everything, and dont worry.

wendy in canada

[Guest guest]

Thanks !

If I have a 'Barf Party' I'll definitely let you know! Maybe I

should call it the 'Spill Your Guts' party! Lord knows that the

word 'barf' or 'vomit' sends my son into orbit!

We had the psych visit this afternoon and he increased his medication

(Luvox) from 100 mg to 150. He's 10 y.o. - and a solid 110 pounds.

This email group came in very handy when I told him that had a

cold this week and his OCD had escalated. He asked him to open his

mouth and he looked down his throat. He was checking for strep-- and

I said, 'ohhh, you mean the PANDAS thing?' He said, 'yes, exactly'

and looked almost shocked that I knew about it! LOL I proudly told

him that I'd found this wonderful email group full of information and

support!

Unfortunately, 's eyes got HUGE when the doc mentioned 'strep.'

He said, 'what's THAT?????' I had to chuckle.... I told the

doc 'please don't give him anything else to worry and obsess about!'

He reassured that strep is something he DIDN'T have!

-- when you mentioned med school in your post, I couldn't

believe it! I've often told that when he grows up, he needs to

work in the medical field. It makes me curious -- I wonder how many

people in the medical profession are OCD? It makes sense-- they

would want to commit their lives to ridding the planet of germs, and

is there a more sterile environment to be employed in other than a

HOSPITAL? Hmmm..

Interesting too that my MIL (mother in law- who has OCD) has always

been FASCINATED by the medical profession. She reads all kinds of

medical journals and seems obsessed with gathering as much info as

possible on every kind of disease imaginable. She knows just enough

to make her 'dangerous' and I bet she's a horrible patient because

she thinks she knows everything - even more than the doctors.

It's been an interesting week. And the more I open up to people

about my son's OCD, the more stories I'm hearing. A neighbor told me

the other day that she has it and she got it from her father who was

obsessed with SOAP. He had to have a clean bar of soap each time he

bathed. Naturally, the family went through TONS of soap! Her

obsession is making sure everyone washes their hands before they

touch anything in the refrigerator. She was horrified to learn that

has OCD because she was extremely fearful that when he comes

over to play with her son, she may be making his OCD worse because

she makes him wash his hands before he gets a soda out of the

refrigerator! And then, my brother-in-law told me about his father--

who was so fearful of germs that he used to bathe in LISTERINE (the

mouth wash) every single night!! I couldn't believe it. His family

simply thought dear old dad was 'eccentric.' LOL

Thanks again for your supportive post. Lots of sympathy and empathy

back-atcha - and to the entire group!! You guys have opened my eyes

and made my life so much easier!

(((hugs)))

Joni

> But the only helpful bit of info I have for you, other than

just tons of

> sympathy and empathy, is that any illness can make symptoms just

explode

> temporarily. We have been as good as 99% better and then my

daughter gets a

> cold, or the flu, and whammo - right back to where we started each

time. The

> good news is that the climb back up the mountain is usually quicker

the next

> time. Each time you conquer an attack of OCD you get better at the

battle.

> So take a break for yourself and remember that he will be

better soon.

> And if you ever have a Barf Your Brains out party, let me know. We

have been

> contemplating the same thing for years. (We also tell Annie that

she has to

> go to med school before she does anything else, just to get over

all her

> body/illness/vomit worries. She sees the humor in that, but sees

NOTHING

> humorous about the barf parties, believe me.)

> Good luck,

> Em

[Guest guest]

Thanks Judy for answering my question, after I read your reply I knew

that was me.I am curious to know from your point of view is your

husband easy or difficult to live with because of (OCPD)

Thanks

Kerrie

> > I had mild OCD as a child and still have hoarding and arranging

> issues. My

> > mother has the obssessive-compulsive personality type and

hoards

> and

> > arranges. I believe all 3 of my kids have OCD, with my

daughter's

> being the

> > instantly recognizable, classic variety. I am also a recovered

> substance

> > abuser (for many years), and I know there is some evidence to

> suggest that

> > children of substance abusers having OCD and/or bipolar

tendencies.

> > --

> >

> > >From: " " <English@I...>

> > >Reply-@y...

> > ><@y...>

> > >Subject: Re: Digest Number 956

> > >Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2001 23:02:30 -0000

> > >

> > >

> > >Joni;

> > >

> > >There have already been some excellent answers to your post,

but I

> wanted

> > >to

> > >take a moment to address your fourth one:

> > >

> > > >Question #4-- Is there any evidence that the OCD gene is

passed

> by

> > > >the mother to her offspring or by the father? Just

curious. I

> know

> > > >that *I* passed on the color-blind gene to 2 of my 3 sons.

It's

> > > >carried by the female to her male offspring, and females are

> rarely

> > > >color-blind. Ironic that my two sons that are color-blind

are

> also

> > > >the ones with the ADHD and OCD. What's the connection, if

any?

> > >

> > >I'm not sure what the current research indicates about the

genetic

> > >transmissibility of OCD, but I can offer some anecdotal

evidence.

> Though I

> > >was the first in my family to be diagnosed (since I was the

first

> to seek

> > >treatment), it runs through my mother's side of the family

fairly

> strongly.

> > >One cousin was hospitalized for it for a time, her mother

shows

> signs of

> > >mild OCD, and another aunt definitely has strong obsessions

about

> cleaning

> > >and arranging. One relative on my father's side also had what

I

> would

> > >classify as medium-strength OCD.

> > >

> > >I would be very interested in hearing what others have to say

> about this;

> > >since I would love to have children of my own some day, it's

an

> issue which

> > >could have a definite effect on my life.

> > >

> > >-

> > >

> >

> >

_________________________________________________________________

> > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at

http://explorer.msn.com

>

>

>