Guest guest Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 I think they are keen on bracing. Remember Jake's curve was relatively small compared to lots of other kiddos - 28o. His brace was working (he was already down from 33o wearing brace parttime for one month), but they didn't know how much longer it would work as Jake was growing quickly. Dr. K left it in our hands if we wanted another brace which they would make in Erie or if we wanted to cast. I asked him what he would do if it were his child, and he said he could get the numbers down much faster and control the rotation with a cast. Then he paused and said if it were his child, he would definitely cast. He doesn't recommend a brace after casting for Jake (every child is different) because Jake is relatively straight right now. This cast and the next will serve as Jake's brace according to him and Dr. . I am a little nervous about going brace-free and will try to push for at least parttime bracing afterwards. Hope this clears things up a little bit. It's hard because what works for one doesn't always work for another. It seems like there are no absolutes, and sometimes that is hard for me to deal with. mom to and Jake Claflin <noellesmommy@...> wrote: This makes me wonder if they aren't so keen on bracing. I think Dr. K and Dr. S both recommended not bracing Jake when he is done with his casts. You will have to ask V about that though. Noelle (12-2-01) Ian (8-15-04) hey Deshea > > > " infantile scoliosis " > > > > > > Is this going to be Lucas's last cast? When he gets > > > his last one, does that mean you won't be going to > > > Shriners anymore? Do they do the bracing there? > > > > > > > > > Noelle (12-2-01) > > > Ian (8-15-04) > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2006 Report Share Posted February 10, 2006 , So, even though the brace can reduce the curve, from what Dr. K said, it sounds like the cast addresses the rotation whereas a brace does not. Am I correct? Noelle (12-2-01) Ian (8-15-04) hey Deshea > > > " infantile scoliosis " > > > > > > Is this going to be Lucas's last cast? When he gets > > > his last one, does that mean you won't be going to > > > Shriners anymore? Do they do the bracing there? > > > > > > > > > Noelle (12-2-01) > > > Ian (8-15-04) > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2006 Report Share Posted February 11, 2006 Exactly! If you're lucky, the brace maintains. If you're even luckier, it could correct. It all depends on where the curve is. But a brace (according to Dr. K) never addresses rotation. mom to and Jake Claflin <noellesmommy@...> wrote: , So, even though the brace can reduce the curve, from what Dr. K said, it sounds like the cast addresses the rotation whereas a brace does not. Am I correct? Noelle (12-2-01) Ian (8-15-04) hey Deshea > > > " infantile scoliosis " > > > > > > Is this going to be Lucas's last cast? When he gets > > > his last one, does that mean you won't be going to > > > Shriners anymore? Do they do the bracing there? > > > > > > > > > Noelle (12-2-01) > > > Ian (8-15-04) > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2006 Report Share Posted February 11, 2006 Thanks . Just wanted to make sure I had it right . Noelle (12-2-01) Ian (8-15-04) hey Deshea > > > " infantile scoliosis " > > > > > > Is this going to be Lucas's last cast? When he gets > > > his last one, does that mean you won't be going to > > > Shriners anymore? Do they do the bracing there? > > > > > > > > > Noelle (12-2-01) > > > Ian (8-15-04) > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2006 Report Share Posted February 11, 2006 Hi , From my understanding the brace can't treat rotation and it's questionable whether it even reduces a curve though as you already said all curves are different. The brace can hold the curve in place though Ms Mehta would say you lose that correct positioning every time you take the brace off. Bridget's brace certainly holds her spine in a better position and it pushes her curve to a straighter position but I believe it is actually growing while the child is held in this corrected position that improves the curve. It was very scary as well as exciting going back to a brace but because of the connective tissue issues we really needed to build up some muscle. Hopefully she's looking good enough in April to stay in a brace but we will have to wait and see. Good luck Bert and Bridget Claflin <noellesmommy@...> wrote: , So, even though the brace can reduce the curve, from what Dr. K said, it sounds like the cast addresses the rotation whereas a brace does not. Am I correct? Noelle (12-2-01) Ian (8-15-04) hey Deshea > > > " infantile scoliosis " > > > > > > Is this going to be Lucas's last cast? When he gets > > > his last one, does that mean you won't be going to > > > Shriners anymore? Do they do the bracing there? > > > > > > > > > Noelle (12-2-01) > > > Ian (8-15-04) > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 12, 2006 Report Share Posted February 12, 2006 I also wanted to add what Mehta told us regarding brace at ETTP. Bracing can work for certain curves IF it is structurally correct and IF the parent/parents are vigilent about putting brace right back on after diaper changes and/or bath. She said the reason she doesn't usually advocate bracing is because she finds that parents find an excuse for taking brace off whether child is complaining, it is a hot day, it is child's birthday, etc. As we all have learned constant support is what the spine needs, and often times it is the parent's lack of committment (her words) that contributes to the brace being ineffective. She thought Jake might have a good chance in the brace he had, but he was already outgrowing it. I've spoken to another mom on this list who agrees with this: if they would cast mould each brace (instead of making subsequent braces with just measurements), bracing might work for some of these kids with idiopathic scoli - again depending of where the curve is. I did ask our beloved brace guy why they didn't cast mould for each brace. He said it is too time-consuming and too costly, and most insurance companies will not touch it. I know I've run off on a tangent, but these are the things I think about.... mom to and Jake bert lehane <bert_lehane@...> wrote: Hi , From my understanding the brace can't treat rotation and it's questionable whether it even reduces a curve though as you already said all curves are different. The brace can hold the curve in place though Ms Mehta would say you lose that correct positioning every time you take the brace off. Bridget's brace certainly holds her spine in a better position and it pushes her curve to a straighter position but I believe it is actually growing while the child is held in this corrected position that improves the curve. It was very scary as well as exciting going back to a brace but because of the connective tissue issues we really needed to build up some muscle. Hopefully she's looking good enough in April to stay in a brace but we will have to wait and see. Good luck Bert and Bridget Claflin wrote: , So, even though the brace can reduce the curve, from what Dr. K said, it sounds like the cast addresses the rotation whereas a brace does not. Am I correct? Noelle (12-2-01) Ian (8-15-04) hey Deshea > > > " infantile scoliosis " > > > > > > Is this going to be Lucas's last cast? When he gets > > > his last one, does that mean you won't be going to > > > Shriners anymore? Do they do the bracing there? > > > > > > > > > Noelle (12-2-01) > > > Ian (8-15-04) > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 12, 2006 Report Share Posted February 12, 2006 Just thought I would throw my two cents in here also. For Tracey and/or Robin, our orthotist in San we have continued to travel to see even though we have moved to San Angelo. We like his open mindedness, willingness to work with Dr. D'Astous and he cast molds each brace, on a cotrell table. I know that isn't the newest technology available, but the closest to and EDF type cast you will find I think. He is great about follow-up and seems to be genuinely concerned for Madison's correction and comfort. I'm not sure, but I think Madison is one of the first on this group to really complete this casting/bracing procedure and here's our experience: She went into a TLSO for 3 weeks, while we awaited her first casting appt in SLC. She wore 7 casts over an 18 month period of time and is now in her second brace. She has been wearing it since her cast was removed and we are VERY diligent about when it comes off. It only comes off at 1600 until 2000 everyday. NO EXCEPTIONS what-so-ever. I don't want to compromise everything we've already accomplished. I'm sorry she can't do everything she wants, when she wants, but it's in her best interest and I'm not flexible at all on this point. We don't remove it for diaper changes, just work around it. We look it just like the cast, we worked around it, so now we must work around this too. Madison's results have been phemnominal, more than we could have ever hoped for. We are so thankful for this group, and Olivia, Shriner's and Dr. D'Astous and her treatment team in San . What I am getting at is this...in her first brace her curve increased by over 30 in just three weeks. Through our experience I have gathered, bracing will not correct; however, after a series of EDF casts, following up with bracing has been great for Madison so far. Of course each child, and each curve is different, therefore responding differently to each scenario. Bracing has been an effective aftercare program for us though. (post final cast 12 COBB and currently at 4 COBB) Not sure if this helps or just causes even more confusion, but just thought I would chime in. Jen Viveiros <jviv314@...> wrote: I also wanted to add what Mehta told us regarding brace at ETTP. Bracing can work for certain curves IF it is structurally correct and IF the parent/parents are vigilent about putting brace right back on after diaper changes and/or bath. She said the reason she doesn't usually advocate bracing is because she finds that parents find an excuse for taking brace off whether child is complaining, it is a hot day, it is child's birthday, etc. As we all have learned constant support is what the spine needs, and often times it is the parent's lack of committment (her words) that contributes to the brace being ineffective. She thought Jake might have a good chance in the brace he had, but he was already outgrowing it. I've spoken to another mom on this list who agrees with this: if they would cast mould each brace (instead of making subsequent braces with just measurements), bracing might work for some of these kids with idiopathic scoli - again depending of where the curve is. I did ask our beloved brace guy why they didn't cast mould for each brace. He said it is too time-consuming and too costly, and most insurance companies will not touch it. I know I've run off on a tangent, but these are the things I think about.... mom to and Jake bert lehane <bert_lehane@...> wrote: Hi , From my understanding the brace can't treat rotation and it's questionable whether it even reduces a curve though as you already said all curves are different. The brace can hold the curve in place though Ms Mehta would say you lose that correct positioning every time you take the brace off. Bridget's brace certainly holds her spine in a better position and it pushes her curve to a straighter position but I believe it is actually growing while the child is held in this corrected position that improves the curve. It was very scary as well as exciting going back to a brace but because of the connective tissue issues we really needed to build up some muscle. Hopefully she's looking good enough in April to stay in a brace but we will have to wait and see. Good luck Bert and Bridget Claflin wrote: , So, even though the brace can reduce the curve, from what Dr. K said, it sounds like the cast addresses the rotation whereas a brace does not. Am I correct? Noelle (12-2-01) Ian (8-15-04) hey Deshea > > > " infantile scoliosis " > > > > > > Is this going to be Lucas's last cast? When he gets > > > his last one, does that mean you won't be going to > > > Shriners anymore? Do they do the bracing there? > > > > > > > > > Noelle (12-2-01) > > > Ian (8-15-04) > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 12, 2006 Report Share Posted February 12, 2006 We have also been very diligent with Bridget and her bracing. When Dr Santora (filling in for Dr D " Astous) told me the thinking now was to give the kids 4 hours a day out of the brace I was scared stiff and actually found it hard to give her any time out of brace besides bath time and swimming time. However after the physio showed me specific exercises for Bridget to do to build up her trunk muscles so that the muscles would have a better chance of holding her spine in the corrected position I felt better about letting her spend two hrs in the morning and 2 hours in the afternoon out of her brace. I suppose April will tell if we are on the right track or losing the valuable gains we have made through our 14 months of casting. I can't see how a brace could reduce a rib hump either though I suppose that is the same thing as saying bracing doesn't correct rotation isn't it? Bert <jenstewart73@...> wrote: Just thought I would throw my two cents in here also. For Tracey and/or Robin, our orthotist in San we have continued to travel to see even though we have moved to San Angelo. We like his open mindedness, willingness to work with Dr. D'Astous and he cast molds each brace, on a cotrell table. I know that isn't the newest technology available, but the closest to and EDF type cast you will find I think. He is great about follow-up and seems to be genuinely concerned for Madison's correction and comfort. I'm not sure, but I think Madison is one of the first on this group to really complete this casting/bracing procedure and here's our experience: She went into a TLSO for 3 weeks, while we awaited her first casting appt in SLC. She wore 7 casts over an 18 month period of time and is now in her second brace. She has been wearing it since her cast was removed and we are VERY diligent about when it comes off. It only comes off at 1600 until 2000 everyday. NO EXCEPTIONS what-so-ever. I don't want to compromise everything we've already accomplished. I'm sorry she can't do everything she wants, when she wants, but it's in her best interest and I'm not flexible at all on this point. We don't remove it for diaper changes, just work around it. We look it just like the cast, we worked around it, so now we must work around this too. Madison's results have been phemnominal, more than we could have ever hoped for. We are so thankful for this group, and Olivia, Shriner's and Dr. D'Astous and her treatment team in San . What I am getting at is this...in her first brace her curve increased by over 30 in just three weeks. Through our experience I have gathered, bracing will not correct; however, after a series of EDF casts, following up with bracing has been great for Madison so far. Of course each child, and each curve is different, therefore responding differently to each scenario. Bracing has been an effective aftercare program for us though. (post final cast 12 COBB and currently at 4 COBB) Not sure if this helps or just causes even more confusion, but just thought I would chime in. Jen Viveiros <jviv314@...> wrote: I also wanted to add what Mehta told us regarding brace at ETTP. Bracing can work for certain curves IF it is structurally correct and IF the parent/parents are vigilent about putting brace right back on after diaper changes and/or bath. She said the reason she doesn't usually advocate bracing is because she finds that parents find an excuse for taking brace off whether child is complaining, it is a hot day, it is child's birthday, etc. As we all have learned constant support is what the spine needs, and often times it is the parent's lack of committment (her words) that contributes to the brace being ineffective. She thought Jake might have a good chance in the brace he had, but he was already outgrowing it. I've spoken to another mom on this list who agrees with this: if they would cast mould each brace (instead of making subsequent braces with just measurements), bracing might work for some of these kids with idiopathic scoli - again depending of where the curve is. I did ask our beloved brace guy why they didn't cast mould for each brace. He said it is too time-consuming and too costly, and most insurance companies will not touch it. I know I've run off on a tangent, but these are the things I think about.... mom to and Jake bert lehane <bert_lehane@...> wrote: Hi , From my understanding the brace can't treat rotation and it's questionable whether it even reduces a curve though as you already said all curves are different. The brace can hold the curve in place though Ms Mehta would say you lose that correct positioning every time you take the brace off. Bridget's brace certainly holds her spine in a better position and it pushes her curve to a straighter position but I believe it is actually growing while the child is held in this corrected position that improves the curve. It was very scary as well as exciting going back to a brace but because of the connective tissue issues we really needed to build up some muscle. Hopefully she's looking good enough in April to stay in a brace but we will have to wait and see. Good luck Bert and Bridget Claflin wrote: , So, even though the brace can reduce the curve, from what Dr. K said, it sounds like the cast addresses the rotation whereas a brace does not. Am I correct? Noelle (12-2-01) Ian (8-15-04) hey Deshea > > > " infantile scoliosis " > > > > > > Is this going to be Lucas's last cast? When he gets > > > his last one, does that mean you won't be going to > > > Shriners anymore? Do they do the bracing there? > > > > > > > > > Noelle (12-2-01) > > > Ian (8-15-04) > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 13, 2006 Report Share Posted February 13, 2006 I think it's fantastic that he cast moulds each brace. I wonder why they can't/won't touch it here on the east coast then????? I guess it's all in the mindset of the ortho. I, too, was like a drill sergeant with Jake in his brace. Because of his age then, he adapted easily and couldn't complain too much. How old is Madison now? I'm glad she got great results with casting and now bracing. It's what we all hope/pray/long for. mom to and Jake <jenstewart73@...> wrote: Just thought I would throw my two cents in here also. For Tracey and/or Robin, our orthotist in San we have continued to travel to see even though we have moved to San Angelo. We like his open mindedness, willingness to work with Dr. D'Astous and he cast molds each brace, on a cotrell table. I know that isn't the newest technology available, but the closest to and EDF type cast you will find I think. He is great about follow-up and seems to be genuinely concerned for Madison's correction and comfort. I'm not sure, but I think Madison is one of the first on this group to really complete this casting/bracing procedure and here's our experience: She went into a TLSO for 3 weeks, while we awaited her first casting appt in SLC. She wore 7 casts over an 18 month period of time and is now in her second brace. She has been wearing it since her cast was removed and we are VERY diligent about when it comes off. It only comes off at 1600 until 2000 everyday. NO EXCEPTIONS what-so-ever. I don't want to compromise everything we've already accomplished. I'm sorry she can't do everything she wants, when she wants, but it's in her best interest and I'm not flexible at all on this point. We don't remove it for diaper changes, just work around it. We look it just like the cast, we worked around it, so now we must work around this too. Madison's results have been phemnominal, more than we could have ever hoped for. We are so thankful for this group, and Olivia, Shriner's and Dr. D'Astous and her treatment team in San . What I am getting at is this...in her first brace her curve increased by over 30 in just three weeks. Through our experience I have gathered, bracing will not correct; however, after a series of EDF casts, following up with bracing has been great for Madison so far. Of course each child, and each curve is different, therefore responding differently to each scenario. Bracing has been an effective aftercare program for us though. (post final cast 12 COBB and currently at 4 COBB) Not sure if this helps or just causes even more confusion, but just thought I would chime in. Jen Viveiros wrote: I also wanted to add what Mehta told us regarding brace at ETTP. Bracing can work for certain curves IF it is structurally correct and IF the parent/parents are vigilent about putting brace right back on after diaper changes and/or bath. She said the reason she doesn't usually advocate bracing is because she finds that parents find an excuse for taking brace off whether child is complaining, it is a hot day, it is child's birthday, etc. As we all have learned constant support is what the spine needs, and often times it is the parent's lack of committment (her words) that contributes to the brace being ineffective. She thought Jake might have a good chance in the brace he had, but he was already outgrowing it. I've spoken to another mom on this list who agrees with this: if they would cast mould each brace (instead of making subsequent braces with just measurements), bracing might work for some of these kids with idiopathic scoli - again depending of where the curve is. I did ask our beloved brace guy why they didn't cast mould for each brace. He said it is too time-consuming and too costly, and most insurance companies will not touch it. I know I've run off on a tangent, but these are the things I think about.... mom to and Jake bert lehane wrote: Hi , From my understanding the brace can't treat rotation and it's questionable whether it even reduces a curve though as you already said all curves are different. The brace can hold the curve in place though Ms Mehta would say you lose that correct positioning every time you take the brace off. Bridget's brace certainly holds her spine in a better position and it pushes her curve to a straighter position but I believe it is actually growing while the child is held in this corrected position that improves the curve. It was very scary as well as exciting going back to a brace but because of the connective tissue issues we really needed to build up some muscle. Hopefully she's looking good enough in April to stay in a brace but we will have to wait and see. Good luck Bert and Bridget Claflin wrote: , So, even though the brace can reduce the curve, from what Dr. K said, it sounds like the cast addresses the rotation whereas a brace does not. Am I correct? Noelle (12-2-01) Ian (8-15-04) hey Deshea > > > " infantile scoliosis " > > > > > > Is this going to be Lucas's last cast? When he gets > > > his last one, does that mean you won't be going to > > > Shriners anymore? Do they do the bracing there? > > > > > > > > > Noelle (12-2-01) > > > Ian (8-15-04) > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 14, 2006 Report Share Posted February 14, 2006 We are very happy with the results achieved through casting and bracing and wish the very same to all of you! She is currently 29 months old. Viveiros <jviv314@...> wrote: I think it's fantastic that he cast moulds each brace. I wonder why they can't/won't touch it here on the east coast then????? I guess it's all in the mindset of the ortho. I, too, was like a drill sergeant with Jake in his brace. Because of his age then, he adapted easily and couldn't complain too much. How old is Madison now? I'm glad she got great results with casting and now bracing. It's what we all hope/pray/long for. mom to and Jake <jenstewart73@...> wrote: Just thought I would throw my two cents in here also. For Tracey and/or Robin, our orthotist in San we have continued to travel to see even though we have moved to San Angelo. We like his open mindedness, willingness to work with Dr. D'Astous and he cast molds each brace, on a cotrell table. I know that isn't the newest technology available, but the closest to and EDF type cast you will find I think. He is great about follow-up and seems to be genuinely concerned for Madison's correction and comfort. I'm not sure, but I think Madison is one of the first on this group to really complete this casting/bracing procedure and here's our experience: She went into a TLSO for 3 weeks, while we awaited her first casting appt in SLC. She wore 7 casts over an 18 month period of time and is now in her second brace. She has been wearing it since her cast was removed and we are VERY diligent about when it comes off. It only comes off at 1600 until 2000 everyday. NO EXCEPTIONS what-so-ever. I don't want to compromise everything we've already accomplished. I'm sorry she can't do everything she wants, when she wants, but it's in her best interest and I'm not flexible at all on this point. We don't remove it for diaper changes, just work around it. We look it just like the cast, we worked around it, so now we must work around this too. Madison's results have been phemnominal, more than we could have ever hoped for. We are so thankful for this group, and Olivia, Shriner's and Dr. D'Astous and her treatment team in San . What I am getting at is this...in her first brace her curve increased by over 30 in just three weeks. Through our experience I have gathered, bracing will not correct; however, after a series of EDF casts, following up with bracing has been great for Madison so far. Of course each child, and each curve is different, therefore responding differently to each scenario. Bracing has been an effective aftercare program for us though. (post final cast 12 COBB and currently at 4 COBB) Not sure if this helps or just causes even more confusion, but just thought I would chime in. Jen Viveiros wrote: I also wanted to add what Mehta told us regarding brace at ETTP. Bracing can work for certain curves IF it is structurally correct and IF the parent/parents are vigilent about putting brace right back on after diaper changes and/or bath. She said the reason she doesn't usually advocate bracing is because she finds that parents find an excuse for taking brace off whether child is complaining, it is a hot day, it is child's birthday, etc. As we all have learned constant support is what the spine needs, and often times it is the parent's lack of committment (her words) that contributes to the brace being ineffective. She thought Jake might have a good chance in the brace he had, but he was already outgrowing it. I've spoken to another mom on this list who agrees with this: if they would cast mould each brace (instead of making subsequent braces with just measurements), bracing might work for some of these kids with idiopathic scoli - again depending of where the curve is. I did ask our beloved brace guy why they didn't cast mould for each brace. He said it is too time-consuming and too costly, and most insurance companies will not touch it. I know I've run off on a tangent, but these are the things I think about.... mom to and Jake bert lehane wrote: Hi , From my understanding the brace can't treat rotation and it's questionable whether it even reduces a curve though as you already said all curves are different. The brace can hold the curve in place though Ms Mehta would say you lose that correct positioning every time you take the brace off. Bridget's brace certainly holds her spine in a better position and it pushes her curve to a straighter position but I believe it is actually growing while the child is held in this corrected position that improves the curve. It was very scary as well as exciting going back to a brace but because of the connective tissue issues we really needed to build up some muscle. Hopefully she's looking good enough in April to stay in a brace but we will have to wait and see. Good luck Bert and Bridget Claflin wrote: , So, even though the brace can reduce the curve, from what Dr. K said, it sounds like the cast addresses the rotation whereas a brace does not. Am I correct? Noelle (12-2-01) Ian (8-15-04) hey Deshea > > > " infantile scoliosis " > > > > > > Is this going to be Lucas's last cast? When he gets > > > his last one, does that mean you won't be going to > > > Shriners anymore? Do they do the bracing there? > > > > > > > > > Noelle (12-2-01) > > > Ian (8-15-04) > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > > > removed] > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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