Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 Isabelle, the info you provided from the government paper is encouraging, especially since I had just gotten inthis email quoted below. I wrote to someone the other day because I thought they had visited a new gardenia *absolute* facility in Tahiti last year when traveling. It was a Monoi facility, and here is her response about the absolute biz in Tahiti, but perhaps she didn't have access to the right people. Hello Anya, If that person finds Tahitian Gardenia Absolute, then they are truly amazing. That little beauty of a flower does not give up it's scent. A big wig chemist in France supposedly came up with a way to make an absolute, but turns out he was a fraud. It was an FO! What I did see/tour in Tahiti was one of the main Monoi Manufacturing plants. No absolute being produced, but was producing monoi and tamanu oil as well as lot's of other goodies. Hope this is helpful. -------------------- -- Anya's Garden http://AnyasGarden.com - perfumes, aromatics, classes, consultation Natural Perfumers Guild + blog with daily updates 1500+ member Natural Perfumery group - / Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 > and here is her > response about the > absolute biz in Tahiti, but perhaps she didn't have > access to the right > people. > > Hello Anya, That little beauty of a flower does not give up > it's scent. A > -------------------- > > -- > Anya's Garden http://AnyasGarden.com - perfumes, This is such a fascinating thread. What on earth does she mean by this?! that the tiare will not leave its perfume? That the methods used are crude? From my humble 2 years into bluebells ... I can see my mistakes and successes at various stages.... so ! onwards and upwards.... always good wishes, Janita __________________________________________________________ Sent from . A Smarter Email http://uk.docs./nowyoucan.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 > > Isabelle, the info you provided from the government paper is > encouraging, especially since I had just gotten inthis email quoted > below. I wrote to someone the other day because I thought they had > visited a new gardenia *absolute* facility in Tahiti last year when > traveling. It was a Monoi facility, and here is her response about the > absolute biz in Tahiti, but perhaps she didn't have access to the right > people. > > Hello Anya, > > If that person finds Tahitian Gardenia Absolute, then they are truly > amazing. That little beauty of a flower does not give up it's scent. A > big wig chemist in France supposedly came up with a way to make an > absolute, but turns out he was a fraud. It was an FO! > > What I did see/tour in Tahiti was one of the main Monoi Manufacturing > plants. No absolute being produced, but was producing monoi and tamanu > oil as well as lot's of other goodies. > > Hope this is helpful. > -------------------- Hi Anya and Janita, I never give up! I am one who believes that the one who searches will find and the one who asks will get!! To answer your friend's reply (and I do understand what she means because everyone visits Monoi production factories in Tahiti) and bear in mind that studies on producing gardenia absolute are recent (2004)) - I attach more translation of another exerpt from the same document: MINISTRY OF THE PROMOTION OF NATURAL RESOURCES RURAL DEVELOPMENT SERVICE DEPARTMENT OF APPLIED AGRICULTURE RESEARCH PAPEETE, TAHITI BY Dr. L. GARNIER, Ph. D., Head of applied agricultural research department STUDY ON TIARE FLOWER OR GARDENIA TAHITENSIS START OF EXCERPT THE TIARE FLOWER CONCRETE The tiare flower exhales a seductive perfume particularly sophisticated which is a true source of inspiration for the perfumers and chemists. The isolation from natural sources of the aromatic raw materials remains one of the major concerns of organic and aromatic chemists. Their main mission is to 'capture' a perfume to give the most faithful and most complete image possible from the start while minimising the production costs. Two process of industrial extraction can be used for the tiare flower (concrete): 1. Steam distillation 2. Extraction via maceration of the flowers in volatile solvents giving concretes, composed of vegetal waxes and essences. END OF EXCERPT There is a reference material (in French) which I am now trying to trace: CLAUDE-LAFONTAINE A.,1993. Study on volatile compounds of the gardenia tahitensis. Phd Thesis 3rd cycle in Sciences, Speciality molecular chemistry, laboratory of organic physical chemistry, University of Nice - Sophia Antipolis, France. The supplier I am dealing with uses 'hexane extraction with ethyl alcohol purification' - Can anyone clarify what this means in terms of process?? Isabelle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 Isabelle Gelle wrote: > CLAUDE-LAFONTAINE A.,1993. Study on volatile compounds of the > gardenia tahitensis. Phd Thesis 3rd cycle in Sciences, Speciality > molecular chemistry, laboratory of organic physical chemistry, > University of Nice - Sophia Antipolis, France. > > The supplier I am dealing with uses 'hexane extraction with ethyl > alcohol purification' - Can anyone clarify what this means in terms > of process?? > Hi Isabelle.... That sounds like the more or lee standard absolute process.... Hexane is the common solvent, and gives you the concrete (the hexane residing is removed then)... Then the concrete is washed in ethanol, leaving you the wax and extracting the absolute... -- W. Bourbonais L'Hermite Aromatique A.J.P. (GIA) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 Isabelle Gelle wrote: > The supplier I am dealing with uses 'hexane extraction with ethyl > alcohol purification' - Can anyone clarify what this means in terms > of process?? > > Isabelle > > Hi Isabelle: That is the most common extraction method, a Grasse standard. The hexane extraction produces the concrete, and the alcohol extraction produces the absolute. -- Anya's Garden http://AnyasGarden.com - perfumes, aromatics, classes, consultation Natural Perfumers Guild + blog with daily updates 1500+ member Natural Perfumery group - / Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 > There is a reference material (in French) which I am now trying to > trace: > > CLAUDE-LAFONTAINE A.,1993. Study on volatile compounds of the > gardenia tahitensis. Phd Thesis 3rd cycle in Sciences, Speciality > molecular chemistry, laboratory of organic physical chemistry, > University of Nice - Sophia Antipolis, France. > Salut Isabelle, This person is now working here: http://www.upf.pf/recherche/LCSN/Gicquel.htm (lafontaine is her maiden name) The thesis abstract is here: http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN & cpsidt=163055 it's been defended in 94, not 93. Good luck ! Isabelle, as many people here, I am very interested in sharing some concrete, if you ever are in a situation of dispatching some of it in order to share the costs. Fab (francaise de los angeles...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 24, 2008 Report Share Posted May 24, 2008 > > Salut Isabelle, > > This person is now working here: > http://www.upf.pf/recherche/LCSN/Gicquel.htm > (lafontaine is her maiden name) > > The thesis abstract is here: > http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN & cpsidt=163055 > it's been defended in 94, not 93. > > Good luck ! > > Isabelle, as many people here, I am very interested in sharing some > concrete, if you ever are in a situation of dispatching some of it in > order to share the costs. > > Fab (francaise de los angeles...) > Salut Fab! Waow! Thanks a lot. This is great information... I will translate the abstract for the group... Then we known exactly what to expect when I receive the absolute sample... I noted your interest and will keep everyone informed in due time. Thank you once again for helping with this 'research' Isabelle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 24, 2008 Report Share Posted May 24, 2008 > > > CLAUDE-LAFONTAINE A.,1993. Study on volatile compounds of the > > gardenia tahitensis. Phd Thesis 3rd cycle in Sciences, Speciality > > molecular chemistry, laboratory of organic physical chemistry, > > University of Nice - Sophia Antipolis, France. > > > > The supplier I am dealing with uses 'hexane extraction with ethyl > > alcohol purification' - Can anyone clarify what this means in terms > > of process?? > > > > Hi Isabelle.... > > That sounds like the more or lee standard absolute process.... > > Hexane is the common solvent, and gives you the concrete (the hexane > residing is removed then)... > > Then the concrete is washed in ethanol, leaving you the wax and > extracting the absolute... > > > -- > W. Bourbonais > L'Hermite Aromatique > A.J.P. (GIA) > Thank you ! I just wanted to clarify that hexane was a solvent... which helps confirm the saying in the government paper I quoted earlier... Isabelle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 27, 2008 Report Share Posted May 27, 2008 > > Hi Anya and Janita, > > > > > MINISTRY OF THE PROMOTION OF NATURAL RESOURCES > RURAL DEVELOPMENT SERVICE > DEPARTMENT OF APPLIED AGRICULTURE RESEARCH > PAPEETE, TAHITI > > BY Dr. L. GARNIER, Ph. D., Head of applied > agricultural > research department > > STUDY ON TIARE FLOWER OR GARDENIA TAHITENSIS > > START OF EXCERPT > > THE TIARE FLOWER CONCRETE > The tiare flower exhales a seductive perfume particularly > sophisticated which is a true source of inspiration for the > perfumers > and chemists. > > Isabelle > Hello Isabelle I am coming back to this thread late... It's full on here at present and I'm now exhausted. It's the annual Hay Festival of Literature and Art ... Applause on your detective work and excellent help from other members here... on catching up I have seen Anya's and 's explanation to you about creating the absolute so all looks as if it is moving along...in a positive manner keep us posted... always good wishes, Janita __________________________________________________________ Sent from . A Smarter Email http://uk.docs./nowyoucan.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 5, 2008 Report Share Posted June 5, 2008 > Hi Isabelle, > You can count on me also ) > > Best regards, > > Jaqueline Hello and all the NP interested in the Tahiti gardenia, Thank you. I have noted you down in the list... The absolute sample was sent from a Tahiti on 24 may but I still have not received it... I just can't wait to hopefully good news with you all soon... Have you noticed recently that cosmetics companies are now using the 'gardenia' as a selling point of their products (shampoo, creams etc..)??? Isabelle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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