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Re: New book, funny too

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You mean, dung beetles actually live in MN??? what do they look like?

Are theyas large as the african kind?

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Dung beetles have been found on every part of the earth except the anarctic.

They might be

there too. You can't have a healthy livestock operation without them. The book

is a SMALL

MIRACLE and I highly recommend it. Like all of Chuck Walters books, there is far

more in it

than the title indicates. A great little surprise Christmas present for

enlightened friends.

Most beetles in MN are the tunneling kind, just slightly larger than a lady

beetle. they are

usually dark brown to black on the front shell and maroonish-orange on the back

2/3s. You

can find them in fresh wet manure.

When I was a kid, the entire Midwest was loaded with the " tumble bugs " that roll

manure into

perfectly round balls with their hind feet. We've managed to kill most of them

off with

pesticides, herbicides and livestock wormers. What a shame. Now we have stable

flies, horn

flies, house flies and face flies as a result.

You can order the book from AcresUSA, the LARGEST Eco-Ag bookstore in the world.

www.acresusa.com.

Will Winter

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Will, I try to use very little, if any DE so that the larve of the

good insects like dung beetles are not killed off. I do admit the

chickens eat a lot, but they don't get to all the manure!

On another note of fies-my new neighbor is commercial and he decided

to vamp up his cattle this winter. He must have close to 200 due

north of me on about 100 acres including row crops. I am worried

about a fly infestation this summer, any suggestions? Maybe tons of

pastured chickens on the North end of my farm?? (and people ask me

why I don't sell off my woods that almost surrounds my pastures -

buffers! - but just a treeline on the north)

Jan

>

> When I was a kid, the entire Midwest was loaded with the " tumble

bugs " that roll manure into

> perfectly round balls with their hind feet. We've managed to kill

most of them off with

> pesticides, herbicides and livestock wormers. What a shame. Now we

have stable flies, horn

> flies, house flies and face flies as a result.

>

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Funny, we used to play with them as kids (easily entertained?) and took them for

granted as part of the ecosystem that we did not understand or appreciate at the

time...that was thirty years ago. We also enjoyed, well, were TERRIFIED by, the

'barn spiders' that grew to the size of ping-pomg balls in the entrances to the

cow-barns...I agree with Will: those critters seem to have largely succumbed to

the seemingly insatiable desire to rid our immediate presence of 'pests.'

How sad. Now we are left with the real pests. In retrospect, a

cow/horse/husbandry barn with BIG spiders was a very polite place to be if you

measured it by the presence (or lack thereof) of flies and other biting insects.

I am much more disturbed by the declination of pollinators. We had such great

colonies of honeybees on our farm growing up...even with supers they tended to

swarm in the fall and completely overtake shrubs and other vegetation. So

focused on the swarm were they that you could walk right up to a gang of a

thousand and they would largely ignore you...not anymore. No swarms and very

anemic producers now. THAT is a big problem that most

advocates of natural pollination will attest to.

*GASP* couldn't be the pesticides, could it? More corn, less bugs. GREAT deal.

Alan

Re: New book, funny too

Dung beetles have been found on every part of the earth except the anarctic.

They might be

there too. You can't have a healthy livestock operation without them. The book

is a SMALL

MIRACLE and I highly recommend it. Like all of Chuck Walters books, there is

far more in it

than the title indicates. A great little surprise Christmas present for

enlightened friends.

Most beetles in MN are the tunneling kind, just slightly larger than a lady

beetle. they are

usually dark brown to black on the front shell and maroonish-orange on the

back 2/3s. You

can find them in fresh wet manure.

When I was a kid, the entire Midwest was loaded with the " tumble bugs " that

roll manure into

perfectly round balls with their hind feet. We've managed to kill most of them

off with

pesticides, herbicides and livestock wormers. What a shame. Now we have stable

flies, horn

flies, house flies and face flies as a result.

You can order the book from AcresUSA, the LARGEST Eco-Ag bookstore in the

world.

www.acresusa.com.

Will Winter

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Oddly, and as you will read in the Dung Beetle book, DE doesn't seem to hurt

the beetles

or any other beneficial bug that we know of. The efficacy of DE as a wormer is

hot and

cold, some love it, some hate it. I'm hesitant to use it because of the dangers

of inhaling it

(asbesteosis). If you use DE, try giving it just in the 7 days prior to a full

moon, when the

parasites are most actively reproducing. I talked to a Texas rancher at Acres

who sez he

keeps all of his horses 100% worm-free using nothing but DE and good nutrition.

And he

lives in one of the wormiest areas of the country. He gives them kelp and

seasalt free-

choice.

Flies from a neighboring farm SHOULD be a pollution factor that could be

reported. Ha ha.

You would have to PROVE that they were your neighbor's flies. That might be

difficult.

" Downstream " pollution from CAFOs or factory farms is a sad consequence of

government

coddling of factory farming.

Truly though, if you keep your manure recycled quickly with chickens, beetles

and even

raking, you won't be seeing much of a problem. Flies are NOT attracted to

healthy animals.

In fact I do fly count approximations on each animal in a herd to look for the

culls.

Agri-Dynamics sells ECTOPHYTE a topical botanical non-toxic insect repellant for

flies,

lice, ticks, mites and other external parasites.

Will Winter

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> When I lived in Anoka county, I was the only person I ever met that had a

> Saint Bernard kennel and no flies. Plenty of dung beetles, no flies. Part of

> it was cedar trees growing around and in the kennel runs. Not the prettiest

> tree, but flies hate that scent. People use cedar trunks to keep the bugs

> out.

>

> We have deer flies here that take a hunk of flesh out. Last summer, I started

> making a border around the yard with baby cedar trees. I also bought cedar

> chips to put around the kennel and that works for a small area, but the rain

> washes the scent away. Trees are better. You might plant cedar in your tree

> line to the north.

>

> Kathy

>

>

>

>

>

> On another note of fies-my new neighbor is commercial and he decided

> to vamp up his cattle this winter. He must have close to 200 due

> north of me on about 100 acres including row crops. I am worried

> about a fly infestation this summer, any suggestions? Maybe tons of

> pastured chickens on the North end of my farm?? (and people ask me

> why I don't sell off my woods that almost surrounds my pastures -

> buffers! - but just a treeline on the north)

>

> Jan

>

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We have used DE for many years. We kept our cattle free of grubs, pinkeye,

ringworm and almost all the flies. We kept it out free choice and usually

within hours the newborn calves would be up to their noses eating it. The

chickens we have now are free of the lice that get under the scales of their

legs. We have used only the Diafil brand. I do not use it much in the garden.

I have been following Walters and Arden s advice on balancing

the minerals in the soil because bugs don't eat healthy plants [however, bigger

critters like woodchucks and deer do].

My condolences about possibility of feedlot flies. If your neighbor is grazing

them no problem, if they are in the barn all day and he has a manure pit, flies

and other issues could be a real issue.

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I discovered the monster spiders in my barn for the first time this

summer and they certainly scared me. I didn't mind them as much in the

far corners, but hated them near the milking stand! I spent a certain

amount of time watching spiders and making sure they didn't come near

me while I was milking. I don't think I have any dung beetles, I tried

to find some last summer. I love to get some next spring if anyone

would have any to spare.

Lynn

> Funny, we used to play with them as kids (easily entertained?) and

took them for granted as part of the ecosystem that we did not

understand or appreciate at the time...that was thirty years ago. We

also enjoyed, well, were TERRIFIED by, the 'barn spiders' that grew to

the size of ping-pomg balls in the entrances to the cow-barns...I agree

with Will: those critters seem to have largely succumbed to the

seemingly insatiable desire to rid our immediate presence of 'pests.'

>

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