Guest guest Posted June 27, 2001 Report Share Posted June 27, 2001 I changed to no more than 1 shot per visit..even though it meant adding xtra visits. Never if not feeling well. Also if doing it again, I would separate the MMR into 3 separate shots..It Is available that way. We did not do Chicken pox...exposed them instead & used acyclavier (sp) to keep away the itch. I got shingles 14 days after foster child was given chicken pox shot!! We have not done the Hepatitis series...but Josh will start his this summer.. . Hard call..... Joy nmlinnen@... wrote: > This may be too loaded of a question for people with enough problems > already to deal with, but has anyone felt great reluctance to > vaccinate their younger children knowing that the older children had > what might be called predispositions to neuro/psychological > disorders? I have not had my 2 yr old vaccinated since his 6 mo > checkup. I just feel very reluctant about it, but at the same time > feeling like I'm taking a risk not having him vaccinated. Maybe I'll > just wait until he is older. I feel like I can't handle anymore > psychological problems(with the two older girls 12 and 9,and the 4th > child a 4 yo boy who has stuttering and lots of fears though he's a > pretty happy kid). Right now the 2 yr old and the 7 yr old seem the > most average or unaffected or whatever you could call it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 27, 2001 Report Share Posted June 27, 2001 where can i find out info regarding this? its a great topic to consider being factored in, and i've never even considered it. what do you know about it? thanks, amy vaccinations >This may be too loaded of a question for people with enough problems >already to deal with, but has anyone felt great reluctance to >vaccinate their younger children knowing that the older children had >what might be called predispositions to neuro/psychological >disorders? I have not had my 2 yr old vaccinated since his 6 mo >checkup. I just feel very reluctant about it, but at the same time >feeling like I'm taking a risk not having him vaccinated. Maybe I'll >just wait until he is older. I feel like I can't handle anymore >psychological problems(with the two older girls 12 and 9,and the 4th >child a 4 yo boy who has stuttering and lots of fears though he's a >pretty happy kid). Right now the 2 yr old and the 7 yr old seem the >most average or unaffected or whatever you could call it. So as it >stands the 12 yr old has had all vaccinations (with severe reactions >as infant)including hepatitis and boosters. The 2 yr old has not been >vaccinated since 6 mo and the 4, 7 and 9 yr olds I am reluctant to >vaccinate further for hepatitis or chicken pox. I guess there is no >hard evidence for risks from vaccination for kids predisposed to >neurological problems, because you can't usually know they have those >problems until they're older. > > >You may subscribe to the OCD-L by emailing listserv@... . In the body of your message write: subscribe OCD-L your name. You may subscribe to the Parents of Adults with OCD List at parentsofadultswithOCD-subscribe . You may subscribe to the OCD and Homeschooling List at ocdandhomeschooling-subscribe . You may change your subscription format or access the files, bookmarks, and archives for our list at . Our list advisors are Tamar Chansky, Ph.D., Aureen Pinto Wagner, Ph.D., and Dan Geller, M.D. Our list moderators are Birkhan, Kathy Hammes, Jule Monnens, Gail Pesses, Kathy , and Jackie Stout. Subscription issues or suggestions may be addressed to Louis Harkins, list owner, at lharkins@... . > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 27, 2001 Report Share Posted June 27, 2001 Regarding vaccinations: There has been much speculation and discussion that the MMR vaccine " causes " autism. However, there is NO scientific evidence, despite numerous studies by scientists here and abroad, that the MMR causes autism or any other neurobiological problem. There was a proven link between the Pertussis part of the DPT vaccine and seizures, and they replaced that vaccine with attenuated virus which eliminated the problem. Even in that case, the rate of complications was extremely small. I am old enough to have had all the formerly common childhood diseases, and have friends who suffered serious complications and PERMANENT disability as a result of having had measles, polio, mumps, etc. Even the Amish in my community have their children immunized. Helen Keller had severe complications from an early childhood bout of measles and as a result was deaf, dumb and blind. Although she was able to overcome these handicaps through the persistance of her teacher, Anne Sullivan, I am grateful to Jonas Salk and the other scientists whose work spared my 3 kids from these devastating diseases. As a healthcare professional, I encourage all of you to discuss your concerns with your healthcare provider, and to seek peer-reviewed journal articles on this issue. No vaccine is without risk, however, this risk is infinitisimaly smaller than the risk of side effects from measles, mumps, polio, etc. Please don't assume that your child is safe because everyone else has vaccinated their children. The only disease that has been eradicated is smallpox. Jule Monnens, RN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 27, 2001 Report Share Posted June 27, 2001 I know a little girl who just died from complications from the chicken pox who was not vaccinated.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 28, 2001 Report Share Posted June 28, 2001 maybe i'm crazy, but i think that the chicken pox is the least important vaccination to get. i'm sorry about the little girl dying from the chicken pox, however that is pretty much unheard of. furthermore, is it even known when the vaccination wears off? i fear for all the children who have had this vaccination, especially girls getting pregnant and ending up getting the chicken pox while pregnant as women. i believe the reason the vaccination was made was so that parents wouldn't have to miss work to stay home with their children. Re: vaccinations > I know a little girl who just died from complications from the > chicken pox who was not vaccinated.... > > > You may subscribe to the OCD-L by emailing listserv@... . In the body of your message write: subscribe OCD-L your name. You may subscribe to the Parents of Adults with OCD List at parentsofadultswithOCD-subscribe . You may subscribe to the OCD and Homeschooling List at ocdandhomeschooling-subscribe . You may change your subscription format or access the files, bookmarks, and archives for our list at . Our list advisors are Tamar Chansky, Ph.D., Aureen Pinto Wagner, Ph.D., and Dan Geller, M.D. Our list moderators are Birkhan, Kathy Hammes, Jule Monnens, Gail Pesses, Kathy , and Jackie Stout. Subscription issues or suggestions may be addressed to Louis Harkins, list owner, at lharkins@... . > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 28, 2001 Report Share Posted June 28, 2001 If this board becomes a debate on vaccinations, many OCD related posts will get buried. I think it was an interesting point to bring up with regard to neurological diseases, but there are clearly two sides to vaccinations -- without scientific evidence --it's going to have to be a personal choice. Until there is some concrete information on whether vaccines cause neurological changes or defects, all we have is conjecture, and we are going to be debating the unresolved and very controversial issue about whether to vaccinate our children. So far, scientific studies have not revealed that vaccines cause neurological defects. I have multiple sclerosis and there was a big buzz about the hepatitis vaccine causing MS. Then that was disproven. --I would add to clarify my statement about the girl who died of chicken pox (which was meant to explain the risks of not getting vaccinations), that it is not unheard of that children die of chicken pox. Many many die of chicken pox every year due to rheumatic fever (which can also cause heart damage) and rye syndrome and other problems. But in explaining my position I am afraid to I have become entrenched in this pseudo-philosophical debate on vaccinations. Please forgive me! Stephany Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 28, 2001 Report Share Posted June 28, 2001 My pediatrician has recommended that my 12 yr old and 9 yr old get the CP vaccination and that my younger kids wait to see if they get naturally exposed until they reach age 7 or 8 (then get the vaccination). I don't think the mother whose little girl died should feel guilty for not vaccinating her daughter since doctors themselves take varying approaches to the use of this vaccine. The other questions about vaccines (re my reluctance to vaccinate my 2 yr old) are probably too personal and subjective for this forum and so counterproductive, so I too apologize for the tangent. -- In @y..., " todd mowry " <mowry@m...> wrote: > maybe i'm crazy, but i think that the chicken pox is the least important > vaccination to get. i'm sorry about the little girl dying from the chicken > pox, however that is pretty much unheard of. furthermore, is it even known > when the vaccination wears off? i fear for all the children who have had > this vaccination, especially girls getting pregnant and ending up getting > the chicken pox while pregnant as women. i believe the reason the > vaccination was made was so that parents wouldn't have to miss work to stay > home with their children. > Re: vaccinations > > > > I know a little girl who just died from complications from the > > chicken pox who was not vaccinated.... > > > > > > You may subscribe to the OCD-L by emailing listserv@v... . In > the body of your message write: subscribe OCD-L your name. You may > subscribe to the Parents of Adults with OCD List at > parentsofadultswithOCD-subscribe@y... . You may subscribe to > the OCD and Homeschooling List at > ocdandhomeschooling-subscribe@y... . You may change your > subscription format or access the files, bookmarks, and archives for our > list at . Our list advisors > are Tamar Chansky, Ph.D., Aureen Pinto Wagner, Ph.D., and Dan Geller, M.D. > Our list moderators are Birkhan, Kathy Hammes, Jule Monnens, Gail > Pesses, Kathy , and Jackie Stout. Subscription issues or > suggestions may be addressed to Louis Harkins, list owner, at > lharkins@b... . > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 25, 2001 Report Share Posted July 25, 2001 Hello, For me, having three children who had sz after Vaccines, and one who became non verbal after vaccines, I became involved,, Now I simply sign the back of the school form that states my religious beliefs are against Vaccines, and that is it. Vaccinations Hi All. I have someone asking me for information that tells, first of all why vacinations are not a good plan and second of all, how to legally not get them. Please send any info to her at this address jlgraves@... Her name is . She needs this info immediately as the pressure to get the shots is really intense and she needs the tools to say no. On her behalf, Thank you, Donna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 25, 2001 Report Share Posted July 25, 2001 Hello, For me, having three children who had sz after Vaccines, and one who became non verbal after vaccines, I became involved,, Now I simply sign the back of the school form that states my religious beliefs are against Vaccines, and that is it. Vaccinations Hi All. I have someone asking me for information that tells, first of all why vacinations are not a good plan and second of all, how to legally not get them. Please send any info to her at this address jlgraves@... Her name is . She needs this info immediately as the pressure to get the shots is really intense and she needs the tools to say no. On her behalf, Thank you, Donna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 15, 2002 Report Share Posted May 15, 2002 Charlene Wierd viruses heh? Stealth viruses are found in anthrax vaccines. We as an entire family, tested positive, and I have two autistic children, and a mother with myeloma (which is 100% of the time positive stealth). I encourage you to get tested with Dr , and or call my doctor who is affiliated with Dr who treats stealth patients! His name is 626-572-8941 and Fax is 626-572-9288, Tell them wanted me to call you, that " I have three autistic children, and my dh was in the military and did receive anthrax vaccines " . That should get him going. The secretary's name is Myarian. She will know who I am, and why I am referring you. I also have pictures of the buggers. We are on courses of antibiotics specific to stealth and also a supplement regime. we all feel better, and the kids with autism are doing wonderfully! Don't tell him this directly, but try to get the cost down so that your entire family can get sampled. It is normally 500.000 a head. I got it down to 125.00. Also, try to get your physician involved. Have him sent a fax from CCID (doctors pack) so that he may study up on this. Most doctors are completely clueless. This way, you can get a way to have insurance pay it (via an " immune test " ). List, this is highly underlooked. Even Dr Gupta in his last conference mentioned he is concerned about this stealth. Stealth is in most of our contaminated vaccines and is COMMUNICABLE. Most of our MMR vaccines have mycoplasma and borna and pestiviruses in them (diahreaal). Please think about the complex neurological problems in your family...are they related?. Such as the picture in mine? Two autistics, one ADD, I have CFS and ADD, some OCD, some tics, cancers, even PETS are sick. Please think that one through? Kathy vaccinations > My name is Charlene and both husband and I are prior military. We > have 3 kids two of them autistic. I heard some talk on vacinations......... > ..My husband was doped up on anthrax, yellow fever and typhoid to name a few > I was also doped up on typhoid and yellow fever never did get the anthrax. > I was a blood donor at Alaska Blood bank and always donated blood. I > donated in december 1996. I got a yellow fever shot february 1997 which put > me in bed with tylenol ect. I was called back to donate march 1997 and was > denied because I tested positive to this weird virus. It was a virus that > you get from 3rd world countries. They were desperate for B pos blood so at > my request sent a sample to a lab in New York. It also came back positive. > I am no longer a blood donor. Also at that time I got pregnant with my son > who is completely nonverbal. I would sure like to know how I had a > positive result since my husband and I have not been in a 3rd world country. > I am a true believe that some of this doping does more harm then > good!!!!!!!!!!!! > Charlene > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 15, 2002 Report Share Posted May 15, 2002 Charlene Wierd viruses heh? Stealth viruses are found in anthrax vaccines. We as an entire family, tested positive, and I have two autistic children, and a mother with myeloma (which is 100% of the time positive stealth). I encourage you to get tested with Dr , and or call my doctor who is affiliated with Dr who treats stealth patients! His name is 626-572-8941 and Fax is 626-572-9288, Tell them wanted me to call you, that " I have three autistic children, and my dh was in the military and did receive anthrax vaccines " . That should get him going. The secretary's name is Myarian. She will know who I am, and why I am referring you. I also have pictures of the buggers. We are on courses of antibiotics specific to stealth and also a supplement regime. we all feel better, and the kids with autism are doing wonderfully! Don't tell him this directly, but try to get the cost down so that your entire family can get sampled. It is normally 500.000 a head. I got it down to 125.00. Also, try to get your physician involved. Have him sent a fax from CCID (doctors pack) so that he may study up on this. Most doctors are completely clueless. This way, you can get a way to have insurance pay it (via an " immune test " ). List, this is highly underlooked. Even Dr Gupta in his last conference mentioned he is concerned about this stealth. Stealth is in most of our contaminated vaccines and is COMMUNICABLE. Most of our MMR vaccines have mycoplasma and borna and pestiviruses in them (diahreaal). Please think about the complex neurological problems in your family...are they related?. Such as the picture in mine? Two autistics, one ADD, I have CFS and ADD, some OCD, some tics, cancers, even PETS are sick. Please think that one through? Kathy vaccinations > My name is Charlene and both husband and I are prior military. We > have 3 kids two of them autistic. I heard some talk on vacinations......... > ..My husband was doped up on anthrax, yellow fever and typhoid to name a few > I was also doped up on typhoid and yellow fever never did get the anthrax. > I was a blood donor at Alaska Blood bank and always donated blood. I > donated in december 1996. I got a yellow fever shot february 1997 which put > me in bed with tylenol ect. I was called back to donate march 1997 and was > denied because I tested positive to this weird virus. It was a virus that > you get from 3rd world countries. They were desperate for B pos blood so at > my request sent a sample to a lab in New York. It also came back positive. > I am no longer a blood donor. Also at that time I got pregnant with my son > who is completely nonverbal. I would sure like to know how I had a > positive result since my husband and I have not been in a 3rd world country. > I am a true believe that some of this doping does more harm then > good!!!!!!!!!!!! > Charlene > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 In a message dated 8/7/2003 9:27:45 AM Central Standard Time, bbliss1@... writes: > I need some quick suggestions -- our doctor's office called with a > cancellation, so I can take my 5 year old son in for his checkup and immunizations > this afternoon. > > Although he hit most of his developmental milestones early, my son showed > signs of some differences before he was even 6 months - for instance, being > able to crawl, but not being able to sit up unsupported and not making any > babbling sounds at all. He never had the sudden regression that so many parents > report between 12-24 months. He also never showed any immediate adverse > effects from any of his shots. Our doctor's office stopped using vaccinations > that contained thimerisol a few years before my son was born. So, I thought in > his case, it did not seem as if vaccinations would have been the cause of his > autism. > > However, now I need to update his shots, and I am feeling a little uneasy > about it. He is due for updates on MMR, DT, and Polio. We live in an urban > area, and we have extended family members who travel quite a bit, so I have > always thought it was a good idea to vaccinate. I really haven't heard a lot of > information about the impact of immunizations on older children. What > decisions have you made for your school-aged children? > > Thanks! > Geraldine > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 In a message dated 8/7/2003 9:27:45 AM Central Standard Time, bbliss1@... writes: > I need some quick suggestions -- our doctor's office called with a > cancellation, so I can take my 5 year old son in for his checkup and immunizations > this afternoon. > > Although he hit most of his developmental milestones early, my son showed > signs of some differences before he was even 6 months - for instance, being > able to crawl, but not being able to sit up unsupported and not making any > babbling sounds at all. He never had the sudden regression that so many parents > report between 12-24 months. He also never showed any immediate adverse > effects from any of his shots. Our doctor's office stopped using vaccinations > that contained thimerisol a few years before my son was born. So, I thought in > his case, it did not seem as if vaccinations would have been the cause of his > autism. > > However, now I need to update his shots, and I am feeling a little uneasy > about it. He is due for updates on MMR, DT, and Polio. We live in an urban > area, and we have extended family members who travel quite a bit, so I have > always thought it was a good idea to vaccinate. I really haven't heard a lot of > information about the impact of immunizations on older children. What > decisions have you made for your school-aged children? > > Thanks! > Geraldine > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 If you are just starting to research vaccines, maybe you should just have the physical but tell them you will be back in a week or two for the vaccines. I would never get the MMR but would rather space that vaccine into 3 separate vaccines with at least 6 weeks if not 3 months between them. So I would get the mumps today then 3 months later the rubella. As for the measles, probably not as most system are having problems with this vaccine. Better yet, get titers done for the MMR and all the other vaccines. My son did not have to have his boosters that are given between 4 years and 6. He had titers done at 5 years 10 months and still had immunity. No point in over doing something that is so controversial. Vaccines were created by caring concerned folks but now they are produced by greedy corporations that are not concerned about adding mercury and bad strains of viruses and will not willingly correct their stock without concerned parents pushing and insisting that they do so. Really makes me want to trust them with what I value the most. The above is just my opinion and I am not a doctor. In a message dated 8/7/03 10:27:46 AM Eastern Daylight Time, bbliss1@... writes: > > I need some quick suggestions -- our doctor's office called with a > cancellation, so I can take my 5 year old son in for his checkup and immunizations > this afternoon. > > Although he hit most of his developmental milestones early, my son showed > signs of some differences before he was even 6 months - for instance, being > able to crawl, but not being able to sit up unsupported and not making any > babbling sounds at all. He never had the sudden regression that so many parents > report between 12-24 months. He also never showed any immediate adverse > effects from any of his shots. Our doctor's office stopped using vaccinations > that contained thimerisol a few years before my son was born. So, I thought in > his case, it did not seem as if vaccinations would have been the cause of his > autism. > > However, now I need to update his shots, and I am feeling a little uneasy > about it. He is due for updates on MMR, DT, and Polio. We live in an urban > area, and we have extended family members who travel quite a bit, so I have > always thought it was a good idea to vaccinate. I really haven't heard a lot of > information about the impact of immunizations on older children. What > decisions have you made for your school-aged children? > > Thanks! > Geraldine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 If you are just starting to research vaccines, maybe you should just have the physical but tell them you will be back in a week or two for the vaccines. I would never get the MMR but would rather space that vaccine into 3 separate vaccines with at least 6 weeks if not 3 months between them. So I would get the mumps today then 3 months later the rubella. As for the measles, probably not as most system are having problems with this vaccine. Better yet, get titers done for the MMR and all the other vaccines. My son did not have to have his boosters that are given between 4 years and 6. He had titers done at 5 years 10 months and still had immunity. No point in over doing something that is so controversial. Vaccines were created by caring concerned folks but now they are produced by greedy corporations that are not concerned about adding mercury and bad strains of viruses and will not willingly correct their stock without concerned parents pushing and insisting that they do so. Really makes me want to trust them with what I value the most. The above is just my opinion and I am not a doctor. In a message dated 8/7/03 10:27:46 AM Eastern Daylight Time, bbliss1@... writes: > > I need some quick suggestions -- our doctor's office called with a > cancellation, so I can take my 5 year old son in for his checkup and immunizations > this afternoon. > > Although he hit most of his developmental milestones early, my son showed > signs of some differences before he was even 6 months - for instance, being > able to crawl, but not being able to sit up unsupported and not making any > babbling sounds at all. He never had the sudden regression that so many parents > report between 12-24 months. He also never showed any immediate adverse > effects from any of his shots. Our doctor's office stopped using vaccinations > that contained thimerisol a few years before my son was born. So, I thought in > his case, it did not seem as if vaccinations would have been the cause of his > autism. > > However, now I need to update his shots, and I am feeling a little uneasy > about it. He is due for updates on MMR, DT, and Polio. We live in an urban > area, and we have extended family members who travel quite a bit, so I have > always thought it was a good idea to vaccinate. I really haven't heard a lot of > information about the impact of immunizations on older children. What > decisions have you made for your school-aged children? > > Thanks! > Geraldine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 7, 2003 Report Share Posted August 7, 2003 If you are just starting to research vaccines, maybe you should just have the physical but tell them you will be back in a week or two for the vaccines. I would never get the MMR but would rather space that vaccine into 3 separate vaccines with at least 6 weeks if not 3 months between them. So I would get the mumps today then 3 months later the rubella. As for the measles, probably not as most system are having problems with this vaccine. Better yet, get titers done for the MMR and all the other vaccines. My son did not have to have his boosters that are given between 4 years and 6. He had titers done at 5 years 10 months and still had immunity. No point in over doing something that is so controversial. Vaccines were created by caring concerned folks but now they are produced by greedy corporations that are not concerned about adding mercury and bad strains of viruses and will not willingly correct their stock without concerned parents pushing and insisting that they do so. Really makes me want to trust them with what I value the most. The above is just my opinion and I am not a doctor. In a message dated 8/7/03 10:27:46 AM Eastern Daylight Time, bbliss1@... writes: > > I need some quick suggestions -- our doctor's office called with a > cancellation, so I can take my 5 year old son in for his checkup and immunizations > this afternoon. > > Although he hit most of his developmental milestones early, my son showed > signs of some differences before he was even 6 months - for instance, being > able to crawl, but not being able to sit up unsupported and not making any > babbling sounds at all. He never had the sudden regression that so many parents > report between 12-24 months. He also never showed any immediate adverse > effects from any of his shots. Our doctor's office stopped using vaccinations > that contained thimerisol a few years before my son was born. So, I thought in > his case, it did not seem as if vaccinations would have been the cause of his > autism. > > However, now I need to update his shots, and I am feeling a little uneasy > about it. He is due for updates on MMR, DT, and Polio. We live in an urban > area, and we have extended family members who travel quite a bit, so I have > always thought it was a good idea to vaccinate. I really haven't heard a lot of > information about the impact of immunizations on older children. What > decisions have you made for your school-aged children? > > Thanks! > Geraldine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 23, 2004 Report Share Posted September 23, 2004 > backing for research from the anti-mercury lobby. Could the doctor explain why is it safe to have mercury in the vaccines but avoid eating fish since it may contain mercury? > > You can flame me, or whatever makes you feel better about it, but I > just don't want everybody putting their kids health at further risk > by clinging on to what is starting to look like a false lead. We > should all pull together and try to go in a more positive direction. > Is there ay explanation for the thousand of kids that make great improvements after chelation and they are dumping Mercury in their usrin and have the urine tests to prove it? I am not saying that I know for sure that Mercury is what caused my son's autistic symptoms. However, i can't fathom those doctors who claim that they know for sure that Mercury is not the culprit without credible, realisitic, and serious research to either rule it in or rule it out. The fact is that Mercury is a known toxin and if you look up the symptoms for mercury poisoning, they are exaclt like the symptoms for autism. > > > Texas Autism Advocacy > > > Unlocking Autism > www.UnlockingAutism.org > > Autism-Awareness-Action > Worldwide internet group for parents who have a > child with AUTISM. > > SeekingJoyinDisability - Prayer support for those touched by Disability: > SeekingJoyinDisability/ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 23, 2004 Report Share Posted September 23, 2004 >She went on to say that the one remaining doctor from the original study that's still saying it might be a cause gets most of his financial backing for research from the anti-mercury lobby.< Believe me the anti-mercury lobby is just people like us and if he gets money from us it isn't much. You will most likely find that all those doctors that recanted were either somehow tied to big Pharma (who makes billions off of vaccines) or are afraid of losing their license. The doctor you are probably referring is Dr. Anderw Wakefield, and in my opinion he is the only honest one in the bunch. That study had nothing to do with mercury. There is another doctor who is a lone ranger and brave soul named Dr. Mark Geier. His background is in vaccines. He participated in the development of DTaP and is still very provaccine EXCEPT for mercury in vaccines. He is dismayed that the medical profession of which he is a part is going to such links to ignore the truth about the dangers and are instead putting out false information to the public. >You can flame me, or whatever makes you feel better about it, but I just don't want everybody putting their kids health at further risk by clinging on to what is starting to look like a false lead. We should all pull together and try to go in a more positive direction.< I myself was injured by the flu vaccine, my grandson regressed into autism after his last round shots, my now 21 year old daughter developed Fibromyalgia (chronic pain) after she received the MMR booster and the Hep B series in High School. I have done much research and I know that by submitting to the propaganda about vaccines and subjecting our infants to them, they are more at risk than not getting them. It all comes down to who are we going to believe? When a doctor goes against the party line (FDA, AMA, IOM, Big Pharma), they are risking their careers and reputations. Here is one of those brave doctors and highly respected in the medical community: Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 7:06 am Subject: Posted with permission from Dr. Tenpenny The immune system cannot be " manipulated " safely. That is the biggest scam medicine has ever created. .This paradigm must be changed to protect the next generations. Non-vaccination must become the NORM, not the " radical " position. Do we shy away from this? Because Big Pharma has more money than most small countries? What are we REALLY afraid of??? It is amazing to me, as a physician, that vaccination has not been placed in the same category as blood-letting leches and ascenic. Injecting infants with dead viruses, dead bacteria and toxic chemicals IS BARBARIC. Every baby that I see--at the mall, in the airport, on the street---I am compelled to protect from vaccination. Why isn't everyone on this list feeling the same sense of urgency?? We pussy-foot around this issue as to not " offend anybody. " And in the mean time, we watch the carnage continue. I see it daily in my clinic. How any physician who treats vaccine-injured children (and adults) can contine to soft-pedal this issue is beyond me. I vaccillate between extremely sad (for the children AND their parents AND their sibilings) and wanting to hurt somebody..... Yes, you can attract " more bees with honey " , but why are we not far past that? We are maiming the young and creating " customers for life " for Big Pharma..... I have been " accused " of being too " radical " and " driving people away " from staring this Devil in the eye.....but when the blood that is running in the streets is the next generation, shouldn't we ALL be " radical " ???? Like the mom who was interviewed today about Paxil leading to her daughter's suicide: she is convinced and convicted. She said to Big Pharma: " the blood of these children is on your hands. " Well, the kidnapping of children's health is also on the hands of Big Pharma to....and on the hand of those who continue to advocate poisoning them with vaccines. There is no middle ground IF AND WHEN you actually STUDY the information. Compromising with the Devil is a dangerous and non-productive position. We are at the point when " sticker shock " in terms of " this is what this is doing to the long term health of your child " is essential. Please. Let's stop trying to find/design/advocate a " safer poison. " There is no such thing. A few annual/regional cases of measles or pertussis (that recover uneventfully) DOES NOT exchange for tens of millions of cases of pediatric asthma/allergies/cancer. Public health is more than low infection rates and high vaccination rates. HEALTH IS NOT THE ABSENCE OF INFECTIONS. Neither is HEALTH " managing " symptoms with drugs. HEALTH is the lack of necessity for drugs! If we can't decide this among ourselves---to completely revolt against a barbaric proceedure---how will we ever effect a change in this " one size fits all " public policy? Dr Sherri Tenpenny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 23, 2004 Report Share Posted September 23, 2004 >She went on to say that the one remaining doctor from the original study that's still saying it might be a cause gets most of his financial backing for research from the anti-mercury lobby.< Believe me the anti-mercury lobby is just people like us and if he gets money from us it isn't much. You will most likely find that all those doctors that recanted were either somehow tied to big Pharma (who makes billions off of vaccines) or are afraid of losing their license. The doctor you are probably referring is Dr. Anderw Wakefield, and in my opinion he is the only honest one in the bunch. That study had nothing to do with mercury. There is another doctor who is a lone ranger and brave soul named Dr. Mark Geier. His background is in vaccines. He participated in the development of DTaP and is still very provaccine EXCEPT for mercury in vaccines. He is dismayed that the medical profession of which he is a part is going to such links to ignore the truth about the dangers and are instead putting out false information to the public. >You can flame me, or whatever makes you feel better about it, but I just don't want everybody putting their kids health at further risk by clinging on to what is starting to look like a false lead. We should all pull together and try to go in a more positive direction.< I myself was injured by the flu vaccine, my grandson regressed into autism after his last round shots, my now 21 year old daughter developed Fibromyalgia (chronic pain) after she received the MMR booster and the Hep B series in High School. I have done much research and I know that by submitting to the propaganda about vaccines and subjecting our infants to them, they are more at risk than not getting them. It all comes down to who are we going to believe? When a doctor goes against the party line (FDA, AMA, IOM, Big Pharma), they are risking their careers and reputations. Here is one of those brave doctors and highly respected in the medical community: Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 7:06 am Subject: Posted with permission from Dr. Tenpenny The immune system cannot be " manipulated " safely. That is the biggest scam medicine has ever created. .This paradigm must be changed to protect the next generations. Non-vaccination must become the NORM, not the " radical " position. Do we shy away from this? Because Big Pharma has more money than most small countries? What are we REALLY afraid of??? It is amazing to me, as a physician, that vaccination has not been placed in the same category as blood-letting leches and ascenic. Injecting infants with dead viruses, dead bacteria and toxic chemicals IS BARBARIC. Every baby that I see--at the mall, in the airport, on the street---I am compelled to protect from vaccination. Why isn't everyone on this list feeling the same sense of urgency?? We pussy-foot around this issue as to not " offend anybody. " And in the mean time, we watch the carnage continue. I see it daily in my clinic. How any physician who treats vaccine-injured children (and adults) can contine to soft-pedal this issue is beyond me. I vaccillate between extremely sad (for the children AND their parents AND their sibilings) and wanting to hurt somebody..... Yes, you can attract " more bees with honey " , but why are we not far past that? We are maiming the young and creating " customers for life " for Big Pharma..... I have been " accused " of being too " radical " and " driving people away " from staring this Devil in the eye.....but when the blood that is running in the streets is the next generation, shouldn't we ALL be " radical " ???? Like the mom who was interviewed today about Paxil leading to her daughter's suicide: she is convinced and convicted. She said to Big Pharma: " the blood of these children is on your hands. " Well, the kidnapping of children's health is also on the hands of Big Pharma to....and on the hand of those who continue to advocate poisoning them with vaccines. There is no middle ground IF AND WHEN you actually STUDY the information. Compromising with the Devil is a dangerous and non-productive position. We are at the point when " sticker shock " in terms of " this is what this is doing to the long term health of your child " is essential. Please. Let's stop trying to find/design/advocate a " safer poison. " There is no such thing. A few annual/regional cases of measles or pertussis (that recover uneventfully) DOES NOT exchange for tens of millions of cases of pediatric asthma/allergies/cancer. Public health is more than low infection rates and high vaccination rates. HEALTH IS NOT THE ABSENCE OF INFECTIONS. Neither is HEALTH " managing " symptoms with drugs. HEALTH is the lack of necessity for drugs! If we can't decide this among ourselves---to completely revolt against a barbaric proceedure---how will we ever effect a change in this " one size fits all " public policy? Dr Sherri Tenpenny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 23, 2004 Report Share Posted September 23, 2004 Yes, you are new to many things, and apparently not very good at researching either. This is what the article quotes the " recanting study doctors saying " " We wish to make it clear that in this paper no causal link was established between MMR vaccine and autism as the data were insufficient, " the researchers said in the retraction. " However, the possibility of such a link was raised and consequent events have had major implications. " ===================================================================== Follows is a statement taken from Dr. Wakefield's letter to the Lancet about this clinical paper. The Times erroneously refers to it as a study, BUT it was a clinical paper only, not a study. " It is worth reiterating that all of the first 12 children reported in the Lancet study were referred to the Royal Free Hospital exclusively for the investigation of their intestinal symptoms at a time when none was involved in Legal Aid litigation. Their pathological findings were interpreted and reported by clinicians who could have had no knowledge of any future legal claim. The report itself was a description of the history as reported to us, and the relevant clinical findings. NO CLAIM OF A CAUSAL ASSOCIATION WITH MMR WAS EVER MADE. [capitals mine] An opinion on choice of single vaccines pending scientific resolution of any possible association, expressed by A[ndrew] J W[akefield] AT THE PRESS BRIEFING [capitals mine], was based not on the findings in these children alone, but on a detailed investigation of the history of MMR vaccine and its safety. " ========================================== In other words, the paper published in the Lancet basically stated the equivalent of 'Look! Isn't it odd? These 12 children with a diagnosis of autism, have a unique, severe intestinal disorder, and also have measles virus in their intestines. We recommend more study.' That's it. So the question remains, what exactly are these doctors actually recanting (a term I haven't heard since my research into the history of the European witch trials)? They don't dispute the factual contents of the paper. They " recant " some non-existant interpretation. Now, Dr. Wakefield subsequently made comments in public that challenged the safety of the MMR that have been born out by the uncooked results of the Danish study (the part that follows the children until they are 5 and of a diagnosable age in Denmark). However, because the stakes are so high and the liability from this medically caused epidemic of neurological disease, he has been hounded out of Royal Free Hospital, out of England, and almost out of medicine. The problems with the current US vaccination schedule are multiple: 1) too young (Hep B at birth has been proven by research to be ineffective) 2) too many (with many children being given more than four at a time) 3) mercury preservatives and other dangerous materials in adjuvuncts including aluminum, fetal tissue etc. 4) multiple vaccines in one MMR, DPTa The dangers are not just autism. Also asthma, ADD, ADHD, seizure disorder, and diabetes. Japan looked at the higher rates of asthma in vaccinated children and decided to wait until kids were two. Guess what? They didn't have children dying on every street corner from vaccine preventable diseases. First rule of medicine is do no harm. The vaccine program has broken that rule. I have an uncle who died at three from whooping cough and a vaccine damaged son. I heartily recommend not to vaccinate. I haven't not vaccinated my younger daughter. Come on. Surely you must have more evidence than your own mistaken belief in BigPHARM and one poorly researched Times article. I suggest you read some of the Drs. Geier research Geier DA, Geier MR. A comparative evaluation of the effects of MMR immunization and mercury doses from thimerosal-containing childhood vaccines on the population prevalence of autism. Med Sci Monit. 2004 Mar;10(3):PI33-9. Epub 2004 Mar 01. PMID: 14976450 [PubMed - in process] 2: Geier DA, Geier MR. An assessment of the impact of thimerosal on childhood neurodevelopmental disorders. Pediatr Rehabil. 2003 Apr-Jun;6(2):97-102. PMID: 14534046 [PubMed - in process] 3: Geier MR, Geier DA. Neurodevelopmental disorders after thimerosal-containing vaccines: a brief communication. Exp Biol Med (Maywood). 2003 Jun;228(6):660-4. PMID: 12773696 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] Vaccinations I'm a new member to this group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 23, 2004 Report Share Posted September 23, 2004 Yes, you are new to many things, and apparently not very good at researching either. This is what the article quotes the " recanting study doctors saying " " We wish to make it clear that in this paper no causal link was established between MMR vaccine and autism as the data were insufficient, " the researchers said in the retraction. " However, the possibility of such a link was raised and consequent events have had major implications. " ===================================================================== Follows is a statement taken from Dr. Wakefield's letter to the Lancet about this clinical paper. The Times erroneously refers to it as a study, BUT it was a clinical paper only, not a study. " It is worth reiterating that all of the first 12 children reported in the Lancet study were referred to the Royal Free Hospital exclusively for the investigation of their intestinal symptoms at a time when none was involved in Legal Aid litigation. Their pathological findings were interpreted and reported by clinicians who could have had no knowledge of any future legal claim. The report itself was a description of the history as reported to us, and the relevant clinical findings. NO CLAIM OF A CAUSAL ASSOCIATION WITH MMR WAS EVER MADE. [capitals mine] An opinion on choice of single vaccines pending scientific resolution of any possible association, expressed by A[ndrew] J W[akefield] AT THE PRESS BRIEFING [capitals mine], was based not on the findings in these children alone, but on a detailed investigation of the history of MMR vaccine and its safety. " ========================================== In other words, the paper published in the Lancet basically stated the equivalent of 'Look! Isn't it odd? These 12 children with a diagnosis of autism, have a unique, severe intestinal disorder, and also have measles virus in their intestines. We recommend more study.' That's it. So the question remains, what exactly are these doctors actually recanting (a term I haven't heard since my research into the history of the European witch trials)? They don't dispute the factual contents of the paper. They " recant " some non-existant interpretation. Now, Dr. Wakefield subsequently made comments in public that challenged the safety of the MMR that have been born out by the uncooked results of the Danish study (the part that follows the children until they are 5 and of a diagnosable age in Denmark). However, because the stakes are so high and the liability from this medically caused epidemic of neurological disease, he has been hounded out of Royal Free Hospital, out of England, and almost out of medicine. The problems with the current US vaccination schedule are multiple: 1) too young (Hep B at birth has been proven by research to be ineffective) 2) too many (with many children being given more than four at a time) 3) mercury preservatives and other dangerous materials in adjuvuncts including aluminum, fetal tissue etc. 4) multiple vaccines in one MMR, DPTa The dangers are not just autism. Also asthma, ADD, ADHD, seizure disorder, and diabetes. Japan looked at the higher rates of asthma in vaccinated children and decided to wait until kids were two. Guess what? They didn't have children dying on every street corner from vaccine preventable diseases. First rule of medicine is do no harm. The vaccine program has broken that rule. I have an uncle who died at three from whooping cough and a vaccine damaged son. I heartily recommend not to vaccinate. I haven't not vaccinated my younger daughter. Come on. Surely you must have more evidence than your own mistaken belief in BigPHARM and one poorly researched Times article. I suggest you read some of the Drs. Geier research Geier DA, Geier MR. A comparative evaluation of the effects of MMR immunization and mercury doses from thimerosal-containing childhood vaccines on the population prevalence of autism. Med Sci Monit. 2004 Mar;10(3):PI33-9. Epub 2004 Mar 01. PMID: 14976450 [PubMed - in process] 2: Geier DA, Geier MR. An assessment of the impact of thimerosal on childhood neurodevelopmental disorders. Pediatr Rehabil. 2003 Apr-Jun;6(2):97-102. PMID: 14534046 [PubMed - in process] 3: Geier MR, Geier DA. Neurodevelopmental disorders after thimerosal-containing vaccines: a brief communication. Exp Biol Med (Maywood). 2003 Jun;228(6):660-4. PMID: 12773696 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] Vaccinations I'm a new member to this group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 23, 2004 Report Share Posted September 23, 2004 : Great summary! All our decisions evolve around a risk/benefit ratio; we are willing to take action when the benefits outweigth the risks. At one point the vaccination benefits outweigthed the risks of adverse reactions but I don't think that's the case any more. My son had a similar history: he was vaccinated when he was on antibiotics, when he had fever, when he had ear infections. He received the Hep B after a difficult delivery. This is unethical, wrong and as far as I am concern, criminal. Even in underdeveloped countries they make sure that the kid is healthy before administering vaccinations. You will be surprise how many physicians are secrectly not vaccinating their kids. I personally spoke with a Texas Children developmental pediatrician which is advising parents not to vaccinate the siblings of their autistic children. I have MD friends that are not vaccinating after they saw what happened to my son. I wish too I knew all that I know now about the risks associated with vaccines, maybe my life will be different. All these physicians and vaccine experts go home at night to their families and NT children. I go home every night to continue my 24/7 battle against autism. As my husband says, we were truly vaccine advocates at one point and we paid for it. I advocate TRUE informed consent. Show me the data, good and bad, and let me make the decision. Always remember, there are lies, damn lies and statistics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 24, 2004 Report Share Posted September 24, 2004 I apologize if my tone in the previous vaccination post offended. I used to feel somewhat similar to you. But after I read the Simpsonwood transcript (a meeting of the top doctors in the US who are supposed to be watching otu for our children's health and safety) where they candidly discussed the high levels of mercury, the liability of that mistake and where one of the doctors even excused himself from the meeting to have his newly born grandson's vaccinations stopped, I snapped out of it. My disgust has grown over the last two years as I have watched top government officials with large financial interests in big Pharm collude and try to protect those companies, while children get sicker. Health insurance premiums are driven through the roof by the drug costs for chronic conditions, and rising health insurance premiums make foreign labor seem much cheaper. I spoke candidly with a top CDC official about the situation, and he shared that there are many in the CDC who recommended against the IOM report being published when it was, but were overridden by even higher officials from the hill. The problem that is being ignored has the potential to be the straw that breaks the US's back as the baby boomers being to retire and people have to spend their energies caring for multiple sick family members instead of building a better widget. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 24, 2004 Report Share Posted September 24, 2004 I apologize if my tone in the previous vaccination post offended. I used to feel somewhat similar to you. But after I read the Simpsonwood transcript (a meeting of the top doctors in the US who are supposed to be watching otu for our children's health and safety) where they candidly discussed the high levels of mercury, the liability of that mistake and where one of the doctors even excused himself from the meeting to have his newly born grandson's vaccinations stopped, I snapped out of it. My disgust has grown over the last two years as I have watched top government officials with large financial interests in big Pharm collude and try to protect those companies, while children get sicker. Health insurance premiums are driven through the roof by the drug costs for chronic conditions, and rising health insurance premiums make foreign labor seem much cheaper. I spoke candidly with a top CDC official about the situation, and he shared that there are many in the CDC who recommended against the IOM report being published when it was, but were overridden by even higher officials from the hill. The problem that is being ignored has the potential to be the straw that breaks the US's back as the baby boomers being to retire and people have to spend their energies caring for multiple sick family members instead of building a better widget. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 24, 2004 Report Share Posted September 24, 2004 In a message dated 9/23/2004 11:32:53 AM Central Daylight Time, jdsk1198@... writes: She said that since that article was published, 2 more of the doctors recanted as well. She went on to say that the one remaining doctor from the original study that's still saying it might be a cause gets most of his financial backing for research from the anti-mercury lobby. My post: Who the heck is the anti-mercury lobby? That must be us. Like we have more money than the pharmaceutical companies? PLEASE. The reason our kids get shafted so much is because we don't have a good lobby. We are all too broke and too busy dealing with our kids. This Doctor needs to get a clue about the real world. Just my .02 cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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