Re: suppliers/ blog on Scrooges

[Guest guest]

I just corrected the Watt story on my blog, which I had mixed

up due to fuzzy memory. He told me about this years ago, and I

simplified it. Turns out it's worse than I originally wrote:

>You got the report on me wrong. The lavender issue was I was told by a

>supplier of real lavender in the UK, that when his friend visited this

>factory in France, what was in the backyard were barrels of ho leaf oil

>for the linalool content, as well as the chemical that converts linalool

>into linalyl acetate. That means perfectly genuine lavender was going

>in the front door and tourists saw that distilled. What they got in

>their little bottles though was a different ballgame. Yet these

>tourists would swear blind that they " saw the lavender distilled so they

>knew the oil was genuine " .

Anya McCoy

Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

Natural Perfumers Community Group

/

[Guest guest]

Just heard from the fellow on the POL forum who got the bunk LBA. We

had just discussed this supplier here last week, including the

incredible waffle she writes on her site, supposedly " exquisite oils "

that heck, may or may not be authentic:

>QUALITY WARNING: This is a lovely Linden Blossom Absolute. One

>fairly prominent essential oil chemist asked me for a sample because

>he had heard we had a nice one, and he's researching Linden. He

>called me back saying it was a stunning specimen. BUT-- at least two

>other essential oil chemists have recently said publicly, on some

>mailing lists that I participate in, that there is NO authentic

>Linden Blossom Absolute being produced today. So...I don't know. I

>am attempting to trace down the truth about this lovely absolute,

>but so far have not been able to. The bottom line is, I do NOT know

>whether this Linden Blossom is what it is supposed to be. I can not

>offer our standard guarantee of purity for it. Yet I don't want to

>take it out of our catalogue because so many of our clients love it.

>So I'm just posting this caveat to let you know it may or may not be

>authentic.

So she sells it at horribly inflated prices. Terrible ethics!

The other seller I mention on the blog with the " sambac " issues who

was also selling bunk LBA to blending group members and their

clueless organizer has taken the stuff off her website in the past

week...amazing results, there is power in numbers. <sarcasm> It's

only been up there for almost two years after it was exposed as being

fake. She and the " exquisite " supplier often do buys together, as

noted on my blog, and well, ...it's a minefield out there, as noted.

Many are asking to establish a " black list " of suppliers. I won't get

involved with that. If someone else wants to do it, so be it.

Something about a rating and review system. I think things can be

too fluid, and change too quickly.

A great supplier may get in one bunk oil by mistake and get smeared

for it, and have trouble with the people " rating " him. It's the

repeat offenders, the blatantly careless/clueless/thieving ones that

are the real problem. We have many great suppliers out there, and we

discuss them here. If one of them got a fake oil in by mistake,

having known them for years, I truly feel they would immediately take

care of the problem.

If someone wants to start a separate group to vet suppliers, they can

do it. The track I like to take here is for newbies - and more

experienced folks, too - to discuss stuff here, in private. That

means that the lurkers who are friends with the bunko artists,

despite their protests that they want nothing to do with this group,

still take posts here and freak out elsewhere, get a clue and realize

that the bigger community at large is starting to really police

itself. Tough words, but they keep promoting two of the worst

offenders because I've banned them from this group, sticking

together. Two of the bunkos used to be members here. I won't allow

anyone to post links to their sites for that reason. It's a shame

their inclusion in another small group allows them to keep selling to

the trade, the newbies, those who do not know of the many times

they've been caught selling junk.

About reporting on the bunkos: we don't have the system down

perfectly yet, so we discuss it in this *private* group. Private is

the key word. The posts here are only for here, we have it in the

welcoming statement that if you take the posts outside the group to

stir trouble, you get booted. The sneaky few (less that six) have

been reported back to me by friends who see their complaints about

our discussions on the bunko artists. Well, let them do what they

will, it's a free world, but we have the numbers, the great

communication, and the willingness to help each other obtain great

oils, not ignore warnings because we're buddies with con artists.

I'm so proud and happy that Watt, esteemed for his stubborn

refusal to allow safety or con issues get by without comment, posted

on my blog. He knows all the bunkos I've mentioned there, plus many

more. He's been fighting the good fight for years, and take his words

to heart - and head - and don't let yourself get scammed.

Anya McCoy

Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

Natural Perfumers Community Group

/

[Guest guest]

>

> About reporting on the bunkos: we don't have the system down

> perfectly yet, so we discuss it in this *private* group. Private

is

> the key word. The posts here are only for here, we have it in the

> welcoming statement that if you take the posts outside the group

to

> stir trouble, you get booted. The sneaky few (less that six) have

> been reported back to me by friends who see their complaints about

> our discussions on the bunko artists. Well, let them do what they

> will, it's a free world, but we have the numbers, the great

> communication, and the willingness to help each other obtain great

> oils, not ignore warnings because we're buddies with con artists.

>

> I'm so proud and happy that Watt, esteemed for his stubborn

> refusal to allow safety or con issues get by without comment,

posted

> on my blog. He knows all the bunkos I've mentioned there, plus

many

> more. He's been fighting the good fight for years, and take his

words

> to heart - and head - and don't let yourself get scammed.

>

>

> Anya McCoy

> Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

> Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

> Natural Perfumers Community Group

> /

>

I'm wondering.... the two con-artists you keep referring to, how

come they can't be mentioned by name inside the group? Seems to me

those are clearly someone to NOT do business with. Is it because

they have friends here?

Seems to me there is plenty of reason to weed them out, since they

are violating not only ethical rules of confidence, but they are

clearly stated in writing.

You mentioned these so many times now, I'm really curious LOL. But

that's O.K. I'll get over it.

The comment by SBH was me. I might have exaturated just a little,

since you mentioned you expected opposition. I still think it's a

good idea. If someone makes a mistake and corrects it, rating would

not be an issue. If someone gets 97 out of 100 positive, that's

still not bad. Just like 100 positive for someone that's only been

in business a couple of months is not necessarily all good. It's all

relative.

Was just a thought. Yes, NP is still the best place to learn about

great companies

I'm not really interested in " Blacklists " I think if we focus on

taking all the business to the good companies, it will have a

default consequence for the others.

Focusing on the positive is always a better choice (without ignoring

the rest)

Thanks, ne

[Guest guest]

I'm not really interested in " Blacklists " I think if we focus on

taking all the business to the good companies, it will have a

default consequence for the others.

Focusing on the positive is always a better choice (without ignoring

the rest)

Thanks, ne

Hi ne and all

Having a half full glass rather than half empty is good......

A small list that could change perhaps for just the NP private group to steer

them in the right direction...... altho Anya has just posted that she doesn't

want to do that

I don't really know what the answer is than just keep talking about good stuff

when you receive it and let everyone know....

This is so important for everyone.... we need to look out for everyones back

and keep the wagons circled.

best

Janita haan

Ascent

www.hayspace.co.uk

---------------------------------

The all-new goes wherever you go - free your email address from

your Internet provider.

[Guest guest]

--- janita morris <heartinmymouth@...> wrote:

> I'm not really interested in " Blacklists " I think

> if we focus on

> taking all the business to the good companies, it

> will have a

> default consequence for the others.

> Focusing on the positive is always a better choice

> (without ignoring

> the rest)

>

> Thanks, ne

>

***************************************************

Noooooo " Blacklists " . For the reasons ne lists

above. And also, it could lead to a lawsuit. Saying

you had a bad experience with a supplier is one thing.

But it's altogether a different animal when it gets

into using a large group like this to ruin someone's

business.In legal terms it's called Restraint of

Trade. Possibly even Libel.

-Patty

________________________________________________________________________________\

____

Any questions? Get answers on any topic at www.Answers.. Try it now.

[Guest guest]

At 11:59 AM 12/11/2006, you wrote:

>Noooooo " Blacklists " . In legal terms it's called Restraint of

>Trade. Possibly even Libel.

Hi Patty:

I forget who originally suggested the blacklist, but they were

probably new to the field, and perhaps even naive about legal

matters. Actually, I think there were several.

In this private group, we can talk about who has scrooged us in the

past, and that is permissable (checked with a long time ago

about that). Someone who was kicked off here last year for crazy

behavior (management nightmare) trashed me and this group just last

week, calling us nasty and political (truly, words that describe her,

lol) on another forum that is not private, someone there reported

her, her remarks got deleted. A longtime member of this group was

praising us there (and we had about a dozen members join) and she

tried to poison the water, er, soap as it were. ;-)

Another forum deleted ALL her comments last year when she went

ballistic (not just about me, she's got a hate on for a lot of

stuff/people). Since the comments on those forums were able to be

googled, etc., they had to protect the site. Stuff here can't be

googled, that's the big difference.

Patty, libel issues are tricky. Blogs exist that trash everyone from

the president to the pope to the local dogcatcher. I'm not interested

in a blacklist for a lot of reasons. A supplier may make an honest

mistake, get on the blacklist, then how does he/her get off? I like

the fluid, evolving talk here, where we can report and report *back*

when something is corrected.

There are obsessive, angry people that always trash others on their

blogs and forums, and we haven't had that happen here, and when it

starts, I and the mods stop it. We want this to stay friendly and

helpful, and i hope it shows.

Anya McCoy

Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

Natural Perfumers Community Group

/

[Guest guest]

>

> There are obsessive, angry people that always trash others on their

> blogs and forums, and we haven't had that happen here, and when it

> starts, I and the mods stop it. We want this to stay friendly and

> helpful, and i hope it shows.

>

yes it shows. i have been pleased here.

i also have been super busy and have had to delete alot of posts

instead of reading them fully, grrrr....i will be less busy after

valentine's day!

xoxoxo

Libbbbbbbbbbby

[Guest guest]

West <tribalpatty@...> wrote:

--- janita morris wrote:

> I'm not really interested in " Blacklists " I think

> if we focus on

> taking all the business to the good companies, it

> will have a

> default consequence for the others.

> Focusing on the positive is always a better choice

> (without ignoring

> the rest)

>

> Thanks, ne

>

***************************************************

Noooooo " Blacklists " . For the reasons ne lists

above. And also, it could lead to a lawsuit. Saying

you had a bad experience with a supplier is one thing.

But it's altogether a different animal when it gets

into using a large group like this to ruin someone's

business.In legal terms it's called Restraint of

Trade. Possibly even Libel.

-Patty

Hi guys..... clarification... here looks like I am suggesting a black list by

the answer to the above...... my overview is half full approach rather than half

empty... talking about good supplier that one may have and avoiding saying

anything about the negative ones..... sorry just do not want any

misrepresentation...

thanks

Janita

---------------------------------

Try the all-new . " The New Version is radically easier to use " –

The Wall Street Journal

[Guest guest]

Libby <libby@...> wrote:

yes it shows. i have been pleased here.

i also have been super busy and have had to delete alot of posts

instead of reading them fully, grrrr....i will be less busy after

valentine's day!

xoxoxo

Libbbbbbbbbbby

Hi Libby

am impressed....... I am a hoarder!!! I keep all my messages.... apart from

obvious ads or trash. To date I am up now to nearly 1800..........shame

faced...........but when I need something......

Janita

Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.

[Guest guest]

On Dec 11, 2006, at 12:09 PM, janita morris wrote:

>

>

> Libby <libby@...> wrote:

>

>

> yes it shows. i have been pleased here.

> i also have been super busy and have had to delete alot of posts

> instead of reading them fully, grrrr....i will be less busy after

> valentine's day!

>

> xoxoxo

>

> Libbbbbbbbbbby

>

>

> Hi Libby

> am impressed....... I am a hoarder!!! I keep all my messages....

> apart from obvious ads or trash. To date I am up now to nearly

> 1800..........shame faced...........but when I need something......

>

> Janita

>

oh janita, i have over 4000 in my inbox.....

yikes, delete delete

xoxoxo

L

also, i got so inspired by R Tisserands Birthday description of lime

trees that when i was in big sur i photographed some lemon trees that

i love and have been making some lemon concoctions for my baths...

i love a cedarwood, rosewood lemon and cypress blend. i call it grove

of the goddess....

ok, i know this is gonna bring out the haters about the rosewood

thing but i have tow 16 ounce bottles from 1994 and i savor them

slowly and carefully, and they are aging gracefully in dark cupboard

where they are safe~!

xoxoxo

L