Re: Natural honeysuckle and hyacinth? No....

[Guest guest]

>

> Hi

>

> I've never seen these absolutes for sale, only synthetics. Do you

> have the

> GC/MS for these aromatics? I'd hate to think you were selling these,

> thinking they're natural, and they're really petrochemicals.

> Granted, there

> may be some boutique manufacturers tucked away in corners of the world

> producing them for fun -- and profit, but they would be very

> labor-intensive and very hard to extract, so the price you're

> offering them

> at is a giveaway as to their synth origins.

>

>

what is the price Anya?

i pay almost $10,000 for 16 ounces.

HONEYSUCKLE ABSOLUTE

(Lonicera Caprifolium)

France (SE) / Flower / Conventional

Item # E192W....................02 oz. - $16.50

Item # E192A..................1/12 oz. - $68.00

Item # E192B....................1/8 oz. - $89.00

Item # E192C..................1/4 oz. - $163.00

Item # E192D..................1/2 oz. - $304.00

Item # E192E.....................1 oz. - $575.00

from:http://www.quintoils.com/pages/essentialoilblendspages/

essentialoilshj.html

and i have asked them many times:::is this really real?

they always say yes..

i have not seen a GC on this.

i love it though, and always use it happily

xoxxo

L

[Guest guest]

> > Hi

> >

> > I've never seen these absolutes for sale, only synthetics. Do you

> > have the

> > GC/MS for these aromatics? I'd hate to think you were selling these,

> > thinking they're natural, and they're really petrochemicals.

> > Granted, there

> > may be some boutique manufacturers tucked away in corners of the world

> > producing them for fun -- and profit, but they would be very

> > labor-intensive and very hard to extract, so the price you're

> > offering them

> > at is a giveaway as to their synth origins.

> >

> >

> what is the price Anya?

> i pay almost $10,000 for 16 ounces.

>

> HONEYSUCKLE ABSOLUTE

> (Lonicera Caprifolium)

> France (SE) / Flower / Conventional

> Item # E192W....................02 oz. - $16.50

> Item # E192A..................1/12 oz. - $68.00

> Item # E192B....................1/8 oz. - $89.00

> Item # E192C..................1/4 oz. - $163.00

> Item # E192D..................1/2 oz. - $304.00

> Item # E192E.....................1 oz. - $575.00

>

> from:http://www.quintoils.com/pages/essentialoilblendspages/

> essentialoilshj.html

>

> and i have asked them many times:::is this really real?

>

> they always say yes..

> i have not seen a GC on this.

> i love it though, and always use it happily

> L

>

I had not seen Quintessential Oils before. They have an interesting selection of

oils,

absolutes and attars, but their prices - ouch! You can get top quality from

other sources

for much less. White Lotus attars, for instance, are about 50% of these prices

for the same

quantity.

Is the honeysuckle natural? It certainly costs enough, and QO undoubtedly

believe it is.

Purported natural absolutes of honeysuckle, gardenia and hyacinth periodically

surface,

often for brief periods. Arctander (in 1960) wrote: " ..present extraction

methods are

imperfect, and it is very likely that the available honeysuckle absolutes are

" compounded "

from natural and synthetic perfume materials. " Tony Burfield, writing in 2000,

seems to

believe that a genuine honeysuckle absolute exists.

The distinction between naturals and synthetics is not as clear as we might like

to believe.

Many absolutes, especially those coming out of Grasse (and being re-sold in the

US) are

largely natural, but have been " compounded " , " manipulated " or, to call a spade a

spade

adulterated, often with a combination of natural and synthetic materials.

QO also list an apricot " alcohol extract " - is anyone familiar with this? Is it

natural? Sounds

intriguing..

Tisserand

[Guest guest]

--- ambientgravity33 <tisserand@...> wrote:

>

> QO also list an apricot " alcohol extract " - is

> anyone familiar with this? Is it natural? Sounds

> intriguing..

>

> Tisserand

Hi ,

I get an apricot extract in alcohol from Prima Fleur

in San , CA. It's the real deal. I assume their

supplier simply tinctures the apricots into the

alcohol.I haven't used it a lot in perfumery, but it

did go nicely in a light floral/citrus blend that I

made. It's also good in tea. I think they also have a

version in oil too.

-Patty

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

> The distinction between naturals and synthetics is not as clear as

> we might like to believe.

> Many absolutes, especially those coming out of Grasse (and being re-

> sold in the US) are

> largely natural, but have been " compounded " , " manipulated " or, to

> call a spade a spade

> adulterated, often with a combination of natural and synthetic

> materials.

>

> QO also list an apricot " alcohol extract " - is anyone familiar with

> this? Is it natural? Sounds

> intriguing..

>

> Tisserand

well......i had read this type of thing before..and i have used QO

for years for certain things.

hard to get things.

i like supporting these women, because they are in my area.

but anyone knowing of a source for these hard to find items, let me

know.

xoxxo

L

[Guest guest]

> > QO also list an apricot " alcohol extract " - is

> > anyone familiar with this? Is it natural? Sounds

> > intriguing..

> >

> > Tisserand

>

> Hi ,

>

> I get an apricot extract in alcohol from Prima Fleur

> in San , CA. It's the real deal. I assume their

> supplier simply tinctures the apricots into the

> alcohol.I haven't used it a lot in perfumery, but it

> did go nicely in a light floral/citrus blend that I

> made. It's also good in tea. I think they also have a

> version in oil too.

>

> -Patty

>

Thanks for this Patty - I didn't realize Prima Fleur were still in business.

This is surely the

same apricot tincture offered by Quintessential, and maybe is the apricot note

Ayala refers

to in some of her fragrances. Anyhow, it's going on my shopping list!

Tisserand

[Guest guest]

--- ambientgravity33 <tisserand@...> wrote:

> > > Hi

> > > I've never seen these absolutes for sale, only

> synthetics. > > what is the price Anya?

> > i pay almost $10,000 for 16 ounces.

>

> > HONEYSUCKLE ABSOLUTE

> > (Lonicera Caprifolium) > I had not seen

Quintessential Oils before. They have> an interesting selection of oils, >

absolutes and attars, > Is the honeysuckle natural? It certainly costs> enough,

> QO also list an apricot " alcohol extract "

- is> anyone familiar with this? Is it natural? Sounds

> intriguing..

>

> Tisserand

Hello

Distinguished fellows

I actually took dried honeysuckle flowers and made an

infusion for later inclusion. I am sure the fresh

flower would infuse or tincture with a better smell.

SO...........................

BB

[Guest guest]

At 11:21 AM 9/8/2006, you wrote:

Read below for a follow-up to my post of the 8th:

>Posted this to a person who calls himself the fragrant alchemist...he

>should know better.

>

>Hi

>

>I've never seen these absolutes for sale, only synthetics. Do you have the

>GC/MS for these aromatics? I'd hate to think you were selling these,

>thinking they're natural, and they're really petrochemicals. Granted, there

>may be some boutique manufacturers tucked away in corners of the world

>producing them for fun -- and profit, but they would be very

>labor-intensive and very hard to extract, so the price you're offering them

>at is a giveaway as to their synth origins.

Got a reply today:

>Dear Anya,

>

>They were natural, however we do not carry them any more. I will have to

>check our website to see where they are still listed.

>

>Sorry for the mistake.

>

>Best wishes,

>Cassandra

>

>Website: http://www.naturalalchemist.com

>Email: enquiries@...

>

>Suppliers of The Natural Alchemist's range of natural skin care,

>hair care and essential oils, and AcuEnergetics Clinic.

Okey dokey ;-) Wish she would share their former supplier! LOL.

Anya

http://anyasgarden.com/perfumes.htm Parfums Natural

http://artisannaturalperfumers.com The Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild

http://.com The Premier Natural Perfume Site Gateway

[Guest guest]

Anya <mccoy@...> wrote: At 11:21 AM 9/8/2006, you wrote:

>

>Hi

>

>I've never seen these absolutes for sale, only synthetics. Do you have the

>GC/MS for these aromatics?>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Granted, there

>may be some boutique manufacturers tucked away in corners of the world

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

Got a reply today:

>Dear Anya,

>

>They were natural, however we do not carry them any more. I will have to

>check our website to see where they are still listed.

>

>Sorry for the mistake.

>

>Best wishes,

>Cassandra

>

>Website: http://www.naturalalchemist.com

>Email: enquiries@...

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Okey dokey ;-) Wish she would share their former supplier! LOL.

Anya

[Guest guest]

> Okey dokey ;-) Wish she would share their former

> supplier! LOL.

>

>

Anya,

I don't know if this is of interest to you but I've

seen these two absolutes listed on several European

sites. Here is one link:

http://www.panspantry.co.uk/essentialoils.html

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> .

> Looking through the the site that offers the benzoin alcohol in

> Aus..... in the rare oils section they have

> honeysuckle............and offering GM analysis forms.....

> interesting...............Anya .........

> janita

>

>

>

> do any sites that any of you buy from offer a GC free before

> purchase?

if so, i would love to start us establishing a list of them to force

over time the rest of the suppliers to do so.

i do not buy in large enough quantities to afford a GC everytime i

buy, as i stock over a hundred different resins, absolutes and eo's/

anyone? i just thought of this and it makes sense that as natural

perfume gains in popularity the masses will follow suit with

education, right?

well, let me know if anyone has any ideas here....

xoxoxo

as always,

L

[Guest guest]

Libby <libby@...> wrote:

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> .

> Looking through the the site that offers the benzoin alcohol in

> Aus..... in the rare oils section they have

> honeysuckle............and offering GM analysis forms.....

> interesting...............Anya .........

> janita

>

>

>

> do any sites that any of you buy from offer a GC free before

> purchase?

if so, i would love to start us establishing a list of them to force

over time the rest of the suppliers to do so.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

xoxoxo

as always,

L

Hi Libby

I think they were charging to customers @ $2.50 but check them out...... as I

am only saying off the top of my head...

janita

---------------------------------

Try the all-new . " The New Version is radically easier to use " –

The Wall Street Journal

[Guest guest]

Libby <libby@...> wrote:

> honeysuckle............and offering GM analysis forms.....

>

> janita

>

>

>

> do any sites that any of you buy from offer a GC free>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

well, let me know if anyone has any ideas here....

xoxoxo

as always,

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.

Hey Libby I have just rechecked the site again (the name keeps escaping

me.....ahimsa? ..... and it is only data sheet for $1.50..........

sorry......would check again for you but have to get on......

regards

janita

---------------------------------

To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new

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[Guest guest]

>

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> .

>

> Hey Libby I have just rechecked the site again (the name keeps

> escaping me.....ahimsa? ..... and it is only data sheet for

> $1.50.......... sorry......would check again for you but have to

> get on......

> regards

> janita

>

>

>

>

are you saying a gas chromatigraph test costs $1.50 each?

i thought these things were $250 per oil?

i used one of these machines in botany classes in college.

thx,

L

[Guest guest]

Do any sites that any of you buy from offer a GC free before

purchase? if so, i would love to start us establishing a list of

them to force over time the rest of the suppliers to do so.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Hi,

As an ex-supplier, I would like to point out that offering a GC

chromatogram with every purchase of oil is simply not practicable on

the tiny quantities of oil that most of us are buying. Matching up

the GC trace to the relevant batch of oil is very time consuming,

and in the end the only thing being forced will be prices, - upwards.

This type of strategy has been tried time and again over the past 20

years and is unlikely to succeed. All that happened over here in the

UK was that a certain number of suppliers began offering fraudulent

GC traces with every purchase to appease those who made demands.

This practice then migrated overseas to Japan where similar demands

were made, and the same thing happened there too.

Fear of being ripped off leads people to believe that a piece of

paper will provide evidence of purity, and this is simply not the

case. The answer is to always buy from a supplier that has been

around for a long time and been recommended by people that you

trust. I have seen very authentic looking GC chromatograms, and had

it not been for an expert advising me otherwise, I would have

believed it to be genuine.

After all, how many of us can interpret the results of a GC

chromatogram?

Just food for thought.

Bev.

P.S - In my experience hyacinth absolute is not incredibly rare, but

real honeysuckle is. And quite possibly you would not get terribly

exited about the fragrance either, since like many absolutes some of

the important higher fractions have not been captured.

[Guest guest]

Do any sites that any of you buy from offer a GC free before

purchase? if so, i would love to start us establishing a list of

them to force over time the rest of the suppliers to do so.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Hi,

As an ex-supplier, I would like to point out that offering a GC

chromatogram with every purchase of oil is simply not practicable on

the tiny quantities of oil that most of us are buying. Matching up

the GC trace to the relevant batch of oil is very time consuming,

and in the end the only thing being forced will be prices, - upwards.

This type of strategy has been tried time and again over the past 20

years and is unlikely to succeed. All that happened over here in the

UK was that a certain number of suppliers began offering fraudulent

GC traces with every purchase to appease those who made demands.

This practice then migrated overseas to Japan where similar demands

were made, and the same thing happened there too.

Fear of being ripped off leads people to believe that a piece of

paper will provide evidence of purity, and this is simply not the

case. The answer is to always buy from a supplier that has been

around for a long time and been recommended by people that you

trust. I have seen very authentic looking GC chromatograms, and had

it not been for an expert advising me otherwise, I would have

believed it to be genuine.

After all, how many of us can interpret the results of a GC

chromatogram?

Just food for thought.

Bev.

P.S - In my experience hyacinth absolute is not incredibly rare, but

real honeysuckle is. And quite possibly you would not get terribly

exited about the fragrance either, since like many absolutes some of

the important higher fractions have not been captured.

[Guest guest]

Libby <libby@...> wrote: >

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

>

>......................>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>non specific text has been removed

>

>

are you saying a gas chromatigraph test costs $1.50 each?

i thought these things were $250 per oil?

thx,

L

Hey L

Here is the website www.ahimsaoils.com.au

In their statement in the rare oils they say " All the oils discussed below are

either 100% pure or floral abs. Although rare and often undocumented with the

popular press, each of the oils oulined is documented with specialist literature

and research "

Well I suppose that could mean anything..... many specialist books outline and

document rare oils give their components etc.......

They say and offer their profile sheets @ $1.50 incl GST.

Tried to download Ihimsa info sheets but had trouble...

Have e-mailed them specifically about the honeysuckle and enquired if they

have any relevant documentation to prove its purity.... and of course apologised

if I appeared reticent or suspicious... hope to receive an answer.

regards

Janita

[Guest guest]

Libby <libby@...> wrote: >

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

>

>......................>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>non specific text has been removed

>

>

are you saying a gas chromatigraph test costs $1.50 each?

i thought these things were $250 per oil?

thx,

L

Hey L

Here is the website www.ahimsaoils.com.au

In their statement in the rare oils they say " All the oils discussed below are

either 100% pure or floral abs. Although rare and often undocumented with the

popular press, each of the oils oulined is documented with specialist literature

and research "

Well I suppose that could mean anything..... many specialist books outline and

document rare oils give their components etc.......

They say and offer their profile sheets @ $1.50 incl GST.

Tried to download Ihimsa info sheets but had trouble...

Have e-mailed them specifically about the honeysuckle and enquired if they

have any relevant documentation to prove its purity.... and of course apologised

if I appeared reticent or suspicious... hope to receive an answer.

regards

Janita