Re: OT: Article in O Magazine

[Guest guest]

At 07:55 PM 10/15/2006, you wrote:

>Hi Everyone,

>

>Has anyone read the new article in the latest issue of O magazine?

>Chandler Burr wrote the article featuring three or four perfumers. He

>basically insults people that are into natural perfumery. One of the

>perfumers he features calls herself as a reformed natural

>perfumer. " She has now seen the light " . What is with this guy? If he

>likes synthetic perfume, fine, great, drown yourself in it for all I

>care. Why does he seem so hell bent on publicly insulting people who

>are into naturals. It just seems so weird that he seems so obessed

>with this. Who is paying him off? Sorry this post is so long.

Hi Liz

Your post isn't too long, not at all. It's something we all need to

be aware of, since Mr. Burr has issued " warnings " to natural

perfumers about his leanings. For some reason, those who like synths,

him and a number of those learning to be perfumers, feel the need to

bash us. We've been tolerant of them in the past on this group, but

the constant snide belitting of our efforts, and the horrendous

private emails I've had to read from these men (and one woman) show

they are basically very insecure, IMO.

Why else not leave folks alone who are happily pursuing their art?

Why try to impose their opinions on us? They're threatened. Burr has

very little understanding of naturals, and he and other writers have

expressed concern and fear that they're " too complex " to blend with, LOL!

I believe a perfumista on the POL forum summed it up, while not

giving an answer: Burr and his ilk are bullies trying for restraint

of trade..wait, let me try to find the post...

....here's the thread, and the particular quote I'm referencing is below it:

http://perfumeoflife.org/index.php?showtopic=10653 & hl=burr

>All very good points, FTR. The only rejoinder I'd make is that if

>your business relies on a select market, then you don't have much of

>a margin to cushion losing any of it. The perfume business is all

>about selling image, and if you promote the idea that natural

>perfumes are inferior, overpriced, and generally uncool, then you're

>going to pull away some portion of that small customer base. The

>segment of the mass market that gets siphoned off to the naturals is

>just a fly speck to the big corporations, but when the defections

>flow the other way, it really hurts the little guys. That's why it

>kind of gets my back up to see a writer and a paper with so much

>style clout go out of their way to diss the naturals.

Talk amongst yourselves ;-)

Looks like time for a nice letter from the ANPG to O magazine. Liz,

I'm going to post your message to the POL forum, since nobody there

has seen the mag yet, I suppose. It's an independent forum -- they

only care if a perfume smells good or not. Some have bashed naturals

in the past, but lightly. Mostly they don't like the lack of sillage.

Be aware, however, many there do love natural perfumes and our Ayala

is very active there, and her perfumes are very respected and loved there.

Burr does have an agenda, and it seems like Luca's tired old agenda,

which Luca himself has dropped, I believe, or at least softened on.

Anya McCoy

Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

Natural Perfumers Chat Group

/

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[Guest guest]

--- Anya <mccoy@...> wrote:

> At 07:55 PM 10/15/2006, you wrote:

>

> >Hi Everyone,

> >

> >Has anyone read the new article in the latest issue

> of O magazine?

> >Chandler Burr wrote the article featuring three or

> four perfumers. He

> >basically insults people that are into natural

> perfumery. Why does he seem so hell bent on

publicly

> insulting people who

> >are into naturals. It just seems so weird that he

> seems so obessed

> >with this. Who is paying him off? Sorry this post

> is so long.

>

> Why else not leave folks alone who are happily

> pursuing their art?

> Why try to impose their opinions on us? They're

> threatened.

>

> I believe a perfumista on the POL forum summed it

> up, while not

> giving an answer: Burr and his ilk are bullies

> trying for restraint

> of trade..

>

I read this thread a while ago when Anya directed me

to the POL group and I was very impressed with this

post. But I actually do think that it is logical for

mainstream perfumers to feel threatened by natural

perfumers. It is true that natural perfume is on the

fringe right now and is a very tiny part of the

perfume market. But there is a general trend in our

society, and there has been for a very long time, of

going back to artisanal, higher quality, more natural,

more " real " products.

For, instance, when I was a kid everyone ate squishy,

plasticy white bread. Even a baguette was just a

longer version of the same bread. Now there are

several artisan bread bakeries in each major city all

competing for the highest quality baguette. People

will pay a lot of money for these breads. The same

applies to natural food stores. When I was a kid,

natural foods were for hippies like my mom. Now we

have Whole Foods which is huge and for everyone who

can afford it.

This trend of looking to the past for higher quality

things applies to almost everything. Almost everyone

with a little money to spare wants things like wood

floors and natural fiber clothing and real chocolate

truffles (as opposed to Hershey bars). The big

perfume companies can see that this change could apply

to them too eventually and they realize they are

unprepared to produce natural perfumes on a large

scale so they are nervous and they are fighting.

Their defense right now is to try to make NPers look

like hyped up aromatherapists (and I have great

respect for aromatherapists but this is just a

different art!) I can't predict what will happen but

I can see why they are concerned.

Sorry to rant and rave, everyone! I'm a little tired

and cranky!

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

On Oct 15, 2006, at 8:17 PM, Glazer wrote:

>

>

> --- But there is a general trend in our

> society, and there has been for a very long time, of

> going back to artisanal, higher quality, more natural,

> more " real " products.

>

>

>

>

>

> __________________________________________________

I think you are very right julia. further more, it is imperative

that the synth based be bashing us. if for no other reason than the

fact that if the public discovers they are paying a fortune for synth

product that cost pennies to make they may be a bit upset. we are

educating the public about natural sources for perfumes, something

that has fallen out of the cultural educational arena, and we have

the audacity to be reviving this bit of knowledge. we represent a

huge threat to the industry, if the word really gets out. so they

are being very pre-emptive in discouraging anyone from learning about

how they are being ripped off, not to mention having their health

threatened, all in the name of money.

for me, it is very encouraging to have this kind of attention, it

shows we are having an effect, a positive effect. otherwise we would

be getting completely ignored. remember einstein's wisdom " great

spirits will always be met with violent opposition by mediocre

minds " . and thank you so much to anya, mandy, and all of those that

are rising to the occasions and pursuing the education that is so

necessary to advance our position.

breathe in health

maggi

[Guest guest]

-- Re: OT: Article in O Magazine

--- Anya <mccoy@...> wrote:

> At 07:55 PM 10/15/2006, you wrote:

>

> >Hi Everyone,

> >

> >Has anyone read the new article in the latest issue

> of O magazine?

> >Chandler Burr wrote the article featuring three or

> four perfumers. He

> >basically insults people that are into natural

> perfumery. Why does he seem so hell bent on

publicly

Hi .

I think it is a case of discredit them before they can

discredit you!!

He is trying to protect the industry that " Gives him his living " & also

these articles give him a lot of free publicity!!

On the positive side (remember I am a Virgo ) It means the fragrance

industry can not dismiss Naturalists any more.

So they are taking us to task, sad but their is a lot at stake, If you think

about the expansion of all us little one man bands it is phenomenal, He

appears to be trying to put a spoke in our wheels before we all form full

orchestras!! As if that happens the perfume industry will have to return in

part to naturalism, & that will cost them major amounts of money.

If he bothers you so much get a picture of him pin it on a dart board &

throw darts at it, great stress & anger reliver, next best thing to a voodoo

doll, but causes no damage so no Karmic come back!.

Love & Light Gill.

[Guest guest]

>>>>>>>>>>>>non text etc

>

>

> Why else not leave folks alone who are happily

> pursuing their art? `````````````````````````````````````

`¬¬¬>¬¬¬¬¬``````````````````````````

> up, while not

> giving an answer: Burr and his ilk are bullies

> trying for restraint

>>>>>>>>>>>>>

unprepared to produce natural perfumes on a large

scale so they are nervous and they are fighting. ````

>>>>>>>>>

Hi Anya and everyone

Y'know.........it is all about money money money....... aware that since the

30's when they discovered they could headspace components of a plant and

reproduce it on the lab benches for an infentessimal amount the perfume houses

have been collating an absolute fortune. A move back toward the naturals means

their profit margins go out the window!!!

Janita.....

believe it or not I am taking off the grubbins below:

Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.

[Guest guest]

At 11:17 PM 10/15/2006, you wrote:change could apply

>to them too eventually and they realize they are

>unprepared to produce natural perfumes on a large

>scale so they are nervous and they are fighting.

Hi

Many of us have discussed this for years, before Burr ever came on

the scene. What is obvious now is that he's a tool of the synth

perfume industry. To wit:

In June he attacks Mandy at a panel discussion for naturals, to the

point, the moderator from the Fragrance Foundation ends the audience

questioning segment.

In August the NYT article appears.

In Sept he bashes naturals out of the blue in

http://www.perfumecritic.com/blog/_archives/2006/9/21/2346329.html

Now O magazine, where he should be just writing on women perfumers, a

great theme, he agains inserts anti-natural sentiment.

What a wazoo, he makes me laugh. Pretty soon his agenda will become

clear to all.

When you look at a strong, active group like this, Mandy's milestone

in NYC this week at Bendels, the fact that major magazines like

Natural Health and Body + Soul are writing positive things about

natural perfumery all in the course of a few months, the momentum is

growing for us.

The fun part I keep in mind is that his agenda will have an

unexpected result (to him). It will get the term natural perfumery

out to the masses who have never heard about it, and a percentage of

them will be interested enough to pursue tracking down some natural

perfumes, much as whole wheat bread and organics have become

mainstream, because there was a pent up demand for it. Just had to

get out there.

Thanks, Chandler!

Anya McCoy

Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

Natural Perfumers Chat Group

/

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[Guest guest]

>

> Your post isn't too long, not at all. It's something we all need to

> be aware of, since Mr. Burr has issued " warnings " to natural

> perfumers about his leanings. For some reason, those who like synths,

> him and a number of those learning to be perfumers, feel the need to

> bash us. We've been tolerant of them in the past on this group, but

> the constant snide belitting of our efforts, and the horrendous

> private emails I've had to read from these men (and one woman) show

> they are basically very insecure, IMO.

>

> Why else not leave folks alone who are happily pursuing their art?

> Why try to impose their opinions on us? They're threatened. Burr has

> very little understanding of naturals, and he and other writers have

> expressed concern and fear that they're " too complex " to blend with,

LOL!

>

> I believe a perfumista on the POL forum summed it up, while not

> giving an answer: Burr and his ilk are bullies trying for restraint

> of trade..wait, let me try to find the post...

>

> Burr does have an agenda, and it seems like Luca's tired old agenda,

> which Luca himself has dropped, I believe, or at least softened on.

>

> Anya McCoy

> Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

> Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

> Natural Perfumers Chat Group

> /

>

You know, it's funny, reading this fiercely sided issue, I have to think

" religion " and " politics' -subjects that are often not discussable,

reasons for nations to wage war. And natural vs synths seems to be the

third in the list.

Maybe this is upsetting, but maybe it is a compliment. Obviously it's

HUGE, and as small as it is at this point, the potential is

unimaginable, since it involves the masses siding, which means money and

money means power....

Yes, it makes perfect sense that some people will wage war, even on

small scale....

But there is no greater Blessing then being dammed by the devil...LOL

take it as a compliment. NP has to be something right on big scale to

get this kind of attention.

ne

[Guest guest]

--- gill <shop@...> wrote:

>

>

> -- Re: OT: Article in O

> Magazine

>

>

> --- Anya <mccoy@...> wrote:

>

> > At 07:55 PM 10/15/2006, you wrote:

> >

> > >Hi Everyone,

> > >

> > >Has anyone read the new article in the latest

> issue

> > of O magazine?

> > >Chandler Burr wrote the article featuring three

> or

> > four perfumers. He

> > >basically insults people that are into natural

> > perfumery. Why does he seem so hell bent on

> publicly

>

>

> Hi .

> I think it is a case of discredit them

> before they can

> discredit you!!

>

> He is trying to protect the industry that " Gives

> him his living " & also

> these articles give him a lot of free publicity!!

>

> On the positive side (remember I am a Virgo ) It

> means the fragrance

> industry can not dismiss Naturalists any more.

>

> So they are taking us to task, sad but their is a

> lot at stake, If you think

> about the expansion of all us little one man bands

> it is phenomenal, He

> appears to be trying to put a spoke in our wheels

> before we all form full

> orchestras!! As if that happens the perfume industry

> will have to return in

> part to naturalism, & that will cost them major

> amounts of money.

>

> If he bothers you so much get a picture of him pin

> it on a dart board &

> throw darts at it, great stress & anger reliver,

> next best thing to a voodoo

> doll, but causes no damage so no Karmic come back!.

> Love & Light Gill.

>

Don't worry Gill! I'm not that upset! I won't be

throwing any darts. I really think Anya is right

about the fact that Burr is working against himself

when he keeps pointing out the fact that mainstream

perfumes are mostly synths. The average consumer

doesn't necessarily realize that when a perfume lists

notes of peach, plum, iris, and peony, it doesn't

actually contain any of these things! People may

really be put off when they realize they are spraying

themselves with chemical cocktails. I think it's true

that no publicity is bad publicity and Burr is

inadvertently spreading the word!

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Is there an online link to this article? I cound not find it on the O magazine

website. Thank you, (lurker, lol)

[Guest guest]

> > --- But there is a general trend in our

> > society, and there has been for a very long time, of

> > going back to artisanal, higher quality, more natural,

> > more " real " products.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> I think you are very right julia. further more, it is imperative

> that the synth based be bashing us. if for no other reason than the

> fact that if the public discovers they are paying a fortune for synth

> product that cost pennies to make they may be a bit upset.

I love the understatement in this - " may be a bit upset " !

> we are educating the public about natural sources for perfumes, something

> that has fallen out of the cultural educational arena, and we have

> the audacity to be reviving this bit of knowledge. we represent a

> huge threat to the industry

I agree that there is very real fear in the industry. A couple of years ago I

wrote to a

French-based company with an interest in both natural and synthetic raw

materials

suggesting that there was a significant difference in environmental impact

between

naturals and synthetics (mostly petroleum derived, multi-stage processing

etc..), and

inviting them to comment. However, the written response I received had way more

words,

and way more decibels, than I had expected. Strident paranoia I would say.

Also look out for the counter-argument that we are raping the earth of precious

and

fragile flora - not totally untrue, but who is really damaging the planet most?

> so they are being very pre-emptive in discouraging anyone from learning about

> how they are being ripped off, not to mention having their health

> threatened, all in the name of money.

> for me, it is very encouraging to have this kind of attention, it

> shows we are having an effect, a positive effect. otherwise we would

> be getting completely ignored. remember einstein's wisdom " great

> spirits will always be met with violent opposition by mediocre

> minds " .

Ignoring us would be a better policy on their part if we were an insignificant

threat, but it

seems they can no longer afford the luxury of ignoring us. I'm not sure that

it's in anyone's

interest to have a *them* and *us* situation, but we seem to be heading that

way.

> and thank you so much to anya, mandy, and all of those that

> are rising to the occasions and pursuing the education that is so

> necessary to advance our position.

>

> breathe in health

> maggi

>

Yes, and we may easily find ourselves in confrontational situations in future,

so great to

have this opportunity for discussion.

Tisserand

[Guest guest]

At 09:54 PM 10/15/2006, you wrote:

>: First of all, your post was so not too long. This coming

>from the master of long posts, ok, well maybe not THE master of long

>posts. There are some here who put me to shame.

> I feel your pain about the " hatin' on the naturals " . Some

> people just have such an issue with anyone who gets into anything

> " natural " or wholistic or whatever. It's weird. I have to go

> through that everytime I read Mens Health. They are the masters

> of " natural hatin' " ! I'm sure they are owned by pharmaceutical

> companies. They are always dismissing any kind of wholistic

> healing as quackery and quick to reccomend drugs for this and that.

>

It's always the most insecure who attack those who want to use

alternative means, . There are even divisions in natural

magazines, I noticed. I get a freebie via mail that is a shill for

the vitamin and herb industry. In a recent article on pain relief,

they had a one-word mention of chiropractic, massage, yoga, etc.,

they just wanted to push supplements. Funny, isn't it?

Anya McCoy

Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

Natural Perfumers Chat Group

/

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[Guest guest]

At 02:42 AM 10/16/2006, you wrote:

> > __________________________________________________

>I think you are very right julia. further more, it is imperative

>that the synth based be bashing us. if for no other reason than the

>fact that if the public discovers they are paying a fortune for synth

>product that cost pennies to make they may be a bit upset. we are

>educating the public about natural sources for perfumes, something

>that has fallen out of the cultural educational arena, and we have

>the audacity to be reviving this bit of knowledge. we represent a

>huge threat to the industry, if the word really gets out. so they

>are being very pre-emptive in discouraging anyone from learning about

>how they are being ripped off, not to mention having their health

>threatened, all in the name of money.

>

>for me, it is very encouraging to have this kind of attention, it

>shows we are having an effect, a positive effect. otherwise we would

>be getting completely ignored. remember einstein's wisdom " great

>spirits will always be met with violent opposition by mediocre

>minds " . and thank you so much to anya, mandy, and all of those that

>are rising to the occasions and pursuing the education that is so

>necessary to advance our position.

Good points, and Maggi. Interesting take on the Burr stuff on

POL: http://perfumeoflife.org/index.php?showtopic=11646 Some take

sides on personalities, others yawn, some flame. Still, almost 500

have viewed it, and they're aware of the synth agenda, and that's all

I care about.

Anya McCoy

Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

Natural Perfumers Chat Group

/

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[Guest guest]

> > >Has anyone read the new article in the latest issue

> > of O magazine?

> > >Chandler Burr wrote the article featuring three or

> > four perfumers. He

> > >basically insults people that are into natural

> > perfumery. Why does he seem so hell bent on

>publicly

>

>

>Hi .

> I think it is a case of discredit them before they can

>discredit you!!

>

>He is trying to protect the industry that " Gives him his living " & also

>these articles give him a lot of free publicity!!

>

>On the positive side (remember I am a Virgo ) It means the fragrance

>industry can not dismiss Naturalists any more.

>

>So they are taking us to task, sad but their is a lot at stake, If you think

>about the expansion of all us little one man bands it is phenomenal, He

>appears to be trying to put a spoke in our wheels before we all form full

>orchestras!! As if that happens the perfume industry will have to return in

>part to naturalism, & that will cost them major amounts of money.

The bullies are afraid, that's their motivation, and bully is all

they know. It's actually quite fun watching the fellow huff and puff

every chance he gets. The fragrance industry is so trying to

capitalize on naturals why hypocritically using ad copy that masks

their synths.

Anya McCoy

Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

Natural Perfumers Chat Group

/

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[Guest guest]

At 08:04 AM 10/16/2006, you wrote:

>Hi Anya and everyone

>

> Y'know.........it is all about money money money....... aware

> that since the 30's when they discovered they could headspace

> components of a plant and reproduce it on the lab benches for an

> infentessimal amount the perfume houses have been collating an

> absolute fortune. A move back toward the naturals means their

> profit margins go out the window!!!

All I know, Janita, and I know this like I know the back of my hand,

is that there is no greater beauty than the evolving, complex scent

of a natural. The public is eating cheezwiz and thinks that's cheese.

They're sniffing artificial stuff and thinking that's perfume. Many

will go on enjoying the artificial (I do sniff it sometimes, myself,

the milder stuff, well made), but let them experience well-made

natural perfumes, and yes, we will dig right into the profit margins

of the big houses.

Anya McCoy

Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

Natural Perfumers Chat Group

/

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[Guest guest]

At 08:12 AM 10/16/2006, you wrote:

>You know, it's funny, reading this fiercely sided issue, I have to think

> " religion " and " politics' -subjects that are often not discussable,

>reasons for nations to wage war. And natural vs synths seems to be the

>third in the list.

>

>Maybe this is upsetting, but maybe it is a compliment. Obviously it's

>HUGE, and as small as it is at this point, the potential is

>unimaginable, since it involves the masses siding, which means money and

>money means power....

>

>Yes, it makes perfect sense that some people will wage war, even on

>small scale....

>

>But there is no greater Blessing then being dammed by the devil...LOL

>take it as a compliment. NP has to be something right on big scale to

>get this kind of attention.

Hi ne

A few are harping that I'm now into the " zealot " zone on POL, and I

got an unsolicited, unwanted bit from a NPers in my mailbox today,

too, lol. I have the long view of this all, perhaps forged by years

and experience and a bit of wisdom as to the ways of the world. Some

only see things in black and white, but I see full color, and all

gradations in this issue. We ARE on a big scale, on the radar, and

every bit of publicity helps.

Anya McCoy

Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

Natural Perfumers Chat Group

/

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[Guest guest]

At 09:32 AM 10/16/2006, you wrote:

>Don't worry Gill! I'm not that upset! I won't be

>throwing any darts. I really think Anya is right

>about the fact that Burr is working against himself

>when he keeps pointing out the fact that mainstream

>perfumes are mostly synths. The average consumer

>doesn't necessarily realize that when a perfume lists

>notes of peach, plum, iris, and peony, it doesn't

>actually contain any of these things! People may

>really be put off when they realize they are spraying

>themselves with chemical cocktails. I think it's true

>that no publicity is bad publicity and Burr is

>inadvertently spreading the word!

Hi :

This is my last post of the night, as my chiro said to take it easy

on the computer, and I'm yawning (body does give hints!) but I want

to try to answer everyone who's replying in this thread, as it is

very important.

Your post is quite lucid and educational, and yep, Burr is helping us overall.

Anya McCoy

Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

Natural Perfumers Chat Group

/

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[Guest guest]

> Thanks, Chandler!

Andrine replies:

Anya, I think you and others are so much more diplomatic than I feel

about this. I read his " interview " (if you can call that chest-

beating display of peacock-strutting buffoonery and interview) at

http://www.perfumecritic.com/blog/_archives/2006/9/21/2346329.html

My instant reaction was, what a mean, small-minded, nasty little

boy. Is this Dennis Rodman in a new suit?

Personally, I think he must have WAY too many funhouse mirrors in

his home, and that he is WAY too in love with the sound of his own

voice. (some little mouse in a corner is whispering Napoleon

complex...)

Oh, dear, could my PMS be showing? I'm so glad that the gentlemen

in our NP group are the lovely examples of enlightened malehood that

I wish the rest of our nation was better-populated with... Looks

like naturals DO make a difference! I guess I can thank Chandler

for enabling me to see that more clearly.

Okay -- here goes:

Thanks, Chandler!

Okay -- now to go sniff something that smells much better.....

ahhh... jasminum grandiflorum -- fake that, Chandler!

Snarkily,

Andrine

[Guest guest]

OK, snipped because of incoherent mingling of many quotes. Can't figure out

who's who, so here is the trimmed version:

From: bodychemistri

> Personally, I think he must have WAY too many funhouse mirrors in

> his home, and that he is WAY too in love with the sound of his own

> voice. (some little mouse in a corner is whispering Napoleon

> complex...)

>

For me, her experience just proves that it is good to stay open.

Also, a difference in personal preference doesn't mean yours is

being bashed.

Hope I'm not making enemies.

Your not making enemy you daft Bat.

But please think for a moment

So just by chance while this person (who's mouth seams to be doing a good

interpretation Of a Spanish Dancers Castanets) was studying distillation, by

some strange turn of events some how gets introduced to synthetics !

" Do me a Favore " Do any of us really belive that He said, She said, had

never been curious enough even to try! & needed to go from the USA to France

to make this discovery!!

How I would interpret that is :

She had heard that The you can get dirt cheap synthetic fragrance in France

& her eyes started to light up like £££ signe's, thinking how much money was

to be made, but after years of advocating naturals how can one pull this

off & not be seen as a hypocrite!

so to save face she wrapped it up in a pretty Parcel & come out with this

load of BUM FLUFF. As a strategic marketing plan!,

I can not speak for the rest of you, but if I had gone half way around the

world to learn a trade / study, I would be focused on one thing & one thing

only, I would not have the time or inclination to go walk about's ( except

for the odd glass of wine or Stella, to relax) looking into things I profess

to abhor, as this would upset my focus. Unless that is it was a previously

arranged plan.

So in my opinion thy are telling whopping great Porky pies.

Love & light.

Gill.

[Guest guest]

--- bodychemistri <heidi@...> wrote:

>

> I'm confused. I just picked up O Magazine to read

> the article. It

> doesn't seem that Burr gives an opinion on natural

> vs synthetic at

> all.

>

> Hope I'm not making enemies.

> >

>

I have not read this article because I don't have O

magazine (was it available online?) so I can't

respond directly to what he said in it. The

important thing you should know is that Chandler Burr

has a long history of bashing naturals. The link

Andrine included is a good start if you want to

understand the issue. The NPR interview also sounds

like an interesting one but I have not had time to

listen to it. It doesn't matter-- I already know the

gist.

Burr has very deliberately set about making naturals

look bad in the media. He actually compared us to

right-wing, fundamentalist Christians, saying that we

are afraid of modern life and that we have retreated

to simplistic, anti-scientific views to make ourselves

feel better! I really think this is a hoot! He

should probably just go back to lying about safety

issues and cost issues because at least he didn't

sound crazy when he did that! However,

misinformed/dishonest is not a lot better. Anyway,

don't worry, you are not making enemies. Of course,

you're entitled to your own opinion. But have a look

at some of his other comments on natural perfumery and

you might change your mind.

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

> >

> > >

> > > I'm confused. I just picked up O Magazine to read

> > > the article. It

> > > doesn't seem that Burr gives an opinion on natural

> > > vs synthetic at

> > > all.

> > >

> > > Hope I'm not making enemies.

> >

>

> Hi Heidi, :

>

> If the OP who shared the info on how she perceived the article was

> incorrect, and we all make mistakes, I'd like to second what

says belos:

>

>

> >I have not read this article because I don't have O

> >magazine (was it available online?) so I can't

> >respond directly to what he said in it. The

> >important thing you should know is that Chandler Burr

> >has a long history of bashing naturals.

>

>Hi Everyone,

I am the one who wrote the original post. I did not buy the magazine

initially so I was trying recall the article from memory. I just

went out and bought it to make sure my reaction to it would still be

the same. Well, it is. He starts his article on ne Langmuir by

stating how she has now come to the realization while studying

distillation in France how many layers and depth synths can add to a

perfume. Mr Burr goes on to say " One of the the standard obessions

of any complex, difficult age is a rise in fanaticism for the

supposedly simple and pure. In ours that has meant a bias against

synthetics. But building a perfume without synthetic molecules is

like building a skyscraper with wood. What is fascinating about

Langmuir is that her collection fairly screams modernism-highly

developed, thoughtful, concerted modernism-and it comes from a woman

who has only recently started building with steel. " Blah blah blah!

As I said before I am open minded and like to read any articles

featuring perfumers. Natural or not. I don't understand why he

cannot just talk about the perfumes. He has to compare people who

are into naturals as fanatics. He knows that alot of woman,

especially young woman, are concerned with products they purchase

being considered hip or modern so of course Ms. Langmuirs's perfumes

are touted as highly developed and scream modernism. I am sticking

with my original reaction. It is hard enough trying to convince

woman that grew up spraying themselves with cucumber-melon or cherry

blossom to try something new and natural without this clown trying

to make natural perfumers out to be fanatics who are not modern. I

know it just seems like a few comments but believe me the people

behind this know excactly what they are doing. In this style

concious day and age to compare a group or person or idea to

fanaticism ( christian I'm sure) or say that in some way they are

not modern or hip is the kiss of death. Very clever marketing on

their part. I wish someone could get a good article in a mainsteam

mag like O magazine listing all the harmfull chemicals used in

synthetic perfumes and beauty products and how being, " modern "

isn't so pretty for your health or the enviroment. Once again sorry

for droning on and on!

Thanks

Liz

[Guest guest]

The

> important thing you should know is that Chandler Burr

> has a long history of bashing naturals.

> Burr has very deliberately set about making naturals

> look bad in the media. He actually compared us to

> right-wing, fundamentalist Christians, saying that we

> are afraid of modern life and that we have retreated

> to simplistic, anti-scientific views to make ourselves

> feel better!

There's a lot of polarization in the world these days, everyone

pointing fingers and amplifying differences into opposition and

outright war. We herbalists have been the targets of these sorts of

attacks for a couple of millenia. Witchhunts are an ever-popular

sport for disconnected folks who have nothing better to do. However,

arguing with these pompous loud-mouths only validates them. The

beauty and healing power of Nature is a powerful magnet for humans

and a powerful cultural movement that Burr can't stop. Let's just

keep our noses in our bliss.

Sharon

http://greenbrierherbalist.com

[Guest guest]

At 12:39 AM 10/18/2006, you wrote:

> But building a perfume without synthetic molecules is like

building a skyscraper with wood.

I guess they want the world covered with skyscrapers to the exclusion

of other types of buildings. LOL.

Anya McCoy

Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

Natural Perfumers Chat Group

/

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[Guest guest]

At 09:50 AM 10/18/2006, you wrote:

> The

> > important thing you should know is that Chandler Burr

> > has a long history of bashing naturals.

> > Burr has very deliberately set about making naturals

> > look bad in the media. He actually compared us to

> > right-wing, fundamentalist Christians, saying that we

> > are afraid of modern life and that we have retreated

> > to simplistic, anti-scientific views to make ourselves

> > feel better!

>

>There's a lot of polarization in the world these days, everyone

>pointing fingers and amplifying differences into opposition and

>outright war. We herbalists have been the targets of these sorts of

>attacks for a couple of millenia. Witchhunts are an ever-popular

>sport for disconnected folks who have nothing better to do. However,

>arguing with these pompous loud-mouths only validates them. The

>beauty and healing power of Nature is a powerful magnet for humans

>and a powerful cultural movement that Burr can't stop. Let's just

>keep our noses in our bliss.

Sharon, all

I come from a professional field - landscape architecture - that is

constantly under attack from architects and civil engineers because

we do encroach into their territory. They petition state governments

on a regular basis to remove the licensing for LAs. They always fail,

but their attacks never stop. It's just the way of the world,

turf-protection, marking, jealousy, fear.

Anya McCoy

Anya's Garden of Natural Perfume http://anyasgarden.com

Artisan Natural Perfumers Guild http://artisannaturalperfumers.org

Natural Perfumers Chat Group

/

----------

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