Guest guest Posted February 14, 2006 Report Share Posted February 14, 2006 <I'm convinced it's all boiling down to PR, buzz, demand.> Hello all, I've been in touch with a massage therapist who currently is working at " Central Market " - the high end line of grocery stores for HEB - the mega giant of South Texas. The equivalent manager of " Whole Body " at Central Market (who just came from Whole Foods) has said that Whole Foods just became too corporate for him (this is someone from the international headquarters). As with many good ideas grown too big, the dew is off the rose, so to speak. I've always thought that human institutions are at their best on the small side. There's a book out there called " The Tipping Point " in which one cogent point is the theory (and subsequent supported information) that the most effective companies work in groups of 150 or less. It's my personal opinion that Whole Foods has grown too large to respond to this delicate, personal, and finely tuned industry. One of the big issues with Whole Foods is the shelf life of their products, which must exceed 6 months. This is a monumental challenge with truly " natural " products. The term " cottage industry " might be a very quaint way of putting it, but I really don't think that something as delicate and intimate as natural fragrances - with all of their associated variances - can be maintained in a " corporate " atmosphere. It's simply too demanding a genre to be able to support warehouse and shelf life for however many months it may take to get a product sold. I think some things must remain small and personal to retain their draw and intrinsic value. I welcome any comments here - I think this is probably a good discussion. Regards, Scentgarden Aromatics Fine Essential Oils & Custom Blends ....Now supplying the Artisan Perfumer www.scentgarden.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 15, 2006 Report Share Posted February 15, 2006 Take a look at my website and let me know what you think. It is a work in progress as I am relaunching it this week. www.emergenaturals.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2006 Report Share Posted February 16, 2006 At 08:30 PM 2/14/2006, you wrote: ><I'm convinced it's all boiling down to PR, buzz, demand.> > >Hello all, > >It's my personal opinion that Whole Foods has grown too large to respond >to this delicate, personal, and finely tuned industry. One of the big >issues with Whole Foods is the shelf life of their products, which must >exceed 6 months. This is a monumental challenge with truly " natural " >products. Hi : I waited a few days to reply, as I was hoping to hear back from either Austin reps or the local regional rep, as promised by Dawn from the Aventura store. Nada. I'm very experienced at writing or otherwise contacting corporate folks when there is a problem, comment or suggestion. I have rarely had such a deafening silence in return as with Whole Foods. Next week, I'll start round two with them, since I don't give up easily, but I really am shocked at their lack of response. Office Depot, Whirlpool, Sears -- they're all much better at customer relations, and look how huge they are. >The term " cottage industry " might be a very quaint way of putting it, >but I really don't think that something as delicate and intimate as >natural fragrances - with all of their associated variances - can be >maintained in a " corporate " atmosphere. It's simply too demanding a >genre to be able to support warehouse and shelf life for however many >months it may take to get a product sold. I think some things must >remain small and personal to retain their draw and intrinsic value. You make an excellent point. Natural perfumers need to be very wary of the lure of the department store counter space, or a place like Whole Foods. Department store SAs are trained, very poorly, IMO, by the reps of the big houses. So, if you get into, say, Barneys, your niche fragrances are likely to get lost. I don't mean niche like Serge Lutens that is sold there, since, IMO, they're corporate, loaded with synths, and much, much, different than naturals. I do put Sally Malanga's Ecco Bella in a different league that most of us, since she's been in business since 1992, and has an extensive body care line, a healthy advertising budget, and support staff and distributors who make sure her product is featured. Still, WF decided to discontinue her perfumes locally because of the $18 cost in a very affluent community! We're just at the start of the learning curve with the public regarding natural perfumes. We can't afford to get lost in the counter display shuffle, or, worse, suffer the fate of aromatherapy, co-opted by firms like Proctor and Gamble. Wouldn't it be a perfect world that instead of Glade air fresheners, true AT spritzes could be available at your local store? That might have been possible at one point, but the AT business community wasn't able to make that leap. I don't think NP ever will, or should, be so commercialized, but we do have to defend our art, and plan well for how it is offered to the public. Natural perfumers, in stepping into the public eye, have to be sure of a professionally-presented- and supported product. Small stores, boutiques and such answer this much more directly than WF. But, still, to not have *one* natural perfume alternative in a store such as Whole Foods -- what a disgrace -- on them. Anya http://.com The premier site on the Web to discover the beauty of Natural Perfume / Join to study natural perfumery Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2006 Report Share Posted February 16, 2006 At 08:53 PM 2/15/2006, you wrote: >Take a look at my website and let me know what you think. It is a >work in progress as I am relaunching it this week. > >www.emergenaturals.com Hi Beautiful images, but they took a long time to load (dialup). You could lose a lot of customers that way, they'd surf right off. Let us know when you have actual content and products up, that's the time for true feedback. Keep up the good work, and good luck with your enterprise. > Anya http://.com The premier site on the Web to discover the beauty of Natural Perfume / Join to study natural perfumery Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2006 Report Share Posted February 16, 2006 <Wouldn't it be a perfect world that instead of Glade air fresheners, true AT spritzes could be available at your local store?> I've often thought this when I go down the aisle of dish detergents with " Lavender and YlangYlang essences " on the label. I think the truth of it is that no big manufacturer could afford the price points if they tried to use real essential oils.....much cheaper and easier to use the synthetic approximations of these aromas (which are sadly lacking IMO) I agree with you about the spa and boutique idea. To me, natural perfumery is an artisan product...works of art - better suited to the shop which serves an intimate clientele. As soon as the production of an aromatic REQUIRES identical odor matching from batch to batch (something which can never be guaranteed with natural aromatics), it ceases to be about the care of creation and ALL about profits at all cost. I don't mean to say that natural perfumery shouldn't be a profitable business - I desperately hope it will! But I just don't see how it will ever be on the level with the perfumery " industry " . And quite frankly, it couldn't retain it's focus if it did. I'd hazard a guess that every member of this list is here first because of their love (and addiction) to natural aromatics. Scentgarden Aromatics Fine Essential Oils & Custom Blends ....Now supplying the Artisan Perfumer www.scentgarden.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2006 Report Share Posted February 16, 2006 > I'd hazard a guess that every member of this list is > here first because of their love (and addiction) > to natural aromatics. Yes and yes. Now I know its all good for me and my family, and I know there are health benefits, but like you say, love and addiction are a big part of it all. Franco www.therapyessence.org.uk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2006 Report Share Posted February 18, 2006 At 11:43 AM 2/16/2006, you wrote: ><Wouldn't it be a perfect world that instead of Glade >air fresheners, true AT spritzes could be available at your local >store?> > >I've often thought this when I go down the aisle of dish detergents with > " Lavender and YlangYlang essences " on the label. I think the truth of it >is that no big manufacturer could afford the price points if they tried >to use real essential oils.....much cheaper and easier to use the >synthetic approximations of these aromas (which are sadly lacking IMO) Hi : I think you will find real EOs in the sprays and dish detergents at WF, but not Publix of Safeway. The green industry manufacturers can buy in quanitty and get better prices, but IMO, the mainstream manufacturers and stores don't care, so they go for the synthetics. >I agree with you about the spa and boutique idea. To me, natural >perfumery is an artisan product...works of art - better suited to the >shop which serves an intimate clientele. So true -- we must focus and brand our lovely creations for that market. >I don't mean to say that natural perfumery shouldn't be a profitable >business - I desperately hope it will! But I just don't see how it will >ever be on the level with the perfumery " industry " . And quite frankly, >it couldn't retain it's focus if it did. I'd hazard a guess that every >member of this list is here first because of their love (and addiction) >to natural aromatics. There are many wonderful natural fragrance companies out there with successful lines in spas and boutiques, many private line. They are natural fragrance, but have not necessarily taken the next step, creating sophisticated natural perfumes. It's coming, and we in this group will be the first to see it and profit from it. Yes, addictions can pay off, after they initially drain your wallet ;-) Anya http://.com The premier site on the Web to discover the beauty of Natural Perfume / Join to study natural perfumery Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2006 Report Share Posted February 19, 2006 < Yes, addictions can pay off, after they initially drain your wallet ;-)> Anya, I've tried to think of how emphatically I can agree with this statement.....maybe just " Hell yea! " is the most succinct way. The only thing about it is that most of us are still in the initially-drain-your-wallet stage. But addiction does keep us coming back, doesn't it. I always told my kids...you don't fail until you quit trying...trite but true. Still trying, Scentgarden Aromatics Fine Essential Oils & Custom Blends ....Now supplying the Artisan Perfumer www.scentgarden.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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