Guest guest Posted April 15, 2006 Report Share Posted April 15, 2006 I've got a couple of ideas on muscle pain that seem to work for me. Regarding eeg and nIR HEG seems to work for rewarding the brain (for whatever should be there) 1) directly ABOVE the offending muscle, and 2) the directly OPPOSITE side on the head. Also, don't forget the fast twitch muscles that get neglected so often. The BodyBlade works nice for arms and upper body. Still trying to fasten one securely to a shoe. ~ A Do Something Useful Muscle pain in legs Dear Colleagues,I am working with a woman in her early 50's who has severe back and hip pain which we have successfully remediated with c4/a2/g 1c 3-6 inh smr rew.She also suffers from frequent migraines and insomnia. She has lots of alpha all over her head. She has responded to t3/t4/g/p4/a2 2C WS (12-15), and sleeps much better now.The remaining issue for her is that she has pain which she describes as muscle pain (not bone pain or arthritis pain) in the front of her legs---quadriceps region. I am wondering:1) Does anyone have any experience with helping reduce or manage this kind of pain?2) What other information about this client would be helpful to you to make some suggestions about things we might try to address her pain without triggering her migraines.Thank you in advance for your thoughts and ideas.Tamson Overholtzer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2006 Report Share Posted April 15, 2006 Very likely that the pain is related to the very high alpha. Training that down will often help reduce pain. Pete > > From: " foxmaven " <tamson@...> > Date: 2006/04/15 Sat AM 01:42:40 EDT > > Subject: Muscle pain in legs > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2006 Report Share Posted April 15, 2006 Marie, Here again, with fibromyalgia and chronic pain, there is a high likelihood of lots of alpha, often frontally, often in the 8-10 range instead of 10-12 Hz and often not blocking very well when eyes are opened. Training this down can be very helpful. Pete > > From: MGreen <mgreen@...> > Date: 2006/04/15 Sat PM 03:39:40 EDT > > Subject: Re: Muscle pain in legs > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2006 Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 : I have a 13 y.o. boy with ADHD but sufferimg more from restless leg syndrome. Might this also be relieved with down training frontal alpha? What can anyone tell me about treatment of RLS. Please. Re: Muscle pain in legs > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2006 Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 Jim, I'd expect that SMR training at the right frequency would be more successful with a muscle control issue like restless leg. Pete > > From: " C. " <jccamp@...> > Date: 2006/04/17 Mon AM 06:22:35 EDT > < > > Subject: RE: Re: Muscle pain in legs > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2006 Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 — You may want to check his meds first, both Rx and OTC stuff. Benadryl caused me to have bouts of RLS. It was a very immediate reaction. HH From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of C. Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 5:23 AM Subject: RE: Re: Muscle pain in legs : I have a 13 y.o. boy with ADHD but sufferimg more from restless leg syndrome. Might this also be relieved with down training frontal alpha? What can anyone tell me about treatment of RLS. Please. Re: Muscle pain in legs > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2006 Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 I read a study a couple of yrs ago about RLS (sorry, I don't remember who did the study). That particular study indicated a tendancy in people who reported trouble with RLS to have levels of beta activity that were much higher than those in the study without RLS. Interestingly, the higher levels were usually found at C3 and/or Cz. So...is might be helpful to check this out on the client's assessment. Lynn RutherfordHarv <hhoward@...> wrote: — You may want to check his meds first, both Rx and OTC stuff. Benadryl caused me to have bouts of RLS. It was a very immediate reaction. HH From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of C. Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 5:23 AM Subject: RE: Re: Muscle pain in legs :I have a 13 y.o. boy with ADHD but sufferimg more from restless legsyndrome. Might this also be relieved with down training frontal alpha?What can anyone tell me about treatment of RLS. Please. Re: Muscle pain in legs>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2006 Report Share Posted April 18, 2006 Good day all, I had to weigh in on this one. I have suffered RLS all my life and have followed research on the disorder. Rather than a muscle disorder, it is linked to neurological causes and particularly dopamine levels. Taking benadryl (and many other otc and prescribed drugs) certainly will aggravate it as I learned the hard way. It has been found that the Parkinson's drug Requip has been helpful for many sufferers. I took it myself for awhile but was one of the unfortunates who had adverse reactions. Not being as learned as many of you in this group, I don't profess to understand the " why " or " how " of much of the research, but I CAN attest to how awful the disorder can be. If you check out RLS.org and/o rlshelp.org you will get some info. A recent article at http://web.sfn.org/index.cfm? pagename=brainBriefings_restlessLegsSyndrome is also interesting. I hope this discussion leads to some suggested protocols that I can also benefit from - I had hope from the beginning of my experience with NFB that it would be the one thing that would ultimately provide me the relief from this horrible disorder. Please feel free to ask any questions! Corina > v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url (#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} st1\:*{behavior:url (#default#ieooui) } — > > You may want to check his meds first, both Rx and OTC stuff. Benadryl caused me to have bouts of RLS. It was a very immediate reaction. > > HH > > > --------------------------------- > > From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of C. > Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 5:23 AM > > Subject: RE: Re: Muscle pain in legs > > > : > I have a 13 y.o. boy with ADHD but sufferimg more from restless leg > syndrome. Might this also be relieved with down training frontal alpha? > What can anyone tell me about treatment of RLS. Please. > > > > Re: Muscle pain in legs > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2006 Report Share Posted April 19, 2006 Thanks. He is on no meds. Re: Muscle pain in legs>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2006 Report Share Posted April 19, 2006 Thanks, Lynn: I don't know what "higher levels" might be, but he is a solid 13% at C3, Cz, and C4. Re: Muscle pain in legs>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2006 Report Share Posted April 19, 2006 Requip is the drug of choice for RLS in current practice. I have seen patients with 10-20 year hx of RLS become asymptomatic after 1 sec. of LENS treatment at FP1 FP2 and FPZ and remain such for 6 weeks. This has happened in the office while the person was experiencing symptoms, they simply stopped. I offerred to treat folks in an RLS support group with the person mentioned above speaking about her experience and got 2 people out of maybe 30 in the room willing to try it. I got the sense that secondary gain must be considered very carefully in the assessment of RLS patients. Marvin Berman, Ph.D. Marvin H. Berman, Ph.D., CBT,BCIAC(EEG) Licensed Clinical Psychologist President, Quietmind Foundation 600 Germantown Pike Ste. A Lafayette Hill, PA 19444-1800 610-940-0488 Tel. 610-941-9912 FAX marvinberman@... www.quietmindfdn.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2006 Report Share Posted April 19, 2006 Marvin, Thanks for relaying your experience. Could you give a reference for LENS treatment or describe the protocol? I have a patient who might want to try it. I think your advisement about secondary gain is well worth keeping in mind. Mark Re: Muscle pain in legs Requip is the drug of choice for RLS in current practice. I have seen patients with 10-20 year hx of RLS become asymptomatic after 1 sec. of LENS treatment at FP1 FP2 and FPZ and remain such for 6 weeks. This has happened in the office while the person was experiencing symptoms, they simply stopped. I offerred to treat folks in an RLS support group with the person mentioned above speaking about her experience and got 2 people out of maybe 30 in the room willing to try it. I got the sense that secondary gain must be considered very carefully in the assessment of RLS patients.Marvin Berman, Ph.D.Marvin H. Berman, Ph.D., CBT,BCIAC(EEG)Licensed Clinical Psychologist President, Quietmind Foundation600 Germantown Pike Ste. ALafayette Hill, PA 19444-1800610-940-0488 Tel.610-941-9912 FAXmarvinberman@...www.quietmindfdn.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2006 Report Share Posted April 19, 2006 As a person with RLS, I give some feedback about your experience with the group offer....For 12 yrs, I did not have a single good night's sleep until I was diagnosed and put on meds. In the 8 years that I've been taking medication (and sleeping well most nights), Ive tried several alternative treatments. ANY night that I did not take the medication, I did not sleep. It's miserable. But, the meds work very well, so I can understand the resistance. Now, I have not tried LENS Tx, and I'm very interested in checking that out thanks to your post, Marvin. Lynn"Marvin H. Berman, Ph.D." <marvinberman@...> wrote: Requip is the drug of choice for RLS in current practice.I have seen patients with 10-20 year hx of RLS become asymptomatic after 1 sec. of LENS treatment at FP1 FP2 and FPZ and remain such for 6 weeks. This has happened in the office while the person was experiencing symptoms, they simply stopped.I offerred to treat folks in an RLS support group with the person mentioned above speaking about her experience and got 2 people out of maybe 30 in the room willing to try it. I got the sense that secondary gain must be considered very carefully in the assessment of RLS patients.Marvin Berman, Ph.D.Marvin H. Berman, Ph.D., CBT,BCIAC(EEG)Licensed Clinical PsychologistPresident, Quietmind Foundation600 Germantown Pike Ste. ALafayette Hill, PA 19444-1800610-940-0488 Tel.610-941-9912 FAXmarvinberman@...www.quietmindfdn.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2006 Report Share Posted April 20, 2006 Sounds great, but what is LENS treatment. -----Original Message-----From: [mailto: ]On Behalf Of Marvin H. Berman, Ph.D.Sent: Wednesday, April 19, 2006 9:28 AM Subject: Re: Muscle pain in legsRequip is the drug of choice for RLS in current practice. I have seen patients with 10-20 year hx of RLS become asymptomatic after 1 sec. of LENS treatment at FP1 FP2 and FPZ and remain such for 6 weeks. This has happened in the office while the person was experiencing symptoms, they simply stopped. I offerred to treat folks in an RLS support group with the person mentioned above speaking about her experience and got 2 people out of maybe 30 in the room willing to try it. I got the sense that secondary gain must be considered very carefully in the assessment of RLS patients.Marvin Berman, Ph.D.Marvin H. Berman, Ph.D., CBT,BCIAC(EEG)Licensed Clinical Psychologist President, Quietmind Foundation600 Germantown Pike Ste. ALafayette Hill, PA 19444-1800610-940-0488 Tel.610-941-9912 FAXmarvinberman@...www.quietmindfdn.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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