Re: Reducing alpha caused abreaction

[Guest guest]

Hey folks

Following the thread on this and other groups, I tried reducing alpha in two

clients last week, and both abreacted. Both of them have extremely high

alpha, and high alpha/theta ratios, and alpha coherence almost everywhere on

the head, but particularly in the parietals, and occipitals. Thinking that

this could be the " attempt " of the brain at not allowing important

information to travel back and forth from the conscious to the subconscious,

I decided to try to help them control it. One had an immediate

in-the-chair-reaction, so I stopped, the other had horrific dreams that nite

(to me that says it was allowing some integration, but maybe too fast too

soon).

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

[Guest guest]

, I had nightmares too when I tried inhibiting the excess 8-10hz.

However, I've had two clients that I do it with, with no such problems.

RE: Reducing alpha caused abreaction

> Hey folks

>

> Following the thread on this and other groups, I tried reducing alpha in

> two

> clients last week, and both abreacted. Both of them have extremely high

> alpha, and high alpha/theta ratios, and alpha coherence almost everywhere

> on

> the head, but particularly in the parietals, and occipitals. Thinking

> that

> this could be the " attempt " of the brain at not allowing important

> information to travel back and forth from the conscious to the

> subconscious,

> I decided to try to help them control it. One had an immediate

> in-the-chair-reaction, so I stopped, the other had horrific dreams that

> nite

> (to me that says it was allowing some integration, but maybe too fast too

> soon).

>

> Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

That'll teach you to try a protocol because someone else used it!!

Seriously, though, the thing I would look at would be what's beneath the alpha.

If you see a lot of fast stuff under the alpha, I would surely work with that

first. Alpha peaks do, as you note, oven block subconscious material from

passing to the conscious. Just training down the alpha is like training down

frontal midline activity that may be holding " nasties " in place. Better, if

possible, to take some of the heat off first before going after the defense.

Might be easier to train that way as well.

What were the other characteristics of the two EEG's you trained?

Pete

>

> From: " Key " <danielkey@...>

> Date: 2006/04/20 Thu AM 08:17:26 EDT

> < >

> Subject: RE: Reducing alpha caused abreaction

>

> Following the thread on this and other groups, I tried reducing alpha in two

clients last week, and both abreacted. Both of them have extremely high

alpha, and high alpha/theta ratios, and alpha coherence almost everywhere on

the head, but particularly in the parietals, and occipitals. Thinking that

this could be the " attempt " of the brain at not allowing important

information to travel back and forth from the conscious to the subconscious,

I decided to try to help them control it. One had an immediate

in-the-chair-reaction, so I stopped, the other had horrific dreams that nite

(to me that says it was allowing some integration, but maybe too fast too

soon).

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

[Guest guest]

Pete,

would this be a natural gas or electric?

Alpha peaks do, as you note, oven block subconscious

On Apr 20, 2006, at 8:54 AM, Van Deusen wrote:

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[Guest guest]

Sometimes globe-trotting just catches up with you...

Re: RE: Reducing alpha caused abreaction

Pete,would this be a natural gas or electric?Alpha peaks do, as you note, oven block subconsciousOn Apr 20, 2006, at 8:54 AM, Van Deusen wrote:

[Guest guest]

And ,

When you did such, what was the outcome for the subject? Am I correct in assuming you did it so that the subjects could then do alpha-theta without the abreaction part?

kirk

Reducing alpha caused abreaction

et al,We expected abreactions in my clinic whenever we reduced alpha (Peniston'sProtocol) and were rarely disappointed. Someplace along the line we startedworking with alpha coherence as a peak performance tool. That's when Idiscovered a lot of my addictive clients had high alpha coherence. MarvinSams and I developed a technique that broke up this coherence problem.After that we never expected abreactions when doing the Peniston protocoland were rarely disappointed.The technique is based on the dynamic range of alpha. We trained at thesite pair exhibiting the highest percentage of coherence but later I learnedthat P3 - P4 worked just as well. One of my associates used any twocross-hemispheric pairs with equal success.The protocol for excessively high alpha coherence is to train to decreasealpha coherence for five minutes or until the graph rolls under and startsincreasing. Then train to increase alpha coherence for five minutes or untilthe graph of the coherence rolls over and starts decreasing. Finally, trainto decrease alpha coherence for five minutes or until the graph rolls underand starts increasing.The protocol for excessively low alpha coherence is to train to increasealpha coherence for five minutes or until the graph rolls over and startsdecreasing. Then train to decrease alpha coherence for five minutes oruntil the graph rolls under and starts increasing. Finally, train toincrease alpha coherence for five minutes or until the graph of thecoherence rolls over and starts decreasing.I haven't used this approach since I closed my clinic for good in 2001, butI suspect the technique may still work. We usually expected the dynamicrange of alpha coherence to increase to at least 40% high to low withinthree to five sessions. Brainmaps confirmed previously high alpha coherencewas significantly lower. Hope this helps.Best,

[Guest guest]

,

It was written in the middle of a 15-hour flight from Seoul to Washington

DC--internet on an airplane, no less--and I was lucky I was writing in

English...

Pete

>

> From: <gmartin@...>

> Date: 2006/04/20 Thu AM 10:34:57 EDT

>

> Subject: Re: RE: Reducing alpha caused abreaction

>

> Pete,

>

> would this be a natural gas or electric?

>

>

>

> Alpha peaks do, as you note, oven block subconscious

> On Apr 20, 2006, at 8:54 AM, Van Deusen wrote:

>

>

>

> --- http://USFamily.Net/dialup.html - $8.25/mo! --

http://www.usfamily.net/dsl.html - $19.99/mo! ---

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

Your clinic must have been a lot of fun! I work hard to KEEP abreactions from

happening with clients by trying to minimize surges around 3 Hz, and I almost

never see them. I guess it could depend on what you define as an abreaction,

but my understanding of the goal of Alpha/Theta training is to integrate old

material WITHOUT requiring that it be abreacted. I understand that when we go

into the alpha (observer) state, and then slide down to the

crossover/visualization state at 7Hz., the idea is to be " observing " our

subconscious material rather than tumbling into it again (as happens when the

theta gets into very low frequencies.)

I'm intrigued by your finding that alpha coherence was the culprit in the

abreactions, and I'm very interested in the system you describe for breaking it

up. I have great respect for Marvin, and I'm sure anything he and you came up

with would be creative and effective. Not sure exactly what you mean by " rolled

under " etc, but I'd love to hear more. Also, what did you consider " high "

coherences at, say, P3 and P4?

Thanks for your input,

Pete

>

> From: " Gilbert " <drjohngilbert@...>

> Date: 2006/04/20 Thu PM 03:09:04 EDT

> < >

> Subject: Reducing alpha caused abreaction

>

> et al,

We expected abreactions in my clinic whenever we reduced alpha (Peniston's

Protocol) and were rarely disappointed. Someplace along the line we started

working with alpha coherence as a peak performance tool. That's when I

discovered a lot of my addictive clients had high alpha coherence. Marvin

Sams and I developed a technique that broke up this coherence problem.

After that we never expected abreactions when doing the Peniston protocol

and were rarely disappointed.

The technique is based on the dynamic range of alpha. We trained at the

site pair exhibiting the highest percentage of coherence but later I learned

that P3 - P4 worked just as well. One of my associates used any two

cross-hemispheric pairs with equal success.

The protocol for excessively high alpha coherence is to train to decrease

alpha coherence for five minutes or until the graph rolls under and starts

increasing. Then train to increase alpha coherence for five minutes or until

the graph of the coherence rolls over and starts decreasing. Finally, train

to decrease alpha coherence for five minutes or until the graph rolls under

and starts increasing.

The protocol for excessively low alpha coherence is to train to increase

alpha coherence for five minutes or until the graph rolls over and starts

decreasing. Then train to decrease alpha coherence for five minutes or

until the graph rolls under and starts increasing. Finally, train to

increase alpha coherence for five minutes or until the graph of the

coherence rolls over and starts decreasing.

I haven't used this approach since I closed my clinic for good in 2001, but

I suspect the technique may still work. We usually expected the dynamic

range of alpha coherence to increase to at least 40% high to low within

three to five sessions. Brainmaps confirmed previously high alpha coherence

was significantly lower. Hope this helps.

Best,

[Guest guest]

Pete, , , :) and (btw it was just hot air, not

gas or electric) :)

Just got my email back, thanks for the reply. She came to me with a history

and a diagnosis; a diagnosis I didn't agree with after my intake (she also

has an uncle who's very objective, and didn't agree with it either). Her

uncle had done a couple of sessions with her, and she responded well. The

assessment showed f/b reversal in beta as tone issue, and some blocking with

FZ being higher than F3/4 (about 50% higher than F4 and 30% than F3).

Histograms didn't seem to unique except for exceptionally higher left sided

amplitudes (all frequencies) at F3 compare to F4.

Theta/beta ratios were fairly normal (except for parietals we little low)

although peak spectrum frequency was a little low thoroughout. Alpha theta

ratios were high everywhere except F3, and of the highs, higher at P3/4 Oz

and T5/6. SMR was 10%. Subjectively she had a lot of filtering issues.

She absolutely " delighted " in good ole C4 inhibit highs and lows training.

We also worked on the cingulate/basal ganglia. In about 3 months time she

couldn't say enough good about changes in her life. Able to better focus,

more comfortable in social settings, able to perform in emergency situations

(even saved a little boy who was drowning. Her comment was she would have

just frozen in the past, probably not even able to move, but calmly handed

her baby to a friend, and went in after the boy). She just wanted her sleep

to be a little more restful.. Thinking we should have addressed those in

other trainings ie SMR, filtering, blocking etc. I thought about the high

alpha. I also planned to begin alpha/theta training at some point, but

thought she'd probably get stuck in the alpha, so chose to inhibit it.

That's when the horrific dream happened. From everything I can make of it,

we made her a little more vulnerable, possibly the dreamworld was releasing

it. I agree with you that my idea about alpha/theta was that it was

abreactionless (is that a word ?? ). I have had one abreaction which was

mostly somatic. We just backed off and came at it later. Admittedly I went

after the second client's alpha too soon. He was under some significant

time constraints, and I did move too fast.

I'm curious about the " rolling under " terminology also.

Thanks to all

Reducing alpha caused abreaction

>

> et al,

We expected abreactions in my clinic whenever we reduced alpha (Peniston's

Protocol) and were rarely disappointed. Someplace along the line we started

working with alpha coherence as a peak performance tool. That's when I

discovered a lot of my addictive clients had high alpha coherence. Marvin

Sams and I developed a technique that broke up this coherence problem.

After that we never expected abreactions when doing the Peniston protocol

and were rarely disappointed.

The technique is based on the dynamic range of alpha. We trained at the

site pair exhibiting the highest percentage of coherence but later I learned

that P3 - P4 worked just as well. One of my associates used any two

cross-hemispheric pairs with equal success.

The protocol for excessively high alpha coherence is to train to decrease

alpha coherence for five minutes or until the graph rolls under and starts

increasing. Then train to increase alpha coherence for five minutes or until

the graph of the coherence rolls over and starts decreasing. Finally, train

to decrease alpha coherence for five minutes or until the graph rolls under

and starts increasing.

The protocol for excessively low alpha coherence is to train to increase

alpha coherence for five minutes or until the graph rolls over and starts

decreasing. Then train to decrease alpha coherence for five minutes or

until the graph rolls under and starts increasing. Finally, train to

increase alpha coherence for five minutes or until the graph of the

coherence rolls over and starts decreasing.

I haven't used this approach since I closed my clinic for good in 2001, but

I suspect the technique may still work. We usually expected the dynamic

range of alpha coherence to increase to at least 40% high to low within

three to five sessions. Brainmaps confirmed previously high alpha coherence

was significantly lower. Hope this helps.

Best,

[Guest guest]

On Apr 22, 2006, at 5:15 PM, Key wrote:

> (btw it was just hot air, not

> gas or electric) :)

>

Oh good, a convection oven!!! best turkey ever have was done that way.

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