Re: WORSE THAN TERRORISTS

[Guest guest]

Will-

What are you talking of? I am confused? Why are they sending lawyers to MN?

Is there a trial? Did one of our milk suppliers get thrown in jail? Is there

an pending bill? Is there a conference, a protest? I think eveyrone on this

board is of course on the side of the farmers, so I am uncertain what you mean

by taking sides. What do you suggest we do? I am all for protecting our

farmers, but I am uncertain as to what is happening or what event is occuring?

I know the warf campaign is active right now, but is that what you are referring

to? If so, what specifcally do you suggest we do? And how did warf throw a

farmer in jail? I admit I do not get the paper and do not watch tv, so I likely

missed something. Can you fill me in?

Thanks,

Carol F

[Guest guest]

>

I'm fighting too. I've been told by the county, and supported by the state,

that I CANNOT

farm my land... well unless I put up a confinement poultry barn, which they

would never

allow me since I don't have enough land to get rid of the manure from 100,000

birds (not

that I would even begin to consider such a horrible venture). I am amazed at

the tactics

and threats that have been used against me. They'd even " let " me right my land

to some

big commodity farmer, but my pastures, hayfield, chicks, goats... aren't ag.

I'm also fighting the adjacent county that I do not want them to spray poisons

right down

the middle of my land. Then I end up getting some big military planes flying

at tree-top

level right over my pasture, scaring my goats more than once.

Lynn

> DAIRY FARMERS. That's right. The feds and the local gendarms have decided that

uppity

> farmers who are trying to make and sell a wholesome farm product, and not a

commodity

> are WORSE THAN TERRORISTS, WORSE THAN CRIMINALS and they are making a

consorted

> effort right now to shut down all independent dairies.

>

> Taking their focus off their assigned job of PROTECTING US, the courts and the

police

> agencies are really PROTECTING THE SYSTEM because nothing threatens them more

than

a

> farmer who makes a stand and claims his or her CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT to grow

and

sell

> a wholesome farm product. Any farmer with a backbone will be STOMPED in an

effort to

> make an example for the others lest they get uppity as well.

>

> It is far worse than you know. Right now the Hartmans, the Brunners, the

s,

and

> actually independent dairy farmers in almost every state are being beaten

down, forced

> out of business, harrassed and, yes, even INCARCERATED. It's far worse than

you think.

[Guest guest]

Lynn-

That is horrible. Is this a recent development, or has this been ongoing? What

is their logic that you MUST have a confinement poulty barn? Are they against

free range for some reason??

Carol F

[Guest guest]

Why don't we see if one of the tv stations will do a story on it? If someone

can give me more background on it I will make the contact.

Jeanne

-------------- Original message --------------

From: " Carol Frisk " <>

Lynn-

That is horrible. Is this a recent development, or has this been ongoing? What

is their logic that you MUST have a confinement poulty barn? Are they against

free range for some reason??

Carol F

[Guest guest]

JOEL SALADIN, the most famous natural farmer in the US, and perhaps the most

famous

farmer of all, is under the gun for his free-ranging birds as well! On his West

Virgina farm

his EGGMOBILES and CHICKEN TRACTOR operations attract people from all over the

wolrd

and are the subject of several best-selling books he's written.

Now the local farmers are up in arms because they say that the free range birds

(as well as

wild birds) will contaminate their sick, sick, sick confinement birds and give

them West

Nile and Avian Flu (see THE OMNIVORE'S DILEMMA for the best discription of a

confinement poultry operation ever written). How IRONIC to think that his

radiantly

healthy birds are a health risk. The confinement farmers are livid with jealousy

and rage at

s fame and success. They would giggle with glee to see him go down the

drain.

also slaughers his own birds weekly in his own on-farm butchering facility.

Since it is

built with open walls, the Gestapo is trying to shut this facility down as well!

Never mind

that there have been ZERO problems, never mind that ALL the confinement poultry

is

loaded with E. coli, Salmonella and other pathogens. Never mind that EVERY

CUSTOMER

picks up birds ON SITE and has FULL VIEW of the entire operation and can decide

riight

then and there whether or not to purchase (isn't that what DEMOCRACY and FREEDOM

are

all about????) is hilariously funny and very very confrontational. He

tells them that he

sanitizes his processing facility with the two best disinfectants known to mn,

SUNSHINE

and FRESH AIR!

It's very likely that, like so many other pioneers in organic and sustainable

agriculture they

will succeed in shutting him down. In one way, I almost hope they do because if

they do,

there is going to be a TSUNAMI of public backlash against the henchmen for big

business.

They will live to regret it if they try to take down Saladin. It's just a

shame that it has

come to this and that he is being forced to waste so much time, money and

emotions on

idiots.

Will

[Guest guest]

Will, Please keep us posted if there is any thing we can do to help

Salatin. He is definitely a role model, teacher, pioneer and is

on the front lines. He has a great article on his website " Everything

I want to do is illegal " . @ http://www.polyfacefarms.com I am sure

many of us like-minded farmers agree with him. We owe a lot to

for trying so many alternative methods and more importantly, sticking

his neck out on the line by writing and speaking about it so we can

all learn and adapt some of his ideas to our own unique farms.

Janice

[Guest guest]

My situation started the day before Xmas and escalated late this spring. Their

rationale is

that the law says it must be " exclusively and intensively " farmed. This is

suppose to mean

that you can't have one corn plant and consider yourself a farm, not that only a

factory

" farm " is a " real " farm. The law specifically includes uses such as hay and

pasture, which

the bureaocrat ignored. I personally think that the bureaocrats are just on a

power trip

and only want big farms since they're much easier to regulate. I also think

that they can't

comprehend anything beyond commodity farming.

Co just passed some law that says you can't have any livestock on less

than 4

acres, in other words, you can have more chickens at your house in downtown St

than

someone with 3 acres in the middle of the country.

I tried talking to the Star Trib, but they just blew me off.

Lynn

>

> That is horrible. Is this a recent development, or has this been ongoing?

What is their

logic that you MUST have a confinement poulty barn? Are they against free range

for some

reason??

>

> Carol F

[Guest guest]

Everyone on here should call the Star and Cycle. Maybe instead of a food party

have a protest food party at the capital. The law they just passed is most

likely unconstitutional. They will have a hard time enforcing it if it was being

done in the past. There is a federal statute titled section 42 1983. Protects

life liberty and property. The Supreme Court is coming down on these slobs when

they trash plain folk. If you did it before. They have problems.

Re: WORSE THAN TERRORISTS

My situation started the day before Xmas and escalated late this spring. Their

rationale is

that the law says it must be " exclusively and intensively " farmed. This is

suppose to mean

that you can't have one corn plant and consider yourself a farm, not that only

a factory

" farm " is a " real " farm. The law specifically includes uses such as hay and

pasture, which

the bureaocrat ignored. I personally think that the bureaocrats are just on a

power trip

and only want big farms since they're much easier to regulate. I also think

that they can't

comprehend anything beyond commodity farming.

Co just passed some law that says you can't have any livestock on less

than 4

acres, in other words, you can have more chickens at your house in downtown St

than

someone with 3 acres in the middle of the country.

I tried talking to the Star Trib, but they just blew me off.

Lynn

>

> That is horrible. Is this a recent development, or has this been ongoing?

What is their

logic that you MUST have a confinement poulty barn? Are they against free

range for some

reason??

>

> Carol F

[Guest guest]

" " " Co just passed some law that says you can't have any livestock on less

than 4

acres, in other words, you can have more chickens at your house in downtown St

than

someone with 3 acres in the middle of the country. " " "

I keep wondering, what's next??? I know I sure wonder what will be in our

futures as far as growing, buying and such of real foods?? Direct from the

farmer!!! I love knowing and often seeing where my food is grown! I know then I

can trust the farmer. Anyone who does not openly want you to see where they grow

your food is someone to run from quickly!

I love being able to go to MVV and see the cows out in the pasture, or being

given the grand tour from Jan's granddaughter! She will even show you where the

latest batch of kittens are hiding! Plus the nest the hen is hiding her eggs in.

LOL. What a doll of a girl! Jan and Wayne, you are truly blessed.

So where is our future heading? How can we preserve our rights to have and buy

foods the way we want and know is best??? I think it is awful when you have to

fear giving a child a glass of milk in your home because of peoples unrashional

fears (caused by the gov)

All I know is, I will proudly buy from the farmer, drink raw milk and fight

tooth and nail to keep those rights!

Kimi

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Romans 8:33 - 39

33 Who could bring a charge against Gods elect? It is God who justifies.

34 Who is he who condemns? It is Christ who died, yes rather, who was raised

from the dead, who is at the right hand of God, who also makes intercession for

us.

35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Could oppression, or anguish,

or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?

36 Even as it is written, " For your sake we are killed all day long. We were

accounted as sheep for the slaughter. "

37 No, in all these things, we are more than conquerors through him who loved

us.

38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor

principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers,

39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, will be able to separate us

from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

--- http://USFamily.Net/dialup.html - $8.25/mo! --

http://www.usfamily.net/dsl.html - $19.99/mo! ---

[Guest guest]

Lynn-

That is terrible! Have you contacted your law makers in the area, the

congressman or woman in your district? Or are they unsympathetic to your needs?

Carol

[Guest guest]

I talk to every law maker I see anywhere. For some, I knew it went nowhere, a

few actually

listened, including my own legislative rep. I'm hoping to get the law clarified

so it will

protect the " smallest of the small farmers. " My area is mainly Republicans so

they would

love that and how could the DFL turn down such a plea!

The local assesor told me that the law was " vague " (yeah, right) and if I didn't

like HIS

interpretation then I should get more politically involved. Well, if he

insists...so be it. I'm

also sure this will end up in court. It would be great to have a court room

packed for

property and food rights since the beaurocrats packed our local hearing at the

county with

people from his side- I guess we were suppose to be intimidated.

Lynn

>

> That is terrible! Have you contacted your law makers in the area, the

congressman or

woman in your district? Or are they unsympathetic to your needs?

>

> Carol

[Guest guest]

> Maybe instead of a food party have a protest food party at the capital.

Excellent idea, Tom. I nominate you to research obtaining a permit to

hold a protest food party on the State Capitol steps this fall. Maybe

instead of having a swap, we can hold a demonstration and rally to

draw attention to this issue.

More realistically, if there's a NAIS demo/rally, let's find a way to

piggyback their efforts and show people how and why we believe what we

believe about real food, small farms and local economies.

~Joe

[Guest guest]

Bear with me--but the more I hear on this topic, and on monoculture-farming--the

more I

think we'll be having our own " Black '47 " someday soon. The Irish Potato Famine

happened

because the bounty of the land was all being exported; the working folks relied

on their own

scrawny patches of land--tiny yards--to mainly grow potatoes, and when a blight

hit the

taters, they starved, despite the abundance of food in their country. As all of

our lush

farmland is devoted to corn and soy, " exported " to food conglomerates for

processing, it's

not hard to imagine that something like a gas hike or a war or severe weather

patterns will

crash our carefully orchestrated web of global food trading, and it will affect

many Americans

the way the potato famine affected the Irish. Most Americans are so far

removed, they

wouldn't have a clue as to how to feed themselves in a crisis. Or mend a shirt.

Or repair just

about anything. Preaching to the choir in this group, I know. But of all the

historical

comparisons I can make, I just keep coming back to the potato famine. I shall

now go eat a

nice, fresh caprese salad, prepared by my loving husband.

[Guest guest]

Peaceful demonstrations at the Capital do not need permits.

Re: WORSE THAN TERRORISTS

> Maybe instead of a food party have a protest food party at the capital.

Excellent idea, Tom. I nominate you to research obtaining a permit to

hold a protest food party on the State Capitol steps this fall. Maybe

instead of having a swap, we can hold a demonstration and rally to

draw attention to this issue.

More realistically, if there's a NAIS demo/rally, let's find a way to

piggyback their efforts and show people how and why we believe what we

believe about real food, small farms and local economies.

~Joe

[Guest guest]

There is a group called minnesotans against nais. It's been very quiet

lately, but

that would be a good group to work with. Ben Powers is in that group and he's

the only

senate candidate from MN whose against NAIS.

Lynn

> > Maybe instead of a food party have a protest food party at the capital.

>

>

> Excellent idea, Tom. I nominate you to research obtaining a permit to

> hold a protest food party on the State Capitol steps this fall. Maybe

> instead of having a swap, we can hold a demonstration and rally to

> draw attention to this issue.

>

> More realistically, if there's a NAIS demo/rally, let's find a way to

> piggyback their efforts and show people how and why we believe what we

> believe about real food, small farms and local economies.

> ~Joe

>

[Guest guest]

There is also scientific clout that can be brought to bear in such a

discussion/demonstration coming from the Union of Concerned

Scientists. They have a good list of publications:

http://www.ucsusa.org/publications/

A new publication supports our beliefs:

http://www.ucs.usa.org/food_and_environment/sustainable_food/greener-

pastures.html

Benefits of Sustainable Agriculture

Greener Pastures

How grass-fed beef and milk contribute to healthy eating

----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------

Greener Pastures author Dr. Kate Clancy describes the benefits of

grass-fed beef and dairy.

UCS comments supporting a grass-fed beef standard

Americans love their beef and milk. With about 70 percent of the

population consuming one or the other several times a week, the

United States is the largest beef producer and one of the largest

dairy producers in the world. But this love affair has serious

consequences for the health of consumers, the environment, and the

cattle themselves.

Many people assume that beef and dairy cows spend most of their lives

happily grazing in grassy meadows. The reality is that most cattle in

the United States spend significant parts of their lives in crowded

feedlots with hundreds or thousands of other animals, eating feed

that contains large amounts of grain (primarily corn). While cattle

on pasture rarely get sick, those confined to feedlots and fed grain

are prone to disease and most feedlot operators routinely feed

antibiotics to prevent illness and to accelerate growth. This, in

turn, increases the risk of antibiotic resistance in humans. In

addition, air and water pollution stemming from dust and mountains of

feedlot manure, and the many fertilizers and pesticides used in grain

production, exact a heavy toll on the environment and the health of

farmers, farm workers, and nearby residents.

Fortunately, there are better ways to raise food animals. Raising

cattle on pasture lessens environmental damage, improves animal

health, and reduces antibiotic use. Over the past decade, numerous

scientific studies have shown that the meat and milk from pasture-

raised animals are higher in fats that may confer health benefits on

humans. To confirm how strong the findings are, UCS undertook the

first comprehensive comparison of fat levels in beef and dairy

products from conventionally raised and pasture-raised animals. Our

report, Greener Pastures: How Grass-fed Beef and Milk Contribute to

Healthy Eating, presents the results of this analysis and examines

what health benefits food producers could promote on their product

labels.

Randi

>

> There is a group called minnesotans against nais. It's been

very quiet lately, but

> that would be a good group to work with. Ben Powers is in that

group and he's the only

> senate candidate from MN whose against NAIS.

> Lynn

>

> > More realistically, if there's a NAIS demo/rally, let's find a

way to

> > piggyback their efforts and show people how and why we believe

what we

> > believe about real food, small farms and local economies.

> > ~Joe

> >

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Peaceful demonstrations at the Capital do not need permits.

Who says it would be viewed as peaceful?