RE: WESTSIDE BENCH QUESTION

[Guest guest]

Nadzeika wrote :

" When using the cambered bar, it is best used with 2-2x6s. This prevents

the bar from descending too far below the chest and over- taxing the pec

tendon. I would also suggest barbell floor press with a wide grip rather

than a close grip. It will bring the bar closer to the chest when doing

this excercise which had a profound effect for me. My sticking point was

2-4 inches of the chest. I used a rotation of cammbered bar with 2 boards,

floor press with a wide grip, close grip inclines, and bottom benches in a

power rack. Start with the bar just off the chest ( approx. an inch or

two ), for the bottom benches, but be careful. It is very easy to cheat

with this excercise and lose your form by placing way too much emphasis on

the shoulders. "

*** Thanks for the suggestion. I've never tried floor presses or bottom

benches. I will give them a go in my next buildup which starts about

mid-December.

Also, could you explain what you meant by " 2-2x6s " . Was it to do with tempo

or sets and reps? (Or both?)

Cheers,

_______________________

Mavromatis

Department of Economics

Monash University

AUSTRALIA

_______________________

[Guest guest]

Dave Tate<EliteFTS@e...> wrote :

" The question posted was about getting stuck off the chest in the barbell

bench press.

If you are having problem off you chest then it is more a problem with bar

speed. You are either training the bench press too heavy or not doing any

type of speed work. Your training weight for the bench press should not

exceed 60% percent of your shirtless max. The greater the bar speed and

reversal strength the higher you will get stuck. This is why we focus on the

partial range movements on max effort days. You need speed to get the bar

moving and strength to lock it out.

Ask yourself this: If you can bench press 400 pounds, then why do you not

miss with 350? This is because of the speed of the barbell is greater with

350, not a specific weakness of any muscle group. Extra work with dumbbells

and cambered bars can help but is not the total solution. "

*** I think Dave may have hit the nail on the head. All my training has a

sameness about it when it comes to bar speed. I never do speed work. And

when I use lighter weights, the reps are too high to maintain a descent bar

speed. Upon reviewing my competition benches (which fortunately are on video

tape) I seem to lift the bar at an accelerating speed to lockout. Initially

slow off the chest and then increasingly faster. My competitors are quite

the opposite - explosive off the chest and then decelerating toward lockout.

It seems I can make a lot of improvement. I will incorporate a speed day in

my next build up. (I'll also do this for my lower half). I shall inform the

group of my progress.

Cheers,

_______________________

Mavromatis

Department of Economics

Monash University

AUSTRALIA

_______________________

[Guest guest]

Cambered bar bench, DB benches, illegal grip benches

-----------------

Mavromatis wrote:

> Lately I've been reading various articles written by Louie and

>Dave Tate about the Westside approach to training. There is a lot of

>discussion about using chains and bands and various exercises (e.g., JM

>press) to build strength in the lockout phase of the bench press. My problem

>is quite the reverse. I find it most difficult to get the bar moving off the

>chest and have little trouble locking out.

>Can anybody inform both me and

>the group of the methods used by 'Westsiders' in this instance? Is the

>solution merely to purchase a bench shirt, or is it in the selection of

>exercises?

***Please elaborate on that cryptic list of devices for the general reader.

Dr Mel C Siff

Denver, USA

mcsiff@...

[Guest guest]

Jim Harbourne <jimharbourne@h...> wrote:

> Cambered bar bench, DB benches, illegal grip benches

-----------------

Mavromatis wrote:

> > Lately I've been reading various articles written by Louie

> > and Dave Tate about the Westside approach to training. There is a lot

> >of discussion about using chains and bands and various exercises

> >(e.g., JM press) to build strength in the lockout phase of the bench press.

> >My problem is quite the reverse. I find it most difficult to get the bar

> >moving off the chest and have little trouble locking out.

>

> >Can anybody inform both me and

> >the group of the methods used by 'Westsiders' in this instance? Is

> >the solution merely to purchase a bench shirt, or is it in the

> >selection of exercises?

When using the cambered bar, it is best used with 2-2x6s. This

prevents the bar from descending too far below the chest and over-

taxing the pec tendon. I would also suggest barbell floor press with

a wide grip rather than a close grip. It will bring the bar closer to

the chest when doing this excercise which had a profound effect for

me. My sticking point was 2-4 inches of the chest. I used a rotation

of cammbered bar with 2 boards, floor press with a wide grip, close

grip inclines, and bottom benches in a power rack. Start with the bar

just off the chest ( approx. an inch or two ), for the bottom

benches, but be careful. It is very easy to cheat with this excercise

and lose your form by placing way too much emphasis on the shoulders.

[Guest guest]

The question posted was about getting stuck off the chest in the barbell

bench press.

If you are having problem off you chest then it is more a problem with bar

speed. You are either training the bench press too heavy or not doing any

type of speed work. Your training weight for the bench press should not

exceed 60% percent of your shirtless max. The greater the bar speed and

reversal strength the higher you will get stuck. This is why we focus on the

partial range movements on max effort days. You need speed to get the bar

moving and strength to lock it out.

Ask yourself this: If you can bench press 400 pounds, then why do you not miss

with 350? This is because of the speed of the barbell is greater with 350, not a

specific weakness of any muscle group. Extra work with dumbbells and cambered

bars can help but is not the total solution.

Dave Tate

[Guest guest]

I've noticed at Westside you're using mostly close grips both for dynamic

and max effort work and then move the grip out in competition. Why are you

doing this? Does this have anything to do with the boost you're getting off

the chest when using a bench shirt? If you're competing RAW would this have

any influence on the width you're using in training? (should I do more speed

and max effort work with wider grips if I'm competing RAW?)

Jan

Oslo, Norway

RE: WESTSIDE BENCH QUESTION

The question posted was about getting stuck off the chest in the barbell

bench press.

If you are having problem off you chest then it is more a problem with bar

speed. You are either training the bench press too heavy or not doing any

type of speed work. Your training weight for the bench press should not

exceed 60% percent of your shirtless max. The greater the bar speed and

reversal strength the higher you will get stuck. This is why we focus on the

partial range movements on max effort days. You need speed to get the bar

moving and strength to lock it out.

Ask yourself this: If you can bench press 400 pounds, then why do you not

miss with 350? This is because of the speed of the barbell is greater with

350, not a specific weakness of any muscle group. Extra work with dumbbells

and cambered bars can help but is not the total solution.

Dave Tate

[Guest guest]

If I understand correctly the best way to increase reversal strength and bar

speed is dynamic benching with chains/bands, free falling the bar and then

exploding the bar up. I own the Westside tapes and I've noticed you don't go

all the way down to the chest before you reverse the movement. Why is this?

Are you still getting the same reversal strength? (obviously you are but I'd

like to know why). What about the first few inches off the chest? Are you

never doing any work in this range?

Still I assume a muscle weakness can be partly responsible for missing off

the chest? How about if you lats are a weak point, won't this contribute to

the problem?

Jan

Oslo, Norway

RE: WESTSIDE BENCH QUESTION

The question posted was about getting stuck off the chest in the barbell

bench press.

If you are having problem off you chest then it is more a problem with bar

speed. You are either training the bench press too heavy or not doing any

type of speed work. Your training weight for the bench press should not

exceed 60% percent of your shirtless max. The greater the bar speed and

reversal strength the higher you will get stuck. This is why we focus on the

partial range movements on max effort days. You need speed to get the bar

moving and strength to lock it out.

Ask yourself this: If you can bench press 400 pounds, then why do you not

miss with 350? This is because of the speed of the barbell is greater with

350, not a specific weakness of any muscle group. Extra work with dumbbells

and cambered bars can help but is not the total solution.

Dave Tate

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