Re: Re: menopause and natural hormone replacement

September 26, 2005

Well, from vast personal experience now, I can add that high levels of

testosterone in women can suppress LH....mine is....it wasn't when I first

became menopausal.

Re: Re: menopause and natural hormone replacement

Idelle Port wrote:

<<< The pituitary doesn't make sex hormones...it makes GnRH,

gonadotropin releasing hormone, which to sex hormones is analogous to

TSH to thyroid and ACTH to cortisol.>>>

Not quite if what I studied is correct:

GnRH is not made in the pituitary, it's made in the hypothalamus and

sent to the pituitary where it causes release of other hormones such as

follicle stimulating hormone (FSH, a sex hormone in my book).

FSH in turn acts on the follicle in women to cause it to release

estrogen. In males FSH from the pituitary acts with testosterone to

stimulate sperm production.

Then there's luteinizing hormone, with release from pituitary also

triggered by GnRH arriving there. It stimulates follicle to make

estrogen first part of cycle in women - then causes development of

corpus luteum late in cycle which then secretes progesterone....

In men LH stimulates testes to produce testosterone.

In small cats repeated matings are required to increase luteinizing

hormone till it is high enough to allow release of egg cells.

Then there's Prolactin - the hormone to stimulate lactation....

All of these from the anterior pituitary lobe, I would call sex hormones.

There's also oxytocin from the posterior pituitary lobe. It causes

contractions during birth, and bonding between male and female after

sex, and bonding between mother and child etc.

Maybe we have different definitions of sex hormones:-)

Or maybe you forgot these ones.

Namaste,

IRene

--

Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.

www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)

Proverb:Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it.

Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects but under no

circumstances should any information published here be considered a substitute

for personal medical advice from a qualified physician. -the owner

September 26, 2005

As someone else pointed out, after menopause, adrenal androgens can become a

sigificant percentae of a woman's sex hormones....

Re: Re: menopause and natural hormone replacement

Idelle Port wrote:

> Au contraire...sex hormones DO come from adrenals as well as gonads..

Negligible proportions though, especially after menopause.

Before menopause, testosterone in women is like 25-70 ng/dl, 25% from

the ovaries, 50% from peripheral conversion of adrenal precursor

androgens and only 25% from the adrenal cotex. By age 30 or 40 that 25%

from adrenals drops at least in half again. So it's by no stretch the

main source. In addition most of it - nearly all - is bound to sex

hormone binding globulin and it can not do anything unless it is " free " .

> Well, I'm a very " rare " one....hyperandrogenism developed well after

> menopause...now, after bilateral adrenalectomy,

Ouch - so you basically have surgically induced 's as well now?

They offered me a bilateral adrenalectomy - nice sweep it under the

carpet approach supposedly to get rid of my high cortisol that they

*assumed* was being produced by adrenals (it's not) - but I luckily

declined.

<< they're still trying to find where I'm producing testosterone in the

male range (400 ng/dl, where 60-70 is tippy-top female)...it now appears

to be some (probably tiny) remnant of " adrenal rest " tissue left over

from when I was an embryo that just decided to start cranking out

hormones (probably cortisol and who knows what else)....cute, yes?>>>

So they think there is remnant tissue external to the adrenals that is

producing hormones? I guess not visible on MRI etc?

<< But then, MEN-1 is no picnic either....nor breast cancer. I'm curious

how high your cortisol has been...and also how low your estrogen is. >>

Cortisol is measured very many different ways depending what lab you use

and which technique they use. It's always a total 24hr urine measure but

the lab standard varies by test method.

So where normal is 10 (or up to 40 for a marathon athlete) mine is now

averaging 320. It's lower than it would be but I take fistfuls of

suppplements to help control it, else I would not be functional at all.

(I wasn't functional at one stage, I almost copped it in 2001.) The

problem is worse with time - cortisol is death to cells so it is a

constant battle daily to re-grow as much as cortisol destroys.

<<<BTW, you probably are aware of the glucose lowering effect of

cinnamon...>>

Doesn't work for me but thanks yes I know about it - for me it is

inflammatory (as predicted in blood type research actually) but I do

find sugar ban helpful (gymnema sylvestre plus other things) and ALA.

<<if not, see Diabetes Care 2003, the work by R.A. .....the

diabetes may be your biggest challenge in the long run.>>

Actually no, it's a cakewalk compared with the cortisol killing every

kind of cell in my system, from brain and hair to toes and everything

inbetween.

It's the cortisol that is a killer. The diabetes is easy to control,

just skip the carbs, it's not like we need any. I use about 4 or 5 units

of insulin a day max, plus supplements, diet and exercise. I've already

*reversed* most of the damage from it - the peripheral neuropathy and

kidney damage - but not the sight reduction, that is still a hassle.

The problem was it was not diagnosed till I had damage - the

doctors just ignored my high blood sugars as " normal " with all that

cortisol around. Then a new endo asked me one day last November " What do

you use for your diabetes? " and that was the first I knew about it.

<< If you don't mind my asking, besides homeopathy, is there any other

treatment you pursued for MEN-1? Ditto for breast cancer....>>>

I don't mind your asking. I'll answer separately for the 2 health

issues, but the real answer is no for both:

For breast cancer, I got a diagnosis and of course they wanted to do

drastic stuff immediately, it was a large and hot tumour. I knew right

away I was not going that way and would be using homeopathy - but I

feared hassles from the doctor and so I told him I would be getting a

2nd opinion, and just never went back, never got a 2nd opinion. I was in

a hurry to get the homeopathy started. In homeopathy everything depends

on a well selected remedy that matches the symptoms - it was really easy

with the breast cancer - the remedy practically jumped at me, so I was

completely confident it would work, but I wanted a cream form to use

topically as well, and I needed to import that (from South AFrica and

the homeopathic pharmacist there custom made it and sent it out stat for

me.) So within a week I was no longer in pain and a month later I was

fine, no sign of tumour. Since homeopathy works by building resistance

to the problem, it won't come back.

I can't really explain how I knew with certainty I would come right on

homeopathy and quickly but I did know. Apart from urgency to get started

and annoyance with myself for not spotting the problem much earlier, I

had no anxiety at all.

With the MEN-1 it's not so simple. I was fit and healthy till 1998 and

then after a few months of extreme trauma with malnutrition (don't want

to go into that aspect; it happened) I put on weight inexplicably and

felt weak and out of breath - and I had blood pressure with 200's

systolic. (Used to have low BP if anything.) Could not get a diagnosis

and went to 13 doctors looking for answers till I collapsed and was

taken by a neighbour to hospital in Apr 2001. I had heart damage, lung

damage, was 300 lbs, was hardly able to breathe etc. They said " severe

lung disease " but that was not it. I had heart attacks from hypokalemia

as the docs would not give me Rx potassium and I did not have cash to

buy my own bottle a day (for the inherited kidney defect I have) But

somehow I got through to November that year. Saw a kidney specialist re

the K I needed and he asked for a renal panel and sloppily landed his

checkmark in the endocrine panel. That showed an astronomical cortisol

reading - more tests followed and " cushing's syndrome " was diagnosed.

All this time I had no medicines other than BP ones to which I had

life threatening reactions on the first try, so I was using homeopathy

and Hawthorn berry on advice of a homeopath kind enough to treat me free

of charge as by now everything I'd ever saved including pension was all

gone and I was way too sick to work of course.

Problem is they could not find adrenal or pituitary tumours as is

usual with cushings, and also I had other hormones out of whack

(aldosterone sky high and insulin as well) and to shorten the story the

MEN-1 was discovered only in July 2004 when multiple tests were orrdered

and the 5-HIAA came back sky high. (5 Hydroxy indole acetic acid is

produced by carcinoid tumours as a metabolic by-product.)

MRIs and CT scans and no carcinoid tumours found. so even if I

wanted some other approach it's not available:

There is no cure or treatent for cushings - the high cortisol -

anyway. The usual " treatment " is to surgically remove the pituitary

and/or adrenals. That would not have helped in my case. So basically I'm

still here thanks to homeopahty. Cushings " untreated " kills in less than

5 years so I should have checked out 2002 latest.

For MEN-1 the " treatment " is also to remove tumours IF they are

found and IF they are in an operable place. They are microscopic and in

my case not found. Only the hormone levels and 5HIAA and symtoms tell

that they exist. I did have one " something " removed this year from under

a back tooth - the fool surgeon did not investigate what it was as she

was supposed to do, but it was pushing the tooth up. My dentist

discovered it and sent me for the surgery.

So basically - I don't have an option anyway - they do not have

options in conventional medicine for my situation. At the moment I do

not even have an endocrinologist officially my doctor - the last one

like the other two, sent me packing. She is afraid of homeopathy and has

no other answers.

So basically I did explore all my options with conventional medicine for

MEN-1 but they really had nothing to offer - and took from May 1998 to

July 2004 just to diagnose it - a few years more than the supposed

listed maximum survival time :-))

Not a great recommendation for conventional medicine:-)

Most of my time is spent finding ways to get healthier with supplements

and homeopathy, and trying to work enough to finance it. Finding the

right remedy for MEN-1 has not been so easy as it was with the breast

cancer, so it is a slow struggle. I am using a remedy, and obviously it

is helping - but not enough to chase the disease - just slow progress.

But compared to how sick I was in 2001 - I am doing amazingly as even

the regular doctors are amazed but admit. They just can not understand

how I can be here is all. I'm not well - life is a challenge - but I am

up for it, and I do have great support from my ARNP and from my

homeopath. My ARNP supports my choices in diet, insulin and Mg and K use

etc; she understands I know more about my case than the doctors and

basically goes along with it. My homeopath picks me up everey time I

have a crisis and gets me back on track.

My homeopath is not local so can not write what few prescriptions I use

- the K and Mg for the kidney defect - and the insulin. That's it.

Everything else is homeopathy and supplements. I am definitely

supplement poor but it helps :-)

> Because you're no longer married, I won't pursue what I would have

> said otherwise.

I won't even ask :-)))

I hope that you get better success with your unusual health issue. The

rare ones usually flummox the medics and leave us carrying the ball

solo. The proverb I quote in my siglines refers to my own health

challenges :-)

Namaste,

Irene

--

Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.

www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)

Proverb:Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it.

Note: This forum is for discussion of health related subjects but under no

circumstances should any information published here be considered a substitute

for personal medical advice from a qualified physician. -the owner

September 26, 2005

Idelle Port wrote:

> Sorry, I was thinking of GnRH-->LH and FSH..

No problem - it's complex and easy to make a mistake when writing a

quick email.

...Irene

--

Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.

www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)

Proverb:Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it.

September 26, 2005

If I " just " had high cortisol, I would consider phoshorylated serine and remeron

for it...the male level testosterone had been as high as 634 ng/dl) before the

1st adrenalectomy, dropped, then rose to 500 ng/dl before the 2nd adrenalectomy

(believe me, I thought long and hard about that 2nd one....the 1st adrenal had

macronodular hyperplasia)....dropped to 250ng/dl measured a month after that

surgery, then tried oral estradiol and spironolactone which only lowere T to 160

and had unacceptable side efffects.....by 6 months post sugery, 422

ng/dl....remember,60-70 is TOP female normal....the DHT just measured is TOP of

male range....so, like you, there is another issue, not just cortisol....but, if

just elevated cortisol, I might still have those adrenals...or at least one,

since the 1st removed did look (CT) like it had an adenoma....or....? From a

subsequent nuclear medicine scan, what's " left " that's still making T isn't a

remnant of my adrenal, but, from position and level of gamma radiation post I131

NP-59 injection seems to be adrenal rest tissue, which never shows on CT or MRI

scans of me, possibly because it just looks like " normal " tissue (ie.enot a

" tumor " ...though, technically, I suppose it's a neoplasm). This thing may be

producing hormone or hormones (cortisol, maybe something else) sporadically and

erratically, so even with taking cortef orally, I suspect it's hard to really

get my cortisol in a good place.

Re at some stage " not functional " ...I think I know from personal experience

exactly what you mean....and no antidepressant can fix the kind of endocrine

problems you or I have.

The high T drives CBG (and TSH) down....I'm on thyroid because of hypo from

atrophic autoimmune thyroiditis...so I get the double whammy.

What was your blood sugar when diagnosed diabetic?

I know about checking for carcinoids...I've had that done as well as being

checked for pheo...

Would a nuclear scan possibly show the carcinoids? I recently learned a lot

about SPECT'CT scan, as well as Cyberknife.

I have a friend with a recurrence of breast cancer...would you elaborate on the

homeopathy?

If you don't want to pursue this on the Longevity board, you can just email me

privately.

You're right that we " raries " come to the end of the endocrinologist's

rope...so....regardless of what I'm pursuing now, I'm always interested in

anything that may ameliorate my current situation....e.g.fiber lowers

testosterone 12% (drop in the bucket for me)....in addition to 500 mg flutamide

)Rx) I'm using saw palmetto and other things used for prostate cancer or

BPH....I haven't tried green tea or ECGC yet...I'm open to any suggestions...

Re: Re: menopause and natural hormone replacement

Idelle Port wrote:

> Au contraire...sex hormones DO come from adrenals as well as gonads..

Negligible proportions though, especially after menopause.

Before menopause, testosterone in women is like 25-70 ng/dl, 25% from

the ovaries, 50% from peripheral conversion of adrenal precursor

androgens and only 25% from the adrenal cotex. By age 30 or 40 that 25%

from adrenals drops at least in half again. So it's by no , dropped so that it

was 250ng/dtretch the